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The Gillard - Rudd comparative scorecard

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Saturday, 25 February 2012 22:52 by Ad astra
Among the countless words that have been written and uttered since the contest between Julia Gillard and Kevin Rudd for leadership became overt, where have you read a comprehensive comparison of the two? All we have had is brief written accounts, short interviews, multiple sound bites of how the leaders have performed in the role of Prime Minister, and over the last few days several revealing articles, mainly about Kevin Rudd.

Kevin Rudd’s announcement of his resignation has opened floodgates of recrimination against him, much of it from his colleagues, who have suppressed what they have felt for a long while out of loyalty to a sitting cabinet minister in a very senior role. Many have doubted the wisdom of colleagues bagging each other so publically. No doubt that will bring its own reward and penalty, but it was done to counter what many politicians and journalists now openly assert has been a longstanding and continuing campaign of destabilization of the Gillard Government by a member of the Inner Cabinet, Kevin Rudd.

In such a contest, exaggeration is unavoidable as each side presses their points. Cherry-picking points to bolster arguments is the norm. We hear the bad things but not the good from each side.

I hope what follows is a balanced appraisal of the two who would want to be Prime Minister. I have identified a number of attributes that it my opinion a Prime Minister of this country ought to be judged against. You may not agree with them all, and may feel others ought to be added. Use the ‘comments’ facility to express your view. I have ordered them in what I believe is roughly their importance. Under each attribute, I give my assessment of how each of the two candidates has fared. Again, express your agreement or otherwise.

Courage
I have placed this attribute first because I believe that without courage no one can survive the travails of prime ministership for long. It is not just having the courage on one’s convictions, but also the courage to implement them against opposition and in the face of adversity.

Julia Gillard
Of all her attributes, courage stands out. She has faced opposition to virtually every reform and every piece of legislation, from Tony Abbott and the Coalition, and in many instances from a hostile media more intent on finding fault than reporting the details of the legislation. Despite having to negotiate every move through a minority parliament, she has succeeded in passing 269 pieces of legislation, some of them major reforms in climate change, minerals tax, health, health insurance, disability, education and so on the list goes. She has had the courage of her convictions and the courage to convert them into legislation, without one failure.

Her courage in facing off the hostility of the media, which in many instances has been more vicious than that coming from the pugilistic Tony Abbott, has become legendary. Her refusal to be intimidated by rude journalists is welcome and lauded by her supporters.

She warrants high commendation for courage under fire and in the face of persistent hostility.

Kevin Rudd
When he became Opposition Leader we were impressed with his convictions, especially about climate change: “the greatest moral, economic, social and environmental challenge of our time”. He began work on this well before becoming PM and then implemented action designed to bring about an Emissions Trading Scheme, about which he successfully negotiated a compromise with the then Opposition Leader, Malcolm Turnbull, only to have his legislation frustrated by the overturn of Turnbull and the installation of Tony Abbott, one vehemently opposed to the ETS, elected on a platform of destroying it.

Rudd had plenty of courage then, but this evaporated in the face of resistance from focus groups and opinion polls, so much so that in the wake of the disappointment of Copenhagen, he decided to put an ETS on the back burner, convinced as he was, that it was an electoral liability. There are many still convinced that had he gone to a double dissolution, he would have won the endorsement of the electorate. But his courage failed him, albeit prompted by some around him. That failure is regarded by many commentators as marking the beginning of Rudd’s decline. The electorate seemed disappointed that he set aside, seemingly so easily, this matter of high principal.

Rudd’s courage was on display when he delivered his Apology to Indigenous People. Only those with the hardest of hearts were not moved with Rudd’s sincerity and eloquence.

He exhibited courage and conviction when handling the global financial crisis, which he and his inner team handled with consummate skill and effectiveness, the result of which is there for all to see in the robust state of our economy. He deserves high commendation.

He had the courage to initiate health reforms, but not sufficient to see them through, leaving an incomplete change over which Premiers were left wrangling. Julia Gillard has taken the reforms to their next stage.

He had the ‘courage’ (albeit ‘crazy brave’) to introduce a Resource Super Profits Tax, but he did so with such meagre consultation that it was largely rejected by the resources sector, forcing a major reshaping of the tax. His courage failed him as he tried to push this reform through. He seemed to misjudge the electorate, whom he thought would embrace the idea of levying taxes on wealthy miners and passing it onto the people, and left the reform incomplete and in disarray. It was Julia Gillard who had the courage to renegotiate it and get it through parliament as the Minerals Resource Rent Tax against Coalition resistance and a hostile industry campaign.

In summary, while Julia Gillard has shown, and still does show outstanding courage in going about her work, Kevin Rudd’s early exhibition of courage left us with high hopes, but disappointment when he seemed to lose his nerve.

Character
This attribute is related to the first. If we define ‘character’ as ‘a disposition to express behavior in consistent patterns across a range of situations’, it can be taken to include honesty, integrity, loyalty, and good behaviors or habits.

Julia Gillard
It may be an oxymoron to talk about an ‘honest politician’, so let’s settle for shades of honesty and integrity. In my opinion, Julia Gillard strives to be honest. She is often accused by the media of dishonesty, of being shifty, of looking guilty, especially during media appearances when confronted unexpectedly with leaked information that embarrasses. The recent Four Corners program is an example. In these situations, it falls to the observer’s judgement; those who wish to read dishonesty do so with conviction; others are prepared to see things in a more charitable light.

Her enemies in Opposition and in the media have applied the tag ‘liar’ to her. Who in this country has not heard Alan Jones’ ‘Ju-liar’? Once applied, such a label sticks, and is reinforced every time it is repeated, which is nauseatingly often. For those who mindlessly accept this label as true, almost every utterance she makes is heard through that filter, and confirms it.

She is accused by Kevin Rudd of lying to him in that fateful conversation the night before his removal, by reneging on what he saw as a promise to give him until October to recover his stature. As only three were at that conversation, we may never know what the truth really was. Those who see her as a liar will believe Rudd; others will believe her. We can but leave it at that.

Similarly, loyalty seems oxymoronic when applied to politicians, but we do see it in varying degrees. It appears that it was loyalty to a sitting senior Cabinet minister doing important international work that inhibited Rudd’s colleagues from exposing his bizarre work patterns and his non-consultative and at times dismissive behaviour towards his colleagues. So we were left with generic phrases such as ‘the Government has lost its way’ or ‘was paralysed’ to ‘explain’ why Rudd was ousted. Only now do we hear the extraordinary way in which he worked, frenetically rushing from one task to another, seldom completing any of them, always late, disrespectful of others’ time and opinions, and demanding of staff while discarding or ignoring their efforts. It was only the loyalty of colleagues that shielded Rudd from exposure; only now when he has resigned as Foreign Minister and he is clearly out to regain the prime ministership, have we been told the facts.

Kevin Rudd
In contrast, if one can believe the stories emanating from close Cabinet colleagues and from journalists, Kevin Rudd has been consistently disloyal to his party since he was deposed. While his supporters will justify his actions as reasonable after Julia Gillard’s ‘betrayal’ of him, how can they justify the treachery against his own beloved Labor party that emerging stories portray? There seems little doubt now that the leak to Laurie Oakes that derailed Julia Gillard’s 2010 election campaign came from Rudd or one of his associates. The leak was designed to seriously damage the PM, but Rudd must have known it would damage Labor’s re-election chances, as indeed it did, to the point of Labor not having a majority. Did he want Labor to lose so as to demonstrate that they couldn’t win without him, an assertion he is now putting about as his rationale for trying to wrest leadership from the PM?

There are many other instances of Rudd’s white-anting of the PM. He has backgrounded many journalists and editors that he would make a bid for leadership and a second one if he failed, something that has not been denied by them. Journalists exaggerate, but they don’t fabricate such stories. He is reported to have sabotaged legislation the Government is proposing. One example is his alleged negotiation with representatives of the pokie industry to water down the Government’s proposed legislation. When a senior minister from inner Cabinet is actively eroding his own party’s legislative program for his own ends, it is gross disloyalty and betrayal. He does not deny that he has been in touch with journalists but says that he will not reveal what dealings he had with them. This weekend he refused to authorize them to reveal the existence of such meetings if they had occurred, tantamount to admitting they did. His supporters will deny the validity of these accusations, but there seems little evidence to dispute their authenticity.

Such disloyalty and treachery is reprehensible in the extreme - such actions in wartime would be considered treason.

On the loyalty front, Kevin Rudd scores very poorly. In my opinion, Julia Gillard does much, much better.

Trustworthiness
This attribute is important in this leadership contest, as Kevin Rudd has nominated the issue of ‘trust’ as the key element in his announcement that he will contest the leadership. He said: "Rightly or wrongly, Julia has lost the trust of the Australian people. Starting on Monday I want to start restoring that trust.” It is a reprise of Howard’s tactic that worked so well for him in 2004; no doubt Rudd hopes it will for him too.

The caucus will need to assess the validity of his assertion and the plausibility that he could restore trust. He has pleaded to the people of Australia to press their local members to support him on this basis.

Vision
While initially Kevin Rudd was seen as a visionary, a fresh new face with an abundance of ideas, it gradually dawned on even his greatest admirers that the vision, though high sounding, was not being translated consistently into outcomes. In his later years, he found a way of deferring action, sometimes seemingly paralyzed by indecision. We noted how in his last year as PM his confidence waned when confronted by tough interviewers like Kerry O’Brien. He seemed intimidated. The lucid speaker morphed into a hesitant one with cliché-ridden talk. Was that because he had so little to show to back up his rhetoric?

In contrast, Julia Gillard has been pilloried by the media for having no vision. ‘What does she stand for’ became the catch cry. Yet over and again she has spoken of her vision – a fair and prosperous country with opportunity for all, a great education and skills training to equip everyone for a rewarding job, a robust economy, support for small business, fair workplaces, a reformed health system, action on climate change – need I go on – you have heard it over and again.

Julia has a vast and thrilling vision for Australia and all its people; if only the media would facilitate its promulgation instead of tearing it down, everyone would know about it.

Competence and management style
Competence is expected from anyone in high office. Competence is related to management style and pattern of work. It is here that one of the crucial differences between Julia Gillard and Kevin Rudd is obvious.

Julia Gillard
She has a reputation for hard work, persistence, a methodical work pattern characterized by purpose, stability, consistency, discipline, and tenacity until the job is done. Her record for getting things done and getting legislation through a minority government is legendary. Her performance speaks for itself. Her negotiating skills have enabled her to get through legislation in parliament that has previously been impossible – means testing of the health insurance rebate is a recent example.

Two hundred and sixty nine bills passed, many encompassing historic policy reforms, is a laudable achievement.

Kevin Rudd
His accomplishments in handling the GFC and in initiating work on climate change have been acknowledged. His Apology will remain one of his supreme achievements. His expertise in international relations is accepted; he has been a fine Foreign Minister. What a pity he has resigned from this post; we can ill afford to lose such talent.

But these accomplishments have been overshadowed by his way of working and dealing with others. He is supremely intelligent, but every description of Rudd’s work pattern reveals chaotic, dysfunctional, unstable, unpredictable behaviour. He is a control freak. His documentation was said to be disorderly and often incomplete and his manner of dealing with it erratic. His disdain for most of his colleagues, his unwillingness or incapacity to involve them in decision making, his habitual lateness for important meetings and his disregard for those he kept waiting, his irregular hours, the demands he made on his colleagues and staff, yet his indifference to their response to his demands, have earned him a reputation for being an unremittingly difficult colleague, and an almost impossible person with which to work.

He seems to have a boundless capacity for work and can live with just a few hours sleep. This was seen as a laudable trait until it was gradually realized that it was not accompanied by a steady flow of work completed on time. Rhetoric abounded to coincide with the media cycle but there were disappointingly small outcomes. Soon the slogan ‘all talk, no action’ was coined and repeated endlessly by both the Coalition and the media.

When it comes to productivity, the product of competence and management efficiency, Julia Gillard wins hands down.

Inclusiveness
This is where Julia Gillard reigns supreme. Her cabinet colleagues tell of the smoothness of her Cabinet meetings, her capacity to include all who can contribute, her skill at fruitful relationships, her willingness to listen, the warmth of her personality, her friendliness.

These attributes are in stark contrast to those of Kevin Rudd, who seems afflicted with virtually the opposite of all of these. The result in his later years was a dysfunctional and at times a paralysed government, an ineffective Cabinet system, and an impotent PM.

Communication skills;
Julia Gillard
Our PM has been lampooned for ‘not being able to get the message across’; more charitable journalists concede that she has many good messages to sell, but insist she fails continually. Why is this so? Is it her ocker drawl, or her frequent repetition of some phrases that grate, or her non-verbal signals, or her schoolmarmish approach to questions, or her dress? Is it what she says or how she says it? To me all this remains a mystery – I have never had any trouble understanding every word she utters. If I were speaking, I would use less repetition, but that simply reflects my style, and who is to judge what is the best style. Journalists certainly think they can and mark the PM down.

She is said to be charming and personable among small gatherings, and the TV clips we see bear this out. But in more formal settings and press conferences she is different and according to the pundits, ineffective. At her recent Adelaide press conference to announce the ballot for leadership, I thought she spoke very well, almost entirely off-the-cuff, and answered many questions, some quite rude, with clarity and laudable brevity. What else do journalists or the public, want?

Kevin Rudd
The contrast with Rudd is stark. He is a brilliant communicator, whether in supermarkets or on the big stage. He has a pleasantly resonant voice, a good turn of phrase, a capacity to write good speeches for big occasions – remember his ‘Apology’ speech – and a sense of place and timing that makes him popular with his audiences and the people at large. He wins hands down over Julia Gillard on public speaking.

I believe this is why he rates so well in the polls as the preferred PM. People at large like him. He is a ‘hail fellow, well met’ who is thronged in public places. People want to touch him and talk with him. He is almost messianic, something not lost on Kevin himself.

Poll addiction
I consider the addiction of political parties, journalists and the media with polling, a pox on our political system, and wrote about this in How opinion polls poison politics. Much of the contemporary turmoil is the direct result of polling, polling which shows Kevin Rudd consistently ahead of Julia Gillard, and Tony Abbott, as preferred Labor leader. There has been a spate of them this weekend showing the same thing, but not all that different from previous polls. But what do they signify? In my opinion they signify approval of the Kevin Rudd they know, the one they have seen in shopping centres, in the street, waving as he gets into cars, in hospitals, outside church, with his lovely family, in arranged ‘pressers’, or in celebrity TV slots. But there is another Kevin Rudd that they don’t know, because little about the other Kevin has reached the general public, kept hidden by his colleagues and media somewhat reluctant to expose some of the nasty side. Now that Rudd has challenged though, the veil has been lifted, and colleagues and journalists feel liberated to tell all. And it’s not pretty.

David Marr in his Quarterly Essay: Power Trip. The Political Journey of Kevin Rudd says: “Rudd had sold himself to the Australian people as a new kind of leader: a man of intellect and values out to reshape the future. If he isn’t that, people are asking, what is he? And who is he? … Millions of words have been written about him since he emerged from the Labor pack half a dozen years ago, but Rudd remains hidden in full view.” That Essay powerfully details Rudd’s pattern of work and behaviour. I could scarcely bring myself to believe it when it appeared in June 2010, such was my faith in Rudd, but sadly what Marr said has turned out to be the case. He repeated his claims in Friday night’s Lateline. Read the transcript here. Malcolm Farr too had much to say on the same show, confirming Rudd’s backgrounding of journalists and business people against Julia Gillard’s legislative program, describing her to a senior businessman as an ‘f bomb (inaudible) bitch’. There are now strong suspicions he or his agent leaked the story to Laurie Oakes, who incidentally, perhaps feeling somewhat chastened about what his leak did to the Gillard 2010 election campaign, has featured an unflattering secondhand story about Rudd’s behaviour in his regular column.

Then there was an exposé by James Button, who was Rudd’s speechwriter for a while, in The Age National Times of 25 February that painted a most unflattering picture of his chaotic patterns of work in We need to talk about Kevin . Here’s just one paragraph: “..Rudd's prime ministership failed, and the failure was, above all, his own. The story of his government, and of its end, has still not been fully told. The consequence has been deep damage to Australians' faith in politics and in government.” He goes on to describe the chaotic Rudd – the Mr Hyde. Anyone still needing to be convinced of this should read the whole article.

Finally, can anyone explain to me why intelligent politicians believe that Kevin Rudd can lead them to victory based on contemporary popularity polls, taken eighteen months out from an election, and reflecting only the public’s opinion of the Kevin they know. What would they say if they really knew the other Kevin, the one who found himself incapable of governing? In my view, these polls are meaningless as predictors, and to base voting for a leader on them is grotesque and stupid to boot. And what is the point of victory under Rudd if he is incapable of governing because of his personality, which he cannot change? These polls are simply personality contests; Monday’s ballot is about who can govern best.

Where does that leave us?
As a strong supporter of Kevin Rudd from the outset, I for one found it difficult to accept the emerging stories of his dysfunctional behaviour, especially after he started so well. I did not want to believe them. But believe them I now must. Was he like that all along? I suspect so; it just took us two years to find that out.

From what I hope you will see as an objective analysis, it is my unavoidable conclusion that Julia Gillard is the only one properly equipped to govern this nation. Kevin Rudd is not. I hope caucus agrees.

What do you think?

Comments (335) -

February 25. 2012 11:45 PM

Jaeger

I think you're right, AA.

Abbott and Latham are sociopaths; they're so dysfunctional, you know they are trouble and give them a wide berth.  Rudd on the other hand is a psychopath: a smiling assassin, very dangerous.

Don't get me wrong; he achieved some important milestones as PM, such as the apology.  The lack of HoR supporters on his side - i.e. those that had to work with him - is very telling.  I think the truth about Rudd is finally coming out, and it isn't pretty; it's hurting Labor, but the alternative - Rudd Mk II - is even worse.

Jaeger

February 25. 2012 11:47 PM

DMW

Thankyou Ad.
interesting and well laid out 'scorecard'

You didn't mention the 'faceless men' in your article but they need to be exposed and it has now happened:

Kevin plays the family card while Julia keeps Tim in the background  Ellen Whinnett @Sunday Herald Sun
www.heraldsun.com.au/.../story-e6frfhqf-1226281560866

DMW

February 25. 2012 11:55 PM

Jaeger

DMW - I blame Jasper the cat; tinfoil hats are no protection against toxoplasmosis.

Jaeger

February 25. 2012 11:58 PM

el gordo

They are both poison to the party and a compromise candidate must be chosen.

Smith, Crean, Combet, Shorten or possibly Roxon.

el gordo

February 26. 2012 12:07 AM

DMW

Thanks Jaeger
I will remember your advice in the unlikely event that I ever become pregnant.

DMW

February 26. 2012 12:17 AM

Jaeger

DMW, toxo is definitely a problem with pregnant women; the mind control aspects with both sexes are more subtle.

www.theatlantic.com/.../

Jaeger

February 26. 2012 12:26 AM

NormanK

Ad astra

This is a telling and comprehensive evaluation of the two candidates that should be read by all interested parties.

Two immediate thoughts - one a little unkind perhaps, the other fanciful.

Rudd’s courage was on display when he delivered his Apology to Indigenous People. Only those with the hardest of hearts were not moved with Rudd’s sincerity and eloquence.

What did it actually cost Kevin Rudd to do the Apology Speech? What was courageous about ti? Presumably he would have had legal advice about whether compensation claims might result because of it. My best understanding is that litigation is what inhibited Howard from going so far as to say sorry thereby admitting culpability. The advice that Rudd got must have reassured him that it was safe to do so. The legal boys and girls probably checked the wording of his speech. With the benefit of hindsight (and not a little malice at my having been duped so well for so long) it is now possible for me to look on the Apology Speech as being the ultimate media stunt which cost Rudd nothing and garnered him lots of praise, especially among the indigenous community.

My background is theatre and the Apology Speech was a great piece of theatre. I am being unkind perhaps but I ask again "what did it cost him?" No complex legislation, no pressure on the budget, not much risk of adverse reaction in the polls (I should point out that his apology did not go down terribly well in my little redneck country Queensland town - but they were never going to vote for him anyway). I was deeply moved by it. It was a beautiful speech expressing sentiments that were long overdue but with the benefit of malevolent hindsight it was also straight out of the Kevin Rudd Playbook. I was moved by his eloquence - I now question his sincerity.
In fact, like a cuckolded husband, I now question every single thing that he ever did apart from the response to the GFC and even then I'm curious to know who drew up the plans. Ken Henry? Wayne Swan?

My second flight of fancy was prompted by something you asked.
Finally, can anyone explain to me why intelligent politicians believe that Kevin Rudd can lead them to victory based on contemporary popularity polls, taken eighteen months out from an election, and reflecting only the public’s opinion of the Kevin they know.

Here's one way that it could work. Don't give him any policy responsibility. Keep him as a figure-head to front the media, an attack dog to challenge Abbott and let the ministers get on with their jobs guided by Cabinet Meetings. Give him all of the resources he needs to continue to build up his own mythology, give the public what they seem to be craving. Smiling happy Kevin. Adjusting his glasses in an intelligent and thoughtful manner Kevin. Photo opportunity Kevin. Straight talking Kevin (with a bit of swearing on the side).
Use Rudd's popularity to the party's advantage but give him none of the power to do harm.
Reckon Rudd would go for it?

NormanK

February 26. 2012 12:51 AM

DMW

Excellent article from Saturday's Canberra Times

Mills of Rudd grind Gillard away  Jack Waterford
The Kevin Rudds of this world nearly always need a Julia Gillard, or someone like her, to clean up their messes, sort out bruised egos, and keep the show on the road.
The Julia Gillards of this world need people with some iron will, vision and bottom, to harness their practicality and their talent for making things happen.

www.canberratimes.com.au/.../...0120224-1trur.html

Waterford, as is often the case, shines some light into corners I hadn't looked at and makes me rethink.

DMW

February 26. 2012 01:19 AM

DMW

NK,
your 'flight of fancy' makes me think you would make a great 'faceless man' Smile

The challenge would be, as Waterford points out, having a 2IC like JG to make things happen.

There are some very talented people in the current caucus that could do it.

Apart from whether Rudd would but it would anybody be willing to take on the very onerous and wearing task of making it happen while being kicked in the guts by the boss?

DMW

February 26. 2012 01:38 AM

jane

A great thought provoking post as usual, Ad astra.

Like you, I was very impressed by Kevin Rudd. He was a breath of fresh and inspiring air Even better, he had the ghastly John Howard on the run.

I was overjoyed when he was elected, even more so when we knew he had The Rodent's scalp on his belt.

And when the rumours started circulating about his temper, his unreasonable demands on staff, his dysfunctional and erratic work patterns, I didn't want to believe it and put it down to sour grapes, so enamoured was I.

I was certainly disappointed when he shelved the ETS, but convinced myself that he was waiting for a more favourable Senate composition and kept on believing in him.

Then came the so-called knifing. Like a lot of us, I was aghast; I didn't know what to think. There seemed to be no rhyme or reason for the sacking. Gillard's stumbling, oft changing and unconvincing reasons for deposing the king.

The "Sussex Street Mafia" got the blame-Gillard had to jump before they pushed her, etc, etc.

Then came the gall bladder and the "heroic return" to save the government and dispel the rumours of barely concealed hostility between Rudd and Gillard.

Then Laurie Oakes' devastating story and the leaks rumour and fingers pointed at Rudd. Once again, I couldn't and wouldn't, believe that he would betray his party and the government of which he was a senior member out of spite.

I just knew he was better than that. He was nobly suffering in silence and working to get the government re-elected.

The election came and went and the press and plenty of so-called pundits pilloried Gillard mercilessly. With each passing day and every cruel vicious attack, my admiration for her grew.

She got on with the job, never complained, never gave her critics the satisfaction of a reaction, never cracked, but turned adversity into success, negotiating her minority government into a productive, competent, smooth running outstanding success, passing 269 pieces of legislation including the controversial MRRT and Carbon Pricing bills.

Through all of this she has behaved with enormous courage, grace and dignity, unlike critics like the repulsive Alan Jones and his fellow shock jocks with their cowardly, lying, virulent attacks on her character.

Which brings me to The Challenge from the pretender to the throne, Kevin Rudd.

To my sadness and anger, instead of the noble sinned against hero of my imagination, I find he is a grubby, spiteful, vindictive autocrat, who plotted to bring down a duly elected government and to blacken the character of his successor out of revenge and hubris.

He has betrayed himself, his colleagues, his supporters and the people of this country. He is not fit to be PM.

Julia Gillard is 10, nay 100 times the person he is; steadfast in adversity, courageous in the face of seemingly insurmountable obstacles, calm in the face of vicious and petty minded attacks on her character, head and shoulders above her critics and naysayers.

I expect her to win this ballot by a wide margin and to go on to greater heights in the coming months. Winning the ballot is very important; it will establish once and for all her right to the position of first female leader of the ALP and her legitimacy as our first female PM.

jane

February 26. 2012 02:05 AM

Patricia WA

After reading AA's comparative score card we probably don't need further re-inforcement,  but just in case John Brumby thinks
Running the country is a hard and selfless exercise, which requires important personal qualities: determination, decisiveness, self-belief, loyalty, decency and a sense of purpose. It requires strong leadership - and with it an ability and willingness to work with cabinet, with caucus, with the Parliament and with the broader community to achieve lasting change.

Julia Gillard has these qualities in spades. She is a team player whose single motivation is a better and stronger Australia. Her record of achievement is testament to this.

Australia is best served by Julia Gillard remaining as Prime Minister, continuing to lead her government and the nation.

Read more: www.theage.com.au/.../...stand-20120225-1tvf6.html

Patricia WA

February 26. 2012 02:36 AM

DMW

This bizarre soap opera is throwing up more subplots than just about any other soapie that I could try to think of.

There are are journalists writing articles that defy preconceived notions of who we may think they support.

Kevin denies bizarre, expletive-laden attack  Samantha Maiden @ The Sunday Telegraph
KEVIN Rudd has denied describing Julia Gillard as a "childless, atheist, ex-communist" as he plotted a comeback a year ago.
Labor frontbencher Kate Ellis and other witnesses have revealed for the first time the "full story" of Mr Rudd's alleged behaviour at Adelaide's Stag Hotel in February last year.


What makes this article all the more intriguing are some tweets that I came across not long after reading it:

Excuse me @KRuddMP but you are lying about Adelaide. I was there. I heard what you said.

@samanthamaiden if you need it, I can confirm Rudd's statements in Adelaide. I was there, standing next to him.


The people that are coming out of the woodwork now that Mr Rudd stages his comeback is bewildering.

DMW

February 26. 2012 02:59 AM

DMW

and I don't for one moment think that come Monday no matter the result that it will be the end of this bizarre soap opera.

Mike Carlton has presented a ditty that rings some alarm bells and an historical reminder of the stupidity of the whole schemozzle.

We're angry little Vegemites as
vicious as can be,
We've ripped into each other
since we joined the ALP.
The polling spells disaster,
getting worse with every week
But we enjoy a faction fight,
A savage brawl of left and right
It puts a rose in every cheek!

The last time a minority government fell apart like this was in 1941, when Robert Menzies' wartime Tories tore each other to shreds. That, too, was a fight over power and personalities, not policy and principle.
Menzies was knifed by his own United Australia Party, ...


The party's over. Rest in despair
www.theage.com.au/.../...spair-20120224-1ttja.html

At this moment I will not fall into despair however I am shaking my head and wondering why the hell apparently mature and intelligent adults are behaving worse than any school-yard bully I ever met.

DMW

February 26. 2012 03:57 AM

TalkTurkey

Ad astra,

Simply the Best.

*J*U*L*I*A* is simply the best of all Labor's brilliant team,
and You Ad astra are simply the best commentator on the Blogosphere.
IMO anyway.

Your thread is the most limpid expose ever of the differences between our immediate past Prime Minister and the present one. No-one could do better.

And never has a thread been more timely. One would hope that friend Nasking, on reading of the stark contrasts between the rivals, would finally come to realise that we - all the rest of us here on TPS I think - have good reason to be firmly of the opinion that Julia Gillard has what it takes, and it is now painfully obvious that Kevin Rudd doesn't. We, the absolute majority bar Nas, don't have to be wrong just because we all have independently arrived at the same conclusion. I know that one person can be the only marcher in step, or the only person with a monopoly on the Truth . . . Think of Galileo with his Truth about planetary movement standing against the whole Holy (refused-to) See . . .  but Nasking that's not You in this case! Please back off your hasty declaration that if (when) JG rolls KR in about 40 hours as I write, you will never write again here, nobody wants that. Just read Ad's thread, I don't see how a rational being, with goodwill to the ALP, could possibly come to any conclusion but the one which you alone reject.

We will win the 2013 election by 'building on the rock', with bricks, not with twigs and straw on shifting sands, not by running in fright from long-term-substantial but short-term-unpopular policy initiatives and personalities, and not by running to populist but short-term policy sops and soppy populist politicians.

Nix on tricks. *J*U*L*I*A* builds the House with bricks.      

www.youtube.com/watch

I can't wait to hear the new revitalised Labor attack on the Coalons from Monday on, and as for the rude gotcha types in the MSM, I relish the thought of our staunch articulate Labor spokespeople putting them firmly in their place, which is not making decisions for the People, except insofar as they are responsible for tellng the People the Truth.

And Bruce Hawker, the archetypal Faceless Man, can hide the rest of his head in his own bucket of merde forever afa I'm concerned. Let's have proper policy, not Tea Party tactics as someone said so truly. We need fundamentally to change the way the MSM operates to jeer Labor's terrific achievements, to a role of informing and educating the Australian People instead.  

Come Monday! Bring it on! as our *J*U*L*I*A* is not afraid to say.

Simply the best. Ad astra, and *J*U*L*I*A*, both.

And Lyn's~Links are simply the best source of information accessible to us Bloggers. The Political Sword is Great.

VENCEREMOS!


TalkTurkey

February 26. 2012 05:02 AM

TalkTurkey

Look what I found on Poll Bludger.

Dan Gulberry
Posted Sunday, February 26, 2012 at 2:56 am | Permalink

ad astra at The Political Sword has compiled a Gillard v Rudd scorecard. The conclusion:

As a strong supporter of Kevin Rudd from the outset, I for one found it difficult to accept the emerging stories of his dysfunctional behaviour, especially after he started so well. I did not want to believe them. But believe them I now must. Was he like that all along? I suspect so; it just took us two years to find that out.

From what I hope you will see as an objective analysis, it is my unavoidable conclusion that Julia Gillard is the only one properly equipped to govern this nation. Kevin Rudd is not. I hope caucus agrees.

www.thepoliticalsword.com/.../...e-scorecard-.aspx

Thank you Dan Gulberry.

But Dog I do hope we can Stop The Bludgers from invading The Political Sword, Web Monkey can you please put up a FULL sign at the top of the page?! Smile

*my say* are you still anywhere, I don't see you on PB atm, you are so-o-o-o welcome here, you have a beautiful conscience.

How many degrees of separation are there between me and *my say* I wonder? Between Ad astra and *J*U*L*I*A* or Kevin, or Abbortt or (random eg) Tony Zappia?  And will Tony Zappia hear of this I wonder? I believe in this medium, let us make the most of it by liaising in every way we can with other bloggers and with journalists and with politicians and with human beings as well.
Lyn our Tweety bird shows the way, but we all need to help, I think people are a bit shy of cross-posting, and of transplanting others' posts from elswhere, well DON'T BE! Everyone loves their posts going around other sites afa I know. I sure do.

I EXPECT that somehow someone will let *my say* know through the ether that TalkTurkey adores her posts and wants her to visit us here at least. I don't post on PB myself so someone had better let her know, or let us all down. Merci bien.

Wonder if Tony Zappia will decide to give us a hat tip.  Smile  

TalkTurkey

February 26. 2012 06:53 AM

lyne lady

Great article - says it all really.  When the caucus overwhelmingly supports the PM tomorrow, the white anting disgraceful Rudd should go back under his rock and allow the great ALP party to get on with the great reforms they are putting in place for the good of the country.  Kevin - it's not all about you, it's about Australia!

lyne lady

February 26. 2012 08:39 AM

Ian

AA,
wonderfully measured analysis...thank you.

Jane@1.38am

Could not agree more

Normank@12.26am

Ditto

Ian

February 26. 2012 08:45 AM

johnL1

While I do not quarrel with most of what is said in this post, I do query the following:  “His (Rudd) courage failed him as he tried to push this reform (the Resource Super Profits Tax) through. He seemed to misjudge the electorate, whom he thought would embrace the idea of levying taxes on wealthy miners and passing it onto the people, and left the reform incomplete and in disarray. It was Julia Gillard who had the courage to renegotiate it and get it through parliament as the Minerals Resource Rent Tax against Coalition resistance and a hostile industry campaign.”

First, the reform was incomplete because Rudd was deposed. Second, the tax was gaining public acceptance despite a concerted and expensive advertising campaign against it by the mining industry.  

The Resources Super Profit Tax (RSPT) was announced on May 2, 2010. The Newspoll taken immediately before this ( April 30-May 2) showed Labor’s primary vote at 35 per cent, 43 for the combined Coalition, 10 for Greens and 12 for Others, giving a two-party preferred vote of 51-49 to the Coalition. The next Newspoll (for May 14-16) put Labor’s primary vote at 37 per cent, the combined Coalition at 43, the Greens at 12, and 8 for Others, giving a two-party preferred vote of 50-50. The Newspoll (for May 28-30) put Labor’s primary vote at 35 the combined Coalition at 41, the Greens at 16 and Others at 8 for a two-party preferred vote of 51-49 for Labor. The Newspoll (for June 18-20 the last before Rudd was deposed) showed Labor’s primary vote at 35, the combined Coalition at 40, the Greens at 15 and Others at 10 for a two-party preferred vote of 52-48 for Labor.

Labor’s two-part preferred vote in the three Newspolls after the RSPT was announced went up 3 per cent to 52 per cent, the combined Coalition primary and two-party-preferred vote were both down 3 per cent to 40 and 48 respectively and the Greens (who supported the RSPT) were up 5 per cent on their primary vote.

In an article (from the viewpoint of those who organised to deposed Rudd) in The Australian Financial Review on July 16 2010, Pamela Williams says in the third paragraph: “Gillard’s ascent to the prime ministership followed an almost flawless campaign ignited by a small handful of Labor MPs just freshly elected in 2007. But it involved some seasoned players too, as well as an explosive campaign by wealthy mining titans, and some subtle manouevring by old Labor hands who traced their lineage back to the days of Hawke’s government.”

Williams reveals that “in early June” Karl Bitar, then ALP national secretary, met Geoff Walsh, a former ALP general secretary and in charge of public affairs at BHP-Billion, to discuss politics and the mining tax. It says the meeting left unanswered questions of whether the Minerals Council polling results were on the table too. The article says: “Asked about the meeting, Bitar yesterday (July 15) declined any comment beyond saying: ‘Private discussions between me and a former national secretary of the party are private’.”

Williams continues: “But a small group of Labor MPs, aware of Walsh’s meeting with Labor’s campaign manager, have privately raised concerns about perceptions of the extent of the mining industry’s role in the assassination of a prime minister. For the miners, the demise of Rudd was spectacular good fortune. Gillard – as the new Prime Minister – made it her first job to dramatically water down major aspects of the resource tax that had so angered the companies.”

On Monday June 14 2010 an article on The Sydney Morning Herald website, under the heading “ALP backbench tells Rudd to move on RSPT”, Sandra O’Malley reported that NSW backbencher (Senator) Steve Hutchins told the party room that he and a number of colleagues wanted the issue resolved before parliament rose for the winter recess on June 24. The article said the prime minister is insisting “the government needs to hold its nerve”.

Interestingly, the article went on to mention “there has been growing chatter about the prospect of Deputy Prime Minister Julia Gillard taking over the leadership” and that a survey by Essential Research the previous week  “continued to show an even divide in the community over the mining tax”.

Finally, I question whether it took much courage to weaken the RSPT (which after all was a recommendation of the Henry tax review) so that its successor, the Minerals Resource Rent Tax (MRRT), was much more favourable to the big miners.

All that said, I still think it is in the nation's and Government’s best interests for Julia Gillard to remain as Prime Minister.  I do not think that she or Rudd should be eulogised, but neither do I think they should be demonised in the manner of Wayne Swan’s comments about Rudd.  

johnL1

February 26. 2012 08:54 AM

grannie

Now hopefully the rest of the country willl see what a gracious caring person and great leader is Julia gillard first lady pm of australia.gob blessyou Julia

grannie

February 26. 2012 09:01 AM

lyn

Hi Lyne Lady

Great to have you here, thankyou so much for sharing your opinion on TPS.  Big welcome to you we all hope you keep dropping in and  leave your comments here on TPS.

I am not sure how reliable Vex News is , but this is  a report, which is scary:-

THE SUM OF ALL SMEARS: Is Kevin Rudd actually mad or just maddening?, Vex News

We don’t say he is the Doc Evatt of his generation lightly. It’s as bad an insult as we can muster. He’s unfit to hold high office. The PM made a big mistake – albeit an understandable one – by retaining him in her team. She trusted him to suck up the brutal punishment imposed by his colleagues on him for his dysfunctional leadership,
www.vexnews.com/.../

CheersSmileSmileSmileSmileSmileSmile

lyn

February 26. 2012 09:05 AM

grannie

Gosh  iam granny. How lovley of you
dan is a great guy beleive me
,  i moved to franks  .ihad togo. And find a peacefull place, of like minds, i never new much about your site,  but i did post the above on  pb  Smile  Smile
I willbook mark.  Your site for a daily look

grannie

February 26. 2012 09:08 AM

lyn

Hi Grannie

Thankyou and a Big welcome to you, we do appreciate your comment on TPS very much.  Ad Astra will come along soon and say hello to you.

Now hopefully the rest of the country will see what a gracious caring person and great leader is Julia gillard first lady pm of australia.

god bless you Julia


Those are such nice words you have said for Julia

CheersSmileSmileSmileSmile

lyn

February 26. 2012 09:09 AM

Bring Back Maxine

Hi AA

An insightful & informative compare & contrast of both protagonists' leadership credentials.

I was really dismayed when Rudd appointed Costello to head the Future Fund. Appointing one of the architects of Workchoices to a plum Government post really stank. The fact that he was white-anting Julia Gillard since his loss of the PMship will trash his legacy, and rightly so. The manner in which he was removed from the leadership, whether rightly or wrongly, does not justify one iota his subsequent treachery.

I'm really annoyed that such Labor notables as Anthony Albanese, Maxine McKew & Ed Husic have come out in support of Rudd. I regard all Rudd supporters as accessories after the fact of this treachery which almost delivered Abbott government.

I'll be looking for a new avatar & Blog name.

Bring Back Maxine

February 26. 2012 09:39 AM

Tom of Melbourne

Bring Back Maxine

…and yet the genuine Maxine McKew remains a strong supporter of Rudd, and continues to express antipathy towards Gillard and the warlords who knifed Rudd.

But what would the genuine article know about politics? No doubt the fake one is far better informed.

Tom of Melbourne

February 26. 2012 09:50 AM

TalkTurkey

I thought of writing a parody . . . But this is a prescient parody of Kevin Rudd, it is spooky even.

I have never seen a cap off the shelf so precisely fit a head.

www.google.com.au/url

No one knows what it's like
To be the bad man
To be the sad man
Behind blue eyes
And no one knows what it's like
to be hated
To be fated
to telling only lies

[Chorus:]
But my dreams
they aren't as empty
As my conscience seems to be
I have hours, only lonely
My love is vengeance
That's never free

No one knows what its like
To feel these feelings
Like i do,
and i blame you!
No one bites back as hard
On their anger
None of my pain and woe
Can show through

[Chorus]

Discover l.i.m.p. say it [x4]

No one knows what its like
To be mistreated, to be defeated
Behind blue eyes
No one knows how to say
That they're sorry and don't worry
I'm not telling lies

[Chorus]

No one knows what its like
To be the bad man,
to be the sad man
Behind blue eyes.


[Thanks to ApexTheory25@hotmail.com for these lyrics]
[Thanks to durstluva1014@yahoo.com, zip_4_ever@yahoomail.com, enloqueciendome88@hotmail.com, cstillsmokin@ctc.net for correcting these lyrics]

Yeah all that and Thanks The WHO! TT

TalkTurkey

February 26. 2012 09:50 AM

Patricia WA

Bring Back Maxine - glad to read that.  I'm always happy to read your comments.  As well until now I've always loved your gravatar and name because of happy memories of LNL and the big 2007 unseating of Howard.  I was astounded at the personal venom towards the PM in that article of hers.  It didn't fit my sense of her at all.   Yet, if that really reflects something of her true character it does explain why so few of the old faithful have done much to help restore her political career after that not really so surprising shift away from Labor there in 2010.  Though I had thought that Maxine being the Maxine I thought I knew she'd be able to hang on to it.

Patricia WA

February 26. 2012 09:54 AM

2353

A well reasoned argument AA.

The problem here is we have one contestant who knows the popularity game and by reputation can't handle the administration game versus another who can't play the popularity game and by reputation can handle the administration game.

One is relying on colleagues to support them, the other is relying on the public ringing colleagues.  It seems that one is secure in their own skin, the other on isn't - judged by the media circus surrounding one of them using their family in the process.

The Rudd Government did develop the stimulus package that kept us out of the GFC Part 1, and Gillard did get the CPRS through - both brilliant achievements.  Both have squibbed it in reducing excesses such as "middle class welfare", tax rorts, truth in media and so on.

Whatever happens, I wish the one that "gets voted off the island" (yes that term is deliberate - they have both at various stages over the last 18 months turned a serious matter into a reality TV game) does not have another go and leaves the eventual PM alone so that they can promote their successes.  

I would love to be in the meeting room tomorrow to tell them both they are pathetic.  Systematic leaking, media stunts and so on do not make a good PM.  They both really deserve a long stint on the Opposition Benches to appreciate how their actions screwed themselves and the ALP - the unfortunate thing is that Abbott would be worse for Australia than either of these clowns.

The longer version of this article appeared in the Brisbane Sunday Mail today.  If you can get a copy of the full one, I'd suggest it is better, but this is still worth reading.  www.couriermail.com.au/.../story-fn6ck620-1226281503985.  Why are we being constantly manipulated?

Beam me up Scotty - there is no intelligent life (in the political parties) in this country.  The sad thing is that people who should know better don't do anything about it.

2353

February 26. 2012 10:39 AM

Eve White

As one of the many from whose eyes the scales have dropped over Kevin Rudd, I thank  you, AA, for you detailed analysis of the relative capacity of the two rivals for the position of Prime Minister
Believing that the role of government is the betterment of the country and its people, it is not difficult do discern that Julia Gillard has achieved  and continues to achieve a great deal to this end.
From the latest revelations, as well as his current behaviour, it is clear that Kevin Rudd is pursuing personal ambition to the exclusion of all else, including the party he claims to be committed to.  Let us not forget that it was through Julia Gillard bringing along her factional colleagues that Rudd acquired his LOTO role. No doubt, at some level he deeply resents the notion that he did not get there entirely by his own efforts. In the light of that, it is interesting how he has attempted to bypass and indeed eliminate the role of factions in the caucus, thus attempting to become dictator for life through controlling all appointments.

The reports of his pejorative terms for Gillard, including the incident at the Stag Hotel in Adelaide suggest the kind of misogyny for which we rightfully criticise TonY Abbott.
The predicted defeat in tomorrow's ballot,and the loss of role ( even though he himself chose to resign)will leave him evenmore vengeful and more time to create mischief with that huge energy. Unfortunately the sensitivity with which he was treated after June 2010 has clearly not elicited any appreciation or self-awareness in Mr Rudd.  It is characteristic of narcissists that they are incapable of either gratitude or remorse.
It would be very unwise to discount the huge potential for destruction which will be further unleashed

Eve White

February 26. 2012 10:42 AM

grannie

One thing  if i  may. During   2007 i was so excited about the  election,  a friend stunded me, she reminds me nowSmile Smile ,  KR  one year wonder.nothing much will happen,'wnat i said indignation , in my voice.  Shs said how do u think howard stayed there aall these years,  NO  i said how.
Thinkabout  he did nothing,  got a bigfright re his polls during  the GST.sent us to iraq,   just nice big gifts like baby bonusSmile Smile . .
Thats how, and that  folks is what we realy seen when u take off your coloured glasses,' 2007/10
I think it was  PJK who said  pms are not suppose d to be loved wtte,  they are here to run a country.


Ps wish i didnot have such  fat fingers,  re the hand held device,'but its much more socabble than hiding in the study on the computer


grannie

February 26. 2012 10:55 AM

Patricia WA

Agree with you Eve White, Rudd's potential to cause damage is huge, but better by far he is unmasked and not running country.  I am very impressed that so many Labor MPs would rather lose their seats than support him.  

Lyn always links to Andrew Elder so I'm probably repeating her here.  Worth reading the 'objective' assessment of a non-Labor writer.
andrewelder.blogspot.com.au/.../...leadership.html

Patricia WA

February 26. 2012 10:58 AM

lyn

Hi Eve White

Thankyou so much for very interesting and enjoyable comment, and a big thankyou for taking time off to comment on TPS.  We need to read you more often.

Your opinion is greatly appreciated,  you would have been a good mix yesterday with Augustus and Ian.

CheersSmileSmileSmileSmile

lyn

February 26. 2012 11:05 AM

lyn

Hi Grannie

Ps wish i didnot have such  fat fingers,  re the hand held device,'but its much more socabble than hiding in the study on the computer

Don't worry about the fingers, you are doing a great job, sharing your opinion, good on you.  BTW you weren't the only one excited about the 2007 election, Kevin Rudd had the country spellbound. You are right it's not supposed to be a popularity contest, ear lobes,long noses, voice projection, religious beliefs, hair does , fashionable clothes, etc. etc.

CheersSmileSmileSmileSmile

lyn

February 26. 2012 11:07 AM

Ad astra

Folks
When I went to bed last night after posting this piece, I did not anticipate finding this morning the large number of comments that were posted during the night, which have continued through the morning.

I thank you all for your kind words and encouragement and for your additional analysis and information.  TPS is a fine repository for useful information and insights from keen political observers.

First though, I would like to welcome to The Political Sword family three new contributors: lyne lady, grannie and Eve White.  We hope you will come back often and leave your comments, as you have done so comprehensively this morning.

There several comments to which I will respond, which I will do seriatim over the following hour.

Ad astra

February 26. 2012 11:11 AM

lyn

Hi Patricia

Thanks for putting up Andrew, there is so much out there I don't think I will cope with it all in the morning anyway.  I will still post the article for historical purposes in our archives with "Today's Links".

Go for it put up as much information as you can find for us, we need it.

Patricia said:
am very impressed that so many Labor MPs would rather lose their seats than support him

This impresses me too but also a worry if we get the wrong result tomorrow.

CheersSmileSmileSmileSmile

lyn

February 26. 2012 11:12 AM

Michael

Well, didn't Kevin Rudd have so much to say today to Laurie Oakes?

So much it can all be reduced to one word, two letters, one syllable...

"me"

Michael

February 26. 2012 11:16 AM

Ad astra

jaeger
You are obviously familiar with psychology.  Your analysis of Latham, Abbott and Rudd is astute.  A clip from Laurie Oakes’ interview of Kevin Rudd this morning, aired on ABC TV, shows Rudd promising total loyalty to Julia Gillard if she is elected to leadership tomorrow.  Time will tell if that is genuine, or whether Rudd continues to be, to use your words, ‘the smiling assassin’.

BTW, I was unable to see the Oakes interview due to my TV picture so breaking-up that it became unwatchable, right here in the centre of Melbourne!  Those who saw it may wish to comment on it here.

Ad astra

February 26. 2012 11:33 AM

Ad astra

DMW
You mention ‘the faceless men’.  I am old enough to remember the original use of that term.  As Wikipedia records: ”At the March ALP conference, journalist Alan Reid commissioned a photograph of Arthur Calwell and Gough Whitlam standing outside the venue at Kingston in Canberra. Although Calwell was the Leader of the Opposition in the House of Representatives and Whitlam was on the opposition front bench, neither man was a member of the Party's federal executive. Reid jibed that the ALP was ruled by "36 faceless men" – a jibe that was effectively used by Menzies and is still remembered more than 40 years later.”.  Then the Parliamentary Labor Party was said to be governed by the 36 member Labor Federal Executive, whose faces were generally unknown to the public.  The tag ‘faceless men’ was potent then, and still is.  However, it is now somewhat of a misnomer.  The structure of the ALP is different now, and the behind-the-scenes manipulations are largely among caucus members, whose faces we know.  But the tag still gives the electorate the feeling that people other than those in charge are pulling Labor’s strings, and they don’t like it.  Factions still exist in all parties and have influence; they are drawn from the caucus, but no doubt influenced by non-elected apparatchiks.    

It is hard to imagine the powerbrokers relinquishing any of their power, but being exposed as they have been during this episode, they may be more circumspect in the future.

Ad astra

February 26. 2012 11:35 AM

TalkTurkey

Grannie!
I am so pleased . for you . to have your say on The Political Sword.
Kiss !

johnL1
Lots of info . . . Thank you . . . but of it all what I do remember particularly were the Kevin O'Lemon ads, if Rudd had got up they would be back by Tuesday!

Amazingly - well not really, some of us have predicted it - this whole saga is being amazingly good for Labor!.

Lyne Lady - I saw your post on PB earlier directing Bludgers here to Ad's Admirable Article. You are always welcome, and isn't Rob Oakeshott something eh, he is courageous to the point of nobility, I honour him much. and I have read many of your posts on PB too, well without wishing to poach some of the best writers from PB, I assure you that you are welcome to post here anytime.

Hat tip to Jaeger, all other Goodwillian Swordsfolks too.

Bring Back Maxine
You would know that I have used your blog name right back at you before, loving your gravatar and admiring your povs, but yes I saw that sour Maxine yesterday too, gee it doesn't take much to trash a great reputation and she managed it for me in a few words. So sorry.

Bring Back Maxine you said

I'm really annoyed that such Labor notables as Anthony Albanese, Maxine McKew & Ed Husic have come out in support of Rudd. I regard all Rudd supporters as accessories after the fact of this treachery which almost delivered Abbott government.

Yes imagine Ed Husic, and Maxine! Albanese is different and could yet be the mango ointment for the stripes Rudd will have to bear in 24 hours.  

To be fair to Husic I haven't seen his reasoning, but I doubt whether I would think it sensible. Maxine, well she does seem rancid doesn't she!

Come on Maxine girl, sweeten up. You did a great thing rolling the Rodent, don't ruin it now.


BBM then you said

I'll be looking for a new avatar & Blog name.

Swordsfolks ! Help BBM in his time of trouble!

Announcing!

The Quest for the New Gravatar! Smile

Suggestions?

Must be made by 8 pm tonight when I will put up my own suggestion.
BBM is under no obligation to accept any btw of course.

Insiders was much more respectful and reasonable than I had expected. There are hidden agendas with Crassidy of course, but even Pigs was a bit restrained toady. Oops today. Smile

*smiling assassin* Ad ? Yes, and *the enemy within*.

I just hope he isn't so-o-o-o-o bent out of shape he does something we will all regret . . . He does have that capability.

Grannie don't you worry about fat fingers.
We like what you say. Do keep coming

I can't keep up with the new Swordsfolks today!

*STOP THE BLUDGERS!* Smile

TalkTurkey

February 26. 2012 11:41 AM

Ad astra

el gordo
I seem to remember you having been here before, but if not, a warm welcome to the family.

My estimate is that an alternative candidate will not be in the offing until much later, and then, according to the pundits, only if the polls continue to be poor.  Here again we see this pointless focus on polls.  I thought Nicola Roxon hit the nail on the head this morning on Insiders when she said polls were simply snapshots that are unable to predict.  Exactly, especially this far out from an election.  I wish Labor would abandon the use of polls to fashion its strategy.  

Ad astra

February 26. 2012 11:50 AM

Ad astra

NormanK
I read your thesis with great interest and I must say it has an air of plausibility.  We will never know whether Rudd’s Apology was a sincere from-the-heart embodiment of what most Australians felt, which required courage to make, or whether, in the light of recent revelations, was a cynical low-risk populist strategy to enhance his image and popularity.  I can only hope it was the former – that was the way it came over to me at the time.

Your second suggestion that caucus members supporting Rudd might see him being used as a popular front man while the real governing was done by others, is intriguing.  That would require a complete reversal of the control freak, ‘I-can-do-anything’ aura that surrounds Rudd right now.  Is that possible?

Ad astra

February 26. 2012 11:54 AM

Ad astra

jane
Thank you for your comment, with which many readers would be in accord.

I empathize strongly with your comment: ”To my sadness and anger, instead of the noble sinned against hero of my imagination, I find he is a grubby, spiteful, vindictive autocrat, who plotted to bring down a duly elected government and to blacken the character of his successor out of revenge and hubris. 

He has betrayed himself, his colleagues, his supporters and the people of this country. He is not fit to be PM.

Ad astra

February 26. 2012 12:01 PM

Ad astra

DMW
The Samantha Maiden piece is probably a forerunner of many like it, where journalists expose vignettes of Rudd behaviour, which to date have been kept under wraps, for reasons I don’t understand considering the hostility of much of the press towards the Government.  The fact that Rudd denies making disparaging remarks about our female PM, yet several journalists are willing to make statuary declarations that he did indeed make them, gives still more insight into Rudd’s modus operandi.

Ad astra

February 26. 2012 12:04 PM

NormanK

That would require a complete reversal of the control freak, ‘I-can-do-anything’ aura that surrounds Rudd right now.  Is that possible?

No.

It was a completely fanciful look at how the ALP could turn the current circumstances to their advantage but not only would Rudd not accept it, it wouldn't work. If Rudd were re-instated on Monday morning, the piranhas would make sure that he was nothing but bones by Monday evening. The Cone of Silence has been lifted and although it may take a long time for more Australians to have the scales fall from their eyes, it is inevitable that the revelations will continue - especially if Rudd maintains a high profile.

NormanK

February 26. 2012 12:10 PM

Ad astra

TT
Thank you again for your kind words and encouragement, and the YouTube clip.

It will be fascinating to view the next QT to see how the Coalition will try to make hay out of Labor’s discomfiture, and Labor’s response to it.

I’m return to the south coast today rather than tomorrow so I don’t miss any of it by being on the road.

Thank you too for pasting the Dan Gulberry post on PB

VENCEREMOS! Indeed.

Ad astra

February 26. 2012 12:10 PM

Tom of Melbourne

While Ad Astra might prefer to adopt a façade of impartiality, this only serves to reinforce predetermined bias (which is par for the course).

There are a range of characteristics that arguably, would equally put Rudd in way front of Gillard, for example –
•  Honesty, and rebuilding of community trust in the political process.
•  Ability to provide a sense of community alignment
•  Capability of representing Australia internationally
•  Independence of backroom political manipulation

I’m sure there are a range of other genuine leadership factors I could identify to prove a point if I was inclined.

The bitterness of the attack on Rudd is disgraceful.

Tom of Melbourne

February 26. 2012 12:18 PM

Ad astra

JohnL
Thank you for your detailed comment.  You really have a wonderful capacity for dredging up relevant facts and figures.  You are an asset to TPS

Whether or not it took courage from Julia Gillard to change the MMRT is debatable, but she got the legislation through.  As they say, ‘compromise is the art of politics’, but there will always be argument about the propriety of any compromise.

Ad astra

February 26. 2012 12:21 PM

janice

Ad astra,
Excellent article as usual but I think you were too kind to Kevin Rudd who has outed himself as a vain, lying and deceitful, traitorous excuse for an honest human being.

Since he called the media out in the middle of the night in Washington where he was supposed to have his mind entirely on his duties as FM, I have been watching him carefully.  His rhetoric has been as changeable as the wind and measured according to his mood at the moment. He wavers from the cheat and liar to the sweet and innocent. He plays the 'poor little me' victim like a violin and is prepared to lie through his teeth when attempting to answer the allegations of his colleagues if he thinks there is no video/audio evidence.  If he thinks there might actually be evidence, then he comes up with a carefully crafted excuse for such behaviour which is not uncommon behaviour in certain circumstances.  Some media appearances have shown him nervous and twitchy and a couple of hours later he appears again all calm and sweetness and light.  Is he on medication?

The Oakes interview this morning was one where Oakes handled him with kid gloves.  He either lied or waffled around questions and vehemently denied the allegations of his colleagues.  He is now appealing to his adoring public by promising that he will be a good little vegemite on the back benches if he loses and will work tirelessly to keep Abbott out of the Lodge.  Pity he didn't bother about handing govt to Abbott when he went about his termite operation to bring about the fall of the PM and thereby the government - not to mention very nearly handing govt to Abbott in 2010.

I have come to the conclusion that Kevin Rudd is mentally ill and therefore should not be allowed any influence whatever in the government of the nation.

janice

February 26. 2012 12:23 PM

Ad astra

BBM
Thank you for your kind comment.  I look forward to your new name and Gravatar.

2353
Thank you for your helpful comments.  Terry Sweetman’s article was very apt.

I won’t beam you up Scotty, we need you here.

Ad astra

February 26. 2012 12:38 PM

lyn

Good Morning Ad

Thankyou so very much for your article The-Gillard-Rudd-comparative-scorecard-, your work is valuable and appreciated very much. Your words have helped me heaps you are an educationalist for all of us on TPS.

See how popular you are, your last  piece went viral,   circulating quickly from person to person, and so has this one, but to be sure it has a lot more travelling to do yet.

TT mentioned links on PB, there have been lots of tweets as well,  I have only just posted Public to Facebook.

My first tweet for TPS:

lynlinking Lyn Linking
Julia has a vast thrilling vision for Australia its people if only media would facilitate its promulgation Ad Astra thepoliticalsword.com/post/2012/02/2

Leroy_LynchLeroy
The Gillard - Rudd comparative scorecard #gillardrudd #respill #kevenge #auspol www.thepoliticalsword.com/.../...e-scorecard-.aspx Considered & accurate via @lynlinking

WhileyAndrew @WhileyAndrew favorited your Tweet

zacksterZac Spitzer
The Political Sword | The Gillard - Rudd comparative scorecard: http://bit.ly/wdzlic


Laurie Oakes interview:-

I was doing my best: Rudd,
Interview Video with Laurie Oakes this morning
Updated February 26, 2012 12:08:13

Kevin Rudd tells Laurie Oakes his senior ministers never expressed any concern about his leadership style when he was PM and denies referring to Julia Gillard as a 'childless, atheist ex-communist'.

www.abc.net.au/.../3853268

You can now watch Nicola Roxon's interview from Insiders this morning.
Nicola Roxon joins Insiders
Attorney-General Nicola Roxon joins Insiders to discuss Labor's leadership crisis.

Barrie Cassidy, The Insiders
www.abc.net.au/.../3853234

lyn

February 26. 2012 12:46 PM

nasking

When I see Insiders' Barrie Cassidy, predictably, working w/ Nicola Roxon & Murdoch's toad Piers Ackerman to further tarnish former PM Kevin Rudd I can only shake my head at the grotesque alliance that has once again risen its head to undermine a popular, certainly flawed, but understandably aggrieved individual...ex-PM.

The attacks on the effective Bruce Hawker have likewise been disgusting...the lowest of low.

In regard to the devious & sick campaign hatched to destroy our former PM, which obviously began long before Kevin was knifed as he was not considered an ALP union man enuff...I would expect no less from the Putin government...or a bunch of slimy commies trying via the backdoor to create a one-size- fits-all country...destroying any critic or centrists, maverick politician in their way.

My wife & I had a lovely b'day w/ her family yesterday...and whilst at Sizzlers the ALP leadership battle came up constantly.

My wife's brother usually votes Labor...he voted for Kev in 07...yet he went for the Libs reluctantly in 10 because he was so disgusted w/ Gillard & her team stabbing a sitting PM in the back in his first-term.

He said he will not vote ALP in the upcoming election if Gillard is still there...he believes she was a great Deputy, effective in parliament & helping to coordinate...but he feels that Labor needs someone like Rudd at the top to get the public's attention & talk vision.

He feels Rudd is very effective w/ people on the ground via the media...more at ease and sometimes charming and funny...yet w/ the gravitas one expects at time from a big leader...whereas, Julia comes across as a bit cold, stiff and oft snappy, touchy...seems angrily defensive.

His wife is a Liberal...

neither are particularly happy w/ how early the means-test on the private healthcare rebate comes in as both of them & their young boy have required useful specialised help from private hospitals/healthcare in their time...

particularly the past decade (I can attest to that)...and they feel that even tho there wages are pretty good as one has a management job in the disability sector...they feel they are being penalised for work wages that they may not be able to continue for a long time due to their health circumstances...at a time when they are close to paying off their home...and wanting to put their boy in a Lutheran school that was recommended to them.

They agreed that the dependent spouse rebate should not have been undermined that way it has.

They are highly supportive of the disability insurance scheme...

and the NBN...but think it is too expensive...think Turnbull might do a better job w/ it due to his background...

but the husband has no love for Abbott (but as I said before...his loathing of Gillard got him to vote Liberal last time...YIKES!).

S's brother also likes the fact the Tax-Free Threshold is changing in July...

but thinks we should have an ETS as soon as possible. He wants to see more energy diversity...w/ lots of solar panels on roofs as he saw in some countries in Europe. He has them himself.

Note: the Disability Insurance Scheme...and a restructured NBN got the biggest thumbs up from them. They were impressed by the internet in Sth Korea & Greece (of all places).

BTW, both originate from families who had little money but worked hard to send their kids to moderate, not overly religious private schools...

they are yer typical laid back on weekends QLDers...who can be shopaholics, use e-Bay...spoil their child...luv eating out or BBQing & go to Coffee Club/cafes...had investment properties they've now sold...luv the big house & garden...do the elaborate party/celebration bit for Xmas & their boy's b'days/naming ceremony/Christening etc...luv to travel & experience fresh cuisine from other places...tho typically Aussie Aussie Aussie...very mainstream (think TV shows, advertised music etc...tho the hubby listens to a bit of alternative stuff too).

The husband is the kind of voter Rudd has to win back.

BTW, I missing the Australian Democrats more by the day.

N'

nasking

February 26. 2012 01:01 PM

nasking

but yes I saw that sour Maxine yesterday too, gee it doesn't take much to trash a great reputation and she managed it for me in a few words.

Gimme a break!

TT,
some of the comments on here are the grubbiest I've seen in years. This is our former PM yer talking about...the individual who helped bring down Howard after 11+ long years.

Are you nuts?

The stuff from some on the ALP frontbench about as low as you can get.

What is this? Former East Germany? Stalinists trying to destroy all before them?

The stuff I'm reading is so myopic & biased I'm blown away.

If this is how you & that part of the ALP treat a great former PM...how will you treat critics, dissidents when yer Julia has more power?

I watched Britian become paralysed back in the 60s & 70s when the far-left & unionists got too much power...I've never forgotten it. I remember the attacks...the threats.

I also think Thatcher went overboard too. Providing toffs w/ the courage to treat others like dirt.

I want balance...choice...sanity.

All tho I support some Green policies...and some of the ALPs...I will not support a party that permits such vicious Stalinist-like propaganda attacks on a former PM...nor those who knifed him.

It's disgusting.

Ad astra,
I cannot believe you supported Jane's grotesque comment. Jane, I'm shocked you've taken such a myopic approach that will see the government lose the next election.

Sad days indeed.

Gillard supporters, I fear you. You are no better than Abbott's lot.

N'

nasking

February 26. 2012 01:01 PM

Jason

Aa,
  


GrogsGamut | 15 minutes ago

RT @chmharvey: Laurie v Kevin: the transcript. Via The Australian. http://t.co/1W6VwwS4

Jason

February 26. 2012 01:04 PM

nasking

The Samantha Maiden piece is probably a forerunner of many like it, where journalists expose vignettes of Rudd behaviour

Ad,
Samantha Maiden is a paid Murdoch assassin who will do anything to destroy the ALP & get Abbott in...

what a grotesque alliance I'm observing once again.

Poor Ruddy. The LONG KNIVES are out again.

N'

nasking

February 26. 2012 01:13 PM

Ian

posting this on political sword, frank and pb

To the Kevin Rudd supporters in the Labor Party caucus.

I would ask to consider, and answer, as honestly as you can.... these questions.

Does the welfare of 23 million Australian citizens matter to you?

Does the ego of Kevin Rudd overide those 23 million citizens?

At anytime throughout the Rudd Government did you have misgivings about his leadership?

Did you have the courage to speak out if this were so?

If, as you state, Kevin Rudd didn't get a fair go, why didn't you stick your principles and resign from any positions you may have held, or, indeed, the party itself?

Do you think that hiding behind the, obviously sympathetic, bound by cabinet conventions of your colleagues, is a noble position in which to undermine and destroy a Govt. and party you profess to love?

Can you guarantee, should Mr Rudd find himself on the backbench tomorrow, he will repay your trust in his integrity and not start another destabilising campaign through the auspices of Mr Hawker?

As the truth is becoming more apparent about Mr Rudds style of leadership do think it was necessary for the good of the country to remove him.

If not, do you therefore think that it was necessary for Mr Rudd to leak, brief, background journalists, while refering to the PM, and by definition, the office of Prime Minister in such an obscenely derogatory way?

Can you give a guarantee to the Australian people that as  Australias Foreign Minister Mr Rudd, while busily undermining a duly elected democratic government, acted with this countries best interests at heart?

Do you believe that Mr Rudd served both his ego and his heart with regards to the last question?  

There are many more questions you could ask yourselves. Many questions that would require a brutally honest answer. Perhaps you will have the courage to ask them? Perhaps not?

We will find out tomorrow.....wont we?



Ian

February 26. 2012 01:17 PM

Jason

Nasking,
       "The attacks on the effective Bruce Hawker have likewise been disgusting...the lowest of low. "

Yet Farrell, Feeny and Arbib part of the "faceless men shtick"
put up by Rudd and Hawker, are part of the caucas that has a vote tomorrow.
Hawker has no vote and holds no elected position in the Labor party. A real "faceless man.  

Jason

February 26. 2012 01:17 PM

NormanK

nasking

Has someone hacked your computer?

NormanK

February 26. 2012 01:28 PM

lyn

Hi Ian

Big thankyou to you, I have read some of your comments in the past and I always feel like asking you can I pinch your opinion Please.

Thankyou so much for your interesting brilliant words.

CheersSmileSmileSmileSmileSmile)

lyn

February 26. 2012 01:32 PM

nasking

Hawker has no vote and holds no elected position in the Labor party. A real "faceless man.

Jason,
Hawker's well known. Not faceless.

Gillard's team has rolled out critics like Marr, Cassidy & former ALPers...

I noticed the following from that transcipt you put up:

Hawker has no vote and holds no elected position in the Labor party. A real "faceless man.

Jason,
Hawker's well known. Not faceless.

Gillard's team has rolled out critics like Marr, Cassidy & former government ALPers...such as Hawke...

LO: You say you’ve never been a creature of the factions but the factions put you there. The factions put the Rudd Gillard team together they made you the leadership team, so you owed your Prime Ministership to the factions. Isn’t it fair that he who lives by the factions dies by factions?
KR: Actually Laurie that is not true. I mean for example the AWU faction which Mr Swan belongs to vigorously and viciously campaigned against my elevation to the leadership in 2006. The SDA faction, known affectionately as the ‘shoppies’ did exactly the same. Other particular unions did exactly the same. I’ve just got to say, I mean the fact that I was able to emerge as leader at that time was because of broad-based support from many, many groups within the parliamentary party, and many individuals. But I've got to say, the factional hierarchy has never been pleased with me, and that's because I've consistently refused to bend a knee to them, because I regard my responsibility as ultimately to the broader party, and to the Australian people.

LO: As I said, though, it's senior ministers who are leading the charge against you, whereas on your part, it's Bruce Hawker, a lobbyist, who's out there every day leading your campaign. Isn't he the ultimate faceless man, the unelected faceless man?

KR: Well, can I say on that core accusation, Laurie, I would not regard Chris Bowen as a junior minister. I don't regard Anthony Albanese as a junior minister. I don't regard Martin Ferguson as a junior minister. I don't regard the former attorney-general, and still Cabinet minister, Robert McClelland, as a junior minister. Nor would I regard Kim Carr, the hero of Australian manufacturing, as some minor afterthought in the scheme of
things.

The truth is that there are different views within the Cabinet. I accept that and I respect that. Just as there are different views within the Caucus. But whatever happens on Monday, we respect the Caucus's views.

LO: But you're dodging the question about Bruce Hawker, aren't you?

KR: Not at all.

LO: Are you paying him?

KR: Of course not. That is an absurd accusation, Laurie. Can I just say, many of us in politics have longstanding friends, and remain loyal. I’ve been a friend of Bruce’s for twenty years, that’s the bottom line and the fact that you’ve got other friends and supporters of other people in politics who pop up from time to time that I presume is all par for the course. I think it is quite wrong to focus on Bruce. I think you would probably agree with me Laurie that Graham Richardson is not exactly a big, big supporter of mine. He seems to have

(Interview by Laurie Oakes w/ Kevin Rudd)

Has someone hacked your computer?

Norman,
this governments led by Gillard has & is making some stupid decisions...pushing away the aspiring middle class...rather than making the upper middle class pay their fair share...so many policies need to be tweaked (IR & tax related to small business, carbon price) or made stronger (think mining tax)...

the stupid decision they made previously was knifing a sitting PM in his first-term.

That's a fact.

N'

nasking

February 26. 2012 01:35 PM

nasking

Few mistakes above...trying to cook my wife's special brunch at same time.

N'

nasking

February 26. 2012 01:37 PM

DMW

Ad @ 11:33 AM,
As Wikipedia records (incorrectly): ... Reid jibed that the ALP was ruled by "36 faceless men"

The story behind how the photographs that eventually gave rise to the "faceless men" is fascinating in itself. It is about persistence and a 'nose for the story' that seems lacking in many reporters today.

The book Alan "The Red Fox" Reid: Pressman Par Excellence by Ross Fitzgerald and Stephen Holt informs history well.

In an edited extract that can be found here:
www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-e6frgczf-1225872615957

Reid, powerfully aided by Paral's back-of-the-head shots of conference delegates, had originally written about the "virtually unknown men" and their role at the 1963 special conference.
He had posited a void, which Menzies had filled up with scary imagery. The Menzies formulation of "36 faceless men" reinforced the idea in the mind of a fearful electorate. The notion was milked for all it was worth.


There is still some conjecture as to who origanly coined the phrase but it was not Reid and Menzies claim to it was refuted by at least one backbencher whose name escapes for the moment.

DMW

February 26. 2012 01:38 PM

Ad astra

Hi Lyn
Thank you for welcoming our new commenters.  Your warmth is appreciated by us all.

Did you see Insiders this morning?  It was all I could get, so I didn’t see the Laurie Oakes interview.

I thought it was a pretty balanced program.  The Nicola Roxon interview was brilliant.  She is a classy professional.  She not once put a foot wrong.

It was interesting to see Piers Akerman not attacking Julia Gillard but instead criticizing Kevin Rudd, something he could hardly avoid since he has been making these self-same criticisms for years.  No doubt, he feels vindicated.

I thought the discussion was somewhat anti-Rudd and at times even a little pro-Gillard.  I feel the media generally may feel that Julia has had a rough trot, not just from Kevin Rudd, but also from the media, and perhaps deserves more clear air to get her message out.  I have the impression that even media insiders have not been fully aware of Rudd’s sabotage, and how difficult that has made the PM’s task.  Can we hope for a better run from them?  Time will tell.

I thought what Nicola had to say about polls was apt: ‘they are but a snapshot and cannot predict’.  Why then do journalists place such store on them?  The reason I believe is not their predictive capacity, but the ease with which they lend themselves to multiple easy-to-write stories and flashy headlines.  And of course they generate money for polling organizations and their usual owners, news outlets.  Her interview is here: www.abc.net.au/insiders/content/2012/s3439650.htm

Andrew Catsaras’ analysis of aggregate polling was informative.  The current average TPP is 54/46, well within Labor’s capacity to narrow and reverse in the eighteen months until the next scheduled election.  All the gloom and dire predictions from the so-called pundits that Labor is certain to lose badly and be in the wilderness for a decade are not justified either on the polling figures or on the history of polling.  Why do these people, like Richo for example, make such predictions?  They are not stupid, so I guess it is just to grab a headline, to make a sensational story, or more cynically to damage Labor by imprinting in the mind of the electorate that Labor is doomed, invoking the bandwagon effect where everyone wants to be on the winner, not the loser.  It is both illegitimate and malevolent.  In my view, we in the Fifth Estate ought to use every opportunity to highlight the uselessness of polls, except of course for commercial or covert political ends!

Andrew is here: www.abc.net.au/insiders/content/2012/s3439649.htm

The link to the whole program is here: http://www.abc.net.au/insiders/

Did you see the Oakes interview?  What did you think?

Ad astra

February 26. 2012 01:39 PM

nasking

Can you give a guarantee to the Australian people that as  Australias Foreign Minister Mr Rudd, while busily undermining a duly elected democratic government, acted with this countries best interests at heart?

Ian,
there is no bigger undermining of a government than to brutally knife its leader in his first-term.

It led to a minority government. JUST. W/ a scumbag health union guy propping it up. Nice one.

Think yerselves lucky that Abbott was Lib leader during that 10 election...if it had been Turnbull or Costello at the time it is likely Labor would once again be in the wilderness.

N'

nasking

February 26. 2012 01:39 PM

Ad astra

Jason
Many thanks for the Oakes-Rudd interview which I shall examine later.

Ad astra

February 26. 2012 01:43 PM

nasking

I thought it was a pretty balanced program.  The Nicola Roxon interview was brilliant.  She is a classy professional.  She not once put a foot wrong.

Ad,
nothing balanced about it. My Wife & I were disgusted. It was a concerted attack on Rudd by Hawke's boy Cassidy & Roxon...w/ the gleeful assistance of Murdoch's man Ackerman...

Roxon can go to the backbench as a two-faced type as far as I'm concerned.

Many of the public will have seen the same.

N'

nasking

February 26. 2012 01:58 PM

Ad astra

Nasking
You find it unacceptable that I am in accord with jane’s views.  Please don’t despair for those of us who support Julia Gillard and are disillusioned with someone we all admired and respected greatly – PM Rudd.  We are sad it has come to this, but the scales have fallen from our eyes.  We are as sad about this as you are sad that his reputation is now so tarnished.  The decline of heroes is always painful.  So please respect our feelings and views as we respect yours.  We are all friends.

What I find incredible is the belief that only Kevin Rudd can save Labor from defeat in 2013.  Who says so?  In a messianic message, Kevin says so, and so do his supporters.  Yet incredibly all this is built on opinion polls eighteen months prior to an election and a facile popularity contest between a Kevin the public thinks it knows (the popular celebrity), and a Julia whose image has been trashed by the media, and now we find by Kevin himself.  In my view it is sheer madness to mount a case on polling figures from a small and I expect disinterested sample.  I wonder what the popularity figures will be after the public has absorbed all that has come out in the last week, all of which points in the same direction.

Ad astra

February 26. 2012 02:03 PM

Augustus



"BTW, I missing the Australian Democrats more by the day."

So do I, they were my natural choice and played an important roll until Natasha, but come the 2007 election I was politically homeless there was no way I would vote Liberal. I liked what Kevin was offering, his stances and commitments, it was refreshing to see and they were genuine. I had read Latham's diatribe cunningly described as a book where he spoke of Rudd being a serial leaker, vendictive, and had an over inflated sense of his own self importance, I read it as bitter and given how Latham's credibility had all but evaporated (those who throw stones should not live in glass houses) I had discounted it, but unfortunately as his prime minstership had progressed I saw something else, there is no doubt in my mind Kevin is highly intelligent and highly committed but a poor manager with a few foibles. Unfortunately it is those foibles combined with his lack managerial skills had forced the party to select another leader, Kevin was given the opportunity to remain a valued member of the front bench in a highly respected position rather than as customary turfed off to the back bench. I do not believe at the time there was any malice, I do agree that there could have been a better way and I can understand why Kevin had felt hurt, but today looking back I do think that Kevin has brought alot of this upon himself.

Augustus

February 26. 2012 02:06 PM

nasking

I noticed this from Patricia whilst I was away organising my wife's b'day:

Poor Rudd is dead!

Poor Rudd is  dead.
At last Rudd is dead.
Canberra's press people heave a sigh.
At last the truth's been been told.
He is done for, has been rolled.
Cos Laurie Oakes refused to tell a lie.


Yes, I imagine that many a factional heavyweight & Gillard supporter were wishing this when poor Ruddy was knifed.

I remember them saying that about Howard when he lost the Liberal leadership.

Also, I noticed yesterday that Anthony Albanese supports Rudd. One of the pollies I most respect. Someone who is able to get the kind of attention necessary...and stick it to Abbott...the way Rudd does.

They don't sound like they are in a custody battle for a child named Australia like Gillard & Abbott are...neither coming out on top w/ the people...yet the Coalition leads leads leads & again leads the polls.

Rudd ain't dead.

HE'S BACK...and he's gonna kick Abbott into the next decade.

N'

nasking

February 26. 2012 02:11 PM

Ad astra

Nasking
Thank you for your descriptive account of how your family members feel.  Their views deserve our respect.

I just wanted to pick up on one person you mentioned – Bruce Hawker.  He has decided to throw in his lot with Kevin Rudd, but I find it a bit rich to hear him condemning the ‘faceless men’, who are actually parliamentarians, while he is doing exactly what they are – advocating for their candidate – using no less partisan language than they have.  He even had the effrontery to suggest overnight that Julia Gillard shown not even contest the ballot, as she has lost the confidence of the people, presumably based on the polls, about which he is well aware of the flaws.  He is hardly ‘faceless’ in reality as we see his face on every TV outlet, but he is ‘faceless’ to the extent that he is not a member of the group entitled to vote – the caucus.  If Rudd loses as expected, he may find he has shot himself in the foot for other Labor contracts.  I wonder how Anna Blight feels about him now.

Ad astra

February 26. 2012 02:21 PM

Augustus

Ad Astra,

You mention Bruce Hawker, I wonder just how much Hawker is pushing his own agenda by pushing Kevin Rudd as the agenda, it has been reported that during Rudd's leadership Hawker had a permanent desk in the PMO which evaporated after the chance of leader and Hawker found himself less important, I guess it begs the question has Hawker been behind Kevin Rudd challenging.

Augustus

February 26. 2012 02:23 PM

Ad astra

Ian
What a great set of questions?  Will Rudd supporters give us the answers?

DMW
Thanks for another historical perspective on the origin of ‘the faceless men’ tag.  I learn something new and interesting every day at TPS.

Augustus
I must go back to Latham’s book.  I must say that with Latham’s reputation I did not give much credence to his remarks about Rudd.  Maybe there was some truth in them.

Folks
I’d love to keep on responding to your comments, but I really need to get on the road back to the south coast, so I’ll say goodbye until this evening.

Ad astra

February 26. 2012 02:33 PM

nasking

The decline of heroes is always painful.  So please respect our feelings and views as we respect yours.  We are all friends.

Ad,
I see no decline. Just an ascent.

I shall always respect you...and the wonderful Lyn...and others on here, they know who they are.

But I believe strongly in my heart that some on here are so intensely biased that they are willing to stomp on the likes of me and other critics...and what kind of society does that lead to?

It's what we feared from the Howardistas....the Murdoch empire.

It does feel like a pile-on...more so after I took a break for my wife's b'day yesterday & Fri eve...

I am convinced that Julia Gillard as PM will lead the ALP into the wilderness...the perception out there w/ the public in QLD is not good. You need QLD. Rural voters. More Christian voters. many others that Gillard will not get.

Now, if Gillard wins the ballot, I will take a break for awhile. I'm so disgusted w/ that team & their supporters and the memory of the knifing so VIVID I will not be able to contribute for some time.

I'm sure some on here will be relieved.

If I return after a Gillard win, after a break to reflect & heal the wounds...it will be to go after an Abbott-led govt...I will not go out of my way to support a Gillard-led one.

Tho, I will support policies if I think them right...well put together...not undermining the middle class. But rather making the upper middle class & some rich corporate fascists pay their fair share.

It's tragic watching a party disintegrate like this...but I guess it was to be expected...when politicians act like mini-Stalinist commies in the night.

Good luck Ad. Yer a fine poster...and persuasive.

But you haven't persuaded me I'm afraid...I know a Titanic when I see it. Captain Gillard just ain't got what it takes.

N'

nasking

February 26. 2012 02:45 PM

Sandy

Nasking 1.01pm and 1.04pm today

I agree with and second everything that Nasking has said.  
I too am shocked and dismayed at the attacks displayed here on TPS.

Yuck!!!!

Yes Nasking, sad days indeed.

Sandy

February 26. 2012 02:46 PM

Ad astra

Nasking
One last comment before getting on the road.  Thank you for your generous comments, which I appreciate.  I’m not really trying to persuade you to my view – I’m just expressing my views, as you have, for others to consider.  I am not in possession of absolute truth.

We are friends here, and you are one of our close friends.  So whatever the result tomorrow, let’s keep talking, calmly and respectfully.  There is no need for you to take a break, unless that is what you want.

Ad astra

February 26. 2012 02:48 PM

Ad astra

Sandy
You too are a part of our family.  We may have different views, but let's tolerate that difference as sound families should.

Ad astra

February 26. 2012 02:55 PM

lyn

Hi Ad

I was just going to call out to you "Hey Wait for me".

Yes I did watch the Laurie Oakes interview, with glued to the screen eyes.

I noticed Laurie's one omission, no mention of any leaks, isn't that what Laurie survives on.   Laurie's reports are over-rated his best days are long behind him.  I do think though there is a feel for Rudd and it comes across in Laurie's approach.

The interview was very bland, Kevin Rudd had a long rope, there was little or no encouragement for Julia .

The Insiders were Ok, but seeing Piers always upsets me. This morning I thought,  to submit my resignation to the Insiders telling them, because of their lounge sitters, I therefore resile from any further analysis of their performance.  There,  they will be sorry about that.
Wouldn't you honestly think on the eve of tomorrow's vote (Historical) they could have found someone more reputable than Piers Ackerman.

anti-Rudd and at times even a little pro-Gillard

I agree with you Ad a ittle pro-Gillard perhaps.

Andrew Catsaras’ analysis of aggregate polling was informative.,
I congratulated Andrew on Twitter . Good news Andrew is going to analyse all the polls once a month.

Cheers Ad have a peaceful trip back to the coast. SmileSmileSmileSmileSmile

lyn

February 26. 2012 03:04 PM

Ad astra

Hi Lyn
There are so many comments, that somehow I missed yours.  Thank you again for your kind remarks and the additional information you supplied, some of which I will digest more fully when I get back to the south coast later today.

janice
I somehow I missed your comments too.  Thank you for your frank assessment.  There will be many who will agree with your opinion of Kevin Rudd’s behaviour, and of course some who will disagree violently.  

As supporters of Kevin Rudd, I’m sure it is as distressing to you as it is to me to digest what has transpired over the last year.  Unless anyone thinks otherwise, we take no joy in his fall from grace.  It is tragic.  So much was promised.

I must get on the road now; it’s getting late.

Ad astra

February 26. 2012 03:36 PM

Kate

Nasking and Sandy you aren't alone in despairing at the personal attacks against Kevin Rudd.  I had hope that Anthony Albanese's genuine statement yesterday would encourage some people to temper their more outrageous accusations.  It seems it is not to be the case.  Instead we see his supporters vilified along with him.  The comments on Maxine McKew are just nasty.  Why is it that many respected commentators and politicians who support him are now reviled and yet those commentators we have rightly mocked in the past as hopelessly dishonest and biased against Labor are now held up as paragons of honesty?  To describe it as "scales falling from the eyes" doesn't cut it for me.  Is Albo then blind? And there are many others that like and respect Rudd.  Are they all terrible judges of character?  It seems to me that the vindictiveness has taken on a life of its own:  we are seeing a "lynch mob" mentality.

Given these comments you may be surprised that I hope Julia gets up.  Although I feel she and Rudd have engaged in MAD my priority is for the Government to run its full course and this is more likely with Julia at the helm, due to the Indies preferences.  I'm being pragmatic therefore.  But my emotions are raw and I despair that so many Labor supporters have turned with such venom on the man who achieved so much.  His achievements are now dismissed.

Albo validated my feelings and I thank him for it.  Nasking and one or two others make me feel less alone.  I thank them all.

Lastly, where is the surprise that 'Insiders' was pro Julia.  Having torn her down with the intention of hurting Labor's standing, Cassidy would hardly give a fair go to a man that could improve that standing.  Make no mistake, he and his ilk want Labor to lose the nest election and will do all they can to achieve it. I feel its a little naive to see it as his scales having fallen.  Once she is confirmed as Prime Minister he will begin the attack anew.

Kate

February 26. 2012 04:21 PM

Sir Ian Crisp

In search of the political Holy Grail – the Rudd Government narrative
Sunday, 14 September 2008 12:09 by Ad astra

What follows is derived not from detailed research, but purely from memory of what we’ve all heard from Rudd and his ministers time and again.
  
Some of the dot points that would characterize the Rudd Labor Government would be:

- Economic conservatism
- Fiscally responsible management that ensures large budget surpluses and reduced Government spending to reverse the inflationary trends evident through 2007 and the consequence, rising interest rates
- Long term planning and nation building to maintain Australia’s prosperity, competitiveness and growth via restoring infrastructure, skills training, and high speed broadband
- Supporting manufacturing while reducing protective tariffs; encouraging research and innovation; high employment
- Evidence-based approach to ideas/projects that involves reviews/assessments and expert advice
- An education revolution from pre-school through technical studies in high schools, TAFE and university
- Performance indicators to monitor teachers and student outcomes
- Reform: workplace reform; reform of Commonwealth-State relations to coordinate efforts in health, water, transport; a seamless economy that harmonizes regulation across States; and reform of the taxation system, reform of welfare support and the transfer system
- Tax relief and measures to assist in balancing the household budget and in supporting small business
- Social justice and a fair go for all, especially the socially disadvantaged
- Determination to ensure a sustainable environment
- Action on climate change that is effective yet not too burdensome on individuals, and small and large business
- Improvement of the lot of indigenous people and closing the life expectancy gap
- An improved health care system that meets community needs
- Action on water and the Murray Darling basin
- Using immigrant workers to cover labour shortages, and employing indigenous people gainfully
- Middle power international diplomacy; promotion of regional alliances; strengthening of defence capabilities
- Keeping election promises
  
If the above were to be included in a cohesive political narrative, it might read:

The Rudd Labor Government is dedicated to economic conservatism and fiscally responsible management that ensures large budget surpluses and lower Government spending to reverse the inflationary trends evident through 2007 and their consequence, rising interest rates.  Already rates have begun to fall, but the road to recovery will be long.

Long term planning is necessary for nation building, economic prosperity, competitiveness and growth.

The Rudd Government is committed to an evidence-based approach to planning that relies on reviews of the available information, tapping into the know-how of experts, and community consultation.  Thoughtful preparation is the first step towards worthy outcomes.  The Rudd Government will not be rushed when so much is at stake – getting it right from the outset is the object.

The Government is determined to restore depreciated infrastructure via the Building Australia Fund, to reinforce skills training to increase workforce participation, and to install high speed broadband to augment learning, training and business activity.
  
The Government is unwavering in its support for manufacturing in this country while steadily reducing protective tariffs.  Its object is high employment.

The Rudd Government is a reforming Government.   Workplace reform was one of its earliest actions; this is ongoing at a pace that allows for steady adjustment to the new order.
Reform of Commonwealth-State relations to coordinate efforts in health, water management, transport; and a seamless economy that harmonizes regulation across States, are among the most important reforms in train.  Comprehensive tax reform will be based on the Henry review and will include reform of welfare support, particularly for pensioners, carers, and those on fixed incomes, who are the ones suffering most in today’s economic climate.
  
The Government is committed to a universal health care system that provides care where and to whom it is needed at a price the individual and the community can afford. A new level of coordination across the Commonwealth and the States will ensure this occurs.
  
In pursuit of social justice and a fair go for all, especially the socially disadvantaged, the Government supports tax relief and measures to assist in balancing the household budget and supporting small business. We believe that a socially responsible Government looks after those who need support, and assists those who are seeking work to achieve gainful employment.

The Rudd Government is committed to a sustainable environment and to this end ratified the Kyoto protocol as its first act.  It accepts the reality of climate change and mankind’s contribution to it, and is determined to contribute meaningfully to carbon emissions control via a Carbon Pollution Reduction Scheme.  This is being developed following the Garnaut Report and the Green Paper with wide consultation with business and the community, and Treasury modeling.  There will be a cost.  But the burden will be reduced by compensation so that households and businesses will not be unfairly affected.  Innovative research towards renewable energy will be strongly supported.
  
Water reform is a key aim and in particular restoring the Murray-Darling system to a healthy state.  The water agreement with the States, the Murray Darling Commission and the water buy-back scheme will ensure that despite the worst drought in living memory this vital waterway will be restored as fast as is feasible.
    
The Government is determined to improve the lot of indigenous people.  The ‘Apology’ was just the beginning of a concerted push towards better health, closing the 17 year life-expectancy gap, and improving living conditions, education, housing and employment.  Assisting indigenous people achieve the standard of living of other Australians is a core aim.
  
To overcome chronic labour shortages in the agricultural sector the Government is introducing an immigrant worker scheme, which will have the added effect of aiding Pacific Island nations.  Indigenous people will also be gainfully employed.  Immigration will continue to be a major policy thrust.
  
Australia has an important role to play in middle power diplomacy.  It will promote regional alliances and play its role in international affairs.  In line with regional and global requirements, it will extend its defence capabilities, particularly its maritime strength.
  
Finally, the Rudd Government is determined to keep its election promises, so that the Australian people can rely on the sincerity and strength of purpose of this Government.  Our commitment is to good government for all the people, sound decision making and an ambitious program of enrichment of Australian society and its economic strength and cohesion, while caring for those who need the support of this our compassionate nation.

So there it is.  Although the words scarcely lend themselves to soaring oratory, they do have the potential to catch attention and engender assent.  There’s nothing there that we haven’t heard before.  It’s just an aggregation of announcements that have been made by the Rudd Government since its election.
    
Is this the narrative columnists are so eagerly seeking, or something like it?  Maybe we’ve all heard the narrative over and again without realizing it.  But maybe I’m barking up the wrong tree; if so, please put me right.  Please add your comments.  Is it what you would expect of the Rudd narrative?

Is it too long? Has something important been left out?  Has the exercise been worth the effort?  


After that appeared in The Political Sword I thought only two actions would follow. The first action was to bother His Holiness Pope Benedict XVI and tell him we had another Australian Saint on our hands. The Pope would have been thinking to himself...first Mary Mackillop, she was acceptable but then they nominated a chap by the name of Hawke....what a brave but unsuccessful battle he had with ebriosity and who can forget his succumbing to life’s carnal vices....then they tossed up the name Keating and the dogs started to bark....now they toss in a fellow by the name of Rudd....rhymes with dud....what is his hamartia?

Failing that I thought you would file papers to officially adopt K Rudd. You even mentioned that you would be proud to have K Rudd as your brother. Now, after telling us how bad he is I guess if he was your brother you would change the locks to keep him out of the house.

I was right back in 2008 when I told you Rudd was a professional idiot and I'm right now: the bird of paradox heads up an ALP camarilla of scheming shakedown artists.


Sir Ian Crisp

February 26. 2012 05:00 PM

Ian

[ there is no bigger undermining of a government than to brutally knife its leader in his first-term.][quote] [/quote]

I disagree

What has become abundantly clear over the last few days is the hubristic, self absorbed mindset of Kevin Rudd  as Prime Minister. That policy decisions appear not to have been  made because they may not have gone down too well  on trashy current affairs programs just beggars belief. Senior Ministers waiting like schoolchildren to see the headmaster? The main function of Government, to administer, becoming moribund? It appears it was a disgraceful egocentric driven shambles. There is no bigger undermining of the trust of the Australian people than that. Should this have continued, this breakdown of sound governance, for the pursuit of  the accolades designed only to soothe the fragile egos of the truly weak, the knives would have been  planted, by stealth, cunning and malice in the backs of the Australian citizens. The hard, admittedly brutal and fast decision taken was the correct one. History will prove it to be so.

You may wish to consider the following;

It is no surprise that corporate Australia want Kevin Rudd back in the chair.....they have his measure....in spades.

Julia Gillard has theirs.....in spades.



Ian

February 26. 2012 05:07 PM

NormanK

nasking

Let me try to walk you down the path that I have travelled over the last 18 months or more.
I was a huge supporter of Kevin 07 going back as far as his prosecution of the AWB scandal. I liked the man and far more importantly I liked the 'idea' of Kevin. Not aligned with any particular faction; taking back control of Cabinet appointments; willing to give jobs to ex-MPs from the Coalition; didn't sweep a new broom through the public service upper echelons; the 'Sorry' speech; ETS rhetoric; pension increase; RSPT - the list is fairly long. During the early stages of the GFC I took to calling him 'My Mate Kevin' when discussing him in this household. I defended every part of the stimulus packages and still do.

When stories emerged about causing a flight attendant to cry and hair-dryers and swearing at parliamentary colleagues I was in there defending him against what I saw as a campaign of destabilisation coming from some sections of the press. "Not Our Kevin", I said. When David Marr published his Monthly Essay about Rudd being driven by anger I said "Not My Mate Kevin".
I was surprised and disappointed by the postponement of the ETS and the temporary halt on some asylum seeker applications. A few other things left me scratching my head but the 'idea' of Kevin was too strong to relinquish in the face of a bit of gossip and some policy decisions that I perhaps didn't fully understand.

When the leadership spill occurred I was extremely angry since it seemed to have been prompted by his fall in the polls and I have nothing but disdain for opinion polls. I didn't see it as a knifing though (an expression which I wish you would desist in using) because it was not a couple of factions narrowly defeating another couple of factions. The numbers against Rudd were so overwhelming that he didn't even contest the ballot. That tells me that his colleagues did not want him as their leader - full stop.
I was also pleased and proud of Rudd for not declaring his seat vacant at the next election.
Over time it became apparent that opinion polls were not the driving force for the leadership challenge but I was left to wonder to myself just what it was that could have prompted such a drastic action. The only answer that I have been able to give myself for 12 months or more is that there must have been some huge policy stoush (perhaps asylum seekers) but even that did not seem to adequately explain what happened.

Move on to the 2010 election where Labor were sitting on 52/48 and, although bland, the election campaign was rolling along reasonably well. Even when Oakes' bombshell landed and derailed the campaign for Labor I was still saying "Not My Mate Kevin - he would never destabilise his own party. Perhaps someone from his camp but not Kevin". However, Rudd didn't call his supporters and demand an end to the leaks, instead they came out at regular intervals with the end result being a hung parliament instead of a modest win to Labor. From then on I began to lose faith in My Mate Kevin. Whispers of undermining were in the press week after week and although even then I didn't point to Kevin, I did wonder why it was that he was not calling on his colleagues to give up the practice. Why too was he not willing to use his popularity to the benefit of the party? He could have been out selling policy achievements, talking Labor up and hacking Abbott down but he wasn't. He kept his profile high but didn't show any passion in defence of Labor achievements or in his attacks on Abbott.

He went on Q&A and sowed the seeds of doubt about Gillard's on-going support for a price on carbon. He undermined her by skating very close to the edge of disclosing Cabinet discussions. During that episode there were several times when Rudd drifted into a pensive mode with a sad look on his face and then seemed to wake up and realise where he was. He didn't re-arrange his face to a more neutral expression but instead turned on the 'do you want an ice-cream' Kevin beam. He is an actor. A very very good actor playing a role that continues to fool large sections of the population.

For the last 4 months Rudd has had countless opportunities to declare (truthfully or otherwise) that the PM had his full support and that he had no intention of challenging. Instead he played silly buggers with non-answers and allowed leadership speculation to hang around the neck of the government like a millstone. Again, if his motives were honourable he would have reined in his supporters and instructed them to desist from the destabilisation of the government. He did not. Instead he resigned in the middle of the night from the other side of the planet without the good manners to ring his boss first but conveniently timed it to dominate domestic news bulletins.

If there is a line to be drawn between supporting Rudd and not doing so, for me, that line was at the edge of a cliff. I was on a steady slide towards the line so that he went from My Mate Kevin to just plain Kevin. In the last several days when the line got crossed my opinion of him has been in free-fall.

The Mendoza interview was telling. Although he may have his own motives in criticising Rudd, it must be noted that he is a passionate lobbyist for mental health care reform. He was in the choice position of having the Minister's ear and the ear of the Prime Minister. He resigned that choice position because he felt that Rudd was only paying lip-service to significant reform and was using him (Mendoza) in a media game. Mendoza describes Rudd's administration in terms that have been used before and since. Autocratic, chaotic, driven by the media cycle etc.

James Button has written a damning article from an insiders point of view. He is the son of a Labor legend. He worked as a speech-writer for the Labor government, not a position that you are offered or that you accept if you belong to the conservative side of politics. That article lays bare all of Rudd's shortcomings.

Kate Ellis has gone public with a story of Rudd bad-mouthing the PM in public. She has since been joined by others who were there and are willing to attest to the veracity of the story.

Kevin Rudd has now broken Cabinet confidentiality by speaking of events surrounding the postponement of the ETS. He has also spoken publicly of the events of the evening of his resignation, revealing details of conversations which would have been undertaken on the understanding that they were private and would remain so.

It has been revealed that a Senator who supports Rudd was in discussions with Clubs Australia offering to kill-off mandatory pre-commitment.

In order to not believe the criticisms that are being directed at Rudd you would have to believe that Simon Crean, Nicola Roxon, Wayne Swan, Stephen Conroy, Tanya Plibersek, Professor Mendoza, James Button and many more are lying in order to promote some other agenda.

Yes, some of us here (particularly myself) are being distinctly hypocritical when we now cite journalists and commentators who we have previously reviled. That is because in this instance we were wrong, wrong, wrong in dismissing what they were trying to tell us. I deliberately used the expression 'cuckolded husband' above because it was the nearest I could find to describe how I feel. The entire facade that is 'Kevin' is completely fake and I am not best pleased to have been betrayed and duped in this way for so very long. It might not be fair but like a betrayed lover, I am now calling into question just about every single thing Kevin Rudd has ever said or done. Did he do it for me and people like me or did he do it to advance his career?

Although it might be fair to say that I am pro-Gillard, over the last 3 to 4 days my predominant sentiment has been anti-Rudd. May I never hear his name or see his face again after tomorrow.

NormanK

February 26. 2012 05:09 PM

nasking

Cheers Sandy & Kate...I'm absolutely astonished by the venomous attacks on Ruddy and it confirms my suspicions that there were highly influential characters in the Labor party who were planning the end of his leadership for a good long time and sabotaging his government...using certain Murdoch, ABC & other media sources to build up a campaign against his leadership and damage him in the polls.

Why is it that many respected commentators and politicians who support him are now reviled and yet those commentators we have rightly mocked in the past as hopelessly dishonest and biased against Labor are now held up as paragons of honesty?  To describe it as "scales falling from the eyes" doesn't cut it for me.  Is Albo then blind? And there are many others that like and respect Rudd.  Are they all terrible judges of character?  It seems to me that the vindictiveness has taken on a life of its own:  we are seeing a "lynch mob" mentality.

Exactly Kate.

When people I respect...and those who I saw as devious, ambitious knifers...come together and start promoting the criticisms of Rudd by the likes of Murdoch's Samantha Maiden, money hungry Richo, Murdoch's Ackerman, the sh*t stirring Barrie Cassidy, that sellout Latham...

well, that to me is desperation gone mad. And a win at all costs approach that comes across more like something Abbott, Joyce & the One Nation-like Coalition types would do.

My respect for Ruddy & Turnbull has gone up immensely.

When I saw Peter Garrett on SKY Agenda permitting The Australian's Dennis Shanahan & other Murdochites to question him on the role of Rudd re: roof insulation scheme...

whilst simultaneously someone deposited roof insulation material at the front of Ruddy's home...it prompted me to say:

If I was a card carrying member of the ALP I'd rip it up now & send it to bloody Sussex st...or Gillard's office.

It's one of the saddest days of my life.

When I see/hear Gillard LIE about the carbon price...then bring it in...after she & Swan had threatened & cajoled Rudd to dispose of it for a ridiculous option of waiting for Abbott to come onside bi-partisan-wise...

and I see/hear her LIE about East Timor...

and LIE about the fact she cares about people w/ disabilities when she goes and takes away the Dependent Spouse Rebate from many who fall thru the cracks...

and LIE about gay marriage (as tho she doesn't support it...what a joke!!!...just political BS)...I do by the way...full-bore...

and LIE about the Aboriginal tent embassy fiasco...when the media advisor came from her office...willing to put at risk Aboriginal reconcilliation & the referendum to add the Aborigines to the Constitution pre-amble...

and LIE to the honorable Andrew Wilkie who bravely fought alongside of those of us trying to bring HONESTY & REAL INVESTIGATIVE REPORTING into that other FIASCO the Iraq War...and the kowtowing by Howard & his bunch to GW Bush...after they had looked the other way as AWB supplied many millions to the Saddam regime which could be used to help weaponise and be used against our own troops...

and LIE about the mining tax being so good for the people...it's a bloody joke...Rudd was going for the big dosh & self-interested unionists & ALPers in a horrible alliance w/ big miners stabbed Ruddy in the back...

w/ all these opportunistic LIES...and the grotesque alliance w/ some in the bad media...and the gross, desperate attacks on Rudd...the man who helped get Labor outa the wilderness...

how on earth do some on here believe I could support the Gillard team?

The polls aren't the half of it.

Ya think many people don't see the same as me? They're not as gullible as some in the present government think.

N'
  

nasking

February 26. 2012 05:12 PM

TalkTurkey


Jason Obelix
Thank you for the menhir mein herr.
Off the transcript I thought Laurie Oakes' questions were quite good but he let Rudd rabbit on a bit.

Ian
That is a great set of questions you ask. I wonder what Nasking's answer sheet would say! Smile

See 'e sez ter me 'e sez,
TT,
some of the comments on here are the grubbiest I've seen in years. This is our former PM yer talking about...the individual who helped bring down Howard after 11+ long years.

Are you nuts?
[ Smile ] (Dam, sprung!)

So I sez ter 'im I sez,
Well stone th' Crows Sport,
If yer talkin about moi (I sez, real cool like see)
Well by Dog Mister Grizzly you do me proud, because just about everyone here, except the odd known illwillian and the shocked dismayed and yuck!!!!ed off Sandy, reckon that 'Rudd' and 'grubby' are a pretty good fit!

I remind you Nasking that a week ago I still could hardly believe the journos - who did have it right after all! - that Rudd has been at the bottom (yeah very sludge bottom) of the leaks and white-anting of the Government, that he was doing so in 2010, and nearly oh so nearly cost Labor Government. Now I have no choice but to believe all that and more, and neither have you, nor Sandy. He's a Rat. King Rat in fact eh.

Let me remind you (or has it never crossed your mind?) that there are many ordinary citizens today who were and/or would have been again Labor Members of the House of Representatives but are not because of the white-anting and leaking actions of this man you think so delightful.

David Marr had it right years ago, I failed to believe him, Rudd will go down as the greatest narcissist Australia has ever seen. He has put his self-importance beyond that of his Party or the People.

If we had a proper majority (which we have not because of Rudd!!!) he'd get disendorsed and expelled from the Party if I had my way. In wartime, as some have said, he'd be shot as a traitor and spy.

Nuts am I. So's Ad then, Nasking and lots of others, very few True Believers to keep you company.

And you keep threatening to *spit it*, well then either do or don't. I'm sick of trying to talk reason to you, and I suspect many others feel likewise, so since you called me out, I'm happy, well sad really, to oblige, with what I think ought to be sufficient to act as an expectorant. I don't mean to insult you but you are being just ridiculous. Shame. You have rejected everyone's friendly notes, everyone in the media is suddenly against you, you have been runnning around like a dinggy two bob watch hand on steroids, from one half-day wonder of a leader to another to another, and another and then others and now you're back to Rudd as the darling of your heart. Yeah well pardon me, I've been a *J*U*L*I*A* bloke fron the first.

To me you seem to be very much in the termite mound yourself now. So if you do extermine yourself, as you offer, (or was that threaten?  Smile ) well, boo hoo, Poor Petal.  

Anyway Sensible People, there's no point ignoring the Elefaunt in the House:

It is this:

Rudd does and will have the power to bring down the Government.

Has anybody else used their speculum on him about that?

Because if you heard it first from TT I must be having a delayed-action nightmare, and it can't be true because obviously others would have been talking about it everywhere, days ago, there must be something wrong with my thinking . . . I hope . . . surely?

Or is everybody too agahast at the possibility to mention it?
FFS TELL ME! What if . . ? . .

Ah but he wouldn't do that anyway would he.

After all he's a worshipful Christian, eh Nas!




TalkTurkey

February 26. 2012 05:26 PM

Kate

I wonder how many contributors to this blog will look back in weeks to come and regret some of the more unpleasant contributions?  Political Sword in the past has been the most pleasant place to be because it avoided the personal attacks on each other.  Even Crisp was more spooflike than to be taken seriously.  Now we witness 'friends' turning on each other.  We know in our personal life that its easier to wound than to heal.  I would ask that people have some awareness of the power of words to damage.  Argue your case strongly but try to avoid viciousness please.  

Kate

February 26. 2012 05:55 PM

Jason

Nasking,
       Sit back and read every word of NormanK's post! I think it sums it up for most people, well at least me!
I get you like and want Rudd, yet this ballot isn't even along factional lines it's a free vote and and it seems they that can vote unlike (Hawker) don't want Kevin.

I've witnessed a slick production over the last few days but it takes more than "rent a crowd" and weekend poll numbers to convince me he's the man.


Jason

February 26. 2012 06:01 PM

Gravel

Ad Astra

Your post is very apt for the moment.  I applaud and agree with most of what you have to say.

I, like most here, were in rapture about Kevin when he came along.  It was a wonderful and uplifting time.  The change over from Kevin to Julia did cause some confusion, but as I held Julia in high regard, was pleased to see that she has lived up to what I had expected of her, and more than I could have wished for.

Having Kevin as the Foreign Minister was the most suitable and apt appointment.  I was impressed with his work, and laughed when the Nopposition and media tried the '747' jokes again, they fell flat because every one knows that a Foreign Affairs Minister has to travel to foreign lands.

What has gutted me is the backgrounding and undermining of Julia that Kevin has been doing, for at least 12 months.  I feel totally betrayed by him.  I can only hold him in contempt.  I would like to think that after tomorrow he will do the right thing by Labor and act in the ALP's interest.

As for Julia not being able to win the 2013 election, could somebody pass me the crystal ball they are all using that shows that will be the case.

From the little bit of 'polling' I have seen, Labor voters are 50/50 split between Julia and Kevin.  It is the LNP voters that are preferencing  Kevin, and I don't get that people think the LNP voters will vote for Kevin ever.  Just as I would prefer anyone but Abbott in the LNP, but I wouldn't vote for them in a pink fit.

Gravel

February 26. 2012 07:17 PM

nasking

Jason & others,
I want you to think deeply about the consequences of Rudd losing tomorrow...the pollie w/ the polls on his side...supported by Anna Bligh here in QLD.

There are a significant amount of voters supporting/defending Rudd who have come from generally right-wing families...or right-wing Labor families...

they are people who found the Left at university...

and/or recognised the fair-go benefits of affordable education, healthcare/Medicare, childcare etc...

and lost more and more trust in the right-wing as they moved to the extreme war-mongering, extreme business kowtowing, One-Nation-like approach to asylum seekers/refugees...and because of the sense that many Coalition didn't give a stuff about the environment...and were willing to cater to extreme nationalist xenophobes. And let religious cults & extremists flourish.

As we've seen w/ Tony Abbott and his sucking up to Barnaby Joyce & the Tea Party-like extremists that shouted about the ETS/carbon price...abused Albanese etc.

Now, if Rudd loses tomorrow...the repercussions for both Federal & State Labor will be enormous.

Furthermore, many like my wife's brother will reluctantly vote Liberal again in disgust.

Many more will move if Turnbull takes over the Libs again.

Other centrists will quit the party...some will try to form another party...others will vote Independent...putting the ALP last...some may decide to vote...or put Greens 1 and put 2, 2, 2 etc. for the rest of the parties.

This would be a disaster for the party. The Libs would rule supreme. For many years. Dominating the States as well. They will go for a double dissolution...the media usual suspects carpet bombing The Greens in the Senate...

before you know it the Lib PM will have the States and a mostly friendly Senate.

A few years later...the cutting of Labor's debt austerity plan (called something more palatable by the Libs) will see the winding back of much we've achieved.

You only need to look at my comment at February 26. 2012 05:09 PM to get an idea of what Abbott, Sinodinos, Reith, Howard, Textor, the other OLD GUARD LIBERALS on SKY & ABC, much of the Murdoch empire, Alan Jones & the other shock jocks, Channel Nine, the odd ABC reporter/host, Pyne, Bishops (both)...the list goes on...

will THROW at Gillard's government the next year to damage her fatally...and win the next election.

Yes, there are positives...there is a good story to tell...but there are plenty of policies that need to be tweaked. And Gillard is NOT TRUSTED.

If Rudd can get in...move a few off the frontbenches...bring others in...keep as calm as he has the past few honorable weeks...tweak policies to make the carbon price, taxes & IR laws & means-testing of private healthcare rebates related to small business & middle class more palatable/useful...(helping business afford rental of property would also help)

and sharpen up the NBN, make it more affordable for government...and make the mining tax slightly more fairer...the media/online world a bit more fairer and diverse...and promote Aboriginal ownership & investment in business...and pushing fullbore our movie/music industry...and dentalcare programs...and listening to Carr on the car industry support, including Green car scheme...

we would leave the Coalition little room to move...

N'

nasking

February 26. 2012 07:18 PM

lyn

Hi Ad and Everybody

You may be interested :-


abc730abc730
There's an ABCTV special at 7.30 tonight on the ALP #respill & abc730's CUhlmann chats w Craig Emerson & Robert McClelland as pt of it...

Labor Leadership Showdown

Join ABC News 24 for continuous coverage of the ALP leadership ballot between Julia Gillard & Kevin Rudd from 5am AEDT tomorrow including key simulcasts on ABC1
www.youtube.com/watch

lyn

February 26. 2012 07:30 PM

nasking

Thnx for the info Lyn. Brill job per usual.

N'

nasking

February 26. 2012 07:38 PM

DMW

nasking,
following your comments over the last few days has been intriguing and I can understand some of why you believe what you do just as I understand to a degree why Albo has chosen to go the way he has.

You asked people here to consider and think deeply about the consequences of Rudd losing.

Equally I ask you to read the Jack Waterford article I linked to above and consider deeply his last paragraph:

I don't think that Gillard can kill Rudd, and, in that sense, I expect that she is doomed in the long run. But when, 20 years hence, we contemplate the senseless waste of a perfectly good and able politician in 2012, it will probably be Gillard we are thinking of, not Rudd.
www.canberratimes.com.au/.../...0120224-1trur.html

Wiser and more astute readers of politics than me, such as Waterford, are as amazed as you are at the tactics being used and are shaking their heads. It seems though many wiser minds have concluded that reinstating Mr Rudd may be one disaster too many.

DMW

February 26. 2012 07:43 PM

NormanK

nasking

You are avoiding the point we are trying to make to you. Many of us, rusted on Labor supporters and former members of the Rudd Fan Club, don't trust him as far as we could throw him. He is a liar, a coward and a traitor. You have offered up nothing that refutes the allegations made against him.
So what if he is popular ..... now? All of this ammunition that has been rolled out over the last couple of days would be aimed squarely at him were he to become PM. Evidence provided by many people other than his fellow MPs.
Like others, I am curious to know where you purchased your crystal ball that predicts a loss at the next election. Which, incidentally, is as much as 18 months away. A lot can happen in 18 months.

NormanK

February 26. 2012 08:08 PM

Tom of Melbourne

To all those critical of Rudd, remember  - s Gough Whitlam once observed, “only the impotent are pure”

Tom of Melbourne

February 26. 2012 08:13 PM

nasking

DMW,
I read that piece and disagree that it will be Gillard talked about more than Rudd in the future. Both have had a huge impact...these years will go down in history bigtime...w/ both mentioned for their passion & various abilities...and the flaws. And if Rudd wins the ballot...and calmly, efficiently creates a generally unified front...tweaks some policies...and rivals Abbott by going out and SELLING THE GOOD STORY to the voters & small businesses on the ground...he will make history as THE COMEBACK KID.

He has changed, he's listening more...he's more assertive...less moody (you can see that by the Oakes interview...imagine if you'd had yer rep trashed like he has...my gawd the man is calm & fast thinking these days...that's what comes w/ reflection, time to heal in another job - FM - and the support of a loving family.

This guy is a dynamo...he evolves & adapts the more he gets hit...he's pretty well teflon...perhaps titanium man...he feels pain...but doesn't resort to the sewer insults...he's willing to admit mistakes...and finds time for his family & church...knocking away calmly the snipers' bullets...putting up an effective shield against the broadsides...

if he can beat this...he can beat anything...including Abbott.

How many people in the world would have the courage to calmly back from a knifing, the ridicule of so many, the great disappointments, the sense of betrayal & isolation...the ongoing insults...and try for the leadership again?

Latham didn't...sadly he melted down into a bitter individual...used by some usual media suspects to damage his own party.

Howard did come back from oblivion. Calmly. He took the PMship, withstood heaps of abuse & investigations, told untold lies...yet won over & over again.

If we miss this opportunity w/ Rudd we miss the boat entirely.

We will be stranded.

Rudd has that something special. The people see it.

He's adapted, evolved...changed...he has tons of experience...

he's giving us everything he's got. Willing to sacrifice so much. He could be making millions now.

But I truly believe he thinks he can lead the ALP to a win...banish the extremist & disliked weathervane Tony Abbott...

and create a much better Australia by tweaking some policies...

and demonstrating what a brilliant campaigner can really achieve.

I'm not willing to throw all that away.

Are you?

N'

nasking

February 26. 2012 08:27 PM

Tom of Melbourne

Ad Astra is wrong. Gillard has no courage, otherwise she wouldn’t have beat the retreat on the carbon tax/price before the last election. She didn’t have the courage of her convictions.

She squibbed it with some half baked promises about a citizens assembly, she said “not before July 2013” she said the change “would fail if there wasn’t community consensus.

She lacked courage when she made those commitments, then she lacked integrity when she broke them.

They’re the main reasons she’s lost the trust of the electorate, Rudd hasn’t and this is the time for rebuilding of public confidence in the political process.

Tom of Melbourne

February 26. 2012 08:30 PM

Ad astra reply

Folks
I’m back at the south coast, but will retire shortly to watch TV.

I’ve read all your comments, so heartfelt, so sincerely put.  

NormanK
Your comment is one all should read at it explains a lot about how many feel about Kevin Rudd, once our hero.  You write with the sadness we all feel.  Nasking puts his viewpoint as strongly.  Some, like Kate, feel as Nasking does, upset at the tenor of comments here.

What I ask is that we carefully separate comments about the political players in this saga, which we may wish to express forcefully, from comments about other bloggers and their comments.  While we are entitled to challenge others’ views with counter arguments, surely we can agree to do so courteously and with regard for others’ feelings.  Let’s not leave a trail of hurt feelings.  There has been more than enough hurt from our politicians; let’s not hurt each other here.

Sir Ian
What a thorough archivist you are.  But what is your point?  That piece was an attempt to fashion a narrative from what Kevin Rudd has said.  I believe it did that accurately.  Perhaps you can understand how sad we feel now that we see that narrative unfulfilled.

Perhaps your point is that you are a superior judge of character, and that we are but eager amateurs.  If that is so, we shall look to you for predictions, and judge you against the unfolding of history, just as you have judged us.

Gravel
Thank you for your kind words, and your pertinent comments.

Good night to you all.

Ad astra reply

February 26. 2012 08:39 PM

jane

......even Pigs was a bit restrained toady.

I don't know TT, seems to be the right word.

ToM @12.10pm, thank God! This comment now absolves me from apologising to you for my blind faith in Kevin Rudd and laying into you for all the spiteful things you have said about him in the past.

janice @12.21pm, well said. You have expressed admirably the sentiments of all of us who feel betrayed by this man of straw with feet of clay and flint for a heart.

Nasking @1.01pm, I fear it is you who is myopic along with some other diehards.

Rudd was not a great PM; this is attested to by almost all his colleagues. And we now have MPs in the most marginal seats saying they would rather resign their seats than have Kevin Rudd as the PM.

This isn't just a couple of disaffected MPs with an axe to grind because they didn't get promoted, talking here-it's dozens of senior people who say that he was was impossible to work with, that he didn't listen, that he refused to be a team player! This isn't just a case of sour grapes

Like you, for a long time I refused to accept that the stories about staff who were resigning wholesale from Rudd's office were doing so because he was a dreadful boss. No, I rationalised, they've been lured away by higher salaries, anything but accept that it was the truth.

But the flood gates are now open-he is that spiteful, narcissistic, overbearing, vicious, bullying dictator shrieking at air hostesses and others who can't answer back.

He has been white-anting the government consistently since he was returned to the fold with the plum job as FM. He met with Clubs Australia to hammer out a deal to spoil pokies reform, ffs!

Rudd is a Labor Rat writ large. Unlike you, I feel betrayed by his recent actions to derail the 2010 election and impose a Liars Party government on us and also by his past inaction and refusal to work with his colleagues.

He came to power promising great things and failed miserably due to his own actions and his narcissism and hubris.

He was sacked because of his incompetence, refusal to be a team player and mile long list of other reasons AA, TT, Lyn, janice and a host of other commenters have enunciated.

What it boils down to is that he's just a sore loser who has been having a dummy spit even longer than Liealot's because the team said they wanted a new captain.

Time to take off the blinkers, my friend and see the tarnished anti-hero for what he is-a very flawed individual who promised much, but delivered little.

As for your fantasy that Rudd will dispatch Liealot, obviously you were asleep during the months between Liealot knifing Turnbull and Kevin Rudd's removal as PM. Rudd has no answer to Liealot, but Gillard will slice and dice the smuggler after she wins tomorrow.

AA @1.58pm, hear! hear!

Augustus @2.03pm, I had the same opinion of Latham, but it appears that he read Rudd correctly.

Kate, @3.36pm, and weren't Maxine McKew's remarks vicious and spiteful? I have no idea why Albo and the few other MPs support Kevin Rudd, considering they must have seen the damage he was doing, and has continued to do in a devious and underhanded way, to the Labor government.

It confirms to me that he is a treacherous, arrogant, narcissistic sore loser, who consistently refused to be part of the team while he was PM and still refuses to be part of a team.

People get sacked from high positions constantly for a variety of reasons; two of those reasons are under performance and incompetence. Kevin Rudd did so in spades and paid the price.

That he is unwilling or unable to accept that his leadership was inadequate is a flaw in his character, not those who relieved him of the position for that reason. He must change and prove that he has learned the lessons, not them.

SIC, yes it hurts to be duped, a feeling you must feel every time Team Liealot opens its collective gob. Nice to finally have something in common. lol

NormanK, @5.07pm, brilliantly said. Your comment along with janice's and several others has expressed how betrayed and angry I am that what I thought was a knight in shining armour has turned out to be a grubby imposter with feet of clay and a heart the size of a pea.

Nasking, if you're so bent out of shape the Julia hasn't followed Wilkies wish to the letter, how come you're not enraged that Saint Kevin was negotiating with Clubs Australia to get rid of mandatory pre-commitment altogether?

As I said above, we're not talking a couple of disaffected MPs upset at not getting a reward, it's his cabinet colleagues, who almost to a wo/man who say they will not under any circumstances serve under his leadership.

And we're not talking a couple of journos trying it on; Kevin Rudd was feeding them information calculated to lose Labor the election.

No doubt done under the illusion that he would come galloping in on his white charger to save Labor from the wicked Gillard and her happy cabinet, support from Windsor and Oakeshott and 269+ pieces of legislation.

Nas', you, Sandy and Kate also conveniently overlook the fact that the Independents won't support a Rudd government, so far from Saint Kevin saving the Fair labor Damsel, he would be delivering government to the creatures of Emperor Rupert, the Liars Party.

Yeah! Nice one, Ruddy.  

jane

February 26. 2012 08:48 PM

Tom of Melbourne

Gosh, thank you Jane.

I was obviously no fan of Rudd, but at least he wasn’t so demonstrably dishonest.

Tom of Melbourne

February 26. 2012 09:04 PM

2353

Kate said I wonder how many contributors to this blog will look back in weeks to come and regret some of the more unpleasant contributions?  Political Sword in the past has been the most pleasant place to be because it avoided the personal attacks on each other.  Even Crisp was more spooflike than to be taken seriously.  Now we witness 'friends' turning on each other.  We know in our personal life that its easier to wound than to heal.  I would ask that people have some awareness of the power of words to damage.  Argue your case strongly but try to avoid viciousness please.  

All I can do is heartily agree.  I too have been shouted down for daring to suggest a vote for other than the ALP is a valid decision - something that caused me to nearly walk away on a number of occasions in the past few months.

This public bloodletting will put Labor in opposition for a decade at least.  Well done to all concerned and those that are blindly supporting a particular person.  You have given the "faceless men" of the LNP all the ammunition they need to cast considerable doubt on both Rudd and Gillard (as well as most of the current generation of ALP politicians).  Is it a pity for Australia - certainly - and I do hope I'm wrong - but see little if any evidence to support a reelected ALP Government in 2013 at present.

Hopefully when the public bloodletting finishes following the 2013 election loss (probably around 2015), the ALP will use it's time wisely to rebuild, return to the left of the political spectrum and get rid of the timeservers and rentseekers.  Then and only then will the regain a core constituency from The Greens - because the votes that go there currently aren't going back to the ALP by choice - which for all intents and purposes is viewed by many as the slightly progressive part of the Liberal Party.

I'd like to wish the best person all the best tomorrow, but in reality you have the person who was knifed in 2010 attempting to knife the person that knifed him, so they are equally as tarred.  It makes no sense to me why this went public in the first place - kids in playgrounds behave better than this.  Goodnight and may I be proven wrong - but I wouldn't bet on it.

2353

February 26. 2012 09:21 PM

Ad astra reply

Folks
WE have a thunderstorm here, so I'm closing the computer for the night.

Ad astra reply

February 26. 2012 09:25 PM

Jason

Newspoll: 53-47 to Coalition

blogs.crikey.com.au/.../

Jason

February 26. 2012 09:36 PM

lyn

Hi Jason

Thanks for the Newspoll results.  See this :-

Tony Abbott will never be prime minister

In your guts you know he's going backwards in the polls ....
"Satisfaction with Tony Abbott has fallen 5 points from 36% to 31% [and] a corresponding [5 point] rise in dissatisfaction with his performance. Tony Abbott [is] far less popular than he was 2 weeks ago" -- Newspoll CEO Martin O'Shannessy

www.facebook.com/photo.php

CheersSmileSmileSmileSmile

lyn

February 26. 2012 09:38 PM

DMW

nasking,
How many people in the world would have the courage to calmly back from a knifing, the ridicule of so many, the great disappointments, the sense of betrayal & isolation...the ongoing insults...and try for the leadership again?

Out there in the 'real world' there are many who have come back from a 'knifing', there are many who have been betrayed and grown to be better people for it.

If, and many believe it is a very BIG IF, Rudd has learnt something and really is a better person for it and is a fully reformed person then maybe he would deserve consideration for the comeback.

There is a lot of evidence that suggests otherwise. Some can see through the 'showman' many can't.

In my fifty years of reading about, observing and participating in politics I have been wrong about many things and right about only a few and I understand why you would think that I am wrong to think Mr Rudd doesn't deserve to have his comeback endorsed by the caucus.

In May 1978 after a personal encounter with John W Howard I stated unequivocally that he wanted to be PM and would crawl over dead bodies to get there and god help the country if it happens and that he would take us backwards. In early 2006 I stated that if Mr Rudd was elected leader of Labor it would be a serious mistake and while he would win the election it would only end in tears.

Soon after Mr Rudd became PM a couple of personal experiences caused me to reassess and think maybe I was incorrect. As a result I 'cut him some slack' and went along for the ride.

I spent some considerable time out of the country in 2009 and was impressed by the coverage of Mr Rudd and his actions during the bushfires and again thought that maybe I was wrong but come October of that year the Oceanic Viking incident and the responses and questions I was asked by people from other countries caused me to believe that my original assessment was right and that Mr Rudd's Days were numbered.

I was surprised about the events of June 2010 and I spoke out about the way Mr Rudd was deposed but understood fully why it had to happen.

If Mr Rudd's comeback were only about his popularity then with many reservations I could agree with you.

If it were only about beating Mr Abbott then I would suggest that Mr Abbott is beatable even by Julia Gillard.

In my heart, my head and in my gut I know with very little doubt that to endorse Mr Rudd's comeback at this time will more than end in tears it will be an absolute disaster and could set Labor on path to complete destruction.

If the destruction of the ALP is in the best interests of the nation then by all means elect Mr Rudd.

I do not think the destruction of the ALP and the desroying of some very good people is in the best interests of the nation and therefore beleive Mr Rudd must be defeated tomorrow.

DMW

February 26. 2012 09:41 PM

TalkTurkey

Kate said
I would ask that people have some awareness of the power of words to damage.  Argue your case strongly but try to avoid viciousness please.

Kate the words that have done most damage are those uttered by none other than Kevin Rudd.

I argue my case with all possible vigour and rigour but never viciously. But with Nasking he is being utterly contrary, and I am at an end of my patience when all I/we get is non sequiturs, ill-based ridicule, and ignorance of material provided by several of us here, including most particularly Ad astra himself of course, which Nasking has said he has read and is not convinced. Anybody not convinced by the accounts provided by many of his closest colleagues (but what would they know?) will not be convinced that copulation leads to pregnancy. So why bother. (Arguing with Nasking, that is, not copulating. Smile )

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Check Abbortt's face at QT on Thursday.
My Eye of Time foresees a very grim and red face on our LOTO.
And a not very happy round silvery head somewhere 300 meters back from the front bench, and 4 lightyears from the UN.

TalkTurkey

February 26. 2012 09:50 PM

Kate

[Nas', you, Sandy and Kate also conveniently overlook the fact that the Independents won't support a Rudd government, so far from Saint Kevin saving the Fair labor Damsel, he would be delivering government to the creatures of Emperor Rupert, the Liars Party.

Yeah! Nice one, Ruddy]

Jane, if you had actually read my last post you would know that I support Julia in the ballot tomorrow for exactly the reasons you state - the Independents won't support Rudd.  It may be helpful if we read what is actually said rather than what we believe someone is saying - perhaps part of the problem is that we are so focused on approving opinions that chime with our own and discrediting those that don't, we lose our powers to accurately represent what is being said.  If we can't get right what is printed on the page, how can we presume to "know" what has transpired through the filter of self-interest?

Kate

February 26. 2012 09:59 PM

jane

He has changed, he's listening more...he's more assertive...less moody

Evidence, Nasking. Who is he listening to? Obviously not the people who would have to work with him.

Rudd may be a good campaigner, but he would also have to be a good PM. And he has to convince everybody who he has put offside that he has changed. They actually know the man, and his personality.

Obviously they don't have your blind faith that the leopard has changed its spots.

.......but at least he wasn’t so demonstrably dishonest.

As who, ToM?  

jane

February 26. 2012 10:13 PM

Bilko

AA
A great article which I totally agree with, and yes I was taken back when Kevin was dumped but from a close family contact who worked with him it was indicated that he was a micro manager and hard to work with. Since then it became apparent that someone was white anting Julia, who in my humble opinion has done a fantastic job in spite of the media and the Noalition attacks.

As mentioned by myself on earlier blogs Kevin went downhill when he failed to counter the industrial manslaughter charge, against Peter Garrett re deaths in the insulation exercise, by Abbort in the HOR.

A suitable response along the lines that was Abbott was indirectly responsible for any deaths in hospitals in Australia during his watch as Health Minister, WOULD have shut up that line of attack quick smart, from which Abbott has never looked back.

Kevin’s next sin was to apologies on insiders instead of saying the companies involved with the insulation deaths would be severely dealth with, which has happened since then but to no avail as the big lie whatever one calls it has stuck. SO in the final analysis Kevin failed to support his team and they eventually failed to support him end of story. Lets hope he fades away to the back bench and quietly rots there.

Bilko

February 26. 2012 10:33 PM

lyn

Hi Bilko

Great to see you just now, I thought I had been missing you too. I am having a great time seeing these old Gravatars that have been hiding for a little while.

How are you going? thankyou so much for your as always, interesting comment and opinion, the last you told us OH was not well, I hope everything is ok now, and you are going along fine.

he failed to counter the industrial manslaughter charge, against Peter Garrett re deaths in the insulation exercise, by Abbort in the HOR.

  I agree that was an awful turnout, industrial manslaughter Abbott said and got away with it.  Poor Peter Garrett no support at all.

CheersSmileSmileSmileSmile

lyn

February 26. 2012 10:47 PM

Bilko

Hi Lyn the OH is lots better but will never be the same, as I said two broken ankles take some mending so she is reduced to a very slow walking race for this year, regarding the ballot Go Julie Go is my chant for the day

Bilko

February 26. 2012 10:55 PM

Bill

This is an excellent, objective, side-by-side comparison of the two.
I do have to disagree on the vision thing. Kevin Rudd had a vision of a more open and inclusive Australia.  The vision of Gillard's, as expressed in the article are rather cliched. Yes, education is good, but was anyone saying it isn't?  What's forgotten is that part of Gillard's pitch for challenging Rudd was to wind back some of his vision.  It's a fair point that the mining tax was brave as in crazy, and she made it more palatable. Credit to her for that.  But she also wound back Rudd's 'big Australia' vision that spooked some people.  She also accepted the opposition's "Stop the boats," cries and has attempted to wind back the more humane treatment of refugees with two failed versions of I-can't-believe-it's-not-Nauru.

She stepped back from a carbon price just as Rudd did. She took a stand on it in government, only because the Greens forced her to. The stand she took on gambling reform, as forced by Wilkie, has also been wound back.  

Gillard is not bereft of policy vision as some would accuse, but I think policy on the run is fair criticism in some cases.

Bill

February 26. 2012 10:56 PM

TalkTurkey

Bring Back Maxine

My suggestion for your new blog name is

Stick With *J*U*L*I*A* !

Gravatar picture should be easy . . .

TalkTurkey

February 26. 2012 10:59 PM

lyn

Hi Everybody

Here is a letter to Kevin from a regional voter see what you think:-

Dear Kevin,
I’m not going to recap your past political victories or defeats here . Real though they may be, in many respects time has made them irrelevant to the present situation.

Nor am I going to dwell on any perceived failings of federal government from November 2007 until now – because government has been steady under trying circumstances over those four and a bit years.

What I am going to do is urge you to consider your own behaviour in either victory or defeat after next Monday.

Should you lose the ballot cast by your peers, I recommend that you do not challenge for leadership again before 2015 and foreswear any private contact with journalists  or political commentators until then.

Should you win through on Monday and become Australian Prime Minister once more, then I strongly recommend that you find a level of  personal and professional humility, tolerance, empathy and understanding which has so obviously escaped you thus far.


Regards,


A Regional Voter

http://northcoastvoices.blogspot.com.au/

lyn

February 26. 2012 11:12 PM

Augustus

Hi Lyn,

That is a very powerful letter

Augustus

February 26. 2012 11:23 PM

lyn

Hi Bill

Fantastic to see you and thankyou lots for your comment. Are you back writing again? that would be so good if you are.


This article by Bill is brilliant:

This week's memo to Labor, Bill, Billablog
Dear Canberra Press Gallery 2 - or, Haven't we heard all this before-
In June 2010, I wrote this:

Dear Canberra Press Gallery,
Look, I know you’re bored. I know Kevin Rudd isn’t the kind of prime minister who whacks himself in the eye with a cricket ball, or confesses infidelity, or tells the opposition leader “I’m going to do you slowly,” or makes a fawning goose of himself in front of royalty, or goes out of his way to be seen cheering any kind of sporting event... So I know that’s rather boring for you, but this is the beat you chose, so could you try reporting about things that are actually happening, rather than the things you wish were happening?
Having got their change of leader in 2010, the press gallery is bored again. After filling columns about Julia Gillard’s voice, hair, partner, dress sense, and even her earlobes, they’ve run out of trivia and now they want to write it so that the Gillard prime ministership was all a dream – like that season of Dallas.


http://the-billablog.blogspot.com.au/

lyn

February 26. 2012 11:34 PM

DMW

One of the dumbest forms of criticism is to shout down an expert in one field who speaks up about something else. The actor with a political point of view, or the physicist who talks about philosophy. The theory is that people should stick to what they know and quietly sit by in all other situations.

Of course, at one point, we all knew nothing. The only way you ever know anything, in fact, is to speak up about it. Outline your argument, support it, listen, revise.

The byproduct of speaking up about what you don't know is that you soon know more. And maybe, just maybe, the experts learn something from you and your process.

No one knows more about the way you think than you do. Applying that approach, combining your experience, taking a risk--this is what we need from you.


Interesting and provocative words from Seth Godin
Stick to what you (don't) know
sethgodin.typepad.com/.../...at-you-dont-know.html

DMW

February 26. 2012 11:36 PM

Bill

Thanks again, Lyn.

Bill

February 26. 2012 11:43 PM

NormanK

DMW

You constantly surprise and amaze me. The Seth Godin quote is a pearler. I knew that I had been obeying someone's instructions for all these years, I just didn't know his name was Seth. Smile
Thanks for the link.

NormanK

February 27. 2012 12:15 AM

DMW

Cheers NK,
it struck such an apposite note given recent discussions it just had to be shared Smile

PS it also goes to prove one must be prepared to read widely

DMW

February 27. 2012 12:48 AM

DMW

Interesting bit of writing from one of those often reviled and useless reporters in the Canberra Press Gallery.

Dogfight we had to have  Katherine Murphy @SMAge/NationalTimes
Canberra political journalists have faced criticism in recent times for not doing enough to tell you the ''real story'' of the Rudd government, so let's not make that mistake again. I'll tell you very clearly that this morning's caucus vote is unlikely to be the end of things when it comes to the leadership of the Labor Party.
But having said it, I don't intend to get lost in an unproductive cul-de-sac. What I'll do instead is consider what is next for Gillard, the likely victor of today's vote.

www.theage.com.au/.../...-have-20120226-1twdm.html

DMW

February 27. 2012 01:12 AM

jane

Bilbo @10.13pm, spot on.

Kate, I apologise for misreading your comment. However, I am unable to understand your blind faith in Kevin Rudd knowing what we now do. I don't think we can ignore or dismiss what his fellow MPs or the msm say about his behaviour and character.

An example is hanging Peter Garrett out to dry when the coward Liealot accused him of industrial murder as Bilko pointed out in his comment. Then to add salt to the wound, Rudd demoted Garrett, thus giving tacit support to Liealot's bizarre claim.

That shows the character of the man and I believe is a lesson well learned by the majority on the front and back benches. Compare that with Gillard's treatment of Craig Thomson.

Frankly, I know who I'd rather have as my team leader.

jane

February 27. 2012 01:26 AM

Casablanca

Was he or wasn't he chaotic?

I admit that I am getting a bit addlepated by all of the claims and counter claims and who said what when and on which blog or in which newspaper but I've just read a gem by The Australian's journalist John Lyons. The name did not ring a bell so I googled him and found that he was the paper's Middle East correspondent as recently as February 2011. Not sure what he is doing in 2012. There is a picture of Lyons at www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-e6frg6so-1225999998742

John Lyons wrote an article published in The Australian on June 21, 2008 (yes, that's 2-0-0-8) under the heading 'Captain Chaos and the workings of inner circle'.

Just about every line in this article is a quotable quote: it is a catalogue of errors; a catalogue of the over-weening manner and ambitions of one K. Rudd.

A quote from Rod Cameron in the 2008 article probably explains why colleagues did not move against Rudd earlier than June 2010. "In the suburbs and provincial towns Rudd is seen in very much a favourable light and admired, not condemned for his work ethic, his intelligence and his commitment to keeping his election promises." Also, Rudd had bagged countless browny points because he had defeated Howard and the Liberal Party was still in post election turmoil. So unsurprisingly in mid-2008 there must still have been hope that things in and around Rudd were not quite as bad as they seemed and that the Ministry could make up for his deficiencies.

Read 'Captain Chaos and the workings of inner circle' at
www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-e6frg6z6-1111116693707

A must read article is one by none other than Nikki Savva.

'It is rare to hear staff speak so disparagingly of a leader, even privately. They respect them too much or fear them too much, or are too devoted to the wider cause. Then again, it is rare to have a leader who behaves so badly with staff and those who serve and protect him.'


Rudd revenge on ALP agenda. Niki Savva
The Australian. April 27, 2010 12:00AM

www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-e6frg6zo-1225858519372

ps Thanks to Simon commenting at Politically Homeless for the above references.

Casablanca

February 27. 2012 01:29 AM

nasking

This one is for jane, TT, Norman & all the other lovely critics:

yep, I'm disgusted w/ the alliance of Gillard supporters, Murdochites & some ABC types like Barrie Cassidy…find it pretty sickening actually.

But I should be used to it. It was the same grotesque alliance that knifed a sitting PM in his first-term who beat John Winston Howard, even in his own seat…

who had the decency to say SORRY to the Aborigines

who injected bigtime funding into public schools & small Independent schools for the first time in yonks

who gave lifeblood to the hospital & organ donor systems

who saved many an Australian job & business from the tsunami that was the GFC…remembering that many a roof insulation company did very well out of the stimulus…as did home owners…and individuals who got cash…and the kids who never have to stand in the sun again during parade…many who have beaut science labs & libraries now…

who funded heaps of infrastructure projects across this country NEGLECTED by John Howard’s Coalition…including the QLD Tugan Bypass…

who put in place the beginnings of the NBN…one of the most imaginative & daring communication & infrastructure projects in the history of this country…

who planned to give small business a two% tax cut and increase superannuation for the private workers off the back of a super profits mining tax that Martin Ferguson confirmed was almost completed as a deal…until the legs were cut out from under them…leaving Australia w/ a piss weak, watered down deal…

who signed us up to Kyoto Treaty…and via subsidies & schemes got solar & windpower happening bigtime in this country…

who increased pensions & other subsidies for the elderly & others…

who brought renewed attention to the plight of the homeless…

and got an agreement w/ Malcolm Turnbull on an ETS…but didn’t have nought but a hostile senate…and Greens & the likes of me playing political strategists for diff reasons…as did Gillard & Swan apparently…and Rudd was the loser for it…

(I was told by a mate whose friend is a bigtime judge that Abbott had been groomed for the leadership & was coming…so I knew Turnbull would be knifed & wily Abbott would kill the ALP over the ETS…not enuff time til that election so I called it a TURDBURGER that ETS hoping Labor would delay it until after we had disposed of Abbott & the fanatics…when Rudd’s polls dived after delaying it I felt for him…felt partially responsible…but history shows we were right, it was highly unpopular at the time because the pressure valve hadn’t been opened up…we got there in the end w/ a friendly Senate…but Rudd should not have had to pay for that decision).

Rudd was also the PM who got big money out there for the Murray Darling buybacks & maintenance/renewal etc…

BUT HEY! Rudd we’re told had a paralysed government…even tho he was only there 2+ years…

Seems like a few pretty good accomplishments to me considering the time & the GFC pressures…

but of course Aussie cynical critics are on 24 hour a day ride like the wind demand demand & demand more speed train these days…

better to listen to factional heavyweights & their puppet pollies who distrust the maverick…

’cause they surely NEVER stuffup…they’re superhuman…

it musta been Ruddy who made all the mistakes in that maiden voyage…and it must still be Ruddy…

’cause SCAPEGOATS are real handy when you feel downright guilty…and yer stuffing up bigtime in the polls time & time again…why not stab the maverick in another frenzied mob attack…

why not join up w/ yer natural media enemies and use some of their spears to kill the scapegoat…

yep, KILL THE RUDD, KILL THE PIG, OINK OINK GET RUDDY…GET HIM GET HIM GET HIM…KNOCK HIS GLASSES OFF…

LET’S GO ALL
LORD OF THE FLIES.

But…we’re different than the other team…the bad Libs…RIGHT?

N’


nasking

February 27. 2012 01:41 AM

nasking

Thanks for the Newspoll results.  See this :-

Tony Abbott will never be prime minister

In your guts you know he's going backwards in the polls ....
"Satisfaction with Tony Abbott has fallen 5 points from 36% to 31% [and] a corresponding [5 point] rise in dissatisfaction with his performance. Tony Abbott [is] far less popular than he was 2 weeks ago" -- Newspoll CEO Martin O'Shannessy


Lyn,

both Abbott & Gillard are falling badly...because the people are awaiting Rudd.

The fact that this fight has seen the ALP go up shows that Kevin Rudd's move has got the policy message across...

when Gillard couldn't all that time.

The man KNOWS how to get media attention.

He knows how to beat that other attention-seeker too. Abbott.

Play w/ the Murdoch critics to support yer case and you play w/ fire.

N'

nasking

February 27. 2012 02:59 AM

Patricia WA

Thanks for those links, Casablanca.  Astonishing,  isn't it, that Rudd has been getting away with this for years.  Was he still the same in DFAT of late?  

Your normal human being couldn't cope with more than one or two such episodes with another person without almost dying of shame.

And does he hide that side of himself from Therese Rein?  And his children?  

Midnight here.  Goodnight before I start to read about personality disorders and don't get to sleep at all.

Patricia WA

February 27. 2012 07:40 AM

lyn





TODAYS  LINKS

There is no “People Power”, The Piping Shrike
Gillard’s tactic has been to frighten the caucus over the potential chaos if Rudd returned, that would only work because there is a sense of it already. Never mind that in doing so,  www.pipingshrike.com/.../...no-people-power-2.html

Gillard and the Labor leadership, Andrew Elder, Politically Homeless
journalists can stop pretending that they're above quoting unnamed sources, and that they have an excuse for not telling us what they knew back then: there is no reason at all why all of those
andrewelder.blogspot.com.au/.../...leadership.html

The smartest person in the room, Jed Lea-Henry, Independent Australia
If the caucus on Monday morning defy public opinion and do not vote for Kevin Rudd, then the question is: what are they voting for? They will be choosing a leader who has languished in the polls for over year, a leader who seems incapable of producing any sort of political traction www.independentaustralia.net/.../

The PM strikes back, The Conscience Vote
She needs to stay out of the mud and concentrate on her strengths – the fact that she has held a minority government together in the face of unrelenting attacks by the Coalition, pushed through a huge amount of legislation and endured opposition from some of the biggest special interest groups in the country.
consciencevote.wordpress.com/.../

A tale told by idiots, Jennifer Wilson, No Place for Sheep
The level of vitriol directed at Rudd by Wayne Swan, Simon Crean and others is alarming: suppose Rudd does win tomorrow, or at later date, how are they going to work with him? Have they all forgotten why they were elected? Man up, people.  
noplaceforsheep.com/.../

Kevin the Poll Dancer – Harnessing the Power of Political Popularity, Preston Towers, The Preston Institute
it should be focusing its attacks on the Opposition’s team – how they would be terrible at delivering anything. Pyne, Hockey, Turnbull, Morrison have said absolutely mind blowingly stupid things about issues relating to their portfolios, but we hear little about that.
prestoninstitute.wordpress.com/.../

Sunday morning political TV show: how Kevin and Julia fared, Zareh Ghazarian, The Conversation
Clearly, the prime minister is favoured to win comfortably. While Rudd has vowed to not challenge Gillard a second time, his presence in parliament will ensure that he continues to attract interest from the media. Indeed, it’s expected that he’ll try to become leader again in the not too distant future
theconversation.edu.au/easy-like-a-sunday-morning-political-tv-show-how-kevin-and-julia-fared-5578

Rudd Declares Challenge On, Ben Eltham, New Matilda
Having declared war on his own party structure, Rudd can expect total opposition from some quarters for the duration of his time in public life. For Labor’s true believers, the nightmare continues
newmatilda.com/2012/02/24/rudd-declares-challenge

A Question of Language – Rudd and Gillard’s Appeals to the Party. Preston Towers, The Preston Institute
It’s an ugly business. Rudd with his Four Journalists of the Ruddpocalypse, helping to break union power over the ALP, plus deliver that policy stuff Versus the Dreary School
prestoninstitute.wordpress.com/.../

The Faceless Men (And Women) Of The Polls, Mike Seccombe, The Global Mail
The polls show people would prefer Kevin Rudd over Julia Gillard as leader. But who are they polling, and would they be Labor voters anyway
www.theglobalmail.org/.../

Bushfire Bill |Comment 2422, The Poll Bludger
Labor wins buy-election narrowly. Rudd sails off to plum UN job, Gillard has numbers restored with new member. After delivering a bumper surplus, larger than expected in 2013, Gillard romps home in federal election later on in the year
blogs.crikey.com.au/.../#comment-1178092

Theories about why there’s still anger in the community about the ALP replacing Rudd with Gillard ages ago before the last election when she won more seats than Abbott but is clearly still less legitimate than he is, Jeremy Sear, Pure Poison
I do enjoy when media outlets report how “confused” and “bewildered” voters are about what’s going on, as if that’s not an incredibly damning indictment on the quality of their political reporting.
anonymouslefty.wordpress.com/.../theories-about-why-theres-still-anger-in-the-community-about-the-alp-replacing-rudd-

Your say on Labor's leadership woes, Gary Kemble
A day out from the Labor leadership ballot, thousands took to the #respill hashtag on Twitter to voice their opinion. Here is a selection of views.
www.abc.net.au/.../3853390

More Gothic melodrama than soap ,Mungo Maccallum, National Times
The divergence between Kevin Rudd and Julia Gillard is obvious and profound. The family man versus the single woman; the committed Christian versus the convinced atheist; the outgoing redhead versus the greying introvert; the internationalist versus the localist; the dreamer versus the pragmatist.
www.nationaltimes.com.au/.../...0120223-1tqnk.html

Peta Credlin, Matthew Knott, The Power Index
The “Queen of No” has her critics, but no-one questions her clout ,Such talk, of course, is extremely premature. Her aim this year is to make Abbott more prime ministerial, with offsiders such as Christopher Pyne to take on the attack dog role in parliament.
www.thepowerindex.com.au/spinners/peta-credlin

Resurrection of Saint Kevin, Andrew Probyn
No one does victimhood like Kevin Rudd. Forget the fact he's the bloke who calls the Prime Minister "the bitch" - or worse - behind her back, to senior figures in industry, to newspaper editors and to members of the Press Gallery.
au.news.yahoo.com/.../1

THE SPEW PARADIGM: Independents squirming like pigs on market day, Nick Mack, Vex News
Abbott wants their seats and a bloody big majority. Abbott possibly wants a double dissolution in the first six months of his prime ministership, if the Senate blocks key reforms.
www.vexnews.com/.../

THE SUM OF ALL SMEARS: Is Kevin Rudd actually mad or just maddening?, Vex News
We don’t say he is the Doc Evatt of his generation lightly. It’s as bad an insult as we can muster. He’s unfit to hold high office. The PM made a big mistake – albeit an understandable one – by retaining him in her team. She trusted him to suck up the brutal punishment imposed by his colleagues on him for his dysfunctional leadership,
www.vexnews.com/.../

Kevin Rudd has the courage to lead that Julia Gillard lacks, Michael McKinley , The Conversation
Members of political parties do not have to like each other. They do have to find ways of developing and implementing sound policies. It is a fallacy that totally ignores the history of, for example, effective but divided wartime cabinets and general staffs.
theconversation.edu.au/kevin-rudd-has-the-courage-to-lead-that-julia-gillard-lacks-5569

The Leadership Challenge,Dylan Caporn,Body Politics Australia
Gillard, she’ll be hoping that after Monday, there will be a period of solid leadership that allows her to get on with the job. But with Rudd watching from the backbench, and the possibility that one third of the party may not vote for her, there could be a very toxic dissatisfaction that will continue to boil under the surface
bodypoliticaus.wordpress.com/.../

Exposing Rudd camp attempt to rewrite history,Dragonistas Blog
I’ve written before that people lost faith in Rudd because his promise to be Howard-lite proved to be empty. Rudd created the expectation but did not deliver. While he promised to be a man of action, he proved to be a man of indecision, committees and reviews. Rudd proved to be nothing like Howard, dragonistasblog.com/.../

Australian Prime Minister Julia Gillard Set to Win Another Round, Julia Baird, The Daily Beast
I have often wondered if Gillard is getting conflicted messages about how women in politics should be because we have such conflicted attitudes: be strong but not too strong!
Be warm but not weak, compassionate but still tough, friendly but still authoritative. Do what it takes to win—but don’t admit to ambition.
www.thedailybeast.com/.../...in-another-round.html

What exactly is a spill?Lauren Dubois , Mamamia
Anyone can nominate. But this spill has been called for one person only. Mr Kevin Rudd. Kevin 07. Kevin 747. Ex-Prime Minister of Australia. Ex-Foreign Minister of Australia. Ex-Happy Little Vegemite. He wants the job, and Julia Gillard is forcing him to finally fight for it. Put or shut up.
www.mamamia.com.au/.../

Troops rally behind Rudd, ABC
Kevin Rudd's supporters are continuing to speak out in defence of the former foreign minister, despite continuing attacks from Prime Minister Julia Gillard's camp.
www.abc.net.au/.../3853646?WT.svl=news0

The Australian Labor Party’s Flying Circus, The Referral
If you are going to take the axe to a leader, you make damned sure they are dead. You have to be prepared to wreck what you have helped build if you want to take the top job; and the wreckage must include the deposed leader. Instead of letting KRuddMP stay KRuddMP until he was so debilitated he resigned
thereferral.wordpress.com/.../

Union money source of ALP strife, Crispin Hull
Remember, Rudd does not have a union background. That was fine when his government was going well, but at the slightest downturn the union heavies got him.
http://www.crispinhull.com.au/

Memory Serves, Wixxy, Café Whispers
Instead we had Abbott, desperately trying to woo the independents and failing dismally. Then slagging them off when what Gillard told them made sense. Clearly the man couldn’t negotiate diddly squat….
cafewhispers.wordpress.com/.../

Anthony Albanese displays grace under pressure, Clarencegirl, North Coast Voices
Transcript of Press Conference,Anthony Albanese
Sydney Feb 25, 2012  ISSUES: Labor leadership
northcoastvoices.blogspot.com.au/.../...under.html

Video

Peter Garrett  part one  Meet the Press
ten.com.au/video-player.htm

This week on Insiders, Barrie Cassidy, 26th Feb2012
the panel discuss an unforgettable few days in federal politics ahead of Monday's Labor leadership ballot.
www.abc.net.au/insiders/content/2012/s3439641.htm

i]Rudd expects campaign against him, Laurie Oakes[/i]
Kevin Rudd says he expects to face a sustained campaign against him if he loses his battle against Prime Minister Julia Gillard for the Labor leadership.
news.ninemsn.com.au/.../rudd-expects-campaign-against-him

Rudd strategist calls for Gillard to quit , Bruce Hawker
Labor strategist Bruce Hawker has said that in light of public support Kevin Rudd should be Prime Minister
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vyso8I1d7kg

Poll of polls, Andrew Catsaras, ABC
Polling analyst Andrew Catsaras does the sums on the major opinion polls to see whether genuine trends are emerging.
www.abc.net.au/insiders/content/2012/s3439649.htm

A history of leadership spills, ABC Video
Posted February 25, 2012 10:50:06

Take a look back at Australia's previous leadership spills, with the current challenge to be the fourth in as many decades.
www.abc.net.au/.../3852492

ABC: [ACT] Hargreaves resigns as whip over ‘joke’
ACT, John Hargeaves, state government
australianpoliticstv.org/.../

Lost in the Leadership Spill, Andrew Leigh, Barry O'Farrell, carbon tax, Liberals, Member of Parliament, New South Wales, unions
With so much of the media’s attention on the ALP leadership drama that there were a lot of videos that were missed. We found ourselves a little overwhelmed. So to make up for it all we’ve produced this post. We’ve collated all the videos missed from yesterday in this post.
australianpoliticstv.org/.../

lyn

February 27. 2012 07:54 AM

TalkTurkey

Centaur009 on Poll Bludger is right . . . Check it out!

"centaur009
Posted Monday, February 27, 2012 at 1:10 am | Permalink
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQ_s6V1Kv6A
I absolutely love this…I know it’s from 2010 but we all need a laugh!!"


The ALP must unequivocally seize the initiative today wrt the MSM, who are squirming to find a new angles of spin and denigration of *J*U*L*I*A*. Simon Crean and Bill Shorten and their ilk must cut loose on OOman and that bald thng on 7 I never watch, and their ilk, OOman as I write is talking of an Opposition "who should ROMP it in in the next election." (verbatim, his emphasis too.)

Please dwell on this aspect Swordsfolks, the MSM and the ABC in particular must be reined in, they are running riot with Australians' opinions. I see this as being central to what this blog is about, a mouse that roars, and with the voice of an old Lion too. Ad astra's article is surely the single most rigorous and definitive piece of side-by-side information in writing ever to do what I hope that all the members of Caucus have done rigorously in their heads by 10AM. You will of course find nothing like it by the MSM. We are being dudded deliberately, and we must *SHOUT* about it!  

BTW I don't think I saw one single comment here on *J*U*L*I*A*s her spectacular speech at that country Labor convention last Friday I think it was pretty slack, no comments anywhere, not on PB or MSM, like it never happened. It was the best speech I ever heard by her, not a sausage in response. I wrote of the awful ABC coverage (quality-wise) too. Ad mentioned her speech, not a comment on it though just queried where he could get a record, someone else obliged him, but was there one real comment on her speech itself, I don't think so!
Or maybe I missed it.  

Much more interest in Nasking's tantrums!


Watch the donut today folks.

TalkTurkey

February 27. 2012 07:55 AM

2353

TT @ 9.41pm, I argue my case with all possible vigour and rigour but never viciously.  That's crap TT and you know it - in the last six months you along with one or two others have ensured that a number of "regular" commentators here have either stopped contributing or walked away for a while.  While you may or may not agree with Nasking's views, at least s/he keeps to to the topic and doesn't get personal.

2353

February 27. 2012 07:58 AM

nasking

ALL,

I remember hearing a man speak in America in the early 2000s…and straight away I knew that man could be the President of the United States…

when I looked into his background I discovered there was a number of problems…and as time went on they increased…some said his Chicago connections, his Muslim connections…queries about where he was born…questions about whether he was too inexperienced all became prominent.

On top of that, he was black.

In a country that had a history of lynching & extreme racism & segregation by some.

Some friends told me that supporting such a candidate during the war on terror would be insane…

particularly as the candidate had the name Barack Hussein Obama…

but my political instincts told me this fella was THE ONE.

In 2005 I ignored what my head told me…and started promoting Obama on Huffington Post.

The next three + years was an uphill battle…especially when the great, formidable Hillary Clinton took us on w/ the help of her mightily persuasive & legendary husband.

And the likes of Fox News & Rush Limbaugh went after Obama like a frenzied lynch mob over his connections to a black pastor.

But we got there in the end…with perserverance and vision and imagination.

Many years before I had watched Bill Clinton come back from Hell…and win a 2nd term…w/ so many in the mainstream media giving him a hard time…attacking his reputation full bore…leaving him seemingly mortally wounded…

but he had that SOMETHING SPECIAL.

And he TRIANGULATED…

And he won…a second Presidential term.

Clinton, Obama…two wins that many said were impossible…candidates too damaged…

Kevin Rudd has that something special.

Are you willing to leave port w/out yer biggest gun?

Latest Newspoll 53-34 Rudd VS Abbott as preferred PM.

---------------
BTW, after the 2004 loss here in Australia Kim Beazley predicted we would be in the wilderness for another 6 years...

on the Troppo Armadillo blog I wrote that we could win in 3 years if we united and used that loss to generate passion & determination.

We won in 2007. Beat Howard comprehensively. In his own seat.

N’

nasking

February 27. 2012 08:06 AM

nasking

2353,
gracias.

N'

nasking

February 27. 2012 08:11 AM

lyn

TODAY'S FRONT PAGES


   Australian Newspaper Front Pages for 27 February 2012

lyn

February 27. 2012 08:19 AM

lyn

Good Morning Ad and Everybody

Fabulous news for TPS, we have had 18 new commenters

in the last 4 weeks .

Thankyou very much to all our recent  new commenters it is delightful to have you on TPS.

CheersSmileSmileSmileSmileSmileSmileSmileSmileSmileSmileSmileSmileSmile

lyn

February 27. 2012 08:28 AM

Ad astra reply

LYN'S DAILY LINKS updated: www.thepoliticalsword.com/.../...-DAILY-LINKS.aspx

Ad astra reply

February 27. 2012 08:42 AM

TalkTurkey

Read carefully, then go figure, it is truth!

As I write, ma belle amie J****, who will be 70 next birthday, and her half-sister D***, who is 72, are both driving to Broken Hill for J****'s full sister K***'s 17th birthday party on Wednesday.

Jason Obelix had trouble getting his head around that.

When he did he laughed till he nearly barfed which would have been a waste of beer.

It has been a recurrent joke for K*** ALL her life. (Hint.)

Have yous worked it out?

TalkTurkey

February 27. 2012 08:45 AM

Ad astra reply

Folks
I don’t keep an account of these things, but last night, twenty-four hours after this piece was posted, there were already 110 comments.  Now there are 131.  This must be close to a record. The traffic is soaring.

As Lyn points out, there have been 18 new commentors in the last four weeks.

And welcome back, Bilko and Bill; thank you for your comments.

Your comments continue to enrich TPS.  It stands out as a place for serious debate about important issues, based not just on opinion but also on facts and figures.  All I ask is that our exchanges are always courteous and respectful of other peoples’ opinions.

Ad astra reply

February 27. 2012 08:51 AM

debbiep

Hi all~

Another great Insight Ad. I may not respond as quickly as I read your piece - but I 'Like'   them. ( double meaning Smile

Great set of Links for the Library Lyn.

And today , may the best (Wo) Man win today.

debbiep

February 27. 2012 09:37 AM

Ad astra reply

debbiep
Thank you for your kind comment.

It looks certain that the (Wo)Man will win.

I guess we’ll all be ‘off the air’ for an hour or so until the vote numbers are announced.  I’ll be back later.

Ad astra reply

February 27. 2012 09:56 AM

Ian

One of the most beneficial things that will come out of this whole affair is the resurgence of Julia Gillard.

Forget about the tired cynicism of the jaded professional students.

Forget about the superior sounding, yet jaded psephwhatevertheyarecalled ologists.

Forget about the political purists who believe that all has a price , but can’t understand value.

Pay them no heed

Julia Gillard will lead Labor and will win the 2013 election. She will win because of one simple, irrevocable truth.

Julia Gillard is stronger ethically, morally, personally and, importantly, mentally than Kevin Rudd, Tony Abbott, Malcolm Turnbull and any other they put up against her.

The quiet voting public have seen, started to understand and realised the bullshit that has been going on is only hurting the nation. As corny as it sounds I believe that, before the next election, the public at large will see Julia Gillard as the guardian that states “Not on my watch”.

You’ll do me Bloodnut. You’ll do me.

Ian

February 27. 2012 10:01 AM

lyn

Hi Ad and Everybody

Turnbull laughs off tilt at Coalition leadership Video, ABC
Posted February 27, 2012 09:54:00

Opposition's Communications spokesman Malcolm Turnbull says the Parliament should pass a no confidence motion in this Labor Government.

www.abc.net.au/.../3854548


BreakfastNewsABC News Breakfast
Malcolm Turnbull calling on Independents to support a no-confidence motion. #respill

theburgermanJohn Bergin
Malcolm Turnbull says parliament should debate a no-confidence motion against the government when parliament resumes at midday.
1 minute agoFavoriteRetweetReply

lyn

February 27. 2012 10:05 AM

nasking

I've heard some idiotic comments from the likes of Cheryl Kernot (not surprising considering some of the past idiotic decisions she's made)...

Richo (the more he opens his big gob the more I dislike him)...

and Conroy (my brother-in-law told me at Sizzlers he reckons Conroy is a big fake and has slowed the rollout of the NBN to cater to Murdoch & other bigtime, influential media moguls)...

I also have no more time for Nicola Roxon...nor Tony Burke...nor Wayne Swan...

And watching Shorten & Arbib etc. walk down that corridor wearing sh*t-arsed grins really pissed me.

PM Julia Gillard & her team are going to have to do one helluva job to get me back on side and blogging again.

I feel very much like Dougie Cameron today.
----------------

BTW, not a good period for Abbott. He looks bloody weak.
Turnbull must be feeling mighty good.

I just hope Julia doesn't manage to help Abbott outa the hole again.

N'

nasking

February 27. 2012 10:12 AM

Jason

Nasking,
       Give it a rest!

Jason

February 27. 2012 10:48 AM

debbiep



Btw, Good to see The Political Sword back on the crikey Politics page Smile. Good work Ad.

http://www.crikey.com.au/politics/

debbiep

February 27. 2012 11:04 AM

lyn

Hi DebbieP

Good on You fabulous work, thanks for finding TPS on Crikey

Thankyou, you lovely little "Good Scout" in more ways than one

CheersSmileSmileSmile

lyn

February 27. 2012 11:04 AM

Jason

Gillard 73, Rudd 29

Jason

February 27. 2012 11:19 AM

Jason

Gillard 71, Rudd 31,

The official result!

Jason

February 27. 2012 11:20 AM

BSA Bob

Jason et al
As good a result as could be expected. Now we wait for the media distortions to begin.

BSA Bob

February 27. 2012 11:32 AM

lyn

Hi Ad and Everybody

BSA Bob don't worry about the Newspaper reporters we have the bloggers, look no further than Ad Astra, look at Grog, look at the others, aren't we lucky:-


Monday, February 27, 2012
ALP Leadership Vote: Gillard 71–Rudd 31, Greg Jericho, Grog's Gamut

Sorry folks. It was media driven, not caucus driven.

How long has it been going? Well April last year The Daily Telegraph ran a story on Rudd “conducting a street walk with the member for the marginal seat of Banks, Daryl Melham”, which had this subtle headline:

http://grogsgamut.blogspot.com.au/

SmileSmileSmileSmile

lyn

February 27. 2012 11:39 AM

nasking

As I commented at the Cafe:

I was weighing up that possibility w/ Smith…but the more I went thru the calculations the worse it got.

The ALP has to stick w/ Gillard now…or realise they stuffed up stupidly and invite Rudd back in September or so.

No third candidate.

I reckon alot of people will be mightily pissed off today, as I am.

I’ve got the same migraine I had the moment after Latham’s crazy handshake was reported…and when I realised Keating was gonna lose to Howard. Not good…I hope it’s not an omen.

Anyway,
Gillard is a tuff lady…almost as tuff as Thatcher…she has much more to learn…but she might get there.

Hopefully the broadsides we’ve given her and her team will provide them w/ some pretty good ideas as to the kind of campaign Abbott, the Coalition & their media supporters etc. will try to damage them with.

If anyone here thinks we were hard on Gillard…wait til the Old Guard Liberals including Sinodinos, Howard, Reith, Vanstone, Brough and many others join up w/ Pyne, Bishop, Joyce, Abbott, Turnbull and Alan Jones, the other shock jocks & the Murdoch & Ch. Nine types…and the Rhinehart…w/ the odd ABC sh*t stirrer….

you’ll see the FLAME THROWERS turned on Gillard bigtime. Making our battle seem like a road hockey game.

I put as much out there as I could so the party can PREPARE.

————
I’m gonna take a well-earnt break again. More time to heal…and reflect. I gave it all I had…as did Ruddy & his team. Obviously wasn’t good enuff for the factional leaders.

Gillard’s got breathing space now. I hope she takes good advantage of it.

Try to keep some integrity people. Some of yer arguments were impressive.

Keep it real. And try to win people over…not distance potential voters.

Remember you need more voters from the Centre & Right…swing voters who want to distance themselves from the kook extremist Abbott & his odd One Nation/Tea Party-like frontbemcher & supporters.

Don’t put them off by being too extremist Left.

Time is running out…

At least the Olympics this winter, UK summer, will give us a bit of a break…hopefully some Aussie wins to build up public confidence & spirit.

Don’t let Abbott out work you on the CHURCH & on the ground…think more small business…and the people out there doin’ their family obligations…

I wish you well.

I’m off to catchup on the American election via Meet the Press, Fox News Sunday etc…

Til later.

N’

nasking

February 27. 2012 11:45 AM

nasking

Give it a rest!

I would recommend the same to you Jason. Seriously.

Or tone down the attacks on people.

Same goes for TT & Patricia.

If you want the ALP to win.

Be smarter about it.

Cheers

N'

nasking

February 27. 2012 11:46 AM

nasking

Ad,
you did well.

Best of luck.

N'

nasking

February 27. 2012 11:50 AM

Michael

A great victory for Julia, and I sincerely believe, Australia.

Rudd and Abbott are interchangeable sides of the same coin.

Michael

February 27. 2012 11:58 AM

2353

Nas said Give it a rest!

I would recommend the same to you Jason. Seriously.

Or tone down the attacks on people.

Same goes for TT & Patricia.

If you want the ALP to win.

Be smarter about it.

Cheers


Couldn't agree more.  Best post of the day.  Playing the person is intellectually lazy and in the end counter-productive as all you do is p*^s them off.

Nas, I hope you recovery continues - come back soon.

2353

February 27. 2012 12:16 PM

Catey

Not sure if any of you noticed Chris Uhlmann discussing the role of the media with Lyndal Curtis during their coverage of the Leadership Ballot this morning.  He said he doesn't know how the media could handle their political reporting any differently.  I have written to him at 7.20 Report with some constructive suggestions.  I urge you all to do the same.

Catey

February 27. 2012 12:21 PM

lyn

Hi Ad

Some of the quetions I heard outside Parliament when the whip released the vote results:

Media questions after the vote count:-
How come it took so long  x 3
who was sitting next to Kevin Rudd
Was there a re-count  x 4

Some comments for everyone from Channel 7 and Twitter:-


Gillard is now a real threat to Abbott, Rob Burgess, Business Spectator
As suggested earlier today, this is the time in the long, sorry affair of the Rudd destabilisation and challenge, for the national media to move political theatre to the back-burner and start – please, please – to pick apart both Labor and the Coaliton's policy platforms and let voters decide which offers Australia the brightest future (How is Rudd still a hero? February 27).

serious political debate emerges in this country in the next 17 months there's a good chance Abbott has a problem. Labor will try to attack what at present looks like an incoherent mix of policies, with no real underlying political philosophy –
www.businessspectator.com.au/.../Gillard-wins-ballot-73-votes-to-29-report-pd20120227-RV29Q

Gillard smashes Rudd in leadership showdown, Channel 7

Prime Minister Julia Gillard has comfortably seen off a leadership challenge from Kevin Rudd in today's federal Labor party ballot.

The Prime Minister won with 71 votes to Kevin Rudd's 31.
au.news.yahoo.com/.../?cmp=twitter

PollyticsPossum Comitatus
Compare Insiders trend http://yfrog.com/ocgo2vp to this one http://yfrog.com/h2qd1oxp Insiders use averages which distort detail

3AW6933AW #Melbourne
AUDIO: Labor Minister and 'numbers man' @BillShortenMP speaks to 3AWNeilMitchell ahead of #respill vote www.3aw.com.au/displayPopUpPlayerAction.action://media.mytalk.com.au/3AW/AUDIO/270212_Bill_Shorten.mp3

PinkelstienMirelle
GOLD!  Abbott 42, Turnbull 41 ... Gillard 73, Rudd 29 ... Who's more divided?”

politicsprojectJames Higgins
Not possible for KRuddMP to launch a second challenge on those numbers #spill #auspol

theageThe Age
Mark Latham tells Sky after today's vote, Kevin Rudd would not be able to make another tilt at the top job www.theage.com.au/.../...-rudd-20120227-1tx1w.html via @theage

PaulBongiornoPaul Bongiorno
This showdown started with the Tele claiming Rudd had 45 to 50 votes two weeks ago. Gillard had to flush Rudd out and she did

LainieEiffLainie Eiff
Congratulations to JuliaGillard for achieving the largest win in a leadership ballot ever! That's my PM! #respill

2FBSStephen C
Now can we stop blaming Rudd and go back to blaming the media?

Paul_MJPaul J
2FBS Let's all follow the polls and do whatever they tell us to do. They say ALP poll driven . Under Gillard they aren't

davidlen2david
Hartcher has many questions to answer re his writings and observations over last 18 mths, for me he is a 2 faced evil bastard

alanramsey2010Fake Alan Ramsey
RT “TommyTudehope: Someone should go and console Peter Hartcher.”

MsBrownMouseMs Brown-Mouse
Prediction, the Australian Media will now try for the same thing only TAbbot v MTurnbull #auspol #sickofthemall

lyn

February 27. 2012 12:41 PM

Ad astra reply

Folks
Whichever way bloggers here wanted the vote to go, the result was decisive.

Thank you Nasking for your heartfelt comments.  I feel I did nothing to bring about this result; I simply placed the facts as I saw them on the table, and drew the only conclusion that I felt the facts warranted.  That was my opinion, nothing more.  I hope we will see you continue to contribute to the dialogue here as soon as you feel in better health.  We enjoy seeing your big bear Gravatar.

Now that the ballot is over, can we please moderate our comments so as not to offend any other blogger personally?  Disagree with opinions, even the facts if you doubt their veracity, but let’s respect each other.  Let’s make TPS a paragon of decency, respect for others, and fair comment.

Ad astra reply

February 27. 2012 12:48 PM

TalkTurkey

As I was saying . .

Much more interest in Nasking's tantrums!

Nasking has been quite irrational about this imo.
Dunno about anybody else's.

Well yes I do. All evidence to the contrary,(that's where it bites) Nasking is near-apoplectically opposed to nearly every other blogger on this, the best-informed blogsite on the matter, (thanks to Ad astra's comprehensive comparative expose) (and now Dear Oh Dear would-you-believe, Nasking has found out about our secret clandestine sinister relationship with Crassidy (! Smile ) (and most of the Ministry, and everybody who doesn’t think Kevin can walk on water.)


So here comes El ingenioso Naskingo hidalgo don Quixote de la Mancha ...  who has renamed himself "Don Naskingo de la Mancha," mounted on his skinny horse Rocinante, accompanied on a donkey by his faithful squire ChuChu Panza, who knows that don Naskingo is shall we say a little eccentric . . .  not to say actually "nuts" Smile. . .

on don Naskingo's Glorious Quest to Save the Honour of his beloved Kevinnea . . .

Behold!  A mighty giant!

So here he comes charging on Rocinante
(who can barely raise a trot) . . .
at the great monolithic conspiratorial windmill
of evil Rudd critics and satanic *J*U*L*I*A* forces
(Including Aa TT NK Smile and Uncle Tom Cobbley and all!)
and
WHACK!

A windmill sail knocks him off his horse!

It turns out to be one of his best friends trying to knock some sense into him!

ChuChu tries to tell him it's all a hallucination,

but No, he gets right back up on Rocinante,
and charges again,

WHACK!
It’s another of his best friends trying to bring him to his senses,

ChuChu is beside himself with worry,
(but even two ChuChus are not enough to restrain him . . .)
  
He remounts again!. . .

(Poor old Rocinante is close to collapse . . .)

Charge!

WHACK!

and so on . . . Smile

Dog I think I'm funny sometimes . . .



But do listen to this! -

www.google.com.au/url

[It is THRILLING and INSPIRATIONAL!
Do listen All, it will do your blood good.]

From wikipedia, (good wikipedia, thank you wikipedia)
Cervantes and his manservant have been imprisoned by the Spanish Inquisition, and a manuscript by Cervantes is seized by his fellow inmates, who subject him to a mock trial in order to determine whether the manuscript should be returned. Cervantes' defense is in the form of a play, in which Cervantes takes the role of Alonso Quijana, an old gentleman who has lost his mind and now believes that he should go forth as a knight-errant. Quijana renames himself Don Quixote de La Mancha, and sets out to find adventures with his "squire", Sancho Panza.
[edit] Cast
•  Peter O'Toole (Simon Gilbert, singing) as Don Quixote de la Mancha / Miguel de Cervantes / Alonso Quijana
•  Sophia Loren as Dulcinea / Aldonza


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Right now I think TPS is the strongest and best since I have known it. Many people here are scholarly, nearly all are goodwilled, Leftish, passionate, and I’m proudly right there with that mob. The standard of what is written here, and the information available here, are attracting attention by bloggers everywhere, with Ad astra and Tweetie Lyn each rightly legendary for their special contributions to the Blogosphere. Eighteen February Newies says Lyn, beaudie, we treasure you all. The Sword has a mission, Putting Politicians and Commentators to the Verbal Sword, and I think it has been scrupulously *True to that Glorious Quest*.  
It was that thought that triggered my sort of parody of Man of la Mancha above btw.

Today is a great day for Labor. Catharsis is so cathartic!

Can't wait for QT. And I owe Jason Obelix a beer, I had Rudd on 25 (a bit of push polling maybe), our menhir delivery man had him in 29 so he's closer.  

A splendid result for *J*U*L*I*A* and Labor, pass the pawpaw oinkment to poor little Vegemite I guess. Though I shall not easily forgive Rudd for his ratting.  Definitely let me offer some to Nasking, Nas it's only really you threatening to quit, people who talk like that are a limp white rag to a red ragger like me (that doesn't mean I'm a Commie, I'm not, just in the loudmouth sense mostly), nobody really wants you to but if you keep saying it well don't be surprised if people tell you, Well go on then EFFOFF! as Ian - (probably jokingly, but with a kernel of feeling I suspect) said, (well wtte). Hell mate don't get your knickers in a knot. The Labor Party is a democracy and it has nothing whatsoever to do with what the Mob thinks in this case, it is up to Caucus alone, anyway you'll just have to wear it Bro, that's the way it works and so it should.  

Rudd starting to speak. All support for *J*U*L*I*A* now,
No qualification, no rancour says he.

Me bin post now. QT coming up in an hour, yum.  


TalkTurkey

February 27. 2012 01:10 PM

TalkTurkey

This is another wonderful inspirational song from Man of la Mancha. Let it be Blog Pawpaw Oinkment for you Nasking, you might identify with don Quixote's sense of isolation and his  true if misguided nobility.

And for You Ad astra,
            'To reach
                  the unreachable
                         . . . *stars!*

www.google.com.au/url

We might never reach the stars, but we can jump for joy now without Rudds' ball and chain. It's GONE! Woo-Hoo!

TalkTurkey

February 27. 2012 01:27 PM

GrannyAnny

Sadly the crap will continue I'm afraid. It's all about the NBN you see.

At the moment the moguls decide what we see and when we see it on their TV shows and in their papers, and what we hear on their radio shows. Their mates the advertisers pay handsomely to use their media outlets and then pass these costs on to us, whether we consume their crap or not. It's all very cosy on the gravy train and they want the good times to roll on.

They can't attack the NBN directly because it is very popular so they use every means at their disposal to discredit the Government and promote Abbott. As soon as they get Abbott slotted into the lodge he will destroy the NBN and then be cast aside like a dirty shirt because he is a lunatic and they know it.

The NBN will allow more of us to choose our media. We could consume stuff from anywhere in the world when we want to. The moguls will no longer have an enormous influence on our lives nor their hands in our wallets.

Get behind the Government irrespective of who is the leader. Bombard Members of Parliament with your views, become involved. We don't have much time left.

GrannyAnny

February 27. 2012 01:47 PM

TalkTurkey

And WOO HOO again, we're off!

*J*U*L*I*A* is lookin' so-o-o-o-o in control of the media.

"so settle in"

*J*U*L*I*A* . . . Kiss !


More joy because it's a . . .


www.google.com.au/url

Abbortt about to be Abbortted now.  

TalkTurkey

February 27. 2012 01:59 PM

2353

8 minutes after AA (who happens to own this place) says Now that the ballot is over, can we please moderate our comments so as not to offend any other blogger personally?, TT posts this Nasking has been quite irrational about this imo.
Dunno about anybody else's.

Well yes I do. All evidence to the contrary,(that's where it bites) Nasking is near-apoplectically opposed to nearly every other blogger on this,
.

What part of offending personally don't you understand TT?  Clean it up or to coin a phrase "give it a rest".  There are always more than one side to a discussion - and the last person who claimed (with some justification) to be right all the time died on a cross a tad over two thousand years ago.  You really are turning people off this blog.

2353

February 27. 2012 02:00 PM

Patricia WA

POST MORTEM COMMENTS FOR TPS POSTERS.  NO TRIUMPHALISM!

For 2353 particularly, I'm sorry that you haven't seen my immediate response to Casablanca's suggestion about my choice of metaphor in writing verse about Rudd , or couldn't see the humor in the final, softer version of my pome.   You're the last person I would want to pick a fight with here, or anyone for that matter.  Even Nasking we don't fight with, we debate and disagree.  

Expressing a point of view in opposing someone's political argument is not necessarily attacking them personally, or even viciously, providing the truth is told and the language used expresses that truth. Bad language, obscene expletives or insulting descriptors are never acceptable. Some in the media have talked about bloodletting and malice on both sides of this issue as if the argument has been out of control. I certainly haven't seen much evidence of that here.

The media's narrative of the debate within Caucus and amongst ALP supporters has indeed been as colorful and hyped up as they could make it, but the language used by those putting the government's case  has, in my opinion, simply been frank and forthright.

For many in Caucus it was simply telling the truth,  a reporting of events and behaviours as they saw and experienced them.  Words like dysfunctional and chaotic are as descriptive and as objective as it is possible to be about a dysfunctional personality whose impact on government is to create chaos.  Treachery is the only way to describe the leaking of confidential information to the media in order to undermine one's own team.   Insulting and belittling are the only words to describe the way a then Prime Minister treated many people working with and for him. If I had seen reports of staff rushing to counter those oft repeated stories I would have doubted them and reflected those doubts in my writing.  Sadly the only defence offered for K Rudd was that this was the price necessarily paid for having someone of his brilliance as our PM.

Like many people I was impressed by his brilliance and initially I supported Kevin Rudd's leadership bid and was particularly impressed by his pursuit of Howard over AWB.  I even thought those first criticisms of him as PM in the media were unbelievably petty and criticised in verse those attacking him, right up to his so-called assassination e.g polliepomes.wordpress.com/.../  and several others written in June, 2010.

People like Ian and Pip and Ad Astra and Jason and NormanK and DMW and many other stalwarts here as well as new visitors have all expressed strong feelings about their sense of disappointment, even betrayal,  but not in malicious or unpleasant terms.  Talk Turkey has a particular talent for painting word pictures and is a great enthusiast.  We need people like him to stir us up and excite us.   But NormanK and DMW and Lyn and Ad Astra will pull him up if he goes too far, as Casablanca did with me when I thoughtlessly, and incorrectly as it turned out, used the Por Jud is Daid lyrics as a frame for a pome about Poor Rudd.

So please 2353 I hope this helps explain my perspective on this very passionate exchange we've had here and helps us all to move into the excitement of the next bright new and optimistic phase of Julia Gillard's first government.
  

Patricia WA

February 27. 2012 02:01 PM

Kate

Ad - many thanks for your endorsement of the notion that contributors to this blog avoid personal acrimony. Let's target our political opponents.

tt - respectfully, could you read Ad's comments re this? Telling someone to effoff is probably not in keeping ....

Kate

February 27. 2012 02:02 PM

jane

Liealot just claiming that the reason he isn't in government is that he DOESN'T DO DEALS!! I think he meant to say he can't do deals, because nobody trusts him. And of course, he's been caught in another BIG FAT LIE!!!!.

And the bullshit continues. Claims not to be negative!! Claims that Gillard's win is actually a vote of no confidence!! Annabel Crabbe has just pointed out that she won by 40 votes to Liealot's one vote win.

Michael Wilson has just pointed out that he needs a GREAT BIG NEW SLOGAN! ROFLMAO!

jane

February 27. 2012 02:23 PM

paul walter

It was a skilled assessment from adastra. Gillard, with a year and half apprenticeship under her belt is ready for her last best shot. Rudd looks hacked off and ready for a rest, with serious pause for reflection, this time. All that has stood between him and greatness is that ego.
The filthy msm, by contrast has shown itself at its ugly worst, but they are not accountable in any meaningful sense, unfortunately.
I share a concern raised by Andrew Bartlett, that the Australian people themselves have not yet sensed the danger inherent in a prospective Abbott government; any guesses why?

paul walter

February 27. 2012 02:46 PM

lyn

Hi Paul Walter

Thankyou for your valuable interesting comment , I see you were here last year we are delighted to see you here today, can I add and again soon.

The filthy msm, by contrast has shown itself at its ugly worst, but they are not accountable in any meaningful sense, unfortunately.

From all that I have read and the fast and furious comments on Twitter, other blog sites and our TPS they are getting some back, Political Journalists have been exposed, for their past lazy gossip, & distorted reporting.
So you see their biased reporting and the efforts to damage Julia Gillard and the Government has come back to slap them in the face.

Some comments for you:-

ben Eltham
Good performance by Gillard in her presser. She appears set on going with a more forceful media presence

HumanHeadlineDerryn Hinch
How did the media get vote so wrong? 73-29 gospel for half an hour. Whoops. 71-31. No recount.

FluffulaGeraldine
Now media can u please get back to your jobs and report policies and grill all sides equally #abcnew24

jjauthorJanie Johnson
How much time does the media spend on the horserace rather than the issues? Answer: Too much!

CheersSmileSmileSmileSmileSmile

lyn

February 27. 2012 03:14 PM

paul walter

re Lynn's invitation, I am like god, just because you can't see me, doesn't mean I'm not here.
Incidentally just back from the folk up the road, LP, where Cast-Iron Helen has launched into the truly ferocious invective only she can be capable of, on the same topic as we're discussing.
Just harking back to this weekend and SBS news and how its followed ABC news down the drain,let alone the scummy newspapers and commercial teev.

paul walter

February 27. 2012 03:23 PM

2353

As you might have realised I am not impressed with the behaviour of the ALP or some of the commentators on this blog.  Here's why.

This leadership challenge is retribution pure and simple.  The problem goes back to the one where Gillard took over from Rudd.  What the ALP should have done is tap Rudd on the shoulder, tell him there is a Government Appointment for him somewhere that appealed to him and let him go on an agreed date.  Lets face it, the man was a bully in the 80's when he was Goss' Chief of Staff - why would he change.

So Rudd announces resignation (health being a strong contender for a reason as he does have a treatable heart problem) and some time later he is appointed to whatever the agreed position was.  Rudd's presented with another option of going to the backbench, his pre-selection is withdrawn and any privilege that can be is withdrawn.  The LNP's only complaint is that it's a job for the boys (an argument diminished by the appointment of Costello and Brendan Nelson to Government roles).  Two days of faux outrage and it's all over red rover.

Instead what do the ALP do?  They run a campaign in the media slagging off at their own "senior" members - not once but twice - and then expect the majority of Australians in 18 months time to believe they can govern anything.  Even the LNP in Queensland isn't that stupid (and they have some enormous own goals to their "credit"!  If I was one of the LNP "faceless men" my media recording device would have been running flat out over the last week or so - to be recycled in spades next election - regardless of who the ALP has installed as leader by then.

So where does my disbelief affect this forum?  Apart from more examples of playing the wo/man rather than the issue which has seen at least one person leave completely (waves at FS), another couple of people take a break and yet others complain to AA regarding the tone of some people comments, there has been generally an absence of the usual civilised tone by a number of people who decided that Rudd or Gillard should win for whatever reason and had to force it down others necks by arguing against the person, rather than the idea.  

At the end of the day, my local federal MP is the one that threatened to resign should Rudd win a challenge some time ago - so we can pretty well imagine how he voted this morning.  If I rang his office and told him to vote for Rudd, do you think it would have make a scrap of difference?  Of course not.  It seems that the majority of ALP politicians are in the same boat.  Rudd knew he didn't have the numbers so he tried to make the select vote into a referendum.  I'd like to say that no one fell for it - but evidence from this blog suggests that some here blindly followed the "media strategy" by both camps perfectly (along with a bit of petrol being added to the fire by the media).  So why do it (apart from me being happy with the current arrangements anyway, hence being too lazy to look up the phone number or email address)?  

All this public muckraking has done is to further destabilise an effective, progressive and functional Government.  When Rudd challenges again - and he will - it will show how much the alp does not understand strategy and the media, hopefully the Government can come back from this self-inflicted balls up before the election.  Basically - do what the LNP do - KEEP YOUR FIGHTS, FACTIONS AND SO ON BEHIND CLOSED DOORS - it can't be that hard if Abbott can do it!  That Abbott was reminded by the media today that the result was decisive - unlike his election could be a green shoot, may it continue to grow.

2353

February 27. 2012 03:23 PM

jane

paul walter @2.23pm, agree.

lyn @2.46pm, interesting comments from Ben Eltham et al.

Watching QT. Gillard is on fire and so is Albo. Liealot speaking in slogans as usual and very unconvincing, imo. Bishop J, as usual a twat.

jane

February 27. 2012 03:35 PM

TalkTurkey

Can't you read 2353, or can't you fathom out what I said
(imo btw!)
. . . all evidence to the contrary,(that's where it bites). . .

Because where someone believes things all evidence to the contrary he's being irrational, by definition, and I will not be told by you or anyone else not to say so, nor to be told that it is an insult when it is the simple demonstrable truth.( As others have done better than I in this thread!) In my opinion, decided by my ability to think rationally, and in independent agreement with almost everybody here including several with whom I have stoushed in the past. SPYHI!  

Oh and Kate,you said

tt - respectfully, could you read Ad's comments re this? Telling someone to effoff is probably not in keeping ...


By 'tt' did you perchance mean me,'TT'? See imo 'tt' isn't 'respectful' you see, I am very respectful of the way I address people here), I reserve such apparent breaches of protocol, snide and not very honest belittlings, for those I actually wish to insult . . . like Poo Poo Pyne, Limpy Crisp and the like. But I will take it that your apparent breach of etiquette is due to ignorance not intent. But Ohhhhh, you precious delicate little petal you, fancy being shocked by EFFOFF, can you ever forgive me, and btw your skewed reference to my use of that term would do justice to Liealot, I'll leave it at that.

(Well here's what I said, in context, c.f. your reportage!)

. . . if you keep saying it [i.e. that he was going, wtte, effoff Smile) well don't be surprised if people tell you, Well go on then EFFOFF! As Ian - (probably jokingly, but with a kernel of feeling I suspect) said, (well wtte).


"Onion sauce! Onion sauce!" Smile

Ian I'm not seriously misqoting you am I? I know you didn't say EFFOFF, but I did, (with WTTE to cover my rear). Even I thought you were a bit 'norty' as somone said, but i smile at stuff that is simply 'norty'. People who want to think I'm nasty though, well, onny swaki mally ponce!

TalkTurkey

February 27. 2012 03:38 PM

NormanK

But NormanK and DMW and Lyn and Ad Astra will pull him up if he goes too far ...

No Patricia I won't. I no longer read that particular contributor's "colourful" offerings. It Ad astra's site and he will administer it as he sees fit.
That it not to say that others who take a dislike to the end product of this particular talent for painting word pictures shouldn't bring their concerns to Aa's attention.

NormanK

February 27. 2012 03:39 PM

Patricia WA

2353   I agree with almost all that you've just written, and would normally agree that the ALP would have been wise to follow that advice to

KEEP YOUR FIGHTS, FACTIONS AND SO ON BEHIND CLOSED DOORS!

However, I think that is exactly what they have been trying to do since June 24, 2010.   It didn't work.  For whatever reason.

Now we move on.

Patricia WA

February 27. 2012 03:53 PM

lyn

Hi Jane

So pleased you noticed , very pleasing comment I thought, I don't know about you but I have a fair bit of faith in Ben Eltham.  He writes some brilliant articles, a good performer in the media as well.

ben Eltham
Good performance by Gillard in her presser. She appears set on going with a more forceful media presence

Cheers SmileSmileSmileSmile

lyn

February 27. 2012 04:36 PM

lyn

Hi  Ad

Some more interesting comments for you:-




davidlen2david
The media are like bloody vampires sinking their fangs into Abibs new warm flesh desperately trying to get to blood, they are disgraceful

vexnewsvexnews
NSW Senator and rising star Mark Arbib to quit - confirmed. #auspol Never a dull moment in Club Fed

BreakfastNewsABC News Breakfast
abcnews: The ABC understands NSW right-wing powerbroker Mark Arbib is about to resign as a minister and a senator #respill

bodypoliticausThe Body Politics
Craig Emerson will be acting Foreign Affairs Minister until a permanent appointment can be made.


davidlen2
JuliaGillard great in qt & with journos today - such authority! well done PM - so proud of you

AhronYoungAhron Young
Julia Gillard: Don't mess with me. That's my feeling from this presser

1petermartinPeter Martin
Abbott press conference imminent. MT timhollo So, who's going to ask Abbott about securing leadership of his own party by 1 vote?

Question Time Today:-

Karen Middleton
Tony Abbott opens qt by asking the PM how she can govern with 1/3 of party against her. She reminds him he only one his ballot by 1 vote.

Pollytics/ possum
Slipper is making the tories so grumpy here, they look like they're about to chuck a tantrum that Peter Hartcher would be proud of #qt

AshGhebranious
AlboMP moves the tally. 44th censure motion

crazyjane13
A *very* weak motion to suspend - calling on JG to explain, the usual litany of complaints. Not censure, not no confidence.

mfarnsworthMalcolm Farnsworth
Suspension motion lost 69-72. #qt

davidlen2david
Surely the media can now see through the LOTO and his rabble for what they are. This pathetic performance in QT and the motion is a disgrace

EdzonesEdzones CC
latikambourke tell Abbott the country didn't call for an election it was a caucus ballot what planet is he been on

LatikaQTLatika Bourke
JG - I always give him full marks for audacity - he survived by ONE Vote. #respill #qt

AgnessMackAgnes Mack
Abbott's voice pitching higher & higher. Budgies too tight?

justinbarbourJustin Barbour
Example: He wastes valuable #qt time to baselessly slam the Govt with absolutely no alternative vision. It is a disgrace

clituberClituber
TonyAbbottMHR You are SO ordinary. TurnbullMalcolm , please challenge Dr No  TA an embarrassment in parliament today

TheKoukStephen Koukoulas
Barnaby_Joyce It's on the public record that Mr Abbott's gross debt to income ratio is about 275%
www.dailytelegraph.com.au/.../story-e6freuzr-1225882967470

lyn

February 27. 2012 04:40 PM

2353

TT - stop playing the wo/man rather than the discussion.  You have every right to your opinion - when you tell others what opinion to have in order to fit into your "perfect" little world that's a problem.  You have been asked at least three times by three different people (including the owner of the blog) today to stop - how about doing it?

2353

February 27. 2012 04:57 PM

jane

Hi Lyn, I'm an Eltham fan too. And the PM has followed her presser performance with an equally spirited and impressive performance in QT.

Made Liealot and Bishop, J look pretty lame, I thought.

I think we're going to see more of the PM on the front foot now that the snake in the grass has been hung over the fence. I also think (or hope?) that she will continue to tell it like it is.

It can only win reasonable people over when she takes them into her confidence as she lays out her aspirations for the country.

There will always be the diehards who are both unwilling and unable to accept the facts, but that's their bad luck. I'm ready to move on with the PM.

jane

February 27. 2012 04:59 PM

Augustus

Thanks to Lyn's brilliant find this morning we now know who really smuggles the budgie in the Noalition

www.thepowerindex.com.au/spinners/peta-credlin

Augustus

February 27. 2012 05:15 PM

Ad astra reply

Folks
I’ve been watching the unfolding scene in Canberra all day, culminating just now with Mark Abib’s resignation, and come back to the site only to find an ongoing scrap about some bloggers’ personal remarks about other bloggers.  This is the very thing we criticize our politicians for doing.  Is it beyond our capacity to be critical of another blogger’s views without offering personal insults?  I find it distressing that despite my pleas that this stop, it simmers on, and some find it so upsetting they question whether they want to return to the site.

I’m sick and tired of the barney to which just a few contribute, but who never seem to know when to stop, arguing the toss endlessly.  I’ve been through this before and threatened to close the site if it continued.  Yet here we are again with more argumentative to-ing and fro-ing.  Do you want TPS or not? If you do, please be respectful to others, and get back to the real game.  It would be a pity at this pivotal time in Federal politics to close the site, but believe me I will if the barney continues.

Ad astra reply

February 27. 2012 05:15 PM

lyn

Hi Augustus

Thankyou for being brilliant you.  

Glad you enjoyed I did too, nice little giggle for me.


CheersSmileSmileSmileSmileSmile

lyn

February 27. 2012 05:32 PM

2353

NOw that normal service is being resumed - a good economics story to dissect ->www.brisbanetimes.com.au/.../...0120225-1tul4.html

Interesting that it's from Fairfax.

2353

February 27. 2012 05:41 PM

Ad astra reply

Hi Lyn
Thank you for the tweets and links.  What a day it has been.  My assessment is that the decisive 71/31 vote will give Julia Gillard the authority she needs to pursue her big agenda without the erosion she has had to endure for the last twelve months.  

Kevin Rudd’s press conference was generous and appeared sincere.  Although some questioned whether he should have acknowledged his departmental staff as fulsomely as he did, as this was a ‘farewell’ to them, I felt it was not inappropriate.

Julia Gillard’s press conference was strong and optimistic.  She answered questions briefly and to the point, and stood for no nonsense from journalists.  I’m delighted she is giving the message to the media pack that she is not going to wear the disrespect they too often dish up.

Tony Abbott’s press conference reminded me of a rabbit caught in the headlights of a fast moving vehicle heading right at him.  We heard the same tired old slogans.  Nothing new emerged.

QT demonstrated how destitute the Opposition has become.  No questions about policy, just the anticipated focus on the Labor ballot.  Tony Abbott’s feeble attempt to suspend standing orders (over 40 attempts so far), was one of his worst – to echo his words, ‘he’s a bad Opposition leader, getting worse’.  Julie Bishop was sat down for not speaking to the motion, instead shrilly shouting at the PM.  The PM gave a feisty reply, wiping the floor with the Opposition leader and his deputy, as she did with every question asked during QT.

The future for Labor looks bright.

Ad astra reply

February 27. 2012 06:19 PM

lyn

Hi Ad

Thankyou so much for your bright optimistic report on today's Political happenings.

Tony Abbott’s feeble attempt to suspend standing orders (over 40 attempts so far), was one of his worst – to echo his words, ‘he’s a bad Opposition leader, getting worse’

What annoys me he can't get the votes anyway, so it has got to be about attention seeking ADD , hyperactivity and impulsivity.

lyn

February 27. 2012 06:24 PM

jane

AA, I couldn't agree more with your sentiments. I thought the PM and the government as a whole had the tiger by the tail.

Liealot's press conference also put me in mind of a rabbit in the spotlight.

I loved the PM's presser. She was confident and let the msm know who was in authority in no uncertain terms and her demolition of No No Antoinette in QT was a a joy to behold.

I was very confident that any attempts by the Liars Party to get capital from the ballot would result in omlette being appled to all their faces and I wasn't disappointed. I reckon that subject will be given a miss in all future encounters

As for Bishop, J, shrill and irrelevant.

As I hoped, the PM will go from strength to strength now that the snake in the grass is hung over the fence.

Any doubts about her ability to deal with Liealot should now be lying in tatters along with the Liars Party's hopes!

jane

February 27. 2012 07:07 PM

Augustus

Ad Astra,

I managed to catch a glimpse of Kevin Rudd's press conference after the ballot, to me he seemed somewhat relieved and I had difficultly understanding this for a moment and it dawned on me that back in 2010 he just conceded defeat on advise, and at the time very good advise, it's the not knowing that can drive you mad hence he himself was unable to accept the reality, today just made that reality very crystal to him and as a result can now personally move forward, I do wish him all the best.

He seems to have a generous and caring friend in Anthony Alabanese as well as a guide if he so chooses to accept, one day he just may do a Howard "Lazares with a tripe bypass"  

Augustus

February 27. 2012 07:18 PM

lyn

Hi Ad

This is Q & A panel tonight :-

MP Chris Evans; Senator Barnaby Joyce; Fmr Labor Premier Peter Beattie; Deputy Greens Leader...

lyn

February 27. 2012 07:22 PM

TalkTurkey

Augustus

"Lazares with a *tripe* bypass"!

Yeah reckon I'll pass on that too. Smile
Long past its use-by date anyway.

TalkTurkey

February 27. 2012 07:27 PM

Augustus

TT lysdexic fingers

Augustus

February 27. 2012 07:36 PM

nasking

2353 & Ad & Kate,
cheers...

Don't worry...if Abbott or some other detestable Lib clown is still leading that morally bankrupt, oddball party who seem to cater to One Nationists & extreme kooks these days I'll most definitely be back...

and giving my bearish all.

As for the Turkey...I see it as all part of the tuff game of politics...and blogging...I forgive you oh Talky one...

tho I did have my Nth American Thanksgiving Day roasting dish out for awhile. Smile
--------------------------------


BTW, thought Gillard's speech was very good. Fired up. Not too lengthy. Taking no crap from the media. But not too agro, prickly. Assertive. Determined. Getting the job done. Not gloating...nor vindictive.

And Ruddys. He was a great FM. It's time for him to help Anna in QLD now...and keep to his seat Federally-wise...and support Gillard fullbore. I take him on his word.

Abbott was flat & predictable...if he were a free product sample I'd put him in an envelope & write RETURN TO SENDER. Smile

--------
Til next time. It's been exciting & fun. Great blog.

Keep up the great & good fight.

N'

nasking

February 27. 2012 07:38 PM

nasking

Oh yea,
Patricia...keep those pomes on Abbott & the Coalition coming.

Delicious. Smile

And Lyn,
those wonderful links.

N'

nasking

February 27. 2012 07:39 PM

Jason

Jane,
    That's right! The PM and the Government should now have the "clear air she and they need without the constant harping from the media pack about if and when "Rudd" might challenge,as the numbers today has put that ambition to rest.

Those disappointed about who won today, I say don't despair get behind the leader and fight the real problem  "the coalition".
I think the reason why there wasn't a vote in 2010 was to try a preserve Mr Rudd's reputation as a former PM! he is/was at least owed that much.

The problem I saw his attempt to become "leader" again  was with "but the polls" say I'm popular you must have me back.
The polls on any given day can also say 50+% want capital punishment re introduced, some polls say 90% of people want voluntary euthanasia other polls say more than 60% of people want same sex marriage legalised.
If Rudd was to be re instated because he's popular in the "polls" would he then be bound to legislate whatever else was popular because of those same "polls"?

I may very well be wrong and tell me if I am! but to be "governed" by "polls" is a slipery slope  to get on I think.

Jason

February 27. 2012 07:46 PM

lyn

Hi Nasking

Nasking the loveable bear, that is so nice of you Nasking, you are  

a nice person.  You have always been our friend since you first came here 2 years ago.

That's a nice thing to say Nasking:-
As for the Turkey...I see it as all part of the tuff game of politics...and blogging...

I forgive you oh Talky one...


cheersSmileSmileSmileSmileSmile

lyn

February 27. 2012 08:13 PM

jane

Jason, I agree. Government by poll is indeed a slippery slope. You can't please all of the people all of the time and you're mad if you try to.

I do wonder about the msm. Will they give the government a short honeymoon period, or will it be open season again tomorrow?

There were some surprisingly positive comments today, and there was some sensible stuff coming from the likes of Kernot and Wilson. Even Crabbe was quite sensible today.

I suppose we'll soon find out, if the press is once again full of Gillard's earlobes and smug complaints that the government is rubbish at getting its message out.

jane

February 27. 2012 08:16 PM

lyn

Hi Jason

I agree the polls are rushed out all the time, they are just about useless and certainly lost some of their zing now that Julia has had
the party support, the media can't say it was because of the polls.

By the way Jason, are you on Twitter, would you tell me.

"but the polls" say I'm popular you must have me back

Here are some comments about the polls , you will agree with all of them:

Margaret Simons
Is public opinion (ie polls) the same as public wisdom?
Those watching the gaping hole that has opened up between the political class and the public over who should be prime minister might wonder whether there a difference between public opinion, as measured by the giant strainer of opinion polls and public wisdom.

jeremysear
Agoodopinion lol rubbish. The polls are a poor approximation for "the public". One poll counts and it's in 2013

gordongraham
NotoriousHarV do you get that a political party is based on ideas, not opinion polls. If it was simply opinion polls, there'd be no point

Paul_MJ
2FBS Let's all follow the polls and do whatever they tell us to do. They say ALP poll driven . Under Gillard they aren't

triplejHack
"the measure of a government is not by opinion polls or daily headlines"

Thought4rce
Polls don't predict anything - they just tell us what happened recently

domknight
If Julia Gillard is overwhelmingly re-elected as predicted, at least nobody will be able to say that the ALP are poll-driven.

lyn

February 27. 2012 08:19 PM

Kate

TT I'm sorry I offended you with the use of lower case for your name.  It wasn't meant to wound.

Regards

Kate

February 27. 2012 08:33 PM

Ad astra reply

paul walter
Welcome back and thank you for your comments.

Augustus
Your comments are so apt.

Lyn
Your links and tweets are a delight.  What would we do without you?

I’m off now to watch Q&A.

Goodnight.

Ad astra reply

February 27. 2012 08:46 PM

lyn

Hi Ad

What a nice comment to me.  I am having a delightful time all our
considerate commenters, respecting different characters  and
personalities.

  It really has been a trying time since Kevin Rudd resigned and before, the speculation media reports, the disappointment in particular MP's.  The worry for Julia. Wouldn't we be happy if now with clear air we can concentrate as Nasking said ,on this historically dreadful, snarky, snipey, awful, horrible Opposition.

CheersSmileSmileSmileSmileSmileSmileSmileSmileSmile

lyn

February 27. 2012 11:37 PM

Christol

Let's not try and gloss over the facts here. Today, the ALP had it's chance to right the incredible wrong of the 23rd of June 2010 and they failed us. They made a conscience decision to completely ignore the voice of the overwhelming majority of the Australian voting public  who remain utterly disgusted by the circumstances in which our Prime Minister was removed.

We suffered for 11.5 years under the Howard Government because the ALP had no stability, no real direction and was unable to put forward a viable alternative to what was the worst Government in my lifetime. That was until Kevin07 arrived with a vision for the country, a battle plan to beat Howard, and a prime-time personality to make it happen. Lets be honest, it was Kevin Rudd that took down the Howard Government single handed in spectacular fashion and dragged the rest of his party back to power.

Is it any wonder that Rudd refused to listen to or involve the entire cabinet in key decisions or jump to the tune of the factions? These same factions that were responsible for the 11.5 years in federal opposition and the destruction of the NSW branch of the ALP?  As far as I'm concerned he earned the right to do it his way and his biggest mistake was that he eventually gave in and listened when they lost their nerve on the ETS.

In a short time the Rudd Government had gone a long way to repairing the Australia that Howard had tried to destroy and this was done whilst at the same time dealing with the GFC. Instead of succumbing to the GFC, they used innovative fiscal stimulus measures to save our manufacturing and retail industries and then injected funds into Infrastructure, schools and transport that had been neglected for years under Howard who's only interest was to run a budget surplus so that he could deliver tax cuts for the rich.

I have no doubt that despite the unprecedented, relentless media attack, Kevin Rudd would have still annihilated Tony Abbott at the 2010 election. Much of the media had conflicts of interest in many key policies and instead of sitting in a back room whining about how hard they were being made to work, Rudds senior Ministers should have been on the front foot selling their achievements, ending the media circus, and destroying the leader of the opposition. This should have been an easy task given the history of this maniac.

In short, they should have been backing the man that had delivered them back to power.

To hear people like Simon Crean trashing Kevin Rudd was sickening. I respected him as a Minister but here is the only Labor leader who's popularity was so low that he resigned before ever even contesting an election attacking KRudd who was arguably the most popular Prime Minister in our history. At the same time on SKY you had Crean's successor Mark Latham trashing and gloating over the fact Rudd would be defeated. This is the same Mark Latham that lead the Labor party to its biggest defeat and handed Howard control of both houses. Rudd not only removed Howard from Government at the next election, he removed him from Benelong.

It was only a couple of years ago that I was thinking that the next Liberal Prime Minister had not even been born yet. How the ALP has managed to completely self destruct in such a short space of time is beyond me. They had the chance to fix it today and win the next election with Kevin Rudd but instead they have once again completely misread how deep the wound is with the public. They have basically handed the next election to a madman that will make Howard look like the Dalai Lama.

Albo understood what was at stake. Unfortunately, his colleagues are under the impression that Julia can turn this around. I don't think there is anything that Julia can do to turn this around. The people wanted their Prime Minister back, and the only way they can show the ALP what they think is at the next election. God help us.

Christol

February 27. 2012 11:38 PM

TalkTurkey

Kate

Are we friends then?

I would have it so.

TalkTurkey

February 28. 2012 12:36 AM

Kate

TT

Yes

Kate

February 28. 2012 07:17 AM

janice

Good morning all.

Isn't it strange how one man's bitterness and treachery can be forgiven and dumped on the shoulders of others?

Kevin Rudd lost the support of all but a handful of his colleages and he was removed by them because his government had become dysfunctional and everyone from the office clerks in Govt Departments to Ministers, Cabinet Ministers and Bureacrats could not stand the environment in their workplace.

The big mistake that was made when caucus took this unhappy and difficult decision was to be soft hearted enough to try and spare Rudd from even more humiliation and not tell the people the true reason behind his removal.  Firstly, the man was not stabbed in the back but was asked that a leadership ballot be held.  Secondly, his colleagues did not take the decision lightly and without due consideration regarding whether it would be better for the nation for them to suck up being involved in a dysfunctional government or whether the nation would be better served by removing him.


Caucus recognised the intelligence (brilliance even) in Rudd and were no less disappointed and saddened to discover that he was incapable to channel all his talent into an organised smooth running ship that used and included all the talent within that ship.  He did not trust nor credit his colleagues with intelligence or talent.  Rudd's capabilities fell short of actually running the country and he was demoted, in effect, to the position of FM which portfolio was where he could shine, and shine he did.

That should have been the end of it.  However, Rudd allowed his bitterness to consume him and there were those around him who fed and nurtured that bitterness.  The Guillard Government has been dodging Rudd grenades from day one.  Guillard has shouldered the whole blame for the events of 2010 and all because she found the courage to step up to the plate and ask Rudd for a leadership ballot.  Rudd's grenades were now getting in the way of good government and the media (who were being backgrounded by Rudd and his supporters) were hinting of leadership challenges and giving off-the-record warnings.   The time had come for it all to brought out in the open where it could be dealt with.

We all know how this has panned out beginning with Rudd resigning his FM portfolio from the USA which was done then because it would impact much more than if he'd waited until his return to Australia.  Members of caucus went out into the media, told their stories about why they wanted to remove Rudd from the PMship.  Rudd went into "sweet innocent" mode and denied it all.  There was heaps of dirty linen from both sides that needed washing and airing - it was not pleasant but nevertheless it was necessary.

It is now all over.  Rudd, the PM and caucus have agreed to forgive each other and get on with the job of governing in the interest of the people of this country and to put aside their own personal beefs.  So, I find it sad that the people seem intent on carrying on with the blame game and dumping on a good government that, all through the messy situation, have always had the interests of the nation and its people at heart.

janice

February 28. 2012 07:48 AM

lyn

Good Morning Janice

You are happy and informative this morning. I have been trying to catch up to you, I did see your comment to me on A Frank View but went back to answer you and then you were gone.  Anyway thankyou Janice.

So, I find it sad that the people seem intent on carrying on with the blame game and dumping on a good government that, all through the messy situation, have always had the interests of the nation and its people at heart

This is exactly why I was upset with the MP's going on TV and dumping out loud, because say Cheeseman for instance, how many times is he going to cop the backlash from his opponent in his electorate.

Enlightening though, I hear ABC 24 this morning talking about dental health what a refreshing change .

CheersSmileSmileSmile

lyn

February 28. 2012 07:59 AM

lyn

TODAY'S LINKS

And the Oscar goes to…,  James Higgins, The Politics Project
Plus, there are the benefits to come of Gillard having been visited by her own mortality. She knows she has to focus more on selling the government’s message, and she will. In fact, it’s already begun. Gillard’s media appearances over the past few days, since Rudd announced his resignation, have been much more effective than in the past
. thepoliticsproject.wordpress.com/.../

ALP Leadership Vote- Gillard 71–Rudd 31, Greg Jericho, Grog’s Gamut
By the start of this year, the reporting went from predictions of a challenge happening sometime in the next 6 months to it a case that a challenge will happen – it must!. I said on Twitter at the start of February that it seemed like Gillard had entered “the killing zone” – and she had http://grogsgamut.blogspot.com.au/

There is no third candidate, The Piping Shrike
The power brokers had given her the leadership, but no agenda with it – other than accommodating to the Coalition line on the ETS, mining tax and asylum seekers. In fact it was the lack of an agenda which was why the political geniuses of the ALP thought
.www.pipingshrike.com/.../...o-third-candidate.html

Rudd’s Decisive Defeat, Norman Abjorensen, Inside Story
For all the trouble Rudd has caused he has at least done Julia Gillard a favour or two. The fact that a ballot was held cauterises the wound left untreated in 2010 and confers a belated legitimacy on the prime minister’s leadership. Further,
http://inside.org.au/rudds-decisive-defeat/

No-one can smash the ALP, Mungo Maccallum, The Drum
And while they may not know a lot about Billy Hughes, or like what they do know, they would certainly agree with his thoughts of 1915: No-one can smash the Labor Party. If no-one has managed so far, it's certainly not about to happen over the present tantrums.
http://www.abc.net.au/unleashed/3853818.html

Winners and losers of a political history rewritten, Paula Matthewson, The Drum
The rest, as they say, is history. On this occasion, the facts are borne out by the numbers and can't be bent to show anything other than the truth. Attempts to recast them for political purposes should be exposed for what they are - blatantly misleading and condescending to all of us
http://www.abc.net.au/unleashed/3854918.html

Gillard Won But Labor Lost, Ben Eltham, New Matilda
The enthusiasm with which the media has carried rumours of leadership speculation has undoubtedly contributed to the destabilisation of the Gillard government in 2012. As I’ve argued here and elsewhere, the ramp-up in the amount and pitch of media coverage meant that that neither the Rudd nor Gillard forces were able to keep matters under control.
newmatilda.com/2012/02/27/gillard-won-labor-lost

Kevin Rudd defeated: That was fun, but …Paul Barry, The Power Index
The fall of Rudd is a lesson worth remembering for those who aspire to power: it's hard to get anywhere in this life—except in North Korea—unless you bring people along with
you. Power in almost every area depends on some degree of consent. He had it from the people but not from those who knew him and worked with him.
www.thepowerindex.com.au/.../201202261090

Gillard wins challenge, but faces another reshuffle, Dylon Caporn, The Body Politic – Australia
Shortly afterwards, the Prime Minister spoke to the press, in what some journalists have labeled one of her best performances. After the last few days of vitriol and spite, Gillard has called on Labor MPs to stop the “ugly” leadership debate.
bodypoliticaus.wordpress.com/.../

Scenes From A Spill, Mike Bowers, The Global Mail
It’s been an unedifying spectacle of bloodletting in the Australian Labor Party. And the Prime Minister Julia Gillard has prevailed in a party room vote over the man she unceremoniously unseated in 2010. But has the 71 to 31 vote quelled the disquiet?
www.theglobalmail.org/.../

Winners and losers: the ALP leadership spill and the triumph of the insiders, Geoffrey Robinson, The Conversation
Is Labor finished? It’s hard to tell. Voters have a low opinion of politicians. They expect them to fight among themselves and as long as their lives are unaffected by government they are surprisingly forgiving of party disunity.
theconversation.edu.au/winners-and-losers-the-alp-leadership-spill-and-the-triumph-of-the-insiders-5590

"People power" falters, Graham Young, What the People Want
Those favouring Julia Gillard are focused inward and are concerned about the management of government, having a cohesive team and the role of the media. Thosefavouring neither cite concerns about the country in general, that the argument is about power and that neither candidate can be trusted.
whatthepeoplewant.net/.../...e-powerq-falters.html

Do you know who our PM is?, Catching Up, Café WhispersWhat we do know. Those who know her personally and are close, have nothing but praised for her guts, ability and loyalty.
cafewhispers.wordpress.com/.../

ALP Finishes Rince Cycle,The Art Neuro Web Blog
Just so I’m making myself absolutely clear once more, I will not be voting for the ALP with Julia Gillard as the Prime Minister at the next Federal election. But I won’t be voting for the Libs or the Nats. I won’t even vote Green because they support Sea Shepherd. I won’t vote for an independent, without knowing what they stand for, but I don’t imagine I’ll find such an independent I can identify with.
artneuro.wordpress.com/.../

Gillard and her caucus: sink or swim together, Malcolm Farnsworth, The Drum
After a week of demolishing Rudd's reputation and denying his achievements, Gillard told her press conference this afternoon that he should be "honoured" for what he did as prime minister. She said she was impatient to get on with governing after the "ugliness" of the past week.
http://www.abc.net.au/unleashed/3854854.html

Gillard crushes Rudd in leadership ballot , Madeleine Heffernan , Smart Company
the Coalition’s calls for independent MPs to support a vote of no-confidence in Labor have been rejected by independent MP Rob Oakeshott, who had dinner with former Coalition leader Malcolm Turnbull last night
www.smartcompany.com.au/.../...73-votes-to-29.html

Dinner snub for Abbott, Gemma Daley and Pip Freebairn , The Financial Review
I’m interested what the motion of no confidence is supposed to be about – no confidence in the right of someone in a political party to ­challenge their leader?” Mr Windsor said. “I don’t quite understand what Mr Abbott would like to express no confidence in.”
www.afr.com/.../dinner_snub_for_abbott_DMSNoSLfAeVRDlM5TgfiFN

LABOR’S LOSS: Mark Arbib quits to spend more time with his family, Vex News
Whoever directed Darren Cheeseman to go on-the-record with an attack on the PM of a kind his Liberal opponent in Corangamite will repeatedly use against him will have plenty of time to repent with him in leisure. It was an unfortunate incident and it did Rudd’s candidacy no good, it seemed. It set in train quite
www.vexnews.com/.../

Bushfire Bill
Posted Monday, February 27, 2012 at 8:38 am Comment number 749, The Poll Bludger

Taking this with Uhlmann’s comments that “It can’t end here” (also an exact quote), we see exactly how the media works. They goad each side into action, manufacturing stories for them to react to, then writing up the resulting fisticuffs. Instant story.
blogs.crikey.com.au/.../#comment-1179795

Bushfire Bill
Posted Monday, February 27, 2012 at 9:33 am Comment number 828, The Poll  Bludger

Gee, The Australian gang are sore losers.Check out their stories, as on their front page on line right now:RUDD WON'T RULE OUT BEING DRAFTED AS PM
KEVIN Rudd has left the door open to being drafted as Labor leader at a later date...
blogs.crikey.com.au/.../#comment-1179875


Video


Gillard defeats Rudd, vows end to drama,  EMMA ALBERICI.   Lateline
Julia Gillard has decisively defeated Kevin Rudd in a leadership ballot by 71 votes to 31 and declared the political drama over, just before Senator Mark Arbib resigned.
www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2012/s3440882.htm

D Day for the ALP, Heather Ewart, 7.30am report
Another intriguing day in Canberra saw Julia Gillard convincingly defeat Kevin Rudd in the ALP leadership ballot before talk of unity and a resignation followed.
www.abc.net.au/7.30/content/2012/s3440767.htm

ALP Leadership Spill,  
UPDATED: 4pm, 27 February: We continue to update our Leadership Spill YouTube playlist. The latest video comes from the ALP and is Julia Gillard’s press conference following the leadership spill.   There are now 130 videos totaling more than 10.5 hours.

http://australianpoliticstv.org/
leadership spill has been called by the Prime Minister of Australia. There has been so many videos they've been collated here for your convenience. Don't forget to check …more
www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLD004BF25E6FD45B8

February 27, 2012. Prime Minister Gillard's victory speech.
Prime Minister Julia Gillard makes a statement after being re-endorsed as leader of the Labor party.
www.aapone.com.au/SearchPreviewVideo.aspx
February 27, 2012. Prime Minister Gillard responds to questions on spill.
questions after successfully winning the ballot for the leadership of the Labor party.
www.aapone.com.au/SearchPreviewVideo.aspx

2012. Kevin Rudd concession speech.
Kevin Rudd has pledged his support to the re-election of the Gillard government after losing his challenge for the labor leadership.
www.aapone.com.au/SearchPreviewVideo.aspx

Labor party leader vote.
Labor party returning officer Chris Hayes announces that Julia Gillard won the Labor Party leadership vote with 71 votes to Kevin Rudd's 31.
www.aapone.com.au/SearchPreviewVideo.aspx

February 27, 2012. Senator Mark Arbib has resigns
Senator Mark Arbib has resigned as Assistant Treasurer, Minister for Small Business and Sport and from the Senate in what he said was a gesture to facilitate the healing of the Labor party in the wake of the leadership turmoil. Mr Arbib was a key player in the move against Kevin Rudd in 2010.

www.aapone.com.au/SearchPreviewVideo.aspx

lyn

February 28. 2012 08:19 AM

janice

Good morning Lyn - hard at work as usual I see Smile

I think the MPs had to go out there hard and say what had to be said.  I'm damned sure they did not enjoy the experience and most of them would have had the same feelings that Albo showed, though I'm sure Albo also had the knot in his gut that he had counselled Rudd not to face a leadership ballot in 2010 because he too wanted to spare his friend and colleague further humiliation.  Albo's pain was partly the knowledge that had he not talked Rudd out of the 2010 challenge, all the subsequent pain and bitterness and the airing of it all in the public eye would have been avoided.

If anyone doubts that caucus members did not enjoy dumping so ruthlessly and publicly on a colleague should sit and watch the video of them all as they left the party room after the ballot.  There were no smiles of victory on even one of them - they all looked like the stuffing had been knocked out of them.  

We will have to endure the media raking through the ashes for awhile but I expect it will die down, hopefully in not too long a time.

janice

February 28. 2012 08:21 AM

lyn

Hi Christol

Thankyou very much for your informative well thought out comment last night.

A big welcome to you, we are very very pleased to have you here, and are looking forward to hearing more of your opinions.

CheersSmileSmileSmileSmile

lyn

February 28. 2012 08:28 AM

lyn

TODAY'S FRONT PAGES

Australian Newspaper Front Pages for 28 February 2012

www.frontpagestoday.co.uk/index.cfm

lyn

February 28. 2012 08:32 AM

Ad astra reply

LYN'S DAILY LINKS updated: www.thepoliticalsword.com/.../...-DAILY-LINKS.aspx

Ad astra reply

February 28. 2012 08:37 AM

Ad astra reply

Good Morning Lyn
Isn't it gratifying to at last see some less negative, even modestly positive headlines in our newspapers.  Let's hope it continues and our PM is given a fair go, something Aussies hold as everyone's right.

Ad astra reply

February 28. 2012 09:34 AM

lyn

Good Morning Ad

This is an excellent summary of Question Time yesterday:

Abbott Can't Leave Leadership Alone , Don Woolford,Australian News com
Julia Gillard, Kevin Rudd and their backers had, after all, done a great job exposing the hatreds within Labor without any help from Tony Abbott.

Voters must, firstly, be sick and tired of it all and, secondly, have by now made up their minds about the rights and wrongs of the affair.

Moreover, Abbott had had his say at a news conference just before question time.

But it was all too juicy for him to leave alone and he got stuck in at question one by asking Gillard how, given she lacked the confidence of nearly a third of her colleagues, she could claim a mandate to govern.

The prime minister thought that was rather audacious - a polite way of saying he was leading with his chin.

Abbott, she continued, had won the Liberal leadership by one vote, leaving the rest of his MPs covered in blood.

READ MORE:

www.australianews.com.au/story

lyn

February 28. 2012 10:47 AM

Casablanca

Less than 24 hours after the spill, Joe O'Brien on ABC24 is saying "The Prime Minister still will not reveal her new front bench". 'STILL WILL NOT REVEAL'!! 'Has not yet announced her new front bench' would be the more appropriate way of putting it. Wait at least until the end of the week before inserting 'STILL' into that news report.

Joe too often is clueless about what goes on in the world outside his newsroom. There is a very long list of Joe O'Brien bloopers and its getting longer.

ReCAPTCHA got it in one 'RUDE qua'

Casablanca

February 28. 2012 11:06 AM

DMW

Good Morning Swordsfolk,

Christol @ February 27. 2012 11:37 PM,
an excellent contribution thankyou

Let's not try and gloss over the facts here.

Some facts have been left out or modified to assist the argument put.

Mr Rudd was elected as leader of parliamentary party on a ticket stitched together by Ms Gillard AND the supposed factional 'warlords' and the 'faceless men' in the machine that supports those elected to implement party policy. Mr Rudd would not have got the position without Ms Gillard in particular and the factions in general.

... it was Kevin Rudd that took down the Howard Government single handed in spectacular fashion and dragged the rest of his party back to power.

First up, despite the beleif of some, Labor would have won the 2007 election with any one of three or four other people as leader. The extent of the win would have been different for sure but it was almost inevitable that there would be a change of governing party.

To state that Mr Rudd single handed and, by implication, on his own, beat the Howard government negates the efforts of the thousands of people, some who possibly were there because of Mr Rudd alone, who swung in behind the campaign. The efforts of many people including the warlords and the faceless people were required. To take one example, the campaigning efforts of Ms McKew in Bennelong were a big factor in unseatimng Mr Howard and to negate those efforts is misguided and the stuff of fairy tales.

The reasons for Mr Rudd's downfall are many and complex however I will distill it to one simple fact: Mr Rudd beleived his own publicity

People can question the 'wisdom' of the caucus decision yesterday and I will offer that they were right because as any parent will tell you Don't reward a dummy spitting kid who is throwing a tantrum

DMW

February 28. 2012 11:17 AM

Casablanca

Gillard's guts and glory
Moira Rayner February 27, 2012

www.eurekastreet.com.au/article.aspx?aeid=30228

Casablanca

February 28. 2012 11:17 AM

DMW

By George, I think he has got it.

[b]Rudd's camp missed Howard's lesson on how to fight back[/i] George Megalogenis @TheAus
www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-e6frg7ex-1226283276711

To jump the shark try this link first: http://goo.gl/fCHpt

DMW

February 28. 2012 11:42 AM

Ad astra reply

Hi Lyn
What an interesting set of links you have given us this morning.  It’s fascinating to read the different take individuals have on yesterday’s events.  Clearly, some want the ‘crisis’ to keep bubbling away and boil over periodically so they can go on writing a ‘good story’, which is much easier than doing some decent investigative work.

janice
I do agree heartily with your 7.17 am comment – a sound summing-up of this awful saga that went on damaging Labor for far too long.  It had to stop, and it has.

You comment: ”We will have to endure the media raking through the ashes for a while but I expect it will die down, hopefully in not too long a time.”  I hope you are right.  Is it possible that they might entertain their audiences with stories of ‘the new Julia’ or ‘Australian’s iron lady’?  Then again that’s too much to hope for from News Limited, that still seems intent on destroying her and her Government.

Christol
Welcome back to TPS.  I accept that what you have written encapsulates your view of recent events.  janice sees them differently.  Do read what she has to say.

Casablanca
You’re so right.  I despair of ABC news headlines.  Who have they got writing them – a reject from News Limited?  Even the English is appalling.

On the ‘reshuffle’ we also have: ‘is being coy’, ‘refuses to be drawn’, ‘has not ruled out retribution’ – all designed to sensationalize the issue.  Why not simply say: “The PM has said she will announce her reshuffle later this week”?  Oh no, that would be too bland for a sensation-addicted audience.

Ad astra reply

February 28. 2012 12:18 PM

TalkTurkey

janice said

I think the MPs had to go out there hard and say what had to be said . . .

Yes I think so too, it has been good for the Guvnors, the Ministry and *J*U*L*I*A* in particular has been able to grab the initiative and are running with it, and the Coalons are all but blown out. They are trembing with apprehension, you bet! Abbortt is now the most obvious source of protein for the Hungry Beast of the MSM, nearly peanuts time for us folks!

janice you said then
. . . Albo's pain was partly the knowledge that had he not talked Rudd out of the 2010 challenge, all the subsequent pain and bitterness and the airing of it all in the public eye would have been avoided.

Yes janice, a few fateful words . . . More damage than the original 'Faceless men' in Menzies* day!

Rudd's perfidy cost s-o-o-o many Labor seats! So much pain! Took us to the brink, over the edge indeed, *J*U*L*I*A* hanging on with her fingernails to the overhanging shrubs, pulled herself over and brought the rest of us with her, Thank Dog she and we are safe now and looking nearly Ready and Set for next year's GO!


But that's why we good decent people of Labor Party persuasion couldn't believe that Rudd was doing this, because we just couldn't believe that he would!

But he DID !

It is gobsmacking. It is still unbelievable. How could he!?

He was a hero once, now he is forever a double agent, a Labor traitor, forgiveness is not a quick option. The damage, so great already, was within a breath, a mere straw, of being infinitely more, we so nearly lost government (and we are in a much worse position than we would have been for next time) just becase of this one bloke's giant underhand unbelievable treachery -  presumably losing Government would have delighted Rudd!

He said sort of Oh sorry anybody i might've hurt yesterday as if it was almost incidental, basically he thought he was being pretty generous just apologising at all. well he is the most famous apologiser of all time after all, this was a repeat command perfoemance and it sounded like a performance to me.

Nobody yet still has commented on my fear that he might yet cr  cro  ros   cros  the Fl  F fff lllloo   oor Dog I can't bring myself to write it, Why is nobody talking about it ? I keep asking Yous, not a whisper! -
Because he could bring down the Government in spite, he's a G gg g o  gg  oddd -fearing Christian after all!

Did you hear it first from (heart-in-mouth) TT ?

I wanna be wRONggggg!

Doesn't much matter to him about the rest of his temporal life, he's sure to be Ruddirected to a bigger better Lodge when he takes that last great free flight. That's what happens with Christians. Happened with Holy Jo. Will happen with Abbortt.

*One thing about this Gillard-saved minority government, it ain't lazy!
If we had a safe majority, our majority might not be so safe!


We will win. What a team. Conroy up for the knock right now on the NBN ground, with *J*U*L*I*A* getting the tapdowns. oh it does my heart good. Not quite half-time! Rudd on the bench for good, pity he didn't just do the exalted job he had without deliberate tripping his own team members. But we have such depth in our forwards, the hole Rudd leaves will like a hole punched in water, he is a byline now. I wonder who gets FA (heh heh, Well Rudd gets FA that's for sure! Smile ) That was a pun btw.

I like the Aussie Rules analogy with Politics. Does anybody mind?

All praise to *J*U*L*I*A*, I have always said so. She is our Captain and our Star, at last she has the wind beneath her pretty wings, and look! Partly because of her I care not a whit for messing my matterfors!

TalkTurkey

February 28. 2012 12:27 PM

Ad astra reply

Casablanca
ON ABC midday news the PM is reported to be “refusing to commit to keeping those who voted against her” in the ministry, when all she said was that appointment would be based on merit.  How can ABC management endorse such deceptive news-casting?

Ad astra reply

February 28. 2012 12:41 PM

Casablanca

Ad

I saw part of the press conference with The PM and Stephen Conroy at around mid-day and the PM said that she would 'Complete the re-scuffle in my own time'. Apparently Ms Gillard had said the same in an early morning interviews. Not good enough for Joe O'Brien.

It was nice to see Julia Gillard looking relaxed and comfortable, nay radiant, in her midday press conference. I realised that she was looking a bit under the pump over the past couple of months, even developing a furrow on her brow, so it was a nice to see the immediate transformation following her resounding endorsement.

Tim Lister reported that hers was the most resounding Labor leadership ballot win since 1982. The next closest was the first Hawke/Keating tussle with 66/44.

Go Julia!  


Casablanca

February 28. 2012 12:43 PM

TalkTurkey

Casablanca said

Gillard's guts and glory
Moira Rayner February 27, 2012

Great article about *J*U*L*I*A* by a fem true believer, with a picture of her so good I printed it! It's beautiful! You'll love both pic and text.

www.eurekastreet.com.au/article.aspx?aeid=30228

TalkTurkey

February 28. 2012 12:59 PM

Casablanca

Ad,

Another leap in comprehension came during the Gillard/Conroy conference. The PM had already batted away at least 2 questions about 'rumours' that Bob Carr had been approached saying that whilst she greatly admired Carr, the man himself had always maintained that he had no interest in joining the Canberra team.

Minutes later some hack asked if she had phoned Carr. The PM answered that she did not discuss private calls or wtte.

That interchange was reported by Joe O'Brien as the PM refusing to rule out whether Carr had been approached. Sheeesh!

Casablanca

February 28. 2012 01:02 PM

Casablanca

TT

That 'picture' would make a wonderful T-shirt wouldn't it.

Casablanca

February 28. 2012 01:14 PM

TalkTurkey

Via Leroy @ 1363 on Poll Bludger, delicious!

www.news.com.au/.../story-e6frfku0-1226283695627

. . . Mr Windsor said while Labor's internal troubles were having an impact, adjudication of government woes would take place at the next election.

"The question really is would I support a no-confidence motion on the basis of someone aspiring to leadership to a political party - the answer is no," he said.

Asked if Mr Abbott or any Coalition MPs were leaning on him to support a no-confidence motion in the Government he replied, chuckling: "A little weakling like that wouldn't lean on me". [ Smile !]

Mr Windsor insisted he had made "exactly the right call" by backing Labor to form minority government despite contrary feedback from his New England electorate. . . .

Read more: www.news.com.au/.../story-e6frfku0-1226283695627


Abbortt is cactus. He is fair game now for the MSM and for the ALP both.

*J*U*L*I*A* will never be talked to again as she was in Adelaide in Friday. Her demeanor is different, you can see it.

She is also at the most powerful age in any fit woman's life in my experience. Women in their 50's are mighty.

Will Abbortt last till September?

The drums the drums  . . .

This is going to be such fun.

TalkTurkey

February 28. 2012 01:16 PM

lyn

Hi Casabloanca

You are keeping me informed this morning thankyou very much, great info, top contributor good work.

I just saw a clip of Julia walking down the corridor, a journalist called out to her,  she said " I have just left an interview thankyou very much"  and kept walking.

Minutes later some hack asked if she had phoned Carr. The PM answered that she did not discuss private calls or wtte.

That interchange was reported by Joe O'Brien as the PM refusing to rule out whether Carr had been approached. Sheeesh!


Joe O'Brien he shows a video clip then distorts his comments straight after the video clip.

CheersSmileSmileSmile

lyn

February 28. 2012 01:18 PM

lyn

Hi casablanca

Sorry about this

"Casabloanca" I wish I would check better before I press save.

cheersSmileSmileSmileSmile

lyn

February 28. 2012 01:30 PM

Gravel

Ad Astra

Your report of Question time yesterday, and of Julia's press appearance tally's exactly with my thinking.  I wish I could express it all as well as you and others here do.

Lyn

Thanks heaps for all your wonderful links, there are some good ones today.  I had trouble with the Global Mail one,  It won't line up with my screen and the scroll won't work with it.  Maybe I need to send an SOS out to NOrmanK, what do you think?

Gravel

February 28. 2012 01:34 PM

TalkTurkey

Casablanca

Yes it would!

Have you ever seen Jane and the Dragon, it is the BEST all-age-inclusive childrens' animated TV series, beautiful clever nice moral funny and you can't help identify *J*A*N*E* with J*U*L*I*A*!

Especially with that lovely triumphant girl pic on your link.

*J*U*L*I*A* is winning hearts and minds hand over fist, especially now with women I suspect, those who mistrusted one of their own gender, (green eyed Ranga at that) but now they are starting to realize that she is not a showpony, she is a tough achiever of reforms that will make their lives better and Australia a better place. It is all coming together.

The glaring merciless spotlight
which has been turned on her by the MSM
with the hope that she will shrink and wither
has instead let her shine! Smile  

TalkTurkey

February 28. 2012 01:38 PM

lyn

Hi Gravel

You are delightful, everyone loves the links but if I only did them

for you I would be happy just to see how happy you are.

Global Mail scrolls sideways, if you look hard to the right in the centre of the page is a big  >  

Not a real success I don't think, a lot of people are disappointed.
Apparently the site cost lots of money to set up and they have all the latest idea's.

Regarding Ad Astra's writing and reports, I agree he has a way of

writing talking.

CheersSmileSmileSmileSmile

lyn

February 28. 2012 01:49 PM

TalkTurkey

Jane and Dragon in action

www.google.com.au/url

Dragon archives as dictated to Jane by Dragon with commentary by Jane

www.google.com.au/url

Martin Baynton the Kiwi author based in Sydney must be a genius. I am green with envy looking at this stuff, the Dragon animation is amazing, as good as anything in Lord of the Rings, though I must say Baynton's Wot-Wots is a bit highbrow for me.

TalkTurkey

February 28. 2012 01:58 PM

Ad astra reply

Casablanca
At the 1 pm ABC news, the reshuffle had morphed into: “there has been no direct comment from the PM on punishing ministers who voted for Mr Rudd”, when all she said was that she would choose on merit and capacity to do the job, and was not going to speculate on her selection in the media.

Ad astra reply

February 28. 2012 02:59 PM

TalkTurkey

I've gone right off VEGEMITE!

I'm into AEROPLANE JELLY now!

www.google.com.au/url

Sing along! Follow the bouncing ball!

I like *J*U*L*I*A* *G*I*L*L*A*RD* !
*J*U*L*I*A* *G*I*L*L*A*RD* for Me!

I like her long earlobes!
I like her sharp nose!
Her smile and her style and her odd taste in clothes!
I like her big bum and her broad Aussie voice,
Hair colour like plum, that's why she's my first choice!
I like *J*U*L*I*A* *G*I*L*L*A*RD* !
*J*U*L*I*A* *G*I*L*L*A*RD* for Me!

TalkTurkey

February 28. 2012 03:13 PM

Casablanca

Ad

Lyndal Curtis seemed to put matters back into perspective when interviewed later by JoeOB.

Curtis talked about the reshuffle becoming a wider issue following the resignation of Mark Arbib. She said that the end of the week or even next week would be a reasonable time frame. Joe did not demur. He's learning, one hopes.

Curtis, however, make a silly point earlier by stating that the PM had used the word 'purpose' a couple of times in an effort to better sell her message. Curtis added "So we will be hearing more of that". It seems to me that this is an example of the media fouling its own nest in the sense that its a cynical assessment of the intent and efforts of the PM (& others) to cut through.

Casablanca

February 28. 2012 03:21 PM

Casablanca

TT

Absolutely delightful ditty. I'm sure that the PM would love it. It also shows with larrikin good humour why we need to focus on the PM's achievements not just on matters that have no impact on her ability to perform her job.

Casablanca

February 28. 2012 03:53 PM

Ad astra reply

DMW
I couldn’t read the full Mega piece as I can’t get behind the paywall, but I noticed some snippets from others writing in The Australian.

Paul Kelly says: “Labor remains a bitterly divided house yet Gillard has won a new chance for political recovery. Her 71-31 victory margin is convincing yet its meaning is deceptive because it is more anti-Rudd than pro-Gillard.

Dennis Shanahan says: “Julia Gillard has had a clear victory and she looks relieved, but the Prime Minister has to do more than just promise "more of the same" if she is to hold on to the leadership and win the next election.

Gillard has to seize this one chance at redemption, this one hope to lift Labor's fortunes and her strongest chance to ensure she leads Labor to the next election.


Is this a sign that they are beginning to back the horse both ways?

PvO says: “It was a positive attempt at reconciliation for Julia Gillard to use her press conference after yesterday's leadership ballot to suggest Labor must honour Kevin Rudd without reservations. But for it to be more than rhetoric, she must back up the comments by demanding Wayne Swan's resignation as Deputy Prime Minister, no questions asked.
The notion that Swan can go on serving as Gillard's deputy without retracting his spiteful hissing about Rudd - claims he is dysfunctional and lacks Labor values - is ridiculous, unless the PM's honouring of Rudd is a fraud. On Sunday, Swan said: "I stand by every word."


PvO doesn’t usually huff and puff this much

Under a headline: “Gillard can never clean away this bloody mess Niki Savva says: ”The seeming perversity of destroying Kevin Rudd and preserving Julia Gillard, voting against a candidate who might secure victory and sticking with the leader all the polls say cannot, can only be explained by deep self-interest.

This most vengeful, bloodthirsty, short-sighted, and possibly fanciful campaign was, according to a widespread belief in Labor, mainly about blowing Rudd into pink mist, so he can never be reconstituted, and only tangentially about saving Gillard.
"

Archetypical angry Niki – does she see a real threat to her Tony’s preeminence in the polls?

Ad astra reply

February 28. 2012 04:01 PM

TalkTurkey

Casablanca
I don't tweet, perhaps you do?
Surely someone send it through!
I believe in the blogosphere:
Somehow I'm sure that she will hear. (it. ) Smile


I would love to put a smile on Our Ranga Lass,
she's so earnt one!

Just in case anyone wonders, I do write rhyme for readers to enjoy, and for my own amusement, but it is primarily and always with an eye to stockpiling the only kind of anti-Abborrt, anti-Tory ammunition I can create. Patricia WA does too, how I know, it's to be seen between every line in invisible code. If ditties  like this can help at all, well spread 'em around please everyone. We can counter the horrible memes about *J*U*L*I*A* promulgated by such as Anal Jones and Bumbolt with fun stuff answering their hatred by giggling in pure amusement right in their faces.

I Like *J*U*L*I*A* is fun to sing! Follow the bouncing ball!  
  

TalkTurkey

February 28. 2012 04:04 PM

NormanK

                           INSIDE LOOKING OUT

Parliamentary Broadcasting Corporation
Broadcast: 27/02/2012
Reporter: Bill Shorten

Chris Uhlmann is Chief Political editor of the ABC and one of the main protagonists in bringing about the leadership ballot today.

Transcript

BILL SHORTEN, PRESENTER: Welcome to Inside Looking Out, I'm Bill Shorten. Chris Uhlmann is the Chief Political Editor with the ABC and has played a leading role in the recent media agitations calling for a leadership ballot within the ALP and he joins us now.
Welcome.

CHRIS UHLMANN: Good evening, Bill.

BILL SHORTEN: What was all that about?

CHRIS UHLMANN: Well, there was a concerted push by Rudd supporters to harness the groundswell of popularity of the former Foreign Minister. It was our duty to bring to light Kevin Rudd's leadership ambitions based on the facts available to us. Unfortunately, he didn't attract as many votes as most pundits would have had us believe.

BILL SHORTEN: Isn't that one of the most extraordinary pieces of self-harm we've ever seen in Australian political reporting and it achieved nothing?

CHRIS UHLMANN: I don't think so Bill. We had credible information .....

BILL SHORTEN: From half a dozen un-named sources.

CHRIS UHLMANN: Yeah, that's true. But by the same token, there's been leadership challenges in the past where no-one has come forward to give us, you know, the Australian public, fair warning. What happened is there was some weeks of speculation about leadership and our editors and producers decided that we had sufficient information to bring the matter to the public's attention. If you're suggesting .....

BILL SHORTEN: You do this routinely though don't you, Chris Uhlmann? Take some little snippet of gossip, some little bit of tittle tattle that one of your sources whispers in your ear and blow it up into a full-blown crisis?

CHRIS UHLMANN: That's hardly fair, I think you're trying to say that somehow there wasn't a push on by Kevin Rudd when plainly the events of recent days have shown that there was.

BILL SHORTEN: This is endemic though, isn't it?

CHRIS UHLMANN: Look, Bill, we brought the matter out into the light of day. We are the ones who forced Rudd's hand, and the Prime Minister's, and now we have a highly controversial, destabilising problem sorted out. We did this for the good of the country. Now we can put all of this behind us. We just want to get on with reporting policy for the Australian people.

BILL SHORTEN: Well you weren't getting on with the business of reporting policy for the last week and in fact you've been obsessed with this for quite some time now. And interestingly, of course, every time that was raised, the media insisted that it was a very real threat. We heard little, if anything, about bills that passed the House last week because you guys were obsessing with a bit of gossip from a few disgruntled backbenchers. You've let the public down, haven't you Chris Uhlmann?

CHRIS UHLMANN: Oh, hang on a second. I think you're now taking a long bow here. I believe in political reporting, journalists work very hard and are very idealistic. Just have a look at what the ABC's been doing. We've been bringing our audience up-to-date information as the events unfolded but now our focus is turned towards evaluating the relative merits of the policies of each side of parliament. We are getting on with business.

BILL SHORTEN:  There were reports of Kevin Rudd having 50 votes in the Caucus. We had headlines like "Gillard under siege". The challenge was going to take place in October, November, December, February, in a matter of weeks, within days. So, what are we to make of the words that journalists say now? What's happened to truth in political reporting?

CHRIS UHLMANN: Yeah, I think we all understand that the last couple of weeks has been quite bruising and difficult. On the other hand, what we've also seen is the media have brought this to a head and now we can move on.

BILL SHORTEN: Rudd attracted 31 votes. 31 votes Chris Uhlmann. That's an exaggeration of around 65%. Why should we believe anything that the media tells us in the future?

CHRIS UHLMANN: You may be right Bill. We do have a job ahead of us to restore faith in political reporting and that's what I and my team intend to do.

BILL SHORTEN: Is this the end of it?

CHRIS UHLMANN: I believe it is. I believe in the best in people. I think Mr Rudd's concession speech today in caucus was gracious, just as I thought that the Prime Minister's speech was big-spirited. Certainly as far as I'm concerned that is the end of the matter and we won't be pursuing the story any further.

BILL SHORTEN: So we won't see any sensational headlines about Rudd supporters being punished? You won't be putting pressure on Julia Gillard to announce her reshuffle sooner rather than later?

CHRIS UHLMANN: The headlines used on ABC on-line stories are .....

BILL SHORTEN: We won't see any talk of a second, or is that third, challenge from Rudd?

CHRIS UHLMANN: I can't predict what .....

BILL SHORTEN: In the interest of balance will we see reports of how Tony Abbott doesn't have the support of around 49% of his party room?

CHRIS UHLMANN: I'm not sure what you're trying to get at here Bill .....

BILL SHORTEN: What we saw in 2010 - and Mark Scott has said this is and others have said it - was that you failed to explain what actually went on in 2010. We heard speculation about falling opinion polls and lurches to the right on asylum seekers but you and your colleagues have known about the problems with Rudd's administrative style for a very long time. Why isn't Mark Scott here explaining what just happened? Because surely all of the questions haven't been answered, even though tomorrow your colleagues will insist that "we answered all those questions yesterday".

CHRIS UHLMANN: Bill, whether or not you're frustrated the Managing Director didn't come on your show, I'm not gonna second guess that. You've asked me to come on. I'm explaining clearly. The Press Gallery, and political journalists more generally, had information that Kevin Rudd was moving ......

BILL SHORTEN: Yes, but you also knew that he hadn't been knifed didn't you?

CHRIS UHLMANN: We knew .....

BILL SHORTEN: You knew that the whole 'stabbed in the back' thing was a nonsense. You knew why the Caucus moved against Kevin Rudd in 2010 and chose not to tell the Australian public.

CHRIS UHLMANN: Well .....

BILL SHORTEN: Instead, you've allowed things like 'illegitimate', 'lacking in authority', 'poll-driven', 'faceless men' and so on to blossom in the pages of the papers and on our screens.

CHRIS UHLMANN: Bill, I don't think we can be held responsible for things that the opposition says. We are duty-bound to report what is said during press conferences, in the parliament and during interviews.

BILL SHORTEN: Yes, but you are also duty-bound to report the truth aren't you?

CHRIS UHLMANN: Of course we are Bill. Of course we are.

BILL SHORTEN: So are you saying that you and your colleagues had no knowledge of the underlying reasons for the events of June 2010? Are you seriously suggesting that your sources told you nothing about the problems within the PM's Office under Kevin Rudd?

CHRIS UHLMANN: Well we may have heard whispers and rumours but we can't base our stories on the say-so of a few disgruntled ministers and public servants or a bit of gossip published in the tabloids. We would have destroyed our reputations in one fell swoop.

BILL SHORTEN: On that note I think we'll end it there, Chris Uhlmann. Thanks for coming in.

CHRIS UHLMANN: Thanks for having me.


www.abc.net.au/7.30/content/2012/s3440766.htm

NormanK

February 28. 2012 04:09 PM

Michael

Surely surely surely...

The penny will drop with the slightly intellectually advantaged members of the Coalition that, as displayed again today, Julia Gillard in Question Time makes Tony Abbott, Christopher Pyne, Julie Bishop, Scott Morrison, The "Eh?" Team of the Opposition, look and sound complete fools?

Michael

February 28. 2012 04:30 PM

jane

janice @7.17am, bravo. A brilliant summation for us all. The two sides have had their say and released all the bile (i hope). They seem to have kissed and made up and now we, as their supporters need to do the same.

Also agree wholeheartedly with your comment @8.19am. I'm sure that all involved have regretted ever since 24/6/10 that they didn't go for a spill.

And although they would still have had to cough up a reason for the ballot, at least Mr Rudd would have realised how little support he had.

And perhaps he would have appreciated the generosity of the PM in throwing the face saving lifeline of the plum job of FM. Most dumped PMs are relegated to the backbenches.

Casablanca @10.47am, she's had 5 minutes, the slack bitch. How dare she keep the great JOB waiting? You really must get your priorities right. He's a busy man and mustn't be kept waiting!

Mr Rudd beleived his own publicity

A very dangerous belief to hold, DMW. And an excellent and very pertinent one line summary.

TT loved the ditty.

One positive to come out of Kevin Rudd's bile has been our introduction to Tony Windsor and Rob Oakeshott. They have been a breath of fresh air and sanity over the last 18 or so months.
It's been a pleasure to have their input.

jane

February 28. 2012 05:43 PM

Ad astra reply

Michael
I thought QT was pretty muted today – is the Coalition running out of puff?

The only questions asked by Coalition members were intended to embarrass the PM by throwing back at her things she had said about Kevin Rudd or vice versa, which she deflected with verve.  The only question remotely related to policy asked by a Coalition member was addressed to Robert McClelland who was queried about his program of activities for the next eighteen months.  Was this asked to embarrass him, or the PM, as he is in some doubt for continuing in his portfolio?  He was well prepared with several sheets of notes and gave his answer full bore.  Was he warned, or did he cleverly anticipate the question?

The session ended at 3.10 pm with a mix up, the Speaker thinking Tony Abbott was about to move to suspend standing orders (he did start by saying ‘I move’) but then sought to ask a question, which the Speaker disallowed as the time for QT had expired and the PM moved to place further questions on the notice paper.

Altogether a limp performance by Tony Abbott (who I think asked only one or two questions) and his team.  They looked dispirited.

Ad astra reply

February 28. 2012 06:05 PM

jane

AA @5.43pm, I think the Liars are dispirited. All their ammunition re support from the Parliamentary party for the PM has exploded in their faces.

A talking head, can't remember who atm, predicted that if Liealot tried that on, he'd better watch out for the return serve. He tried it and as predicted was aced.

Now that all the anger has been vented, the government is going full steam ahead and look out anyone who gets in the way.

jane

February 28. 2012 06:56 PM

2353

NormanK - very clever.  I seem to remember you doing a similar thing a couple of times in the past.  Can I ask for more?

2353

February 28. 2012 08:06 PM

janice

Norman K,
That Shorten/Uhlman interview is absolutely brilliant. I've been thinking for a very long time that journalists should submit themselves to public interviews, and I would dearly love to do the "Shorten" role.  I would love to interview Oakes, Hartcher and Shanahan for starters and then have a go at making Nikki Savva squirm.

janice

February 28. 2012 09:28 PM

Catey

NormanK - that interview is bloody brilliant - just what I needed.  Chris Uhlmann is like a stone in my shoe.  He has totally ruined the 7.30 Report for me.  Thank you, thank you, thank you.

Catey

February 28. 2012 09:31 PM

DMW

I listened to an interesting panel discussion on 'Labor Woes' on Late Night Live.
www.abc.net.au/.../3851380

Barry Jones related how he is often asked by Uni Students about how to get into politics.

I will paraphrase:
Student: I got a degree in Law & Economics which party should I join or which minister should I go and work for.
Barry Jones: What do you beleive in? What are your interests?
Student: Ummmm

It doesn't paint a bright picture for the future of government or politics in my mind.

Then I read this:
“Find something more important than you are,” philosopher Dan Dennett once said in discussing the secret of happiness, “and dedicate your life to it.”

Now there is a gem of wisdom for aspiring and current politicians.

It offers one stick against which we could measure a politician to determine if they are good or not.

This is not directed at any particular pollie of the moment but I would hazard a guess that if we looked at the current crop we would find a fair number on both sides that are more important (in their own minds) than anything else in the omniverse.

The Dennett quote comes from this article:
How to Find Your Purpose and Do What You Love  by Maria Popova @Brain Pickings
www.brainpickings.org/.../

Well worth a read.

DMW

February 28. 2012 10:01 PM

TalkTurkey

Ad astra, Jane,
Dispirited! Yes! Weren't they!

Funny, I think I get more pleasure out of their pain in losing than I get from our pleasure in wnning!. Smile

The sweetest moment for me was when, with the camera on the Coalons' front bench, Slipper 94a'd a Lieberal (off camera), but as he did so, the front benchers' heads all slumped in unison, it bespoke defeat-at-last, there was a sort of finality and acceptance in their misery, like the way a convicted embezzler's head slumps when he gets his 12-year sentence . . . Only embezzlers only take a second to realize that the game's up, it's taken the Coalons nearly 18 months, and you know that makes it so much sweeter . . .

Didn' I tole yous-all, (with my Eye of Time in close-focus mode), by the end of this week (Thursday near the end of QT specifically) the Coalons' gloating will have turned to despair . . . Well it didn't take that long, (Eye of Time is  conservative in prognostications), today's QT told it all.  

They are utterly empty, clueless, panicking inside now! Their easy ride is over, their cover is being blown and their bluff called. They have nowhere to run and they are scared. I saw a great line earlier today, wtte that the Coalons are so stupid they've gone all the way up a blind alley just to see. Smile

Mesma was hopelessly floundered on Q&A 8 days ago. She will be a beached floundered flounder soon. And she is just the way the others will go.  

They have no idea of how to frame a policy. They thought they wouldn't have to. Their costings are a joke, they know it, heh heh,
Poor Joe, Poor Joe, watcha gonna do
Watcha gonna do when they come for you?

So come on MSM, do yer bloody jobs!
Expose the NOposition
as malicious lying yobs!


It is no mere truism, that saying, Whatever doesn't kill me makes me stronger -(check out Bear Grylls!!!)- and can you imagine how strong our Boadicea is now! The Coalons know they have no champion to stand against her, the MSM knows they have gone several bridges too far and they are retreating in disarray before the righteous contempt being shown them, in replies to their gotcha-attempt questions, by key Labor Ministers, by Bob Brown, and critically by our IndependAnts. Always it is *J*U*L*I*A* herself who leads the attack, famously, "Don't write crap!", that was the moment since which the MSM has never felt quite so comfortable in their skins, and now that Labor has passed almost every major reform, the whole Government is in a position to flick impudent questioners - I love it, it's suddenly happening the way I have longed for so long.


Btw, Slipper by name, steel-capped boot by nature in QT today, he sat *J*U*L*I*A* down peremptoriy, kicked people out,  shut people up like nothing I ever saw before, he sure isn't averse to using his power  . . . He is after all the most powerful person in Australia!

TalkTurkey

February 28. 2012 10:13 PM

Ian

Mr Rudd beleived his own publicity


and by doing so believed he was the one chosen to write both his and the countrys destiny. It was never going to be that easy and never, ever should or will be.

Ian

February 28. 2012 11:05 PM

NormanK

2353

Can I ask for more?

You certainly may. It depends on the Muse. And The Fates.

Catey (I'm glad I cheered you up Smile) remarked yesterday on what might well be the most interesting observation made by a journalist during the ABC24 coverage of the ballot. As part of the SpakFilla that was being dished up while we waited for something (a leaf to fall from a tree - anything!) to happen, was an exchange between Chris Uhlmann and Lyndal Curtis.

Uhlmann was going on about 'truth in politics' when he made the astonishing concession that he could see why politicians were not more adventurous and truthful in their dealings with the press and the public at large. He admitted that if a politician offered a frank personal view or used an expression that strayed from the party line the media would be on to it like a flash. "Aha so you are at odds with the Prime Minister on this issue!" or some such sensationalist nonsense. As a result politicians are not frank with journalists during interviews. Uhlmann wondered aloud about the problem and lamented the fact that he could see no way of getting off what he referred to as 'the treadmill'.

One way to take at least a small step away from that treadmill would have been for Uhlmann to change his own approach. He interviewed Bill Shorten that evening. Now imagine if Uhlmann had said something like:

"I understand that it would have been difficult for you and your party to explain at the time the truth about what happened in June 2010. It would be very difficult to besmirch the reputation of an enormously popular Prime Minister within days of having removed him from the job. It would have been unkind to him and potentially damaging to the party at a time when you are trying to promote a new leader and while you had one eye on the upcoming election scheduled for later in the year. Are the events of the last few days an attempt to get that story across to the public?"

Who knows how Shorten would have responded - best guess is that he would have stuck to his lines and given a bland answer about getting on with governing blah blah blah. But at least Uhlmann would have displayed a little of the understanding that he actually possesses (as exemplified by his remarks that morning) and might have started the long journey to establishing a reputation for objective yet empathetic questioning. Who knows where it might lead if one of these high profile journos actually adopted some style other than hostile attack?

But Uhlmann had to be Uhlmann and he went after Shorten in the same old way:

Well you weren't getting on with business for the last week and in fact you've been obsessed with this for quite some time now. And interestingly, of course, every time that was raised, the Government denied it. So, what are we to make of the words that politicians say now? What's happened to truth in politics?

This confrontational way of interviewing politicians is just training them to 'stay focussed, stay on message' and leads to the bland exchanges and responses that we see today. Interviewing a politician should not be all about trying to cause them to stumble or (Heaven help us) promoting the idea that the question is more important than the answer. We have a classic example of the latter with the Michelle Grattan question to the PM this morning:

Ms Gillard, there’s been some suggestion this morning that a Minister might have exercised a sort of effective veto over Mark Arbib continuing in the ministry. Can you tell us unequivocally that this was not so?

Now there's a question that could launch a thousand stories! The answer was always going to be defensive, a dead bat back to the bowler so obviously the importance of that question was the question itself and not the answer. What's the point?
As it turned out the PM was in no mood for Michelle's nonsense and dispatched it to the fine leg boundary with a clever deflection:

PM: I’ve got absolutely no idea what you’re referring to, absolutely no idea. Next question.

So 2353 (long story short Laughing) it was the fortuitous juxtaposition of Uhlmann's remarks yesterday morning and his complete inability to recognise that he is part of the problem and could take steps to help rescue political discourse in this country that set me off to lampoon him. It's in the hands of The Fates.


janice

Thanks for the kind words and for copying it over to AFV.
I'd love to see your interview with the Egyptian Princess. Smile

NormanK

February 28. 2012 11:28 PM

jane

[quote]Their costings are a joke, they know it, heh heh,...[quote]

They just haven't found the right catering firm yet, TT. I don't know how you could be so insensitive. You know how temperamental these bloody cooking types can be! Always whining about a few lousy billion here and there.

Well a bit more than a few, I suppose. Well a lot more actually. But it'll be easy enough when we stop the income stream from the MRRT and the carbon price and hand it back to the miners.

That'll pour mega bucks back into the budget! See! You people reckon I'm an economic illiterate!

I have to say I am enjoying Slipper's reign as Speaker.

Ian @10.13pm, amen to that.

jane

February 28. 2012 11:32 PM

DMW

NK
... obviously the importance of that question was the question itself ...

Interesting.

I suggested above that we could use Dennett's proposition “Find something more important than you are and dedicate your life to it.” could be used to assess the worth of a pollie and gave no thought to journalists.

It is time to get to work on a 'self importance' measuring device.

DMW

February 28. 2012 11:51 PM

DMW

via @mfarnsworth

Jonathon Holmes of Media Watch sent an email to a number of journalists prior to this week's programme and Laura Tingle's response is interesting.
www.abc.net.au/.../1204_tingle.pdf

Suggest you scroll down and read the email from Holmes before you read Ms Tingles response.

DMW

February 29. 2012 12:05 AM

NormanK

DMW

Your synapses are firing alright at the moment, aren't they?
That's another lovely quote and could be applied to so many different walks of life. I know that all of the professional dancers that I worked with could not have risen very far without selfless dedication to an art-form that they regarded as being bigger than themselves.
The Church, a sport, any art-form, community service, teaching, defending the weak and downtrodden, health care, the environment, law and order.
The list is long.
Your 'self-importance measuring device' might produce a lot of red faces in surprising vocations other than politics.
Contemporary journalists? Make sure there is adequate room on the upper end of the scale - bearing in mind that it might be used to measure morning TV hosts and shock jocks.

NormanK

February 29. 2012 12:24 AM

DMW

NK
I had an afterthought about that device - it would be ok as long as no one pointed it at me - I could get embarrassed too some days Embarassed

DMW

February 29. 2012 12:28 AM

DMW

The Time Lords have given us an extra day of summer today.

If you can see it through the rain enjoy it.

DMW

February 29. 2012 12:43 AM

DMW

Way back in the dim distant past I pontificated on the position of the Speaker of The House and proposed that a special electorate be created based on the Governor General's residence so that the GG would 'elect' a truly independent Speaker.

Given the way Mr Slipper is growing into the role maybe some will start to think it may be a good idea.

This article though could turn some off:

Speaker in driver's seat as battle of wills leaves 'irrelevant' Gillard speechless Tony Wright @SMAge/NTimes
www.theage.com.au/.../...hless-20120228-1u12c.html

DMW

February 29. 2012 07:10 AM

TalkTurkey

Today ma belle amie J**** (going on 70 ) and her half-sister D*** (aged 72 ) are in Broken Hill celebrating J****'s full sister K***'s 17 th birthday party.


Read as many times as it takes you to figure it out!

TalkTurkey

February 29. 2012 07:43 AM

Jaeger

DMW,

Slipper is doing a good job as Speaker, but as you point out the media only notices when they can use it against the government (or the Speaker.)  Apparently the steady stream of evicted Opposition members isn't newsworthy.

While there is a way to go to bring QT back to the standard set by Westminster, Slipper has made a good fist of it so far.  The neutering of the SSOs (Silly Stunt Operations) as a soap box to get sound bites on the evening news has been particularly effective.  

I'm not sure about the GG 'electing' a speaker, though; that would politicise the role of the GG.  The current arrangements aren't perfect, but with proper separation of the Speaker from their party (if any), it can certainly work.

Jaeger

February 29. 2012 07:52 AM

lyn

TODAY’S LINKS

A brilliant coup,James Higgins, The Politics Project
Also, good to see, Gillard and Communications Minister Stephen Conroy are having a press conference as I speak about the NBN. Getting on with the job. Like Gillard said yesterday, settle in.
thepoliticsproject.wordpress.com/.../

The 'Certainty' Myth , Mr Denmore, The Failed Estate
The irony is that part of the reason Gillard has been in trouble in the polls has been the damage that the strong currency is doing to just about every industry outside a supercharged resource sector. If you recall, Labor did have a plan to deal with that imbalance. It was called the RSPT. But then business pleaded for certainty.....
thefailedestate.blogspot.com.au/.../...y-myth.html
Gillard's challenge: two opposition leaders in a hurry, Andrew Elder, The Drum
For Tony Abbott, any upswing for the Government will reveal that his current cruisy performance is notthe idling of a powerful machine but the flat-stick throttling of a feeble beast
http://www.abc.net.au/unleashed/3856540.html

It’s the tie! Ash, Ash’s Machiavellian Bloggery
It might be his take no shit attitude where he saw off Warren Truss on another 94A sin binning: Warren’s second in a week. When the nationals leader commented that a ruling the speaker had given was outrageous, Slipper stamped his foot down and threw him out with little if any warning
ashghebranious.wordpress.com/.../

Truth and Common Sense, Wayne Brooks, Curiosity and Challenge
Because it makes the front page of a sad greedy and vindictive old mans newspaper doesnt make it true, nor does seeing a “public commentator” spewing personal views or watching political journos mouthing off on television.
wrb330.wordpress.com/.../

Politics Gets Personal in Australia,  The Diplomat
But whispers soon emerged that Rudd had some management problems. The early talk was of a frenetic work pace. But then came stories of inefficiencies, an explosive temper, anger, a lack of consultation, and a megalomaniacal obsession with concentrating all power in his hands, yet a reluctance to make decisions. Staff and colleagues couldn’t stand him.
http://ht.ly/9kivm

AND THE OSCAR GOES , Tracey Spicer, Hoopla
The REAL Julia is warm, funny, and committed to social change: an effective communicator and brilliant negotiator
thehoopla.com.au/.../

Live by Big Brother, die by Big Brother , Graham Young, On Line Opinion
These voters want Rudd back as PM because they feel Labor broke this implicit compact with the electorate and that Rudd deserves to complete his term so that they, not the Labor party and
www.onlineopinion.com.au/view.asp

The origins of Rudd’s pitch to the people, Upstart
The ALP party room knew that there would be no certainty that the independents would support Rudd and that the week-long character assassination by his colleague would be used mercilessly in election ads by the Liberals come the next election.
www.upstart.net.au/.../

Laura Tingle Sent: Monday, 27 February 2012 10:00 AM To: Jonathan Holmes
Should journalists 'out' people who have spoken to them on the presumption that journalists actually adhere to their code of ethics? Of course not.Having said that, our first obligation is to our readers. The balancing act of political journalism in particular is telling people things they need to know without revealing our sources. www.abc.net.au/.../1204_tingle.pdf

How Gillard should think the unthinkable and look like a leader, Chris Styles, The Conversation
The role of a leader is to ask the big questions and encourage those working with them to be brutally honest and rigorous in their answers. Being brave enough to suggest “the opposite” is more likely to illicit innovative and creative ideas than the same old, same old. That’s leadership.
theconversation.edu.au/how-gillard-should-think-the-unthinkable-and-look-like-a-leader-5600

LABOR’S LOSS: Mark Arbib quits to spend more time with his family, Vex News
Sick of the toll on family, sick of the criticism from jumped-up pretend-strategists like sleazy millionaire lobbyist Bruce Hawker, just sick of being Canberra. The nation needs
www.vexnews.com/.../

JULIA GILLARD TRIUMPHS , Duckpond.
ALP faced challenges in terms of structure, organization and talent, not to mention as was pointed out membership. Similar challenges are shared by the Liberal Party.The political game is played through polling which has given the corporate media monopolie
wmmbb.wordpress.com/.../

Episode 04, 27 February 2012 , Media Watch
Simon Crean: Now, I think if the journalistic profession also was interested in getting balance into this debate, they ought to come forward. They don't have to name the time and circumstance. They just have to admit, like we know, it was being done.
www.abc.net.au/mediawatch/transcripts/s3440733.htm

Long Lunches And Serious Influence, Norman Thompson, New Matilda
In 2002 I was chosen to direct the NSW Greens Democracy4Sale research project. We explored the millions of dollars of political donations that flowed into the coffers of political parties from various industry groups and all the influence and access it gave donors to members of the NSW government
paper.li/.../farnsworth!politics

Bagging the gallery isn’t the whole story re: leadership ‘beat-up’, Bernard Keane, Crikey
That’s not to say it doesn’t happen, obviously. News Limited, and particularly The Daily Telegraph, prosecutes a partisan agenda that creates a form of incessant and often ludicrously over-the-top propaganda directed at Labor and the Greens. The Telegraph is also, according to Essential polling, the least-trusted major media outlet in the country.
www.crikey.com.au/.../

Question Time, Suspension of Standing Orders, Let’s Call the Whole Thing Off, Aussiepollies
shorter questions and shorter answers, the scope for more supplementary questions and a shorter Question Time for those whose health is at risk from too much exposure to the stressful event which takes up just over an hour of the political day. However, Ministers still struggle to be “directly relevant” to any question,
aussiepollies.com/.../

Green to go: Where to for the Australian Greens – Part I, Dylan Caporn, Body Politics – Australia
But the division means that the Greens will struggle to achieve the goal of government, especially if NSW continues to oppose a powerful central office. The federal party also needs to foster a healthy, cohesive relationship with the NSW wing, otherwise they won’t be able to achieve government in their own right.
bodypoliticaus.wordpress.com/.../

Scott Morrison and “diseased” asylum seekers.Jennifer Wilson, No Place for Sheep
“As long as Labor’s soft policies on our borders continue, these boats will continue to arrive along with the risks they carry, including people with serious communicable diseases,” Mr Morrison said.
noplaceforsheep.com/.../

Abbott signs special deal for pollie payrise , Pints Worldwide News
TAXPAYERS are set to give two Coalition frontbenchers an extra $45,000 a year pay which legislation says they’re not actually entitled to.
pints.biz/.../

Close of Nominations for Queensland Election, Antony Green
The Labor Party, the LNP and the Greens have nominated candidates for all 89 electorates. The Australian Party have nominated 76 candidates, Family First 38, One Nation 6, with another 43 candidates having nominated as Independents or as represenatives of unregistered political parties.blogs.abc.net.au/.../...r-queensland-election.html

Updated NBN Rollout Information Released, Michael Wyres
The updated information highlights that current planning has listed premises totalling 758,100 across the country for the fibre rollout portion of the build. A number of the listed sites have total premises information that completes the rollout numbers at those sites.
michaelwyres.com/.../

Telstra’s NBN Might Be Brilliant?, Whistleout Com.
We all understand the easy things…like both political parties identifying broadband and digital bandwidth as a major infrastructure requirement for the future. Yet, chaos seems to surround this poor gem of an idea.
www.whistleout.com.au/.../telstras-nbn-might-be-brilliant

Turnbull “gets” the NBN, claims Oakeshott, Renai LeMay, Delimeter
It’s not the first time that it has been claimed that Turnbull has a hidden passion for the NBN project, despite the fact that Opposition Leader Abbott ordered the MP to “demolish” the NBN initiative when he was appointed Shadow Communications Minister in late 2010. In February 2011, an executive from national broadband provider Internode claimed Turnbull secretly “loves the NBN as a concept”,
delimiter.com.au/.../

NBN set to ramp up after separation tick,, ZDnet
"Tony Abbott has a big decision to make now. As the scale of the NBN's network expands into regional areas across the country, he should abandon his destructive opposition to the project. Who knows — maybe the National Party will finally speak up and support fast telecommunications for regional Australia," Greens communications spokesperson
www.zdnet.com.au/...-separation-tick-339332592.htm


Video

PM refuses to safeguard Rudd backers, Sky News
Mr Abbott used a suspension motion in parliament to dare Ms Gillard to introduce migration legislation which would shore up the Malaysian asylum seeker processing deal, accusing her of being afraid to lose a vote in the lower house.
www.skynews.com.au/.../article.aspx

The day after the big showdown, 7.30pm Report, ABC
One day after its leadership ballot, how are things in the Federal Labor party camp
www.abc.net.au/7.30/content/2012/s3441783.htm

Leadership hangover remains for Labor, Lateline
Despite the leadership battle being over, Labor must deal with a ministerial reshuffle that is threatening to spark yet another outbreak of factional violence
www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2012/s3441906.htm

Spill was meant to resolve leadership contest: Gillard
Posted February 28, 2012 09:35:55

Prime Minister Julia Gillard says yesterday's spill was not designed to destroy Kevin Rudd but to resolve the leadership contest.
www.abc.net.au/.../3856736

Julia Gillard  NBN
The ACCC has approved Telstra's NBN structural separation undertakings. Order of Apperance: Prime Minister Julia Gillard and Minister for Communications Steven Conroy
www.aapone.com.au/SearchPreviewVideo.aspx

ABC: Greens call for dental care funding
australianpoliticstv.org/.../

$10b needed to fix dental health system: report
A report on the state of the nation's teeth has found the nation's dental health is getting worse and a universal Denticare scheme is the solution
www.abc.net.au/.../3856134

Queensland Votes: LNP on Health,
Bligh hits the GC and Clarke runs
This post is dedicated to the television ads (the ones that make it on-air and those that don’t), the ‘virals’ and whatever we come across from the Labor Party, the Liberal Party, the Greens, Bob Katter’s Australian Party and whoever else is uploading content; including the various mainstream media outlets. Each day we’ll post a new ‘Queensland Votes’ with that day’s contributions.
australianpoliticstv.org/.../

lyn

February 29. 2012 08:01 AM

Patricia WA

Happy Birthday to Talk Turkey's friend!  As a child I felt sorry for those born on February 29th and wondered how their mum and dad made up for all the years they missed out on birthday celebrations.   Now I realize how blessed they are in remaining forever young.

Patricia WA

February 29. 2012 08:10 AM

lyn

TODAY'S FRONT PAGES


Australia Newspaper Front Pages for 29 February 2012

www.frontpagestoday.co.uk/index.cfm

lyn

February 29. 2012 08:15 AM

lyn

Hi Talk Turkey


Happy Birthday to your friend from me too,

CheersSmileSmileSmileSmile

lyn

February 29. 2012 08:17 AM

TalkTurkey

From Jackol on Poll Bludger

[Like I been gobbling about for over a year.]

Hope you people who have cut Assange adrift can sleep o' nights.

You know I eulogize *J*U*L*I*A*, well imo she is dead wrong on her attitude to Assange.

I ask those who apparently don't get it yet, (or just don't care?), to wonder why I am so pro-Gillard over most things and yet so condemnatory of her on this one matter.

Hard hearts, closed minds, will your feelings change?
Will your feelings change when they take Assange?

Oh that's right he hasn't provided you with the anti-Right informational hand grenades you thought he would so he is expendable. Besides his mother is not very nice to *J*U*L*I*A*. And he looks arrogant too.(Or supercilious anyway eh!)  

Australian cattle being slaughtered inhumanely in Indonesia are getting huge sympathy (as they should) and their inhumane slaughters getting huge condemnation, enough to get the Australian Government (Joe Ludwig) in the hot seat again, all fair, but Assange can go hang? Literally! Or maybe get the extreme hot seat himself! (Worst puns of the year so far, no apology).  
I implore you to consider afresh your attitude to this man for Dog's sake SEPARATE THE ISSUES, get it right! A man's life-long liberty and possibly his life itself are at risk here!

That this man happens to be Australian doesn't change the moral issues, but it does mean that You and I are responsible for protecting him from the kangaroo courts of foreign powers!

FFS PEOPLE, CARE!

Learn the facts! and SEPARATE THE ISSUES!!!!!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Jackol
Posted Wednesday, February 29, 2012 at 5:15 am | Permalink
Ok, this is going to be a problem:

www.smh.com.au/.../...-assange-20120228-1u14o.html

In commenting I’m relying on the SMH to have got its interpretation right, and checked the various assertions made. That could well be a mistake…

I’m no fan of Mr Assange, as I’ve said here before, but this does seem to partially validate what seemed like conspiracy theories surrounding the Swedish extradition.

Sigh.

If there’s any substance to the Swedish accusations, Julian Assange should front up to the Swedish justice system. However, that shouldn’t be cover for whipping him off to the USA, which now looks like what will happen. If the USA does have an indictment sitting on the books, and it hasn’t tried to use it to extradite Julian Assange from the UK, it looks a lot like they’re planning on pouncing on him in Sweden.

That would seriously stink, and it would pose a catastrophic political problem for the Australian government.

To my mind it would also be conclusive proof that the US military/political/intelligence communities are collectively idiots. How to make a martyr in one easy step. How to look like totalitarian dickheads in one easy step. How to get the yoof up in arms and hacking away like crazy … in one easy step.

I guess I’m crossing my fingers now that the UK courts knock the extradition to Sweden on its head. And the Wikileaks/Julian Assange fan club are going to be insufferable. Grrr.

I’m assuming there’s absolutely nothing the Australian government can do. I guess there’s no way to “extradite” Julian Assange back here ahead of the Swedish claim … a trumped up charge in Australia would presumably never fly… and it’s hard to say that an extradition request from the USA to the Australian government would be possible to refuse. Presumably the death penalty would not be on the table(!).

TalkTurkey

February 29. 2012 08:20 AM

Ad astra reply

LYN'S DAILY LINKS updated: www.thepoliticalsword.com/.../...-DAILY-LINKS.aspx

Ad astra reply

February 29. 2012 09:29 AM

lyn


Good Morning Ad

Bushfire Bill picks Dennis Shanahan this morning:

:Bushfire Bill
Posted Wednesday, February 29, 2012 at 9:07 am Comment 2401


Dennis Shanahan reminds me of one of those country newspaper editors
See? Either Gillard is gone because her leadership is dysfunctional, or Gillard is gone because unnamed anonymites are campaigning to destroy her.

And it only took a day.

If Shanahan was a country editor, he’d also know that one of his main tasks would be to take the rubbish to the tip. All those unwritten stories, mad scribblings on the back of envelopes, used white board markers, worn out post-it pads and those clumps of belly fluff all over the floor need to be disposed of in an appropriate manner. I wish he’d consider hopping into the Otto bin himself, actually

blogs.crikey.com.au/.../#comment-1182577

Phillip Coorey finds something on the Liberals to write about, I see Phillip is still relying heavily on sources, I think he is saying the Liberals hypocrisy knows no bounds:-

Coalition in a froth over milk , Phillip Coorey
A SENIOR Liberal senator branded a colleague a ''f---wit'' yesterday during a heated discussion about cut-price milk.

Sources said Victorian Liberal MP Sophie Mirabella leapt to Senator Ryan's defence, telling Senator Heffernan: ''Why don't you go and pop your Alzheimer's pills.''
The exchange occurred after Mr Abbott's opening address in which he congratulated his team for its ''exemplary discipline'' while the Labor Party tore itself apart over recent days.

Mr Abbott found himself again defending his paid parental leave policy after two of his MPs argued the money could be better used elsewhere.

The Victorian MP Russell Broadbent argued that the scheme was excessive. He was backed by the Queensland senator Sue Boyce, who said Mr Abbott's was a ''Rolls-Royce'' scheme when all that was needed was a ''Holden''.

Mr Abbott's scheme would cost $3.3 billion a year. Mothers who took leave to look after their babies would receive their full wage for six months.

www.smh.com.au/.../...ver-milk-20120228-1u13a.html

lyn

February 29. 2012 09:50 AM

TalkTurkey

Patricia WA
This should get you thinking about Julian ASSANGE:

It's not Assainge as in change . . . (Grange, mange, range etc, plenty)
it's not Assanj as in flange . . . (Only one?)
it isn't Assonj like blancmange  . . .    (Only one!)
it's ASSAAHNZHJHZE or like that, . . .  Not a bloody hope!

You can't even write the second syllable pronunciatorially in English, you have to use phonetics with special pronunciatorial symbols, which I only ever quarter-learnt it and 98% forgot.

But please Patricia think about Assange!

On a lighter note:

I'm workshopping a rhyme for K*** :

Seventeenth today!
Seventeenth today!
You won't get
The Key of the Door
Till [TalkTurkey]'s*
Eighty-four!

* My name has the same cadence as TalkTurkey too.
That wasn't exactly planned but is usable here . . .

And like TT it's alliterative too (BB).
I did sort of plan that.

And I am 68 too you see which K*** knows . . .
That was purely incidental! Smile

TalkTurkey

February 29. 2012 09:58 AM

jane

Rain? What's that, DMW?

Happy birthday to your friend from me as well, TT. ATM my brain is too addled with rhino virus to nut out the puzzle you have set.

Can't agree with you on Assange, though. I stick with my first impression that the man is a complete tosser. From what I've read around the blogs, his co-workers have the same opinion.

Will search for links later as I have to tear off for the m-i-l's ACAT assessment. Hopefully, it will tone down all the angst and garment shredding going on atm.

jane

February 29. 2012 10:34 AM

lyn

Hi Talk Turkey

I have collected some tweets with links for you on Julian Assange, you are definatelty not alone with your concerns:

DOJ refuses to confirm Assange indictment revealed by Stratfor leak
The U.S. Department of Justice is refusing to comment on whether it has prepared espionage charges against WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange, even after emails allegedly stolen from the Austin, Texas firm Strategic Forecasting (Stratfor) and published Tuesday revealed that the company claims to have a sealed indictment against him
www.rawstory.com/.../#.T005Y8nA5iA.twitter
Charges against Assange drawn up in US, says email

www.theage.com.au/.../...email-20120228-1u14c.html

GrogsGamutGreg Jericho
Ausflatfish: Charges against #Assange drawn up in US, says email http://bit.ly/zViJlp #WikiLeaks #GIfiles

BeckonsTruthTruthBeckons
The United States wants Julian Assange in custody and tried for alleged crimes. http://fb.me/1c4Ze56jM

team5starteam5star HomeWealth
Julian Assange claims 'intellectual property': He had the chutzpah to claim that the documents belonged to him a... http://bit.ly/wR5boF

AndreaGeorge3Andrea George
WikiLeaks Stratfor Emails: A Secret Indictment Against Assange? #youtube http://bit.ly/w0GedA

vinhostTrevor Haynes
Important Statement by US Centre for #Constitutional Rights regarding reported sealed #Assange indictment http://bit.ly/zCd6Ne #WikiLieaks

ugottabekiddinKim
Assange indicted. Bush and Cheney still on the loose

AlterNetAlterNet
WikiLeaks 2.0: How Julian Assange's Partnership with Anonymous Could Change the Landscape of Hacktivism http://is.gd/ovZQRb

CheersSmileSmileSmileSmileSmile

lyn

February 29. 2012 10:45 AM

Ad astra reply

Hi Lyn
Thanks for the BB link - he really gets into Dennis Shanahan!

Ad astra reply

February 29. 2012 11:44 AM

TalkTurkey

Lyn
Today I think your Links are the most delicious ever so far,

it's a case of

How you gonna keep us
Down in the Polls?


www.google.com.au/url  
[Awful singing but amazing WW1 photos!]

Plenty of others on dear sweet Youtube,
just Google
  how you gonna keep em youtube
and Presto! Change-O! There's lots.

How you gonna keep us
Down in the Polls
Now that our hands are free?

How you gonna get us
Out of power?
Country and town,
We'll be around!
How you gonna stop us
Scoring goals?
Tone you're history!
Oh you can pull the wool or any stunt
But lying straight in bed, Oh no you can't!  
How you gonna keep us
Down in the Polls
Now that our hands are free?


The thing that's really changed now
is that enough of the truth is Out There now
(including to us btw!!!)
that the Stab in the Back
is plainly a filthy blatant lie . . .
and that is a Big Thing.

The hair on my back is standing up, my blood is singing in anticipation of the coming fight, Lead on *J*U*L*I*A*!

Feels like we've had manacles removed. Fie on Abbortt!

Windsor calls him a WEAKLING !!! Smile

Now there's nice little meme, Smile

Abb-borrrt's a weeeek-ling!
Nyaaah-Nyaaah Nyah Nyaaah-Nyaaah!

TalkTurkey

February 29. 2012 12:00 PM

DMW

Go Trent Yarwood

Trent has written a letter to Mr Morrison re his 'typhoid scare'

dl.dropbox.com/u/14987851/Morrisson-2.doc.pdf

via@NoPlacefofSheep

DMW

February 29. 2012 12:01 PM

lyn

Hi Ad and  Everybody

Julia is calling the Journalists for what they are , as we said yesterday, Julia is much more outspoken.   Julia tells the camera the story on Bob Carr, front page today is competely untrue.

jeravincerJeravincer
Amazing yet completely unremarkable “@latikambourke: On Bob Carr - PM says story on front page of the Australian is 'completely untrue.'”

John_HannaJohn Hanna
latikambourke On Bob Carr - PM Julia Gillard says the story on the front page of the Australian is 'completely untrue.' #ZING #MEDIA

Davis_GMDavis_GM
Dont tell me Murdoch's The Australian wrote a page one story that was wrong against PM. Shsh !!

lyn

February 29. 2012 12:27 PM

DMW

The constant reference to and focus on the leader of the opposition and the need to beat him (and it seems him alone) needs to change.

However these words when considered carefully are very pertinent:
Tony Abbott will not be dragged down by his own contradictions, as some seem to think, or to hope and pray. He will be beaten, if he can be, by better policies, programs, and presentation, by reasoned defence of what Gillard is doing and means to do. Only then can Gillard make a withering charge on the Coalition's stock of ideas and policies.

From the sage and astute Jack Waterford
PM should call in renovators @Canberra/National Times
www.nationaltimes.com.au/.../...0120228-1u0xi.html

DMW

February 29. 2012 12:41 PM

TalkTurkey

jane,
1. Check Patricia's post @ 8.01.

2. Be very careful with the medication, pachyderms are very sensitive to drugs.  

3. (change gear)
You said
Can't agree with you on Assange, though. I stick with my first impression that the man is a complete tosser. From what I've read around the blogs, his co-workers have the same opinion.


Well I stand corrected, your first impression, taken along with that/those of his (perfidious, treacherous btw) co-worker/(s),*
is obviously more than enough reason
to ignore the opinions of such as
Geoffrey Robertson,
John Pilger,
Greg Jericho,
and me,
in fact your opinion makes it
absolutely imperative
that the righteous world  
trump up rape NON-charges against him,
freeze his assets,
keep him under house arrest for over a year,
under constant cloud of being extradited
to a country whose laws on "rape" are bloody crazy,
with every chance of being further extradited to the US
where he will most certainly be arraigned
in a military kangaroo court,
just as certainly convicted,
and sentenced not-quite-so-certainly to several lifetimes
in the severest of close imprisonment,
the only other possibility being that they fry him.

Oh well he's only one man.
Lots more where he came from.
You didn't like him anyway.

*[(Just one, importantly, I think,
you do mean Dumshite yes? Others?) ]

TalkTurkey

February 29. 2012 12:56 PM

Jason

DMW,
   Thanks for the link to "Jack Waterford" I pretty much agree with all he said!

Jason

February 29. 2012 01:05 PM

TalkTurkey

"I WILL TRUMP THE INSULTS WITH RESULTS!"

Rob Oakeshott, NPC luncheon today
with Tony Windsor equally happy and proud
winning the next election
with pride and passion!


HOORAY!

You never heard a politician more fired!

I LOVE these two men!

Don't miss this one way or another Folks!

Ad astra this will warm the cockles of your heart.
You have waited years to hear this tone.
These are two very fine humans.  

TalkTurkey

February 29. 2012 02:21 PM

Glorfindel

Gillard cave to the numbers men and rolled Rudd, she caved to the mining industry over the mining tax, caved to Bob Brown over the carbon tax, caved to the right over the Malaysian Solution.

She said that there was as much chance of her playing full forward for the bulldogs as there was her being PM – all the while her staff were writing her victory speech and she was distributing polling underming Rudd. She said there would be no carbon tax under her government, that there was an agreement with East Timor over refugees.

Gillard can be condemned with her own words and actions – to smear Rudd you need to rely on innuendo from unnamed journalists and politicians and the word of Mark Latham.

Hardly the most compelling of sources.

The Gillard government will continue to stumble and bumble along – it wasn't Rudds idea to arrange an Australia day riot.

And the few good acheivments  this government has left – such as the strength of the economy and the NBN are left-overs from the Rudd government

In another 6 months or so the party will have the same problems – replace the terminal and inept Gillard with somebody more appealing to the voters or continue their march towards annihilation.

Hopefully from there next stint in the wilderness a better Labor party will emerge.

Glorfindel

February 29. 2012 02:52 PM

Casablanca

It is 2.47pm and Mr Abbott has risen to call for a suspension of standing orders. I took the only action possible and hit the OFF button. I note that there was a mass exodus from the government benchs led by the PM.

I suggest that others also hit the OFF button in protest.

Casablanca

February 29. 2012 03:29 PM

TalkTurkey

Drums along the Murray River!
Drums in Western Sydney!
Abbortt soon will be chopped liver
And all those of his kidney!

Wasn't it just this morning I said *J*U*L*I*A* always leads the attack?

Get these 3 killer thrusts by *J*G* in QT today! Smile  

SLASH!
“I know the LOTO has an unhealthy obsession with the so-called faceless men in the ALP. What he should be concerned with are the USELESS men sitting behind him”.

[The Labor back benchers clapped and the Gallery exploded in derisive merriment . . .]  

Seconds later:

CHOP!!
I should have said before, you should be more focussed on the useless men and women over there!

STAB!!!
"Whoever I select as FO won’t break into a sweat wiping the floor with her!"

And Albo said wtte the next bloke to buy at coffee at (?Joe's?) would have more idea of running the FA Dept than Mesma !


TalkTurkey

February 29. 2012 03:53 PM

lyn

Hi Ad

Here are some comments during Question time today:-

PollyticsPossum Comitatus
Suspending standing orders over Bob Carr? Can't even pretend that's serious

samanthamaidensamanthamaiden
Gillard shaking head re question from Abbott on whether Bob Carr approached re Senate vacancy. Albo says question out of order

naomiwoodleyNaomi Woodley
Suspension motion lost 69 votes to 74. Gillard calls an end to #qt

AshGhebraniousAshGhebranious
I like the cut of the PM's suit. And this calm confident thing is good too!

awelderAndrew Elder
Alby Schultz out - how will Parliament function without that leech

ResidentOZKerry Seebohm
Speaker "Sudden Death Slipper" surely has everyone on their toes. #qt #auspol

Dylan_CapornDylan Caporn
Bronnie is outta there #qt

GrogsGamutGreg Jericho
Bye Bronnie qt

FunHoleNo_5Clinton McRobert
qt oh Bishop got served by #PM lolol

SarahWiley8Sarah Wiley
PM to julie bishop- whoever I select as foreign minister wont break into a sweat wiping the floor with her

franklinmatthewMatthew Franklin
Govt benches empty as abbott calls gillard dishonest - except for albo and swan

Margy011Margaret
Thought Tony Abbott was embarrassing yesterday but this tops everything #qt

BiancaStemanBianca
Why is Abbott permitted to put on stupid voices in #qt

Matt_RosMatthew Ross
GrogsGamut: Has there been a more lame reason to suspend standing orders? (since the last one at any rate)” #qt we like play school

MisdaMagooMisdaMagoo
Abbott so embarrassingly desperate now. qt Merely interested in mudslinging. Any policies Tony? auspol SkyNewsAgenda ABCNews24 TheDrum

geeksrulzIntrepid Geek
Oakeshott: "Tony is trying to insult his way into office

mwyresMichael Wyres
Whoever allocated Tony Abbot a face should be sacked... #qt

AndrewCatsarasAndrew Catsaras
This is new: a suspension of standing orders by the Opposition, I can't recall ever seeing it in Question Time before. #qt

GeorgeBludgerGeorge Bludger
Can someone tell me why this standing order has any relevance to anyone in Australia? qt

PollyticsPossum Comitatus
Suspending standing orders over Bob Carr? Can't even pretend that's serious

naomiwoodleyNaomi Woodley
Albo notes it's the 43rd suspension motion moved by Oppn. Says they're never about policy. qt

PollyticsPossum Comitatus
Alby Schultz get's chucked 1st question in #qt Wonder how long it will take some of them to learn

PaulBongiornoPaul Bongiorno
"Faceless, useless", witless . Have mercy

seearjayChris Johnson
Guess who's stinging about the useless men of the Opposition term JG so aptly used? QT

GrogsGamutGreg Jericho
Oh geez, poor Pyne has had to steal Gillard's line about useless men. Plagiarised in less that 15 minutes

naomiwoodleyNaomi Woodley
Albo says he has 2 words for Oppn outrage at the fact Bob Carr might be considered for parliament: "Campbell Newman". #qt

mwyresMichael Wyres
Albo suggests the Opposition calls for suspensions so they get a few minutes on the government benches... #qt

TAWNBPMTAWNBPM
Today we saw the 43rd suspension of standing orders from Abbott. What a waste of taxpayer's money andParliament's... http://fb.me/HaMdjGJ4

naomiwoodleyNaomi Woodley
Slipper chides B. Bishop for re-entering chamber before her 1hr suspension is up. (she's in the adviser's box). #qt

paddybtspaddy bts
LOL Bronnie gets a slap from Slipper for trying to get back on the field before time. qt

HarryJ_MPNot Harry Jenkins
Tsk tsk Bronnie! Don't enter the chamber before you're allowed out of the naughty corner! #qt

AshGhebraniousAshGhebranious
Oh Bronnie comes onto field too early. Avoids a 24 hour suspension with a warning qt auspol

naomiwoodleyNaomi Woodley
Suspension motion lost 69 votes to 74. Gillard calls an end to #qt

gordongrahamGordon Graham
Albo destroys the Coalition's point on Bob Carr by bringing up Campbell Newman #qt

CheersSmileSmileSmileSmileSmileSmileSmileSmile

lyn

February 29. 2012 04:08 PM

Patricia WA

Sorry TT, we are on different sides of the debate on this one.  I haven't changed my mind about Julian Assange.  What right has one man to break into records private to a whole nation, or groups of nations, and use them to wield influence in the world?   His sexual peccadillos are of no interest to me except that his somewhat casual bedroom manners may be indicative of his general character.   We already know from his own admission he has used trickery and illegal means to hack into and steal from our national archives, and others, and seems to consider the fruits of his crimes his to dispose of to his personal advantage.

PS On a lighter note, I take it from your comment to Pip that I have cracked your conundrum!  Sorry,  I guess one can only crack codes.  So have a I resolved your riddle?

Patricia WA

February 29. 2012 04:15 PM

Sir Ian Crisp

DMW, interesting article by Trent Yarwood. Interesting but worthless. Maybe Trent could wipe the drivel from his chin and reconcile his bile with:


Tuberculosis (TB)

TB is a serious disease which has been declared an epidemic and a global emergency.

Visa applicants aged 11 years or older must undergo a chest x-ray. Those under 11 may be required to have an x-ray if there are indications they have TB or have a history of contact with a person with TB. The purpose of the x-ray is to determine whether there is any evidence of either active or previous TB.

Evidence of active or previous TB will not, in itself, adversely impact on the outcome of the visa application.

Where x-rays show possible evidence of TB, the applicant will be asked to undergo more specific tests to establish whether or not active TB is present.

If active TB is found, Australian migration law does not allow a visa to be granted until the person has undergone treatment and been declared free of active TB. A course of treatment usually lasting between six to nine months is required, plus further testing to show that the treatment has been successful.

If the x-ray shows evidence of previous but now inactive TB the applicant may be asked to sign an undertaking at the time of visa grant.

By signing the undertaking, the applicant agrees to contact the Health Undertaking Service on a free call number on arrival in Australia. The applicant also agrees to report for follow-up monitoring to a state or territory health authority, as directed by the Health Undertaking Service. The visa is not at risk, once in Australia, no matter what status of tuberculosis is diagnosed as a result of the monitoring.

www.immi.gov.au/media/fact-sheets/22health.htm


So, Mr Yarwood's "cases reported in Australia" might include those alleged refugees and asylum shoppers who are released into the Australian community contingent on their commitment to seek follow up treatment if they have TB.

Facts and not velleities please DMW.

Sir Ian Crisp

February 29. 2012 04:16 PM

janice

Patricia WA,

You and I are on the same plane on the Assange issue.  His motives for doing this is purely for one Julian Assange.

janice

February 29. 2012 04:23 PM

lyn

Hi Talk Turkey

Thankyou for your appreciation and thankyou for the link to Youtube,
I love that song.

English Country Garden is better but not applicable here I know. You are going to say to me "but Lyn you can't have The English Country Garden" all the time .

Lyn
Today I think your Links are the most delicious ever so far,

it's a case of

How you gonna keep us
Down in the Polls?

www.google.com.au/url  
[Awful singing but amazing WW1 photos!]


The Austalian have to try and prove they were rignt about Bob Carr, but can someone tell me what it has to do with Tony Abbott whoever is chosen.

MayneReportStephen Mayne
Abbott was brilliant on Bob Carr shemozzle in Parly today. See The Australian's wrap of latest political mismanagement: www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-fn59niix-1226285013437

lyn

February 29. 2012 04:27 PM

Gravel

NormanK

Your "Inside, looking out" piece is just brilliant.  Thank you so much.

Lyn

Thanks for your response yesterday, I thought I might be doing something wrong.  Let's hope that something can be done by them to fix it.

We watched Oakshotte and Windsor at the NPC before QT.  I got the impression the media didn't like the home truths they were being told.  We sat rivetted, they were just excellent.

We thought Julia was just brilliant in QT today, and of course Albo up to his usual standard.  I'm starting to get a bit interested again.

Gravel

February 29. 2012 04:33 PM

TalkTurkey

Glorfindel:
In The Fall of Gondolin Tolkien writes that his name "meaneth Goldtress for his hair was golden".

Well you might be your own golden-haired boy, Sunshine, you might have killed a Balrog, but your poisonous words put me more in mind of the horrid Shelob the disgusting spider.

Let me explain something:

I actually divide posters here into two camps, and it isn't left/right, religious/irreligious, black/white, the great divide for me, is between Good-Willians and ill-willians.

Guess what mob I've put you in!

I TT have acquired the reputation here (by a few only) of being a vicious bully.
I hotly deny that, but I must say that when confronted by a post such as yours it feels like qualifications! Smile  

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Oh for the Goodwillian Lefties:

'Fresh financial questions DOG Campbell Newman'

GOOD DOG!!! Smile

TalkTurkey

February 29. 2012 04:53 PM

TalkTurkey

Lyn,
This one is just for you.
By the loveliest basso profundo there EVER was.

www.google.com.au/url

MAH LINDY LOU
[Words and music by Lily Strickland (1920)]

Lindy, did you hear that mockingbird sing last night?
Honey, he was singing so sweet in the moonlight
In the old magnolia tree, bustin' his heart with melody.
I know he was singing of you, Mah Lindy Lou, Lindy Lou
I'd lay right down and die, and die,
If I could sing like that bird sings to you,
Mah little Lindy Lou.

Lindy, did you smell that honeysuckle vine last night?
Honey, he was smelling so sweet in the moonlight
Clinging 'round my cabin door, reckon it's 'cause he loves you so.
Honey, that's the way I love you, Mah Lindy Lou, Lindy Lou
I'd lay right down and die, and die
If I could be as sweet as that to you,
Mah little Lindy Lou.

Lindy, did you feel that south wind blow last night?
Honey, he was kissing you sweet in the moonlight
Blowing from the old bayou, seems to say it loves you so.
Honey, that's the way I love you, Mah Lindy Lou, Lindy Lou
I'd lay right down and die, and die,
If I could be that wind a-kissin' you,
Mah little Lindy Lou.  

TalkTurkey

February 29. 2012 05:12 PM

jane

TT, I'm afraid we'll have to agree to disagree on the subject of Assange. He sent a distinct unpleasant shudder down my spine the first time I saw him.

And I'm more inclined to take the word of his co-workers about his being a complete tosser than those who don't have to work with him.

Now that that's out of the way, I agree with you on the important things-Liealot is a tosser par excellence and the Liars Party; well the name says it all.

jane

February 29. 2012 05:26 PM

Casablanca

Maybe I hit the OFF button too early (ie when Abbott called for the SoSO) I would loved to have seen the bit where Bronnie shashayed into the Chamber before her suspension was up. What a hoot.

Casablanca

February 29. 2012 05:38 PM

lyn

Hi Casablanca

Dratts to the Camera's I would have loved to have seen that too. Did you see apparently she snook into the Advisors box.


Cheers SmileSmileSmile

lyn

February 29. 2012 05:42 PM

lyn

Hi Ad and Everybody

We all need to join in "Congratulations”  to Patricia today,  Patricia’s Blog site Polliepomes has been chosen by The National Library.

http://polliepomes.wordpress.com/

What a great honour for Patricia in recognition of her brilliant work.

Certification from the National Library:

I am delighted to inform you that your publication is now publicly
available in the PANDORA Archive at http://nla.gov.au/nla.arc-132006

Polliepomes is listed on the PANDORA Archive at http://nla.gov.au/nla.arc-132006

Access to your publication in the Archive is facilitated in two ways: via the Library’s online catalogue; and via subject and title lists maintained on the PANDORA home page http://pandora.nla.gov.au/index.html.

If you wish you may indicate your archived status by using a PANDORA logo button or by incorporating a PANDORA search box in your website. The details on how to access these are at: http://pandora.nla.gov.au/publishers.html#logo

Big cheers to Patricia SmileSmileSmileSmileSmileSmileSmile

lyn

February 29. 2012 06:00 PM

2353

Well done Patricia.  A well deserved honour.  May your verse be read by many into the future.

2353

February 29. 2012 06:45 PM

Casablanca

Patricia WA.

My warm congratulations for being elevated to Pandora. I seem to recall that your main reason for setting up polliepomes was to collect your works in one place for the benefit of your descendants. Now you will be immortalised at the National Library of Australia.

Big things from little things grow! I'm sure that you will share your glory with your cute dog.

Casablanca

February 29. 2012 06:45 PM

NormanK

I try not to make a habit of gazing into the crystal ball and making definitive predictions but I'm going to give myself a pass.
Campbell Newman is going to come unstuck with the media during this Queensland election campaign. He seems to have an Abbott-like disdain for the journalists following him around, believing he can do and say anything and they will just wear it.

Recently he held a stunt in order to make a 'preliminary announcement' about an LNP policy. When journalists tried to ask questions looking for detail he told them (words to the effect of): "It's a teaser! Do you know what a teaser is? You'll have to wait until tomorrow."

At another presser he got annoyed that questions were not about the policy announcement that he had just made and told them (wtte): "if you haven't got any more questions about this (policy initiative) then there's no point in my being here any longer" and walked off.

Today, after a series of questions about campaign donations made when he was still Mayor of Brisbane, he showed his displeasure and with a smile on his face said (pointedly): "It's been fun as always" as he walked off.

He has an appalling attitude to the press and seems to forget that if he wants his message to get out, he needs them as much as they need him.

This will sound like a contradiction coming from me but it should be clear to all politicians that it is a fine line between sucking up to the media and showing disdain for their profession. Julia Gillard seems to have begun the process of taking no nonsense from certain individuals or particularly stupid questions but I don't think she can be accused of pouring scorn on the whole profession. Yet.

Newman is not a good performer because he is thin-skinned and gets impatient when his carefully stage-managed appearances get side-tracked by questions that he doesn't want to answer. He is relying on high polls to compensate for his arrogance. If the media find a chink in his armour or the polls start to slide he may very well find himself on the receiving end of some very vindictive reporting. Abbott runs the same risk.
He is also skating very close to losing his temper and I would not be surprised if we saw a dummy-spit as the pressure of the campaign starts to build.

All good news for Anna Bligh who is struggling to swim against the tide of an "it's time" voter animosity.

NormanK

February 29. 2012 06:47 PM

NormanK

Patricia WA

Congratulations! That is a very great honour indeed. And thoroughly deserved.

NormanK

February 29. 2012 07:31 PM

Patricia WA

Just been watching Sky News National Press Club Interview with Robb Oakshott and Tony Windsor.   What a joy!  There are two parts - not sure if this link covers both.

www.youtube.com/watch

Patricia WA

February 29. 2012 07:57 PM

TalkTurkey

jane you dismay me.

My comments in italics

TT, I'm afraid we'll have to agree to disagree on the subject of Assange.

No we won't, I disagree with you fully disagreeably.  There is no area for compromise here.  

He sent a distinct unpleasant shudder down my spine the first time I saw him.
Oh well that clinches it then. Guilty of inducing unpleasant shudders down spines, he's a witch! Burn 'im! Burn 'im!

Nothing to the unpleasant shudder that will be sent down his spine if they electrocute him though. You reckon that tit for tat? I wonder how you'll feel then
.

And I'm more inclined to take the word of his co-workers about his being a complete tosser than those who don't have to work with him.
Yeah even if it's only one co-worker (who is a traitor and liar), that'll do. All tossers (on the basis of anybody else's opinion) should be flayed, half-hanged over a hurdle, their hands chopped off, their stomachs cut open and their entrails drawn out and burnt before their eyes while they are still alive, then they should be cut into quarters and fed to the pigs. That's what I think anyway.  

Now that that's out of the way,
It's not "out of the way".
I agree with you on the important things-
Yeah what's a man's life in the scheme of things anyway.
Liealot is a tosser par excellence and the Liars Party; well the name says it all.
Yep, another one for burning.



Now I'm serious. Very.

jane have you NO sense of proportion? Pity? Justice?

Having had no support in this matter whatsoever, I am beginning to think I must have misjudged the company here. I mean that with gravity. If I come to believe that there is so little compassion on the Political Sword, such apathy to or acceptance of the possibility of ANYBODY being put to death by decree, or if I find that the majority of people here actually support the death penalty, or even kangaroo courts, that is quite sufficient to send me packing, because I'll know for certain I'm wasting my breath here. This is the first time I have ever made such a remark here, and I do it in anger and dismay, but with full intent if I don't find anyone at my back.

Who do you people think you are, so to abandon in every way a human, a countryman at that whose support he should be able to rely on?
What has he done to you so heinous that he deserves to be treated like Mussolini??

If the Labor Party were ever to support capital punishment, or kangaroo courts, or to introduce a referendum to bring the death penalty back, I would go elsewhere too amd feel loyal to my own core priciples in so doing. This is not wet lettuce stuff. True Laborites are implacably opposed to the death penalty, and to railroading, and always will be if I can help it, and while there is breath in Barrie Jones or while his spirit still moves the Australian Labor Party.

And if that ever changes, I'm gone.

jane says,

I agree with you on the important things

I say, No you bloody don't!.

And don't bother telling me Oh but he probably won't get judicially murdered. You jane and others have already abandoned him on the basis of ignorance, whim and unpleasant spinal shudders. Whatever happens it will be with your acquiescence and apparently full approval. I am nauseated by your attitude.    

All who are silent should speak out now. Those who support Assange's arraignment are unworthy of the Labor Party's history of fighting for human rights, not just in my opinion, it is the most core of all core Labor beliefs. Notice that I have always even condemned *J*U*L*I*A*s weak-kneed abandonment of Assange.

??? Ad astra?

TalkTurkey

February 29. 2012 07:58 PM

2353

I suspect NormanK is correct and Bligh wanted a long campaign to see Newman blow his top.  I too saw the clip on the TV tonight and it was interesting that the focus (from Seven anyway) was Newman getting flustered when asked to defend campaign contributions and then walking off, so the pressure is building.  From memory a comment was made by the reporter that he relies on a "well the ALP would say that" line when he gets flustered.

The "what happens if Newman doesn't win Ashgrove" line seems to be getting a bit of an airing as well - and after being on a bus yesterday on Coronation Drive (yes I got caught up in the public transport problems in Brisvegas yesterday, its normally a 20 minute train ride to town) for an excessive period thanks to Newman removing the bus lane system while Lord Mayor - if I see him in the next little while I'll certainly be having a go at him.

Don't write Bligh off just yet.

2353

February 29. 2012 08:07 PM

Patricia WA

I've just seen all your lovely compliments!   Thank you.  When I first received the National Library invitation my immediate reaction was to contact Lyn here at The Political Sword and Miglo over at Cafe Whispers to let them know about it and thank them.  Together with Ad Astra and Min, they and all the other regulars here and over there have been such a huge encouragement to me.

I am sure you have all felt Lyn's warmth as she welcomes newcomers to TPS.  I certainly did.  You can imagine too how excited I was to have had Miglo write to me after I'd blogged with a few verses with CW and ask me to do more, even to contribute a full post!  What a contrast with another site where the blogmaster asked me not interrupt serious threads with rhyming comment and confine myself to their Weekly Whimsy post.

I just love coming here and verbal jousting with Talk Turkey and reading Ad Astra's posts with comments by NormanK and DMW, Janice, Gravel, 2353 and all of you.  Casablanca is right, I only set up the polliepomes blogsite to gather them all in one place with your lovely compliments so I could have something to leave for my grandchildren when I'm gone.  

I so wanted to be a writer when I was a young woman, but I got married to another writer and we both wanted children! By the time they were grown up I had another absorbing career. Here I am fifty years later having finally become a published and recognised writer.  In my 77th year!  It is unbelievaby exciting and gratifying.   Shows what encouragement can do!

By the way in checking out my listing with PANDORA I found myself honoured to be in very distinguished company along with Ad Astra and TPS, our good friend Greg at Grog's Gamut, Mr. Denmore - and others I know we all respect.  My sense is that my selection had a lot to do with the company I keep!

Patricia WA

February 29. 2012 08:08 PM

Ad astra reply

Patricia WA
Congratulations on being listed on Pandora.  This is great honour and very well deserved.

Ad astra reply

February 29. 2012 08:34 PM

Jason

NormanK, 2353
             I've only watched one press conference with "Campbell Newman" and that was the one where he was standing along side "Abbott" in a park last Saturday.
I  got the feeling that "Newman" was quite happy for Abbott to go on about whatever he wanted,and in a funny sort of way I thought he let Abbott try and answer for him as the last thing he wanted was to be asked anything by your media!

Jason

February 29. 2012 08:36 PM

Jason

Patricia WA,
           May I also add my congratulations to you as well!

Jason

February 29. 2012 09:23 PM

TalkTurkey

Patricia WA

Congratulations, I was right about you wasn't I! Told you!

Well done, polliepomes is a document that will be of more and more interest to your extending family as time goes by. We have all been watching you coming out and blossoming. Later bloomers aren't we.

Everybody needs encouragement, even a few kind words are a thrill, you should hear Jason's wonderful compliments he pays me on the phone when I sing parodies to him! Smile I will sing to him whenever I can from now on.  

Lyn and Ad astra are the best encouragers I know. And you say I encourage you with verse, well that is mutual of course you know.

A week ago I had coffees with a girl I taught as an 11-y-o in Year 6 - the loveliest age for girls I think, really helpful and polite and sincere, if they've been treated decently anyway. Well she is now 48, with 2 kids 12 and 14, and she is one of Adelaide's gutsiest performance poetesses, she reads her work at the same place I read mine, Friendly Street Poets, mostly free verse but she does write rhyme too (she puts it down to me that she does any at all Smile ) and it's rattling good rhyme too. She is a bit depressed atm about some bad life decisions, anyway this morning I rang her and asked if she would do me a favour and write a poem by next Tuesday, and read it at FSP that night. She agreed, I'll post a copy when and if I can get one, but I bet she'll write one anyway, and feel the better for it as you know we do when we do something worthwhile.

Never stop writing Patricia.  

TalkTurkey

February 29. 2012 09:32 PM

Ad astra reply

Folks
I've spent much of the day finishing off: We are being conned by the polls – the Tarot Cards of politics, which I will post tomorrow afternoon.

Ad astra reply

February 29. 2012 09:59 PM

Patricia WA

Thanks, Jason, I see that you and quite a few others were among those I didn't actually name up there.   I've been very interested in the interraction we can see has developed here between yourself and TT.  My sense is that it began with a get together after a discussion here at TPS.  Please forgive me if I'm wrong.  I always think of you as if in your gravatar picture, and I imagine you being a very sane and steadying influence on Talk Turkey!  His sort of brilliance does need ballast occasionally.

Patricia WA

February 29. 2012 10:17 PM

Catey

Patricia

Warm congratulations.  I love your poems, but from your comments I feel your warmth and genuine keen concern for the future of this nation.   Well done.

Catey

February 29. 2012 10:22 PM

DMW

Congratulations PWA
bet that made your day
Smile

DMW

February 29. 2012 10:27 PM

DMW

You all now I am not one to crow Tong

But I think I have a first. SIC actually used a link to support his argument.

Totally irrelevant and pointless but a link all the same.

I will trust Mr Yarwood's assessment of the facts before any blathering from SIC.

DMW

February 29. 2012 10:39 PM

NormanK

Patricia WA put up a link to the speeches by Rob Oakshott and Tony Windsor at the NPC. I couldn't use it to source part 2 so here is a separate link.
www.youtube.com/watch

If you haven't watched the videos may I recommend them to you. Windsor in his speech is the farmer talking over the back fence and making an awful lot of good sense. Oakshott is the country politician up on a tree stump talking energetically and passionately about what effects his electorate and more broadly the nation.

The question and answer session from the later stages of part 1 and all of part 2 are icing on the cake. If you want to hear Abbott bagged, have a listen. If you want to hear Gillard praised, have a listen. If you want to hear Oakshott pour a bucketful on to the Nationals, have a listen.

I nominate Tony Windsor for president and Rob Oakshott as Special Minister for Policy Development.

NormanK

February 29. 2012 10:42 PM

DMW

Jason @ 12:56 PM,
a pleasure to provide that link.

While I don't always agree with what he writes, personally I think Waterford is one of the better journalists in the country who writes without grinding an axe and a very sharp eye.

Now that Canberra Times is part of National Times we may get see more of Waterford. Often the CT would have an article in dead tree edition that didn't appear on the intertubes.

DMW

February 29. 2012 11:05 PM

Miglo

We're all proud of you at Café Whispers too, Patricia.  But like I said over at the Café, whilst it is humbling to receive your kind thank you, all the credit goes to your good self.  I'm sure Min, Lyn and Ad astra will agree.

Miglo

February 29. 2012 11:26 PM

jane

NormanK @6.45pm, and he hasn't even been slightly trashed yet. I wonder how he'd cope with the barrage of shit Julia Gillard's had thrown at her over the last 18 months. Not well, would be the prediction.

And thank you for the youtube link to Windsor and Oakeshott at the NPC. What a breath of fresh air those two are. I'll happily second your nominations.

TT, stop being so melodramatic. I don't like the creature and no amount of bullying, heckling and barracking from you will change my opinion. In fact, your ranting is reinforcing my opinion.

Assange is a self opinionated tosser and professional waste of space, imo.

I'm sorry so much of your life is bound up in his, but that's your choice. Assange has been accused of rape and the Swedes think he has a case to answer. I don't know whether he's guilty of rape or not and neither do you, so stop the crap.

In fact, I'm somewhat nauseated that you don't seem at all concerned that he may have committed such a crime. If he was the hero you seem to think he is, he'd front up, not hide like a coward.

You may have fallen for the maligned hero act; I haven't. So get over it and stop trying to force your opinion on me!

Patricia, I'd like to add my congratulations to everyone else's. You've come a long way, baby!

jane

February 29. 2012 11:29 PM

NormanK

DMW

Make up your mind!
A swag of fresh corn on the cob or a dessert plate full of fresh cream every morning for a week awaits.
Rooster or kitten?
I'd hate to give you the wrong prize.

NormanK

February 29. 2012 11:44 PM

NormanK

jane

I was just thinking (in the shower) (as you do) that Newman might be finding the going a bit tough in the step up from City politics to State politics. No doubt the LNP will feel that they have surrounded him with astute operatives but their track record for shooting themselves in the foot stretches back years and years. Also, Newman is on his own when he is in front of the 'chooks' of the QLD media. Anna Bligh is a cunning, experienced operator with seasoned help around her so I think CanDo (how stupid is that?) is in for a very tough ride.

The one and only reluctant bit of admiration that I have for Tony Abbott is that he has learned his lessons well and has kept Mr Hyde under wraps for the most part since assuming the leadership. He is not the same man and it must take an awful lot of willpower to keep up the charade. It doesn't hurt that every time he slips up the media give him a free pass but still there mustn't be a day that goes by when he doesn't think of a clever quip that he subsequently represses because he knows it will be out of order.

If Newman keeps burning these reporters they won't show him the same latitude that they give to Abbott. In fact there's probably a state reporter or two out there just itching to break into the big time and if it means undoing CanDo then so be it.

NormanK

March 1. 2012 12:30 AM

DMW

NK
did you miss the Smile like the cat that got the cream? prrrrrrrrr

DMW

March 1. 2012 01:38 AM

jane

NormanK @11.44pm, my perception is that he is another Liealot in the making, but in the very early stages. And yes the Qld branch of the Liars Party does seem to have an uncanny knack of foot injuries.

Liealot has masked his true self very well as you say, and he'd fool young players who haven't watched him from the start of his career. I'm sure there are plenty of old campaigners like you and other Swordsters who are waiting for a meltdown.

With luck, it will be in about 16-17 months time - too late to bed down another leader.

jane

March 1. 2012 04:46 AM

Patricia WA

HAS SPEAKER SLIPPER A STRATEGY FOR A SURFEIT OF SSO'S?

Reformer? Or snake in the grass?
Watch Peter Slipper kicking ass,
And doing it with gravitas.
In Oz speak that means ‘bit o’ class.’

It isn’t just the way he’s dressed
In long black gown and fancy vest.
What has the media most impressed
Is the end of uproar and unrest.

Members are no longer hostage
To shouts, insults, bad language.
More legislation now has carriage.
That’s something not to disparage.

The Chamber fills no more with cries
Of outraged members screaming,  “Lies!”
Simply saying,  “You fantasize.”
Does not shock.  Nor does,  “Porky pies!”

What of time-wasting SSO’s
Used by Abbott against his foes?
Some forty-two so far of those.
More still?  Only God,  or Slipper,  knows!

Will Prissie Pyne,  when censured,  use
‘Time Out’ to find the Members’ loos,
Fearing the Speaker may refuse
To let him rise to make more POOs?

For Liberals he’s a mystery.
Slipper?  Reformer?  This Tory,
Now handing Labor victory,
To be praised one day by history?

polliepomes.wordpress.com/.../

Patricia WA

March 1. 2012 06:34 AM

janice

Good morning all.

Have only just caught up with the news and it is such wonderful news.  Congratulations, Patricia WA.
I saw there was a special brilliance in your work after reading only a few of your pomes way back before the polliepomes site came to be.  

Watched Oakey and Windsor on the Nat.Press Club yesterday.  These two men are, in my view, national treasures.  If only there were a few dozen more MPs like them.

janice

March 1. 2012 07:14 AM

Casablanca

NormanK & Jane

Campbell Newman is practically Liberal Royalty with both parents having been Federal Ministers. He was only 12yo when his father won the seat of Bass which event is said to have been the beginning of the end for Gough Whitlam. He has followed in his Dad's footsteps with a career in the army before moving into politics and now an attempt to get dropped-in to a government changing role in State politics.

My point being that the man has Liberal Party DNA and a clear ambition to follow in the family business of politics. He has been around the grubby business since he was a kid so I would not under-estimate his ability to manipulate the media and to claw his way through.

Casablanca

March 1. 2012 07:24 AM

Casablanca

Patricia WA

I see that you have celebrated your inclusion into Pandora with another excellent pome.

QT under Slipper has been transformed and I expect that it may start to rate in Glenn Dyer's daily TV List in Crikey.

Casablanca

March 1. 2012 07:31 AM

lyn

TODAY’S LINKS


Sorting fact from anecdote, Greg Jericho, The Drum
I do not suggest we take a Mr Gradgrind position because "facts alone" would be a dull, utilitarian life indeed. But let us not forget them either; for without facts the anecdote can become a lie represented as truth. And that is not good for policy, politics, or media reportage
http://www.abc.net.au/unleashed/3857392.html

Angry MPs in Tony Abbott ambush as parental leave attacked , Darin Sullivan, Left Flank
WHEN you look at Prime Minister Julia Gillard’s earlobes you see a testament to her tinny ability to survive against all odds. Devine’s blog.  He was joined by Liberal Senator Sue Boyce, a past president of the Down Syndrome Association of Queensland, who also raised questions about the parental leave scheme,
darinsullivan.wordpress.com/.../

From Big Brother to Survivor – Ignoring Abbott and Focusing on his Team, Preston Towers, The Preston Institute
The list goes on with Liberals who crumble under anything approaching a cross examination by a journalist or politician. There are a number of people in the community who are unaware of just how many holes Abbott has in his team, the mistakes they make, the concepts they don’t understand.
prestoninstitute.wordpress.com/.../

Only Gillard plan was to knock off Rudd, Kim Peart, Independent Australia
Unfortunately, the affair was hushed up, the facts locked away and as if there was a normal process in train; Kevin Rudd was given the highly responsible position of Foreign Minister, representing Australia to the nations of the World.
www.independentaustralia.net/.../

Replacing Rudd: what to look for in a new Australian foreign minister, Binoy Kampmark, The Conversation
Australia’s foreign minister portfolio has been left vacant and the discussion on who will replace Kevin Rudd is now underway. Whatever his flaws as a prime minister, Rudd was perceived, on a certain level at least, as a foreign minister who discharged his functions with purpose and effect.
theconversation.edu.au/replacing-rudd-what-to-look-for-in-a-new-australian-foreign-minister-5621

Albrechtsen defends Latham, Carr praises Hadley, Jones lobbies for Packer  , Matthew Knott, The Power Index
You can't accuse Janet Albrechtsen of bearing a grudge. Ten years ago, Mark Latham slammed her under parliamentary privilege as a "skanky ho who will die in a ditch to defend the Liberal Party". Today, she defends Latham as a man of "courageous honesty" and "one of the nation's most honest and piercing
www.thepowerindex.com.au/.../albrechtsen-defends-mark-latham-bob-carr-praises-hadley-jones-lobbies-for-mate-james-packer

Government’s snap decision to close solar rebate scheme will damage this emerging export industry, Antinuclear
Australia to Close Renewable Energy Bonus Scheme on June 30 Bloomberg By Jason Scott – Feb 27, 2012 Australia’s Renewable Energy Bonus Scheme, which has
provided more than A$320 million in incentives for households to switch to more energy-efficient hot-water systems, will close
antinuclear.net/.../

When common sense fails, Bill, Billablog,
When we use common sense to reason we are prone to falling into fallacies of composition. When we use our personal experiences as if they represent knowledge that can be generalised we also run the danger of having views that are just plainly wrong.
bilbo.economicoutlook.net/.../

Soft Data Keeps The Door Open for Interest Rate Cuts, Stephen Koukoulas
slurry of top tier data today paint a picture of weak credit, weak housing and still soggy retail sales. These trends have been evident for a while and are probably not a massive shock to the RBA, although they leave the possibility of an interest rate cut alive.
http://www.stephenkoukoulas.blogspot.com.au/

Seminar on David Graeber’s Debt – admin notice, Crooked Timber
We’ve now received and published all the contributions in our online seminar on David Graeber’s Debt: The First 5000 Years . For those wanting a handy index the posts are:
http://crookedtimber.org/

NBN, carbon price to stay: independents, Channel nine,
Both Mr Windsor and Mr Oakeshott said the complexity of unwinding the two policies made it all the more likely Malcolm Turnbull would return to the leadership of the coalition in the future.
news.ninemsn.com.au/.../nbn-carbon-price-to-stay-independents

Has Speaker Slipper A Strategy For A Surfeit of SSOs?, Patriciawa, Polliepomes
He seems to me more perfectionist, even vain, than vengeful. Be that as it may, I wonder how much more of an asset than one more precious vote the Prime Minister anticipated her new Speaker in the Lower House might be
polliepomes.wordpress.com/.../

WHO’S AFRAID OF THE ONLINE TROLL?, Wendy Harmer, Hoopla
Doesn’t matter if you are male or female; whether you’re in the depths of despair or celebrating your triumphs, seems there’s always some ‘anonymous’ who is there to rainon your parade. To make you feel small and unworthy.
thehoopla.com.au/.../utm_medium=email&utm_



VIDEO


Facebook group reveals ugly side of Defence Force culture, 7.30pm report
While the Australian Defence Force tries to clean up its image following recent sex scandals, a private social media group of former and current soldiers shows some sections of military culture are still deeply offensive.
www.abc.net.au/7.30/content/2012/s3442781.htm

Is Google watching you?, Lateline
Internet giant Google is under fire for a new policy that allows it to more closely track users.
www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2012/s3442865.htm

National Press Club,
Independent MPs Rob Oakeshott and Tony Windsor address the National Press Club on February 29, 2012
www.abc.net.au/.../3860282

Solar rebate scheme did not end early says Mark Dreyfus
Parliamentary Secretary for Climate Change and Energy Efficiency, Mark Dreyfus says the solar hot water rebate scheme has not ended early and was due to finish this year
www.aapone.com.au/SearchPreviewVideo.aspx

Queensland Votes: Police, disability funding and Campbell’s Web
There were a lot of promises and ‘policy announcements’ but there were few details about where the funding was coming from. It’s getting particularly bad for the LNP as Newman continues to duck tough questions about how he plans to fund his promises while cutting the budget

.australianpoliticstv.org/.../

Campbell Newman Speaks with Together
LNP Leader Campbell Newman speaks to members of Together about his party's plans for the future in the 2012 Queensland election campaign
www.youtube.com/watch

Julia Gillard launches 'The Australian Moment'
Julia Gillard launches George Megalogenis' book 'The Australian Moment' at Parliament House in Canberra. Sky News
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HxbH_UF9AbQ

Julia Gillard and Stephen Conroy: Press Conference
australianpoliticstv.org/.../

lyn

March 1. 2012 07:34 AM

lyn

         TODAY'S FRONT PAGES

  Australian Newspaper Front Pages for 1 March 2012

www.frontpagestoday.co.uk/index.cfm

lyn

March 1. 2012 08:39 AM

Ad astra reply

LYN'S DAILY LINKS updated: www.thepoliticalsword.com/.../...-DAILY-LINKS.aspx

Ad astra reply

March 1. 2012 09:38 AM

lyn

Hi Ad

The Bob Carr story is reported on the front page of the Australian,
as normal, she said, he said, we are just dreaming if we think they are going to change.

This is my tweet this morning:-

lynlinking
MPs said
one source said.
Another MP said
Another MP who said
senior government sources
one source said

www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-fn59niix-1226285632288

lyn

March 1. 2012 10:26 AM

Ad astra reply

Hi Lyn
I noticed the splash in The Oz.  I'm writing something about it now.

Ad astra reply

March 1. 2012 10:26 AM

Gravel

Patricia

Congratulations, you deserve this recognition, and it is not before time.

We are having lovely soaking rain here.  Expected to last for 24 more hours.  The joys of a new/old home, woken up by a drip=drip-drip sound.  Found a great leak, can only be fixed after rain has finished, and it only happens when the rain comes from the East, which is not that often.  Luckily all else is going well so far.

Good to read a lot of confirmation how good Oaky and Windsor were yesterday at the NPC.  Unfortunately not a word from the media.

Gravel

March 1. 2012 10:33 AM

DMW

Casablanca @ 7:14 AM
CanDo disproves the 'rule' like father, like son.

Kevin Newman was 'a gentleman and a scholar', a humble bloke who worked his electorate in the old fashioned 'parish pump' style of keeping in touch with the people and particularly those who wouldn't vote Liberal in a pink fit.

Kevin on more than one occasion shared many a 'cleansing ale' with my father. Local Labor MP's including a future state Premier were 'guests' at times and some interesting plots were hatched.

While CanDo may think he is 'Liberal Royalty' his father would have been embarrassed to be thought of that way.

DMW

March 1. 2012 10:48 AM

lyn

Hi Ad

Dennis Shanahan at it again still:-

Leroy_LynchLeroy
2 great responses to Shanahan's shameless beat up in Oz today re Bob Carr #auspol #bbill http://tinyurl.com/6umkfen & http://tinyurl.com/7kqgp3y
Shananana has shifted his goal post so many times over attacking PM on Carr, even the Socceroos’d have problem scoring
www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-fn59niix-1226285632288

Bushfire Bill comment 3429 The Poll Bludger
Posted Thursday, March 1, 2012 at 8:09 am


It’s all set out for us in a convenient mud map:

CARR AT ODDS WITH PM ON BID
Matthew Franklin and Dennis Shanahan
BOB Carr has directly contradicted Julia Gillard's denial that he was offered the post of foreign minister in her government this week.

* DENNIS SHANAHAN: Offer denial another failed test
* TROY BRAMSTON: Call Bob to Canberra
* GREG SHERIDAN: Carr drive-by a loss for Gillard
* DEFENCE: Disruption fear with Smith move
* IN DEPTH: Labor in crisis
blogs.crikey.com.au/.../#comment-1183613

lyn

March 1. 2012 11:19 AM

jane

Gravel, @10.26am, I'd welcome rain from any direction. It's been six months since it rained in my neck of the woods and we rely solely on tank water.

Are you surprised that the Independents NPC address has been ignored by mainstream (ie Murdochracy) media? They were brilliant, I thought.

jane

March 1. 2012 11:20 AM

The Politics Project

The Politics Project's take on 'Carr for Senate' and Gillard's looming cabinet reshuffle. Let's hope Gillard makes some bold choices.

thepoliticsproject.wordpress.com/.../

The Politics Project

March 1. 2012 11:44 AM

lyn

Hi James

James how delightful of you to visit TPS, thankyou very very much.

We do enjoy your articles very much.  Thankyou and congratulations on your blog "The Politics Project" you are doing a fantastic job, facts and truth reporting.

James said:-

This is absolutely infuriating. Just days after securing the biggest win in Labor leadership history, Prime Minister Julia Gillard has already managed to botch her planned reshuffle of the federal ministry
thepoliticsproject.wordpress.com/.../

CheersSmileSmileSmileSmile

lyn

March 1. 2012 11:59 AM

Ad astra reply

Media Mash

Flogging a dying horse by Matthew Franklin and Dennis Shanahan

Although the ABC has largely abandoned the Bob Carr story in its news bulletins, and Barrie Cassidy made but passing reference to it this morning in his weekly roundup of federal politics, ‘The Heart of the Nation’ just couldn’t let it go, couldn’t pass up the opportunity to damage our PM once more, couldn’t resist trying to justify its beat up of yesterday.

A piece in The Oz today by these two ardent Gillard supporters titled: Bob Carr at odds with Julia Gillard on ministry bid www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-fn59niix-1226285632288 begins “ The Prime Minister's handling of the disclosure of Labor's attempt to draft Mr Carr has sparked fresh concerns among colleagues about her political judgment.  The concerns emerged last night after Ms Gillard attacked as ‘completely untrue’ a report in The Australian yesterday detailing the government's offer to Mr Carr - despite the fact Mr Carr had publicly confirmed the offer had been made.”  Note that in trying to nail PM Gillard they put their assertion up front but don’t accuse her of making the offer.  They talk about ‘the Government’s offer’.

Yesterday these journalists wrote in the third paragraph of Mutiny kills PM's Bob Carr plan www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-fn59niix-1226284538034 ”Ms Gillard offered the job to Mr Carr, Labor's longest-serving NSW premier and respected national Labor figure, last week when Mr Rudd resigned to contest the leadership ballot, and before Senator Arbib announced his resignation from the ministry and Senate to create a NSW vacancy.” Note they say ”Ms Gillard offered the job …”  Julia Gillard described this as ‘completely untrue’.

Today, in paragraph eight, yesterday’s assertion that ”Ms Gillard had offered the job to Mr Carr” had morphed into ”The Australian revealed yesterday that the government sought to draft Mr Carr to Senator Arbib's vacancy with the offer of the foreign affairs ministry.” (my bolding).  

Three paragraphs later we read: ”He (Carr) said last night that ‘party officials’ had talked to him about the possibility of filling the Senate vacancy and being considered for the foreign ministry post. ‘Prime Minister Gillard had definitely not made any offer about the foreign affairs ministry nor had any one on her behalf,’ he said.”  That seems clear enough.  Yet Franklin/Shanahan write today: “Late yesterday, as it emerged that Ms Gillard had spoken to Mr Carr on Monday night at least twice, the former premier released a clarifying statement stressing that while party officers had talked to him about the possibility of filling Senator Arbib's position and the possibility of the foreign ministry, Ms Gillard made no offers about the ministry.” Again my bolding, and that seems pretty clear. But they felt they needed to add: “His statement made no reference to discussions he had with her on Monday night or the fact that he had begun preparations then to become foreign minister after speaking with her.”  So the fact that he made no reference to these discussions is somehow newsworthy, and in a sinister way.  And for good measure, they slip in the assertion that he ‘had begun preparations then to become foreign minister’ and also had ‘booked a flight to Canberra’.  Is this true?

If your brain is reeling with this contorted account of what went on, don’t blame your brain.  It is contorted.  The story is buried in obfuscation, in which these two writers excel.

What seems clear is:
- That ‘party officials’ (said initially to be NSW ALP general secretary Sam Dastyari) spoke to Bob Carr, who lives in NSW from where the replacement senator must be drawn.
- That those conversations were about the Senate vacancy and reference was made to the Foreign Ministry post.
- That Julia Gillard had some conversations with Bob Carr.
- That she made no offer of a ministry to him.

In beating up this story, the real angle of these journalists was to nail PM Gillard on the charge of lack of judgement, manifest by a so-called ‘revolt’ by some of her ministers who naturally believed the Foreign Minister should be drawn from the existing ministry, but according to The Oz was heading to an ‘outsider’.

We will likely never know the full details, but again this incident illustrates how a newspaper can insert itself into a matter for government, and specifically a matter for the PM, and through an inaccurate story distort the reality to the PM’s disadvantage, and at the same time give fodder to Tony Abbott for another attack on the PM.  The fact that the authors today have contradicted their story of yesterday is obscured in their contorted and at times devious and ambiguous language.

These two are always setting ‘tests’ for our PM, and in their eyes she always fails.  What about a ‘test’ for Dennis Shanahan and Matthew Franklin, a test of accuracy and consistency in reporting, a test of fairness and evenhandedness, a test of clarity of writing.  They fail comprehensively on all counts.

Ad astra reply

March 1. 2012 12:10 PM

Ad astra reply

Hi Lyn
Thank you for the links to the Franklin/Shanahan story in The Oz, which I read after posting my Media Mash.

I can see that I'm not the only one incensed by the story.  OzPol Tragic and BB make very telling analyses.

Shanahan and Franklin know no shame.

Ad astra reply

March 1. 2012 12:20 PM

Ad astra reply

James
Welcome to The Political Sword family. Do come again.

We are enjoying reading your Politics Project.  You seem to have inside information, which makes your pieces informative.  I enjoyed reading your take on the likely new ministry, although I feel it is premature to use the term 'botch' in referring to the reshuffle.  Why don't we wait to see what eventuates.  No doubt there will be plenty of comment then, including accusations of botching if her choice does not match the expectations of some.

Ad astra reply

March 1. 2012 12:51 PM

lyn

Hi Ad

Thankyou for your wonderful Mash up but you said

Thank you for the links to the Franklin/Shanahan story in The Oz, which I read after posting my Media Mash

I was just wondering did you read all these  (Joke)   they really are crazy, what an amazing beat up, biggest ever I think (joke 2)

Libs turn scorn on Gillard over Carr
Sky News Australia - ‎38 minutes ago‎
Libs turn scorn on Gillard over Carr Updated: 11:31, Thursday March 1, 2012 Senior Liberal figures have accused Julia Gillard of bending the truth in trying to explain away discussions the prime minister had with Bob Carr over the foreign ministry.
www.skynews.com.au/.../article.aspx

Gillard warned against returning Stephen Smith to foreign affairs portfolio
The Australian - ‎57 minutes ago‎
Image Video Video Smith confirms he opposed offer to Carr Mundine firms as Senate frontrunner JULIA Gillard faces a further blow to her authority if she hands the foreign affairs portfolio to frontrunner Stephen Smith. Foreign affairs expert, Professor ...
www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-fn59niix-1226285979385

Gillard fine tunes another ministerial merry-go-round
Sydney Morning Herald - ‎1 hour ago‎
Prime Minister Julia Gillard is putting the final touches on her ministerial shuffle and is expected to make an announcement tomorrow on the details of her second cabinet since December. The hotly contested foreign affairs portfolio is likely to go to ...
m.smh.com.au/.../...rrygoround-20120301-1u475.html

Gillard red-faced over Carr bungle
Sydney Morning Herald - ‎2 hours ago‎
A BUNGLED attempt to woo Bob Carr to Canberra to serve as foreign minister has raised fresh concerns about Julia Gillard's authority, just days after her resounding victory in the leadership ballot. Mr Carr, the former NSW premier, confirmed yesterday ...
m.smh.com.au/.../...arr-bungle-20120229-1u3id.html

New leaks sting Prime Minister Julia Gillard
NEWS.com.au - ‎2 hours ago‎
Former NSW premier Bob Carr says he was not offered a cabinet post in the Gillard government. Prime Minister Julia Gillard held secret talks with Bob Carr, say insiders. Source: News Limited JUST two days after Julia Gillard scored a thumping victory ...
www.news.com.au/.../story-e6frfkvr-1226285755765

Offer denial is another failed test
The Australian - ‎2 hours ago‎
Smith confirms he opposed offer to Carr IN denying a report in The Australian yesterday that she had offered Bob Carr the post of foreign minister, Julia Gillard went over the top and allowed for no nuance or backpedalling.
www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-e6frg75f-1226285544391

Gillard own goal over Carr
The Australian - ‎3 hours ago‎
Bob Carr has directly contradicted Julia Gillard's denial that he was offered the post of foreign minister. First off: Ms Gillard's handling of the issue, including Mr Carr's disclosure that he was approached, has raised fresh concerns about the PM's ...
www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-fn59nqgy-1226285747881

Smith opposed offer to Carr
Sky News Australia - ‎4 hours ago‎
Smith opposed offer to Carr Updated: 07:36, Thursday March 1, 2012 Defence Minister Stephen Smith's office has confirmed he fought a push to have former NSW premier Bob Carr drafted into the Senate so he could serve as foreign minister
. www.skynews.com.au/.../article.aspx

Let your dogs loose, Julia, and you may still have a chance
Brisbane Times - ‎5 hours ago‎
Now that Julia Gillard and Kevin Rudd's brawl over who has the right to be the next leader of the opposition is over, there might just be one bright spot for the ALP in this sorry mess - and I'm not talking about the resignation of the special envoy to ...
www.brisbanetimes.com.au/.../...0120229-1u38w.html

Gillard favoured Carr but Smith wouldn't budge
The Age - ‎5 hours ago‎
Just after Mark Arbib confirmed on Monday that he was leaving the Senate, the NSW Labor general secretary, Sam Dastyari, rang Bob Carr. Dastyari, who has long been keen for Carr to move to Canberra, sounded out the former premier.
www.theage.com.au/.../...budge-20120229-1u3hs.html

National interest and pride demand we fight to join the UN Security Council
Sydney Morning Herald - ‎5 hours ago‎
Julia Gillard is right to ignore the critics who are calling for our bid to be dumped. PRIME Minister Julia Gillard was right to make clear this week, as she did on ABC Radio the morning after her decisive leadership win, that Australia would continue ...
www.smh.com.au/.../...-council-20120229-1u38x.html

Smith confirms he opposed offer to Carr
The Australian - ‎9 hours ago‎
DEFENCE Minister Stephen Smith's office has confirmed he fought a push to have former New South Wales premier Bob Carr drafted into the Senate so he could serve as foreign minister. Prime Minister Julia Gillard's authority has been shaken as she seeks ...
www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-fn3dxity-1226285690328

Gillard Working on Australian Cabinet Reshuffle
Bloomberg - ‎10 hours ago‎
Australian Prime Minister Julia Gillard, who won a leadership ballot on Feb. 27, said she's working on changing her cabinet lineup, without giving an indication when it may be announced. “My door is open to talk to people as I work my way through the ...
www.bloomberg.com/.../...an-cabinet-reshuffle.html

New leaks sting Prime Minister
Herald Sun - ‎11 hours ago‎
JUST two days after Julia Gillard scored a thumping victory over Kevin Rudd she has been stung by new leaks against her. Her call for unity has been undermined by Labor insiders revealing that she held secret talks with former NSW Premier Bob Carr ..
. www.heraldsun.com.au/.../story-fn7x8me2-1226285650513

poor decisions are still being made
The Australian - ‎12 hours ago‎
LESS than 48 hours after winning endorsement as Prime Minister, Julia Gillard makes another apparently ill-considered decision. The idea of replacing Mark Arbib with former NSW premier Bob Carr and appointing him foreign minister has backfired with ...
www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-fn558imw-1226285525522

Ignore doubters and call Bob Carr to Canberra
The Australian - ‎12 hours ago‎
Smith confirms he opposed offer to Carr THE Labor Party should send Bob Carr to Canberra and make him minister for foreign affairs. Although the push for Carr seems to have petered out - as it appears Julia Gillard supported Carr's move to federal ...
www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-fnbcok0h-1226285542358

Gillard unclear in Carr crash cover-up
Herald Sun - ‎12 hours ago‎
JULIA Gillard yesterday panicked and appears to have muddied the truth about a stupid bid to recruit former premier Bob Carr. "Completely untrue," the Prime Minister blustered. But it wasn't at all, so just two days after beating Kevin Rudd in a ...
www.heraldsun.com.au/.../story-e6frfhqf-1226285568801

Bob's not running and PM's left by the side of the road
The Age - ‎12 hours ago‎
Bob Carr, former premier, civil war history dork, lover of the malleefowl and friend to Gore Vidal, has always declined offers to enter federal politics. But now he has, whether he meant to or not. His flirtation with the foreign affairs portfolio, ...
www.theage.com.au/.../...-road-20120229-1u3hl.html

Carr drive-by a loss for Gillard
The Australian - ‎12 hours ago‎
Smith confirms he opposed offer to Carr JULIA Gillard's failure to get former NSW premier Bob Carr as her foreign minister is a tragedy for her government and for Australia. When Kevin Rudd lost the prime ministership in 2010, Australia lost a lot of ..
. www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-e6frg76f-1226285517448

Defence disruption fear with Stephen Smith move
The Australian - ‎12 hours ago‎
SENIOR Defence Force officials are concerned that shifting Stephen Smith back to foreign affairs will disrupt strategic defence plans, and mean the Labor government has had four defence ministers in as many years. Amid the furore over the offer to ...
www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-e6frg8yo-1226285567989

Failed Carr overture fuels Abbott attack on PM
The Age - ‎12 hours ago‎
JULIA Gillard's authority has taken a fresh knock, after leaks of aborted discussions with former New South Wales premier Bob Carr over a proposal to make him foreign minister. The opposition seized on the fiasco, with Tony Abbott declaring that in ...
www.theage.com.au/.../...on-pm-20120229-1u3fh.html

PM called to explain if Carr offered ministry
ABC Online - ‎15 hours ago‎
By chief political correspondent Emma Griffiths, staff Federal Parliament erupted into shouting and laughter this afternoon over whether the Prime Minister had lined up former NSW premier Bob Carr to fill a position in the Senate and the plum job of ...
www.abc.net.au/.../?site=sydney

Bob Carr denies Julia Gillard's job offer
Herald Sun - ‎15 hours ago‎
FORMER NSW premier Bob Carr has admitted NSW ALP officials approached him about being parachuted into the Senate and the federal cabinet, as the federal opposition accused Prime Minister Julia Gillard of being captive to Labor's "faceless men".
www.heraldsun.com.au/.../story-fn7x8me2-1226285518327

Bob Carr denies cabinet post rumou
Sky News Australia - ‎16 hours ago‎
Bob Carr denies cabinet post rumou Updated: 20:07, Wednesday February 29, 2012 Former NSW premier Bob Carr says he was not offered a cabinet post in the Gillard government. Reports on Wednesday suggested Ms Gillard offered Mr Carr the opportunity to ...
www.skynews.com.au/.../article.aspx

Bob Carr denies job offer from Julia Gillard
The Australian - ‎18 hours ago‎
FORMER NSW premier Bob Carr has denied having been offered a cabinet post by Prime Minister Julia Gillard. Reports today suggested Ms Gillard offered Mr Carr the opportunity to fill the NSW senate vacancy caused by the retirement of Senator Mark Arbib ...
www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-fn3dxity-1226285391927

Julia Gillard pressed to reveal the offer made to Bob Carr as he sought to ...
The Australian - ‎20 hours ago‎
JULIA Gillard has refused to rule out in parliament that she offered the foreign affairs ministry to former NSW premier Bob Carr, despite earlier denying the story outside the chamber. Mr Carr confirmed to The Australian Online today ...
www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-fn59niix-1226285013437  

lyn

March 1. 2012 01:10 PM

lyn

HI Ad

As if that wasn't enough information from Dennis Shanahan and his

shanahanigans

Here is a bit more:-

Bushfire Bill comment 3523 The Poll Bludger

Gillard’s fundamental crime was to declare that a Shanahan story was “completely untrue”.

If anything is designed to get Dennis thundering, it’d be saying that

Shanahan is paid to cobble scraps of unsourced leaks and gossip, gluing it together with his own fevered imaginings.

Hence, we get the Prime Minister, the very day after an epoch making win in the party room, the patron of nearly 300 pieces of legislation against trenchant opposition, in power so far for 18 months after her demise has been predicted weekly, now even more solidly in place after being re-elected as leader, labelled as “failed within 24 hours” by this pompous prick with a squeaky voice, Dennis Shanahan.

The only gig he can manage is to write for an already failed newspaper – literally failed for years now, as it cannot pay its pay, having to be off-loaded for free at supermarker checkouts like some cheap local rag – but subsidized to the hilt by its creator for sentimental and partisan reasons.
blogs.crikey.com.au/.../#comment-1183709

lyn

March 1. 2012 01:17 PM

NormanK

Oh FFS!

Smith opposed offer to Carr

Defence Minister Stephen Smith's office has confirmed he fought a push to have former NSW premier Bob Carr drafted into the Senate so he could serve as foreign minister.

A day later, Mr Smith's office issued a statement to Fairfax Media where he did not deny the objection.

www.skynews.com.au/.../article.aspx

That's it. That's the sum total of evidence they have for that headline. And as Lyn has shown, it is not the only one and not one of those that I have read actually contain 'confirmation'.

How do I find myself a journalist so that I can refuse to deny that I am a multi-millionaire? My bank balance could do with the boost.

This is a feedback loop of monumental proportions. Even if there is some substance to their claims they have not offered up one iota of proof and yet the grass fire spreads.

A slightly more realistic take on events:

The ALP still so tender the lightest touch causes agony
by Malcolm Farr    The Punch

It wasn’t Julia Gillard’s idea to offer Bob Carr the foreign ministry. It originally came from talks the former Premier had with his initial contact on the matter, NSW Labor secretary Sam Dastyari who had not consulted the Prime Minister. She did not make an offer.

Stephen Smith did not barge into the Prime Minister’s office and tear shreds off her because he wanted the ministry. He expressed an interest but has said privately and publicly it is up to Ms Gillard.

If he did have a tantrum, it would be the first of its type in his 20 years in Parliament. As one source said, “The thesis that Smithy flicked the switch to bull-in-a-china-shop strains credulity.”

www.thepunch.com.au/.../

NormanK

March 1. 2012 01:34 PM

Gravel

Jane

Sigh, no I did not expect any reporting from the media, but I did hope for about  a second that their straight talking might have hit a nerve somewhere.

Sorry to hear you haven't had rain, we are in East Gippsland, Vic.  I know what it is like on tank water, we were for over 12 years until now.  Even though we have constant access now, we are still and will remain very frugal.  We have a very small water tank here that we use for drinking and cooking only, and can't get used to the smell of chlorine in the main water supply.  

Gravel

March 1. 2012 01:50 PM

Ad astra reply

Hi Lyn
You have been busy collecting that catalogue of bilious articles on ‘the Carr episode’.  Of the 26 listed, 11 came from The Oz which is obviously pulling out all the stops to cause PM Gillard maximum damage before she announces her new ministry, and another seven came from News Limited.
To be engaging so ferociously, the Murdoch media must be concerned the PM Gillard is getting the upper hand and is well on top of her ministry, which is the last thing they want from our PM, to whom they have assigned failure upon failure.  

NormanK
What a sensible article from Malcolm Farr.  If he can write that, and he is well connected, why are we having the onslaught from most of the others?  I think we know the answer.

I’m going to watch QT now, and when it’s concluded, I’ll post We are being conned by the polls – the Tarot Cards of politics.

Ad astra reply

March 1. 2012 01:50 PM

lyn

Hi Ad and Everybody

Chris Uhlmann had a night on Twitter last night:

Chris Uhlmann’s night on Twitter, NIC CHRISTENSEN,    The Media Machine
Nick Leys noted in Media Diary today the host of the ABC’s 7.30 program had an interesting night on Twitter.
Alone in a hotel room without electricity and unable to watch Annabel Crabb’s new cooking program Kitchen Cabinet he used his iPad to make contact with the outside world.

his colleague Latika Bourke was more blunt asking:
Latika Bourke's tweet
Ulhmann was quick to reassure assure Bourke  that no he wasn’t drunk

blogs.theaustralian.news.com.au/.../

justinbarbourJustin Barbour
Yes. RT apmd: Is Chris Uhlmann drunk-tweeting?

monkeytypistChris O'Regan
Today we are all hungover Chris Uhlmann

lyn

March 1. 2012 03:40 PM

Ad astra reply

Folks
QT was more of the same.  Almost no questions from the Coalition related to policy, a couple on the carbon tax, and of course the 44th motion to suspend standing orders to enable the PM to reveal all in relation to the ‘Carr affair’, moved shrilly by Julie Bishop who chronicled every untruth she alleges Julia Gillard has uttered, and seconded by an equally shrill Christopher Pyne.  As is the routine Antony Albanese calmly responded by pointing out that the suspension of standing orders would prevent the House addressing policy issues of importance to the nation, a very effective counter.  The motion was defeated by the usual margin.

What a waste of taxpayers’ money.

Ad astra reply

March 1. 2012 04:02 PM

lyn

Hi Ad

Thankyou for your wise and thoughtful opinion on Question Time today

Quite a few others share your view:

I have collected these comments for you:-


fiztig
So now the Opposition prosecutes the case using evidence from Dennis Shanahan? Riiiight.

GeorgeBludgerGeorge Bludger
fiztig singing: "Dennis told me, Dennis told me, Dennis told me so, I know everything I need to know cause Dennis told me so

MWhalanMark Whalan
gordongraham: "If Shanahan writes it, it must be true" Christopher Pyne #qt” *Tears of laughter*

externallylaws
Oh for goodness sake, lying  about what?!! An Australian article? hahahahahahaha. #believethatbelieveanything#qt

gordongrahamGordon Graham
Gillard sets things straight. Bit of a slap in the face to Shanahan and a few others #qt

davidlen2
Obviously Shanahan & his muk raking jurno mates at the Oz are feeding Abbott and Pyne info re their stories, all crap info but still feeding

Jitterry
This is ridiculous, absolutely ridiculous!

naomiwoodleyNaomi Woodley
Albo says he has 2 words for Oppn outrage at the fact Bob Carr might be considered for parliament: "Campbell Newman".

fiztig
PaulBongiorno Julie Bishop has done herself no credit on this SSO. None. #qt

MrDenmore
On the Carr beat-up, the caravan's moved on from Canberra, folks. No-one's watching. No-one cares. Can't you find something practical to do?

SpaceKidette
Did anyone carry on like a burnt pork chop when Sinodinos was appointed to the Senate? #qt #blownoutofallproportion #

Bushfire Bill on Dennis Shanahan, who ia=s the topic of conversation everywhere today, including Question Time

Bushfire Bill
Posted Thursday, March 1, 2012 at 1:05 pm 3714  The Poll Bludger


So far the LOLstralian has all bases covered:

(a) If she appoints a popular person she is weak.

(b) If she appoints an unpopular person then this will be the wrong person.

(c) If she consults, or asks for opinions, she is dithering and lacks leadship qualities.

(d) If someone else goes off half-cocked and ask an outsider to become a Senator, the party is an out-of-control trainwreck.

(e) If she insults Dennis Shanahan, then she’d better be prepared to have hard facts to go up against his gossip.

(f) If she gives into the press and explains everything, she is clearly trying too hard, and is a failure for being pushed around by the media.

(g) If she doesn’t explain anything, saying it is (as should be) private, then she is papering over cracks at the very top of Cabinet.

(h) Hugh White will decide who becomes FM, and the manner in which he is appointed.

(i) She can’t appoint Smith because Hugh White says he was a dud FM.

(j) She can’t appoint Crean because Crean must be punished for saying nasty things about Rudd.

(k) She might appoint Bowen, who thereafter be known as “the man who cocked up Immigration and is now going to cock-up Foreign Affairs.”

(l) If she appoints Bowen, a Rudd supporter, this will show she is weak.

(m) If she upsets Bob Carr then she has slandered one of the most gifted and loved politicians that has ever graced the Australian political scene.

(m) If she does appoint Bob Carr, then he is {too close to America|too close to China|a boring wonk who thinks knowing Henry Kissinger is a ticket to stardom}.

(n) Whoever she appoints she is {weak|scared|under the sway of faceless men|lacking authority|lashing out|defying the Press Gallery|finished}

(o) This is just another disaster to add to the disasters of Australia Day, the Carbon Tax, the Rudd debacle, Pink Batts, School Halls, the BER, her chaotic response to the Qantas lockout, her girlish flirting with Obama, allowing herself to be depicted f**king Tim under an Australian flag, allowing protestors to get “in her space and in her face”, her shankles, her ear lobes, her bum, her nose, her voice, New Julia, Old Julia, Who is Julia, Timor, Malaysia, Nuclear fuel to India, live cattle exports, crushing questions from Tony Abbott in QT that she cannot answer so they’re not played on the TV news, her communist past, her feminist past, her lawyer-speak way of giving speeches, her silly giggle, her right wing power base, her left wing power base, the third of the party that hated her and and still hates her, solar cells, her atheism, her hypocracy in meeting the queen, her gaffe in not curtseying, her stupid hat at the wedding, her unpopular Pokies policy before it became a shining light after she abandoned it, her failure to break up Telstra within 6 months, and that dog she got from a puppy farm.

Most of all she said Dennis Shanahan made up a story. THAT is the unforgivable bit.

blogs.crikey.com.au/.../#comment-1183905

lyn

March 1. 2012 04:11 PM

Ad astra reply

Folks
I have just posted: We are being conned by the polls - the Tarot Cards of politics.

http://www.thepoliticalsword.com

Ad astra reply

March 1. 2012 04:56 PM

Jason

Patricia WA, @ February 29. 2012 09:59 PM

" I always think of you as if in your gravatar picture, and I imagine you being a very sane and steadying influence on Talk Turkey!"

Well I try! And as most know on here not very succesfully.
I have tried to stop posts on here that I think might offend but have failed! not much I can do about it.
I know I've been wiped by some on here, but to them as much of an arse they think I am, a poster who is no longer here I dug into my pocket to help them and their family have a good a christmas as they could! and would do the same for most of you if required

But thanks Patricia I do try!
  

Jason

Comments are closed