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Australia is 'The Sweet Spot’ to be

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Saturday, 16 June 2012 19:55 by Ad astra
In recent days we have luxuriated in great economic news: strong growth, low inflation, falling interest rates, low unemployment, good jobs data, renewed triple A rating by Moody’s, low net national debt, massive investment in the pipeline, and an upbeat RBA and Federal Government. Each piece of good news has added to a sense of euphoria about our situation and our prospects. We live in a great nation.

In the light of this great news, it seems a good time to review a book that transmits this very message, and asserts that our favourable position has not happened by some accident of good fortune, some stroke of good luck. In his 2011 book: The Sweet Spot – How Australia made its own luck - and could now throw it all away (Black Inc), Peter Hartcher shows how it has all come about.

It is a very readable book, filled with facts and figures and sound reasoning. For me it became a page-turner, something one would not expect when reading a book on economics and Australian history. For anyone interested in how we got to where we are, and where we might go from here, it is a great read, and eminently plausible. Of necessity, this piece can only pick the eyes out of his comprehensive account. Read the whole book to derive the insights it offers so lucidly. Much of what appears below is drawn from the book, including several direct quotes. I acknowledge their source gratefully.

Hartcher gets onto his theme early. On page two he says: “Australia today is closer than it has ever been to fulfilling the promise as a golden land, even the most golden of all lands. It is the only developed nation on earth that has not suffered a recession in the last two decades.” He goes onto record how we sailed through the Asian economic crisis of 1997-98, flourished through the US stock-market bust and recession of 2003 and grew through the global financial crisis. He talks of our low unemployment rate and our high per capita income, now well ahead of the UK and the US. Yet he ponders why we seem so unexcited about our golden land: “If this achievement had been a sporting triumph, [such as beating the US in the gold medal tally at the Beijing Olympics] Australians would have erupted in a frenzy of celebration….Yet surpassing the country [the US] regarded as the benchmark of prosperity in the key measure of income was not even noted in the mainstream media. Winning sporting gold is a national triumph. Winning real gold, the gold of high incomes and high living standards is, apparently, trivial.”

He continues: “Perhaps it’s too new, or too incredible, for Australians to absorb, but the country has now become so successful as a prosperous modern power that it can afford to take a little credit for winning the real prizes of international life, rather than just the consolation ones.”

Hartcher then details our other accomplishments: Being first in the UN’s Human Development Index that measures how well ‘people can develop their potential, and lead productive, creative lives in accord with their needs and interests’, ahead of Norway. “Australians in short, enjoy the benefits of living in the world’s superpower of living standards.” The OECD’s Better Life Index, which also includes health, education, income, personal security, working hours and community connections, found: “…that Australia’s overall living conditions were the best.” Again he scratches his head: “One of the perversities of Australia’s ascendancy as a superpower of living conditions is that its people have shown a striking insouciance about it. At two consecutive national elections – in 2007 and again in 2010 – the voters refused to re-elect the governments that presided over these conditions.”

He notes that Paul Krugman described Australia as “the miracle economy of the world financial crisis” and the OECD reported that: “in the last decade of the 20th Century Australia became a model for other OECD countries”. While many would attribute Australia’s success to the mining boom, Hartcher points out that “only one dollar in twelve generated in the Australian economy came from the combined industries of oil, gas, coal, iron ore, gold and other minerals.”

Hartcher then goes to another of his themes – the fairness and tolerance of our society: “Australia’s accomplishment is far greater than generating wealth and services for an elite…The wider picture is that Australia is one of the world’s fairest countries, one of the most tolerant, and one of the safest.” He concludes his first chapter: “So Australia has managed to become one of the richest countries in its financial wealth, perhaps the richest of all in its living conditions, and also rich in its spirit of fairness and cohesion.” and ”This book points out what the serious observers in the rest of the world have noticed but that most Australians have not: Australia has become one of the most successful countries on earth.”

Hartcher then expands: ”…entrenched egalitarianism is one of two defining themes that run through Australian attitudes.” He talks about ‘The Tall Poppy Syndrome’ and then says: ”Talk of egalitarianism in Australia is sometimes reduced to a discussion of the concept of ‘mateship’.” Later he says: ”But beneath the manners and mannerisms, egalitarianism has a deeper and harder identity. It’s called fairness. This has several manifestations. One is fairness of outcomes. Another is fairness of opportunity. A third is fairness between one generation and another.” He elaborates on the dire social and cultural effects of inequality.

Hartcher then describes the other defining strand, other than egalitarianism, running through Australian attitudes, namely freedom, which he defines as ”…the right to make your own choices in life. Freedom…includes political and legal rights” and ”…freedom to choose a course of study or a field of work or start a business.” After describing several examples of extraordinary Australians: Twiggy Forrest, Professor Ian Frazer, the inventors of the bionic ear and sleep apnoea treatment, he says: ”If you want growth and prosperity you need economic freedom.” and ”…fairness and freedom are the essential themes in Australia’s history…All countries make their way by navigating these twin currents. In making practical choices of policy the two are usually opposed: it’s an established tenet of economic policy that equity and efficiency are to be traded off against each other…Perfect equity in incomes policy… would…fail to reward initiative and effort. The economy would wither. Perfect efficiency…would create a society of huge inequality. With no social safety net to catch the most vulnerable, exploitation and suffering would go unchecked. The key to crafting a country lies in setting the balance.”

Hartcher gives a whole chapter to a detailed discussion of the claims by some that Australia is becoming less fair, more polarized and that inequality is growing, concluding that of the first type, fairness of outcomes: ”The incomes and wealth of the low-, middle- and upper-income groups have all risen in the last decade or so in Australia. And by international standards, Australian economic equality is in the middle. Of the second type, the fairness of opportunity, Australians have ample opportunity to move out of poverty, to transcend their parents’ income category, to build the lives they choose for themselves…On the third type, the fairness of how one generation treats another, Australia’s performance is exemplary, almost uniquely so. Australia’s fast-rising prosperity has been enjoyed unequally, but fairly…perfect economic equality is impossible…trying to get there would allow no room for the other essential quality in the creation of a successful modern society, freedom.”

His next chapter discusses economic freedom. Perhaps the most telling paragraph reads: ”In an overview of Australia, the Index of Economic Freedom says: “Australia’s modern and competitive economy performs well on many of the 10 economic freedoms. The country has a strong tradition of openness to global trade and investment, and transparent and efficient regulations are applied evenly in most cases. An independent judiciary protects property rights, and the level of corruption is quite low. Of the ten categories, Australia’s strongest scores were for financial freedom, labour freedom, property rights and business freedom. Its weakest scores were for trade freedom, investment freedom, government spending and fiscal freedom. Its scores on monetary freedom and freedom from corruption were middling.”

He concludes: Even as it delivers a relatively high degree of fairness to society, it has also improved the level of freedom of its economy. It is a happy equilibrium of this balance that is the source of Australia’s modern emergence as a model, a success in its own right and an example to others.” He asks “How did this happen?

Hartcher then gives an absorbing account of Australia’s colonial history in a chapter Destined to Fail, and concludes: ”Criminal, brutal, militaristic, starving and racist. This wouldn’t seem the most likely starting point for a country that emerges a little more than two centuries later as one of the world’s outstandingly law-abiding, free, peaceful, fair, prosperous, tolerant societies. Yet this is exactly what happened.”

The next chapter takes up the theme of rights in Australia and how they evolved in what began as a penal colony and concludes ”In defiance of its colonial origins, Australia was born a proudly democratic nation and a pioneer in the rights and freedoms of the people. And its burgeoning industries gave it the highest average incomes in the world.”

His next chapter describes a period when protectionism reigned. ”Australia remained addicted to its sheltered existence. The shop remained closed. Protectionism, and its supporting superstructure of controls on finance, controls on international capital flows and controls on labour, was comfortable but ruinous…Equity had crowded out efficiency.”

In the following chapters, Hartcher describes the way in which Hawke and Keating set about reducing protection: ”When Hawke and Keating took power in 1983, the average level of effective protection for the manufacturing industry was 25 per cent. By the end of Labor’s thirteen years it was down to less than 10…even when Labor left office after thirteen years the job was not yet finished.”

He then describes the changes that took place during the Howard/Costello era. ”In the twelve years before Hawke and Keating took power and the reform era began, Australia had suffered four recessions. When Howard left office, Australia had enjoyed sixteen years of continuous economic growth, on the way to at least twenty years of unbroken expansion.” He concludes: ”In the reform phase of 1983 to 2007, under Labor and Liberal governments, Australia realized it was on its own in the world. It started to make its own way. Australia had no idea how severely it was about to be tested.”

The next chapter describes how the Rudd Government tackled the global financial crisis, guided by Ken Henry’s advice: “If you really want to make a difference, go early, go hard, go households.” It is a chapter that deserves close attention for its historic value. Hartcher mentions the components of the Government response: the bank guarantee and the phased stimulus package, and acknowledged that: ”…Australia successfully flicked the switches at the right time. The switches worked because they were attached to powerful engines.” He goes on to say: ”While Australia enjoyed prosperity in the midst of international hardship, its government signally failed to win credit for its accomplishment…Two things happened. Rudd’s opponents cleverly turned a tale of extraordinary economic success into a political narrative of incompetence.” We all remember the ‘pink batts’ and ‘school halls’ campaign of the Opposition, strongly aided and abetted by The Australian.

The GFC chapter aptly titled I expect you to die concluded: ”The economy survived the most savage global economic crisis since the Great Depression…Australia’s economic success was the envy of the world, yet it seemed to hold its achievement in little regard.”

The next chapter focused on IR and Howard’s WorkChoices, the ‘structural deficit’ consequent upon the stimulus, and on productivity, about which Hartcher says: “Another vital measure of efficiency is national productivity. Contrary to popular impression, productivity is not a way of measuring how hard a country works. It’s the key way of measuring how smart a country works, in getting maximum benefit from the same amounts of human labour and invested capital…Australia performed poorly for a long time on this key measure, with a long run average of 1.2 per cent annual improvement. This almost doubled during the 1990s, thanks to the economic reforms of the 1980s and ’90s. Then it slumped again in the last decade. For the last five years it’s been below zero”. By 2007, the pendulum that swings between efficiency (productivity/competitiveness) and equity, had begun to swing towards greater equity, but that meant less efficiency.

The next two chapters address different models of society and gives examples of countries that use them. Space does not permit a discussion of them here.

Which brings us to one of Hartcher’s key chapters: How to blow it. He quotes David Alexander, former press secretary to Peter Costello: ”The most interesting aspect of the success of the Australian model is that a country can achieve a significant degree of egalitarianism without sacrificing economic freedom”, what Alexander calls the ‘platypus model’. Hartcher asserts that ”…one of the secrets of Australia’s balance is that leaders have not been slaves to ideology. Labor and Liberal prime ministers have employed policy tools borrowed from the ideological toolkit of the other side.” He quotes Hawke and Keating’s introduction of policies that were disruptive to workers, and Howard’s support for their deregulation and protectionist reforms.

He then puts his finger on what he believes is a core contemporary problem: ”It was Tony Abbott and Julia Gillard whose combined efforts brought the era of responsible policy-based leadership and ambitious reforms to a shuddering halt…their separate political calculations brought them together as the political father and mother of Australia’s new populism, an ugly, squalling brat that soon drove the nation to distraction…The advent of Tony Abbott as opposition leader brought an abrupt end to the Liberal Party’s mindset of rationality and responsibility.”. Pointing to the fact that Howard was prepared to forgo easy political advantage by supporting the government in the national interest, as was Brendan Nelson and Malcolm Turnbull, he noted that Abbott’s angry opposition broke with the Liberals’ style of responsible leadership. Hartcher says: ”Abbott’s easy change of mind in pursuit of power, his exuberant embrace of populism, mark him as an opportunist”, but he goes on to say: ”But while the opposition leader is a key influence, he cannot single-handedly change the national political and policy agenda.” Hartcher continues: ”Gillard led Labor into a wholesale retreat into populism. She identified three priorities she wanted to address, political problems for the government she wanted to fix. Each represented a retreat from policy ambition.” They were of course the ETS, asylum seekers, and the mining tax.

Hartcher is strong in his condemnation of what he sees as lack of leadership. ”Both prime minister and opposition leader had demonstrated that they were prepared to change their beliefs on major policy areas if it would help them to procure power. With leaders exposed as opportunists, political debate quickly ended up in sterile exchanges…”

Returning to the theme of his book, Hartcher writes: ”Australians created the sweet spot for themselves. The country needs to know that circa 2010-11, it offers the best living conditions available on the planet. Not because it started out that way, and not because of the mining boom, but through building, through reforms and through intelligent public-spirited leadership. And, yes, through a little luck. But as Donald Horne warned, relying on luck is an invitation to complacency. And complacency is a dreadful problem solver.” He concludes: ”If Australia is to have a golden future. It will not be gilded with the sort of gold that is discovered by digging deeper holes in the ground. The necessary gold is not to be found in the country’s pits but in its wits.”

In his final chapters Hartcher talks of other models, but there is not space to discuss them here.

The purpose of this piece is two fold: The first is to introduce you to Peter Hartcher’s splendid book, with as much drawn from it as space will allow, to inform you of his approach with the hope that you might seek to read the book from cover to cover. There is so much more in it than I can leave here. The second is to engender discussion of the issues he raises.

Australia is indeed 'The Sweet Spot’ to be. If you did not already know that, Hartcher’s book will persuade you to that view. But even without that, the economic data of the last week or two should suggest even to the skeptics that we are doing very well as a nation. While some do not feel they are doing so well, the majority ought to – there is no better place on earth to live. Why then is it that there is so much pessimism, so little confidence, so much gloom around?

As with all complex situations, the likely reasons are many: the financial turmoil and political uncertainty in Europe, the sluggish US economy, stock market volatility that imperils the pension of many, and the political turbulence in our own country, are all engendering uncertainty and apprehension among the people. But in my opinion there is another reason, one that the mainstream media seem to overlook, or gloss over, or prefer to ignore. I’m referring to the incessant negativity of the Leader of the Opposition, the approach he has taken from day one.

He has never stopped deriding the Government, never ceased from demeaning PM Gillard, never supported anything the Government has tried to do, never stopped talking down the economy and the way the Government is managing it despite all the glowing economic news of late, never prepared to acknowledge in the smallest degree the Government’s success in economic management and during the GFC, hell bent on destroying the carbon tax and the mining tax, labeling them as ‘toxic’ harbingers of an Armageddon, intent on ’demolishing’ the NBN ‘white elephant’, and repealing many other pieces of reforming legislation. Can anyone advance a convincing case that this man has not had a profound influence on the thinking of the voters and the psyche of the nation?

Here we are in ‘The Sweet Spot’ so convincingly argued by Hartcher, yet there is gloom and despondency, much of which I believe is locally created. We seem to have talked ourselves into a state of reactive depression, and one of our ‘therapists', our LOTO, keeps reminding us how depressing our situation is and how miserable and hopeless we ought to feel. We need a change of therapist.

What a pity it would be in inept politicians threw it all away.

What do you think?

Comments (242) -

June 16. 2012 09:23 PM

Psyclaw


AA

You are obviously very enthusiastic about what Hartcher says, especially the main Sweet Spot theme. Fair enough. It probably takes a read of the whole book to come to this view as an on-balance assessment of Hartcher's wider assessment of the situation.

There were several quotes to which I took exception but the following one is the one to which I object the most.

”It was Tony Abbott and Julia Gillard whose combined efforts brought the era of responsible policy-based leadership and ambitious reforms to a shuddering halt .........Both prime minister and opposition leader had demonstrated that they were prepared to change their beliefs on major policy areas if it would help them to procure power........"

Firstly, I do not believe that this observation of Hartcher's can be accepted unless it is couched in terms that recognise that it is in fact a hung parliament, and all that that implies. The tenuous nature of the possible term of government is everpresent. Is Hartcher silent on that or is it just that you have not quoted his allowance for that aspect?

Secondly, he tars Ms Gillard and Mr Abbott with the same brush, and thereby allocates the blame 50/50. IMHO this is a gross distortion and unfair to JG. Since 2010 the government has actually legislated sufficient policy reforms to ensure JG's place in history even if her reign ends tomorrow. In this context I note what I have pointed out now for 18 months ...... the cross benches gave JG only "confidence" support on September 8, 2010, and specifically reserved the right to go their own ways, policy wise.

This opened the door for Abbott to actually share government from the opposition benches, something never before afforded to a LOTO. On any matter he stood with the same  equal challenge as JG ...... convince the cross benchers about any policy and you have the numbers to legislate it.

Which media person has ever taken this issue up!

Thirdly, based on your quotes, Hartcher has not allowed for Abbott's uniquely pugilistic character. He has been in JG's face from the got-go. At no time has he been restrained by civility or honesty. JG has returned vitriol, but in a far less quantum. I do not believe nor accept that even the harshest JG critic, if holding a modicum of fairness would see her as the initiator of what Hartcher calls non- policy leadership.

Fourthly comes the elephant in the room, the role of the MSM. The lazy MSM, the one-sided MS, the uncritical-of-Abbott MSM, the priority-reporting-of what Abbott-says MSM, and the MSM unable to rope Abbott in for a significant interview in more than a year cannot be silently passed by.

Fifthly, I object strenuously to to Hartcher's slur that JG has changed her policy beliefs to gain power. I expect he is referring to the no-carbon-tax matter, and I won't canvas it here except to assert that the simplistic reduction of the issue to a "lie" ignores several aspects which make the issue complex, but nevertheless it remains very amenable to being mantracised by the ill informed, the non-thinkers, and anyone with a motive to distort.

Psyclaw

June 16. 2012 09:41 PM

DoodlePoodle

Another great article Ad Astra.  Thanks for sharing it with us.  I concur with the views expressed by Psyclaw.

DoodlePoodle

June 16. 2012 10:46 PM

Ad astra

Psyclaw, DoodlePoodle
Thank you for your comments.

I agree with you assessment Psyclaw.  I have tried to faithfully reflect Peter Hartcher’s words and sentiments.  As you may have guessed from my comments about Tony Abbott at the end, I hold him almost totally responsible for the lamentable state of affairs in Federal politics, and have said so from the outset, beginning with my first piece about him: The pugilistic politician.  

I agree with your assessment of Julia Gillard.  I am of the view that Peter Hartcher, like most of his journalistic colleagues, is reluctant to lay blame unilaterally at the feet of Tony Abbott.  Time and again, in the press, in the TV and radio news and on current affairs programs, including those on the ABC, there is a deliberate intent to ‘blame’ both sides of politics, both leaders, for the nasty politics we have to endure day after day.  In my opinion, most of the nastiness would disappear if Abbott were to be replaced by almost anyone else in the Liberal Party.  At least Hartcher hands out blame in equal measure to both leaders; in so many instances journalists lay most of the blame, most of the criticism on Julia Gillard, and let Tony Abbott off the hook almost completely, most of the time.  While I sense that this is changing, with criticism of Abbott slowly mounting, most journalists give him a slap only with a wet lettuce.

I have pondered why this is so, and of course what journalists write may be an accurate, unbiased reflection of their actual views.  I suspect however that many, convinced by the opinion polls on voting intention that Tony Abbott will be PM at the next election, are keeping their options open should this occur, wanting to be onside with the nation’s next leader, perhaps on his media drip feed, and certainly not cut off from it.  Another factor that might influence their attitude relates to the parlous state of the press with a falling customer base and declining advertising revenue, and the consequent sacking of journalists.  Fairfax journalists, of whom Hartcher is one, might believe that should that media empire collapse, News Limited might be their only refuge, and a history of antagonism to Tony Abbott and the Coalition would not be a positive in seeking employment with that anti-Government, pro-Coalition organization, one intent of ‘regime change’.

Ad astra

June 16. 2012 10:51 PM

Catching up

I agree with most that has been written.

I do not agree that the PM turned her back on any policy.  The PM agreed to nothing that was in conflict with Labor policy.  With any policy, there is more that one way to deliver.  Back in the days of the original Medibank hesitation, Hayden kept rolling with the punches, kept bringing it back after making changes that got it through.  Yes, not as originally planned.  The Opposition manage to stop the funding mechanism but not the bill.

I was young then, but followed every step of the drama.  Hayden would hit that brick wall, full back and look for another way around it.

As for the minority government, it is functioning well.

One would have expected, with the loose support of the cross benches, Mr. Abbott would have had more success within the house.


Mr. Abbott appears to scorn the house by ignoring all it does.  This has left a free run for the PM to get her legislation through.

I believe that Mr. Abbott thought he could bully himself into government.

I believe that the court cases they have set in motion, were design to bring down the government, before hitting the courts.

That is not happening, they are preceding and one wonders what Mr. Abbott's next action is. The sky is not going to fall in  after July.  In my opinion, the opposite will occur.  The money being paid in compensation, will provide a stimulus to the economy.

The message must eventually get through, that we are not doing too bad.





Catching up

June 16. 2012 10:58 PM

Ad astra

Psyclaw
I will re-read that chapter of Hartcher’s book to answer your specific question, but from my memory of what he wrote, he did not seek to acknowledge that PM Gillard’s decision making on policy matters was influenced, and indeed made extremely difficult by the minority parliament with which she has to work every day.  My impression was that he did not see that as letting her off the hook; instead he saw her abandoning strongly held policy positions opportunistically in what he judged was pursuit of power.

In fairness to Hartcher, I’ll read the relevant sections before responding specifically. I’ll get back to you tomorrow.

Ad astra

June 16. 2012 11:05 PM

Ad astra

Catching up
Thank you for your comments.  While I can’t clearly recall the Hayden days, I do agree with your later paragraphs.  I hope you are right when you say: The message must eventually get through, that we are not doing too bad.
.  It would if only the media permitted.

Ad astra

June 16. 2012 11:05 PM

NormanK

This morning's excellent interview, Anthony Albanese speaking with Chris Kenny about Slipper and more. This is a very strong performance.

www.skynews.com.au/.../

Users of Safari should disable AdBlocker to get this to play.

NormanK

June 16. 2012 11:26 PM

Ad astra

NormanK
Yes, that was great interview performance by Anthony Albanese.  He is first class.  As Robert Pirsig said in Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance: Quality is hard to define but you recognise it once you see it.  Anthony Albanese is quality.

Ad astra

June 16. 2012 11:33 PM

Psyclaw

AA

I enjoyed your further comments. I think you are getting near the money with this:

Another factor that might influence their attitude relates to the parlous state of the press with a falling customer base and declining advertising revenue, and the consequent sacking of journalists.

In addition, I think that the MSM  and specifically the journos themselves have not been able to marry the investigative, analytical part of their traditional role to the digital medium. There is so much info available to them from Mr Google that they mistakenly think that they can find out all the info they need without leaving their desk.

The sheer quantity of available digital info blinds them to the fact that most of this does not constitute primary sources, and they consequently fail to find that primary info which is unique to each individual journo's "wearing out the boot leather" search.

Add this to the info in your quote, and then add in the bias of so many individual journos and the editorial stances of News and Fairfax, and the result is a pathological MSM.

So as a group, they give us plenty of forrest but no unique trees.

Psyclaw

June 17. 2012 12:32 AM

Russell in Glendale

AA Holding Abbott to account. I agree that the state of the media in Australia has more than a slither of truth about it with emasculation of Fairfax. The dominance of New Ltd within the business environment here another. However, I note that 'The Conversation' is starting to get some traction and longer term may start to really get up the nose of News Ltd. Certainly there are some things the current Govt can do on the world stage that could turn the tables on the Liberal opposition. The first would be to make life difficult for News Ltd in Australia. Second, get some global support to make life difficult for an Abbott lead government regarding climate change solutions.  

Russell in Glendale

June 17. 2012 09:02 AM

jaycee

One has to be careful not to put all ones' eggs into the Abbott basket (case)! He is a goner..The Liberal political machine is Machieavellian to its' core and as soon as a suitable, pliable replacement comes along, Abbott will "Step down for the good "of the nation"...Which is what the Liberal Party has always had in the fore-front of its' concern". The main enemy is the right-wing destructive mechanism of which the Liberal party is the political arm.
The weakness of the individuals in the "media game" is their beholden to the "mortgage syndrome"...How does any "Boss" intimidate his workers but with the threat of the sack and all the lifestyle chaos that entails. But as someone, like so many of us, who has gone on strike to support or to maintain quality of life and sometimes lost so much in those disputes, I can only give a little sympathy for the journalists position...They have a choice...; strike for self respect and decency or get on their knees and beg....as a humble worker, I and soo many of my fellows did and will continue to do the honourable thing and stand up for human decency!

jaycee

June 17. 2012 09:30 AM

2353

Sounds like a good book AA.  No - I haven't read it.  From your description of the chapters and the subsequent discussion it proves a truism in that Journalists are good at investigating (after all, it is what they do), however those still relying on work in the industry become less factual and more editorial the closer the events are to the current day.

Thanks for the link to the interview NormanK - it demonstrates how the Government can get a message across if allowed to by a good interviewer (which Ullman isn't).  The Interviewer showed how the follow up question is a powerful weapon as well.

2353

June 17. 2012 10:24 AM

Patriciawa

Psyclaw has said it all for me, AA.   I go along with Hartcher's thesis and with your exposition until we reach the current impasse in the reporting on Oz politics and the public mood. Psyclaw calls it the elephant in the room - our main stream media.   I see it too, rather I feel it all the time as I listen and watch reporting of news in our public arena.  It's the dead hand of control from Murdoch, the tyrant champion of capitalism.  His fall from grace in the UK will hopefully lead to a loosening of that grip here and elsewhere in time to make a difference especially in elections in the US and here.

I know that Hartcher is a Fairfax man but he knows well where he may need to look for the butter on his bread in future.  As well, there is a personal element in his attitude to the PM.  Is he a Ruddist, or a misogynist?

PS  ReCAPTCHA is ' arog FAUST'!!!   I often think, watching journalists, that they look uncomfortable at best and more often miserable.  I wonder, have they been contacted and contracted privately and made pacts with the Devil?

Patriciawa

June 17. 2012 10:39 AM

TalkTurkey

Good Morning Swordsfolks, Welcome Goodwilled Newcomers and Lurkers

Thank you Ad astra for yet another article, of which I have only read two paragraphs so far, I do that a lot I'm afraid, I sort of save you up until later and read some of the comments first. Like the glace cherry on the top. Disordered thinking sort of, but when I get around to you I already have a mix of opinions and when I read what you have to say I can hardly ever find a single point of disagreement with you in particular. I find that remarkable.

I used the term 'sweet spot' quite independently only a couple of threads back, in regard to where Labor sits v the Abborttians wrt the next election, you are using it here to describe our economic BENISONs (Beautiful EXTRAORDINARY NONPAREIL Inspirational Set Of Numbers) but of course it's all related. And I know before I read you this time, I am going to agree.

Watching Lopsiders, there's *J*U*L*I*A* at the economic summit, Glenn Stevens invites all these rich suited men (and probably women, didn't see none but) to comment, not a sound, they all look utterly glum, and do you know why? Here they are sitting on their pile, more bigger piles per capita than anywhere else in the world, the economy is in the sweetest spotit could be, Glenn Stevens says, "We're all unhappy right?"

Why?

It's because they have nothing to complain about in the economy, nothing their side of politics could be doing so well, they can see the writing on the wall that Labor is in the ascendant, no way to fight it, they won't be able to push workers around so much after all, they can't make the poor poorer wrt themselves, they will just have to be sadly consoled by making their own pile bigger far than it would have been if their mob had been in power!

Boy the rich Right side of politics is despicable.


["Carbon tax" . . . Crassidy spits out his defiant deliberately-ignorant agenda-driven attitude. Other panellists follow suit.]
      
"She did(*!) lose her temper on Q&A."
WHAT ?!!!
Voices at two paces you lying bastard.
I don't know your name but I want to boil your blood.
What a piggish thing to say. She exactly kept her cool.

(*!) NOW PLEASE NOTE : The subtitles (notoriously outrageously hopeless) read exactly as in the line I quoted above.

But on hearing it a second time I think he said [i]"didn't"[/i] not [i]"did"![/i]
Can anyone confirm please?

Old Brian Toohey points out that if Abbortt got in he would extend the GST to everything and increase it by 4% and it would cost 6 times as much as the price on carbon will. Bravo Brian. Ha ha.

Have a good day Folks. Be glad you're in Australia. However tough you might have it personally, you'd be worse off everywhere else.  


TalkTurkey

June 17. 2012 11:56 AM

Ad astra

Psyclaw
I’ve started re-reading the chapter in which Peter Hartcher made his disparaging comments about both leaders; as soon as I’ve responded to other posters, I’ll finish it and get back to you.  This will also interest others who have endorsed your view.

Ad astra

June 17. 2012 11:57 AM

Ad astra

Russell in Glendale
Holding Abbott to account is now the most critical change we want to see from MSM.  Do you have the link to ‘The Conversation’ pieces that you say are gaining traction in getting up the nose of News Limited?

Ad astra

June 17. 2012 11:57 AM

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jaycee
I suspect you are right – although Abbott now has support while the polls of voting intention are in the Coalition’s favour, they will ditch him as soon as he seems to be a liability.


Journalists, being human with families and mortgages, fear losing their jobs, and will be tempted to compromise their ethical and journalistic standards in order not to offend their employer.  We already know how Murdoch rules his empire.  The morning on Inside Business I hear that Gina Rinehart’s bid for seats on the Fairfax board is overtly to influence editorial policy towards her conservative point of view.  We are seeing another ‘Murdoch’ in the making.

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June 17. 2012 11:58 AM

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2353
Peter Hartcher’s book is a very good account of how Australia has become such a prosperous and fair nation.  Although we may disagree with his comments about what he likes to label as Julia Gillard’s opportunism in pursuit of power, the rest of the book is as good an account of our nation’s economic progress as I have yet read.  I’m still to read Mega’s book.

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June 17. 2012 11:58 AM

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Patriciawa
You will be interested to read my re-read of Harther’s chapter: How to blow it.  I think we all agree that the MSM is a major problem in the political game, where media executives and journalists see themselves as players rather than just spectators, reporters and commentators.  This came out on Insiders this morning; clearly at least some journalists see that, and know it constitutes a conflict of interest.

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June 17. 2012 12:00 PM

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TT
I do hope you enjoy the piece when you read it.  It’s pretty intense, as usual, but the good news about this wonderful country will bring joy to your heart.

I did hear that comment about ‘Julia losing her temper on Q&A’, and was initially confused.  I believe it was said the she didn’t lose her temper, which indeed was the case.

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June 17. 2012 12:18 PM

TalkTurkey

BULLSEYE EMMO on Press the Meat!

Right in the Abborttian guts!

The War is ON!

They have the heavy weaponry and the dough

But We have all the fearless warriors and we have our own  communications and we have the Abborttians in full and panicked flight because of their own self-hoisting petards!

And it's feeling better by the day, better than I thought and even better than I would have dared to hope!

If Utegate was a single ball from a misfired muzzle-loader that took out Turdball, the twin issues involving Peter Slipper and Craig Thomson is a double-barrelled hi-power scattergun that is set to take out WHO ?

Not Peter Slipper!

POOPOO PYNE!  YIPPEEEEEEEEE!
Ashby
Lewis
Brough
Abbortt (with no specific knowledge HaHa)
And and and ?

Not Craig Thomson!

Kathy Jackson
Lawler
And and and ?

And there ARE potential criminal matters involved on THEIR side.

TalkTurkey

June 17. 2012 12:50 PM

42 long

They are trying to hang it on Roxon/Albanese for speaking about stuff that is before the courts. Roxon was very carefull to say that and that it was only the commonwealth lawyers submission ( and not a court result)(In response to a question anyhow)
   Compare these measured and careful statements with the outlandish shrieking claims of the LNP types. Does their hypocrasy have no limits?
I thought tha allocation of time to the matters surrounding Winsor's challenger was out of proportion to it's real import and gave much opportunity for shots at the NSW labour movement generally. General labour shit canning all ads to the feeling that they are no good through and through, same as the attempt to foul the whole union movement with the goings on at HSU east branch ( Money can't buy this sort of free promotion o prime time, that is why I'd like to see more objectivity from Crassidy. Let's face it this stuff is screened from above by the ABC. So he will toe the line. Nice to NOT have Ackerman there. Have to be thankfull for small mercies.

42 long

June 17. 2012 01:22 PM

Patriciawa

Whatever else came up on 'Lopsiders' I think all we true believers here at TPS would have been delighted in the shift in the assessment of Julia Gillard.  Those clips of her speaking at the executive women's conference were stunning, both in content, her demeanour and her appearance.  How proud we can be of her as she sets off to appear in yet another world forum. I am sure there will plenty of coverage of that, if only to distract from all the legal and parliamentary dramas here! A lot has changed since I posted this at 2.38pm May 1, as a comment on  Ad Astra's great post www.thepoliticalsword.com/.../...oyal-Wedding.aspx.

Where Was Our PM?

Are you like me and wonder why
Images of our PM seem zero
While news media let not a chance go by
For a story picturing their ‘hero?’

Why, when he has an early morning dip,
Is there always someone from the press
On hand to get another photo clip
Of Tony Abbott in ‘undress?’

On Christmas Island he’s a ‘pop star’
Where he ‘plays some pool and has a beer.
Chatting up a blond perched at a bar,’
Slighting our PM to raise a cheer.

But, overseas on affairs of state,
Conferring with heads of government,
Partnered by a true Australian ‘mate,’
Her competence gets no acknowledgement.

Julia Gillard, in the desolation
Of Japan’s earthquake, sharing their distress,
Provides, it seems, just an illustration
Of how she needs to improve ‘her dress.’

In London amongst the royal wedding crowd,
Compared with any other famous guest,
Our PM really does Oz proud.
She’s poised, elegant and well dressed.

There we glimpsed her once. We may again
As daft old Dame Edna makes a fuss
About her hat, mocks her origins, and then
Sneers at her because she talks like us.

On ‘Insiders’ today we get more spin,
Lots of footage of the Coalition’s ‘Action Man’
As if the Oppposition was already in
And our Prime Minister an ‘also ran.’

But did you hear that banker whose opinion was,
After travelling with her on the China trip,
“She did sterling work as statesman!” So now, will Oz,
At last, commend her? Or will that be just another media blip?

Patriciawa

June 17. 2012 03:42 PM

42 long

  Perhaps they should be named "OFF"siders. Any thinkers out there who don't recognise the power of persuasion of the media yet? The masses swallow it hook line and sinker. They think they are watching "flycam"  a snapshot in time. Well the amount of setting-up some of those interviews take is mind boggling. and they can all be edited. No-one ever quotes the complete statement by Gillard re the  carbon tax/price. When there are "millions of images out there all you have to do to make it come out ANTI someone is to pick the lest flattering ones or add a long nose. (Gee that's clever)
   Anyhow how much is Gina going to spend to get her message across with Fairfaux. What will THAT be worth after she has trashed it's reputation, by distorting it's message.
   Recognising that print media is doomed, why don't some journo's split off and tell the truth. They will mostly lose their jobs anyhow. How much better to do it with honour than go down with the collaborators and "suck" types, aquabbling over what's left.
   Thank dog albitey for the internet and forums like this and good links etc.

42 long

June 17. 2012 04:01 PM

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Psyclaw
I have now re-read the chapter from which Peter Hartcher’s adverse comment was taken about Julia Gillard being an opportunistic politician who is focused on power, namely How to blow it.  I enjoyed reading it again as much as the first time.

I must say he was far tougher on Tony Abbott’s opportunism than on what he saw as Julia Gillard’s.

Regarding your specific question, Hartcher did not mention her having to grapple with a minority parliament.  So he was not using that reality to ‘excuse’ what he saw as her opportunism and desire to retain power.  He did mention the ‘hung parliament’ but in the context of Tony Abbott’s offer to ‘do anything’ to gain power.  So he did not offer any legitimate reason for PM Gillard’s change of stance on some policies, such as having to negotiate with the Greens and the cross benches.  He put any change of her position down to opportunism, power seeking, and lack of leadership, stating that she was unwilling to tackle the difficult reforms, unlike previous PMs – Hawke, Keating and Howard.  He sees PM Gillard as not being in the same class.

That’s his view, and it’s consistent with the views he expresses in his columns.   We do not have to agree; indeed we strongly disagree.

Another two paragraphs struck me on the re-read, too long to include in the original piece.  They give insight into how Australians can be so gloomy in the face of good economic news.

Hartcher details survey data revealed in The Australian Voter: Fifty Years of Change a book by ANU academic Ian McAllister: ”He [McAllsiter] came to four main findings on so-called economic voting.  First, the Australian voter gives greater weight to the state of the national economy than his own economic circumstances.  Second, the electorate gives greater weight to the outlook for the economy rather than the past or present.  Third, “in general, relatively few voters take an optimistic view of the economy in a year’s time, regardless of the objective economic situation at the time the question was asked”.  And fourth, Australians are increasingly likely to think that their country’s economic performance is beyond the control of the government in any case.   Or as McAllister explained: “The proportion saying that the government would make ‘no difference’ to the economy in the year ahead has consistently increased from 51 per cent in 1990 to 61percent in 2010.”

Hartcher comments: ”In other words, for Australian voters, it’s about the future, the future is always bleak, and governments won’t make a difference anyway.  This is unrealistic and reckless.  It’s unrealistic because for a generation now, the continuous expectation of gloom has been vindicated only once, with a mild downturn Australia experienced in the global financial crisis. It has been a false expectation.  And it’s unrealistic because the government is the critical element in good policy, and good policy is the critical element in economic outcomes.  It’s reckless because it is an invitation to politicians to discard good policy.  If the electorate will not reward good performance, why bother performing?  This low expectation creates a perverse incentive for politicians.  It’s much easier to deal in cheap populism than good policy, to run fear campaigns than reform agendas, to demonize the rival party than to propose better alternatives.  This is exactly the problem Australia has in 2011.  Yet active and prudent economic management is urgently required.  Not because the country lacks a boom, but because it has one.”

These paragraphs point to the paradox that good economic news does not spark optimism, but pessimism instead.

Similar paradoxes are described in Possum’s exposition on Crikey: What Australians believe,

blogs.crikey.com.au/.../

Here is Possum’s summary:

”What comes out from this broad snapshot is that what Australians believe about the role of government in our society and economy isn’t necessarily what our institutions believe or practice, and probably hasn’t been for a while. Our beliefs as a country are certainly far removed from many participants in the national debate that pretend to speak on behalf of our population and on behalf of our interests.

“Whatever the faults, foibles or otherwise of these national beliefs – and this isn’t an exercise in either support of, or opposition to them – our national debates on the role of government in our society and economy are becoming increasingly isolated from what the majority of the country actually believes.

“Our public debates assume that the benefits of privatisation have reached a conclusion – the public believes that privatisation was and is a catastrophe and that government should own a larger sector of the economy because we trust government more than large private sector corporations.

“Our public debates assume that smaller government and less regulation is universally beneficial – the public supports substantially higher levels of regulation on just about any topic you care to name and struggles to find something they’d like the government to become smaller in.

“Our public debates assume that economic reform has been such an obviously beneficial thing to ordinary Australians that it no longer needs explaining – the public believes that corporations took all benefits of that reform, leaving them with little more than a casualised workforce and reduced job security.

“If we keep having our national debates like this – excluding larger and larger sections of our population and ignoring what they believe – they won’t be national debates, we’ll just be talking among ourselves generating ever increasing quantities of public opprobrium, contempt and general unhinging. If you haven’t noticed – this is where we are at right now.”


We have to acknowledge that we are dealing with an electorate that holds paradoxical views.  These are exacerbated by the incessant flow of misinformation, scaremongering and downright deception that emanates daily from Tony Abbott and his frontbench, amplified by a complicit MSM.

Finally, Psyclaw, I hope you will see that this piece was to reveal some of the facts, figures and insights contained in Peter Hartcher’s well-written book, rather than an attempt to spruik it.  I am taken with how much of it is in accord with my own thinking, and not surprised that there are some assertions and conclusions with which I disagree.  In fact I’m astonished there are not more.

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June 17. 2012 04:10 PM

Pikiranku

Forgive me if I'm thick, but I just don't get that stuff about Julia Gillard leading Labor into "wholesale popularism".  I thought the three areas you mentioned - the carbon price, asylum seekers and the mining tax - were all examples of how Julia Gillard is sticking to her Labor guns in spite of popular opposition.  
It's even hard to accuse Abbott of total popularism when he clings to certain policies which do not have popular support - examples being his implacable opposition to the NBN which is supported by a considerable majority of Australians and his refusal to abandon his Rolls Royce PPL which generally seems to only have appeal to people who would have voted Liberal anyway.
I'd have thought that a far greater threat to our continued prosperity is the negativity which is being promulgated daily by the Tories with the assistance of the MSM. There's not only the much-discussed effect on consumer and business confidence, there's also the problem of uncertainty for business.  Abbott's promise to unwind the carbon price, for example, means that Australian businesses cannot put plans in place for their future under an ETS.  Businesses which would normally be planning years ahead are currently paralysed by the uncertainty which Abbott and the conservatives have created.  That's really damaging.  And Peter Hartcher can't blame Julia for that.
It was a very interesting post, though, AA, and one I'm still thinking about.  Thanks.

Pikiranku

June 17. 2012 04:17 PM

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TT
I didn’t see Meet the Press, but I’m glad you are pleased with Craig Emerson’s performance.  He has decided to get stuck in, and how he does.

42 long
There was a rather feeble attempt in the lead in to the story on Insiders about the Slipper/Ashby/Brough/Lewis/Pyne matter to paint Nicola Roxon as going beyond what was prudent, but the discussion defused that and in fact I thought defused also the ‘dirt file’ story, despite it being childishly embellished with vision of politicians ‘digging dirt’.  I do wonder sometimes how these visual ‘experts’ regard we viewers.  They must think we are stupid or have the mind of a three-year-old.

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June 17. 2012 04:22 PM

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Patriciawa
I agree – there was definitely some acknowledgment of Julia Gillard’s resilience.  Some in the media are beginning to show a sneaking regard for her.

I enjoyed your pome, especially the last stanza:

But did you hear that banker whose opinion was, 

After travelling with her on the China trip,

“She did sterling work as statesman!” So now, will Oz,

At last, commend her? Or will that be just another media blip?


I didn't see that comment from the banker - do you have a link?

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June 17. 2012 04:30 PM

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Pikiranku
Thank you for your encouraging remarks.

Psyclaw and I agree with you, as do many others here.  We feel Peter Hartcher has misunderstood the situation PM Gillard faced and still faces day after day, a need to accommodate other views to get things done.  His theme is that both leaders are not showing leadership, but opportunism.  Why he has this opinion is unclear.  So we can but disagree.  We have a different opinion.

Ad astra

June 17. 2012 05:26 PM

Patriciawa

AA,   I think it was in the Inside Business which followed that particular May 1st, 2011, Insiders we were discussing on TPS. Not sure.  I'll follow up later, but closing down computer now, family coming.  Important birthday tea!  TTFN!

Patriciawa

June 17. 2012 05:42 PM

Psyclaw



AA

Thanks for your effort in re-reading; it clears up my query.

Concerning the whinging aspect of Australians, this is a very interesting paradox. On the one hand the average punter doesn't understand the complexities as you mentioned earlier, and by the same token IMHO  they are generally unwilling /  disinterested in getting on top of the detail..... better things to do.

Nevertheless, uninformed as they are, they are quick to condemn that about which they know nothing. This can only be explained I think, because being too lazy to do their own research, they are only too happy to accept someone else's. And who steps into the void, loud, clear, "authoritative" ...... none other than the shock jocks and the tabloids. And regarding matters political, I think pretty well all the MSM press are tabloids.

And our press regulation is so poor that Jones can get away for months with reciting lies about climate change, and when formally found to have done so by ACMA, what is the consequence ......nothing! Can we expect him to fabricate again? Certainly. Is he frightened of ACMA? Not a chance in the wide world.

While on the matter of the MSM press,  I have observed a significant step in their retreat. On my 900Klm trip today I enjoyed a double shot long black at a golden arch facility and availed myself of the free Sunday Telegraph (News) and Sun Herald (Fairfax).

In neither paper was their any discussion at all of any aspect of current political issues. No articles about Slipper, Ashby, Jackson, Thomson, the court cases, the subpoenas, etc etc. It is as though these issues have fallen off the edge of the MSM world. Why is this so!

As I said, this may be part of the big retreat. Alternatively an epidemic of the very contagious subpoena anxiety may have broken out. The silence of the Opposition might indicate a similar plague in their ranks, and they have put themselves in an isolation ward for their own self preservation.

Although throughout my upbringing I have been taught to not wish ill on anyone, on this occasion I am prepared to sin. May they suffer long, seriously, and painfully.                                                                  

Psyclaw

June 17. 2012 06:36 PM

TalkTurkey

Abbortt refuses Environment Minister Tony Burke a Pair
so that he cannot attend the Rio summit on Tuesday - which I understand is the day Australia presents its . . . ? presentation.

Counter to Australia's and the world's interests.

It won't save any money. It won't save any carbon.

It is an act of pure mindless malicious bastardry.

Like the time he similarly refused Craig Thomson a pair to be present at the birth of his first child. Never forget that.

It was part of the persecution that could have driven a lesser man than Craig Thomson to suicide - however innocent he might be.
At the moment that is exactly 100% remember. Well Craig I believe you will be vindicated, at least 99% which would be plenty for me, while your accusers will be brought low. KJ's own mental health might be a problem for her then but that's nobody's fault but hers and her friends'.

Some things are beyond the ordinarily-forgivable. These two decisions of Abbortt's are in that category, one for its horrid inhumanity, one for its implications for his own nation's standing in the international community. I know he gets all the forgiveness he needs from Archbigot Pell weekly, but he will be suffering the torments of Hell well before he gets promoted to Purgatory. His Hell is already happening, but he ain't seen nothin' yet. LOSING!

These acts of bastardry are cumulative, some will strike some people's sense of outrage and others others iyswim, like Bernie Banton comments and Shit happens comments and Juliar comments, all in all he is being seen for what he is, a very nasty immature simplistic megalomanic punchdrunk combative irresponsible but most of all nasty fool of a man who must and will not ever take the reins of power in this country.

The mood on Twitter and Poll Bludger is like unto a lot of individual good Dogs on neighbouring farms, all trying their best to catch the bastard Fox that keeps killing the wildlife . . . and now they've got the scent, the Fox is on the run now, from foxhole to foxhole, the MSM won't ferret him out but WIXXY does! And now no matter where he goes now he's done for!

Gee Ad at long last there are heaps of people on our fave rave blogs and on Twitter who are beginning to Believe again, it's got me close to tears of right-on rage that so many such good people have to try so hard to keep these hoon hordes from seizing power.  Craig Emerson's performance this morning - (which you must see and will I know because someone here will certainly direct you to it even if I don't. Or if they don't I will.) - had me power-punching the air, I bet I was no orphan! Albo, Roxon, Emmo - All beginning their opening gambits in the Real War these last couple of days, the Abborttians are already reeling and foxholed but they ain't seen nothin' yet and they are starting to realize that! They are empty! Naked! Friendless! Failing day by day! No way home!

Even (in their dreams) if they won the next election - as if, now! -they'd be flummoxed anyway, they will never undo the price on carbon, never stop the NBN, never impose a Colossal Price Hike on FOOD and everything at present exempt - (just trumpet it as policy go on Liars I dare ya!) that will cost Average Families b]SIX TIMES [/b]as much as the 'CARBON TAX' and will hit those who can least afford it hardest.
Abbortt can't do any of that! He's done for!

Neither could Turdball do anything about it, nor anyone on their side as a new LOTO even if the Coalons made the change in time and the other-than-Abbortt-led mob could win - the Greens would certainly stop them ripping away the BENISONS conferred by our amazing Government, and every day the concrete sets more indissolubly . . .

"Oh we'll just have a double dissolution" they say. Pretty facile! They wouldn't win an absolute majority even then, (not before 2015 at the earliest) and we'd still be left with the BENISONS. They're stuffed. They think Labor would just roll over and let them undo all the good stuff, Oh OK it's a fair cop! I Don't Think So!

My dear old Dad was brought up near the foot of leg-shaped Yorke Peninsula, west of Adelaide. YP gets weather from several directions, we used to go there for huntinshootinfishin holidays as kids. Dad was so good at picking the nuances of weather change, it used to astonish me.
You'd say
Let's go fishing at Corny Point Dad,
He'd say
No we'd better go to Edithburgh instead, (on the other side of the Peninsula)
Why?
Well because of the way the wind's getting up
But there's only a few breaths from the North Dad
Yes but it will get around to the West in a couple of hours . . .
And yes he'd be right, if we'd gone to Corny Point we'd have been blown off the map.

Well let me tell yous-all, like my old Dad, *J*U*L*I*A has us metaphorically in safe harbour, having correctly anticipated the coming blow; the Abborttians are clustered down at exposed Corny Point still yelling and screaming, but it will all be in vain for them. They'll all be blown away except for a rump, I called the game weeks ago.

Game on. Summon up the blood!

Psyclaw the more I read of yours the more I value your opinions.





      



TalkTurkey

June 17. 2012 06:50 PM

Psyclaw


Comrade TT

Many thanks. I look forward to your posts as well ..... always great food for thought and most importantly, strong encouragement for us all to keep up the good fight.

Psyclaw

June 17. 2012 07:18 PM

42 long

  There doesn't seem to be a limit to Abbots nastiness.  Some people who have a claim to God. seem to be inately lacking in basic humanity, yet they would have you believe that atheists are the ones who are not capable of good behaviour.
   Let the tree be judged by the fruit it bears Mr Abbott. You are a traitor to your country as you continue to do it harm so that you may achieve your aim of being in power. You have shown yourself to be completely unworthy, and by gathering compliant people around you, have contaminated the party you lead ( for now)

42 long

June 17. 2012 07:32 PM

archiearchive

Tony Abbott is acting just like so many other failed dictators have in the past. Tearing down as much of the world as is possible as he goes under! From failing to allow a pair to destroying the Liberal Brand he is on a rampage and the sooner someone in the Lib ranks grows a pair and challenges, the better. Not only for the Liberal Party but also for the Nation! His failed machinations means <A href="archiearchive.wordpress.com/.../">he is now facing a perfect storm!</a>

archiearchive

June 17. 2012 07:34 PM

archiearchive

Bother - the link didn't work neatly  Frown

archiearchive

June 17. 2012 08:23 PM

DMW

Psyclaw @ 5:42 PM
On my 900Klm trip today ...

Phew, I make that about from Kingston to Smithton and return. That is one big day for a Taswegian Smile

DMW

June 17. 2012 08:47 PM

Ad astra

TT
Abbott is acting like the mean person he is in not granting a pair to a minister going to an international conference on behalf of the Government. I wonder what George Pell would say about a good Catholic doing that.  42 long and archiearchive feel as you do.

Yes, there are good signs that Labor ministers have decided that they have had enough crap from the media and are not going to take it any more.  Craig Emerson was great on Meet the Press and Albo was very good when he appeared on Sky News, I think it was.  The media will fight back, but I think the Government has them on the run.

I’m calling it a day.  Good night.

Ad astra

June 17. 2012 09:05 PM

42 long

  I'm being too easy on the party. They appointed him (although by one vote (which ironically included Slipper's).
   The party is still responsible, so why let them off. They sit there ar question time with the orchestrated "Shame ,shame.  calls of their Pathetic Pantomime.
  I speculate on the effect of the "wonder from the West" being around. That will put the cat amongst the pigeons. Heavens knows they need an infusion of talent.
Tony's "thefuture is the Past" has no respectability. Even if it was so good,  and it  WASN'T. Times and circumstances have changed markedly. Most of their policies will run foul of the United Nations, ( which they would probably ignore as "Babybush" did and provoke world condemnation, they would upset our nearest neighbours as they have on each occasion they have pronounced a policy which involves them or when they visit malaysia or indonesia.
   Union smash/bashing seems to be a trait which unites them. How many countries don't allow unions and what are those countries like to live in?. The right to collective representation is enshrined in UN law. The only real class war is of ABBOTS making. he would keep taxing people who have no capacity to pay. No surplus income, and let the excessively rich people who fund him have a free ride. We should be very cognisant of where the LNP get their money and who owns the papers and radio stations that make it hard for the labour message to get out. THe LNP can see no wrong in the fact that we have a suspect media monopoly in australia. Why should they? They are on a real good thing as things are .

42 long

June 17. 2012 09:39 PM

DMW

42 long @ 9:05 PM
I'm being too easy on the party. They appointed him (although by one vote (which ironically included Slipper's).

To be pedantic the one vote margin stretches things a bit.

It is true that he won the LotO hat against Turnbull on that fateful day (26 November 2009) by only one vote.

Since then there has been an election and two things make that 'one vote margin' irrelevant.

Traditionally the Libs declare all positions vacant after an election. Mr Abbott was elected leader unopposed after the 2010 election therefore he notionally had 100% endorsement for his position.

The make up of the party room (i.e. the electors for the position of leader) has changed a good number of the new faces would be indebted to Mr Abbott for his 'brilliant campaigning' during the election that helped them to unexpectedly win a seat in parliament and therefore may feel 'obliged' to vote for him should there be a spill.

DMW

June 17. 2012 10:37 PM

Psyclaw

DMW

Trip time 4.00am-4.00pm with a few stops. Fortunately SHMBO shares the driving task equally.
Cheers

Psyclaw

June 17. 2012 10:59 PM

Psyclaw

DMW

On 2 July 2010, the Government announced that from 1 July 2012, the PRRT would be extended to include all onshore and offshore oil and gas projects, including the North West Shelf, oil shale projects and coal seam gas projects.

I hope ToM can read the date of this. It is an example of legislation embraced by the electorate that he nominated. He said that JG who he was smearing at the time is incapable of successful reform.

This destroys ToM's criticism of JG by his own pen.

ToM

Still waiting ..... it's almost a week now and no example of reforms embraced by the electorate. Each day that passes without your "evidence" confirms what we mostly think about your posts here ..... you make the facts up as you go along.

Psyclaw

June 18. 2012 12:00 AM

DMW

Psyclaw,
12 hours pretty good with 'business' in between. The roads there have improved greatly since I trundled them week in week out.

It is intriguing that the PRRT attracts virtually no notice or opposition. Considering that it has more effect on our hip pockets than the MRRT it is actually outstanding.

DMW

June 18. 2012 12:06 AM

DMW

A change of subject

Abbott's evil policy work  Malcolm Fraser @NationalTimes
One thing Abbott is right about is that integrity needs to be restored - but not with the system, as he asserts. What is missing is integrity in the presentation of information and integrity in our politicians and their policies.
www.nationaltimes.com.au/.../...0120617-20hzs.html

DMW

June 18. 2012 12:07 AM

Psyclaw

DMW

Howard made amendments to PRRT on 5 separate occasions between 2001 and 2005 so the LOTO might be sensitive to the coalition's vulnerability.

Psyclaw

June 18. 2012 03:58 AM

TalkTurkey

Ad astra said
The media will fight back, but I think the Government has them on the run.

And don't they just hate it! They get a sort of look on their face as if the pre-existing sneer can't find its way out but instead gets bent out of shape like an offended Kenneth Williams of the penny-dreadful Carry On series saying Ewwwwww!

I lost one post trying to pull up a picture of him as Caesar doing just that, but now you'll have to find it yourself.

TalkTurkey

June 18. 2012 04:20 AM

TalkTurkey

Funny, just as I posted that last, ABC24 showed a clip of *J*U*L*I*A* with Wormtongue Jones making him that proposition to see him back there in 2013 with wtte Are they trying to get rid of you? and that was exactly the particular instance I had in mind! (though there are others already, and I expect there will be many more soon Smile ) He looked like he had been smacked hard on one side of his nose, I LOVE it! Because I despise him.

Breaking news, 3.30am CST,
Greece headed for second breathlessly-close election result.  
Left looks to be trailing slightly but the Right won't help the situation, they will make xenophobic policy and create terrible strife.

The cradle of democracy is looking increasingly like its coffin.

Socialists looking good in French Parliamentary elections though.

Can't say the times aren't interesting. Sigh.

TalkTurkey

June 18. 2012 04:23 AM

TalkTurkey

Why doesn't everyone call him Wormtongue anyway?

TalkTurkey

June 18. 2012 07:33 AM

Lyn


TODAY’S LINKS

The Latest BISONs - 16th June 2012, Glenn Stevens – The Finnigan’s
Reserve Bank boss Glenn Stevens tells grumpy Australians to enjoy the high dollar - AUSTRALIANS should learn to enjoy the high Aussie dollar, despite its impact on export industries like tourism and manufacturing,
http://thefinnigans.blogspot.com.au/

Shoe leather fetish, Andrew Elder, Politically Homeless
None of McKenzie-Murray's idealised journalists are doing a fraction of the work that Peter Wicks and his small team are doing. What's worse is that there is a kind of embarrassment on the part of the so-called professional journalists that there is more to the story than they had managed to uncover.
andrewelder.blogspot.com.au/.../...her-fetish.html

The Mainstream Media have Jumped the Shark, Victoria Rollinson
I now read Independent Australia on a daily basis and I also enjoy the amalgamation of quality blogs on The Political Sword. The Conversation is a great place to find critical analysis of topics from politics, to education, to environment, all provided by Australian academics. It has even got to a point where these blogs aren’t just commenting on news that is reported in mainstream media, but are also publishing exclusives
.victoriarollison.com/.../

Barry O’Farrell’s broken promises and budget blowouts, Independent Australia
That’s right, Barry’s promised surplus has turned into a whopping big deficit — and it seems that no matter what the Coalition sell off, and how many people they sack, they are still unable to balance the books.Barry’s broken promises are such legend now in NSW it has been hard to keep up with them all; however, here is a link to 100 of them after Barry’s first year in the Premiers role.
www.independentaustralia.net/.../

You say you’re not happy with media in this country – then WE can do something, Turn Left 2013
If we are going to lose all hope that the media can ever be more than just a Liberal Party propaganda tool, then we need to act… if we are going down, might as well go down fighting
turnleft2013.wordpress.com/.../

The Other Side, Wixxy, Wixxy Leaks
Sarah Wiley of channel 7, who is a pleasure to deal with, despite having a badly bunged up foot. Simon Benson of The Telegraph in Sydney, for keeping an open mind and following the trail of evidence. I particularly wanted to also mention Kevin Wilde of channel 9, whose enthusiasm, drive, and professionalism is unsurpassed, a dedicated journo, and a great bloke to boot.
wixxy.wordpress.com/2012/06/16/the-other-side-2/

Is There a Perfect Storm Ahead For Tony Abbott-, Archie, Archie Archives
Perfect Storm may be about to explode about Tony Abbott’s leadership and, in fact, about the popular support for the Liberal/Nats Coalition. Australians do not like failure and if Abbott comes to be seen as a failure, suddenly, political sentiment will swing to Labour.
archiearchive.wordpress.com/.../

A Mans Man or Scurrying Rodent?, Wayne Brooks, Curiosity and Challenge
To be subjected continually to your endless litany of three word tag lines and misdirection is bad enough, yet to be forced to suffer your deliberate never ending assault on our Parliament via attempts at suspending standing orders is almost sickening
wrb330.wordpress.com/.../

ABC’s ‘dirt unit’ is just another dog bites man story, ABC has gone to Hell
ABC News online articles you get the impression that this practice isn’t a common occurrence at all and that the Gillard Government is an immoral go-it-alone rogue. The sloppy journalism provides you with no sense of history (ie. perspective) on this unfortunately prevalent behaviour.
www.abcgonetohell.net/.../abcs-dirt-unit-is-just-another-dog-bites-man-story

Roxon’s Ashy v Slipper intervention: improper, unwise or what? Ken Parish, Club Troppo
The lawyers have told the court they have phone records to support their argument of a calculated political campaign against Mr Slipper.They allege Mr Ashby gave information to former Howard minister Mal Brough and to News Limited journalist Steve Lewis.Federal Attorney-General Nicola Roxon says it shows the case against Mr Slipper was politically motivated.
clubtroppo.com.au/.../

Truth, opinion and Australian journalism, Dragonistas blog
I find it troubling that at least two highly esteemed and principled journalists can’t/won’t see the importance of separating analysis from opinion. The standard for objectivity is not that complex – if I can determine from a piece what the writer thinks about the subject then it’s opinion, not analysis. They are not inter-changeable.
dragonistasblog.com/.../

Here to Help, Therese Trouserzoff, Window Dressers Arms , Pig and Whistle
Quite a few patrons at the Pig’s Arms complain about the ABC’s “The Drum” closing off comments so quickly after an article has been posted, that they cannot get a comment in
http://pigsarms.com.au/2012/06/17/here-to-help/

Slipper: who’s the rat, Miglo, Café Whispers
Mal Brough who wants pre-selection for Slipper’s seat of course remains the shining little angel on top of the Christmas tree. Brough was voted out, perhaps his electorate know more about him than meets the eye.
cafewhispers.wordpress.com/.../

The Innocence Of Craig Thomson (48): The Political Shakedown, Perused In Tranquillity, Bob Ellis
That high ground, once lost, is hard to reconquer, and cannot now be regained by Tony Abbott, who is rightly regarded by most people as a busted flush and a bruised and crumbling bully. He is highly intelligent, and philosophically acute, but fatally impatient, and did not understand that his true opponent was something more than Gillard’s
www.ellistabletalk.com/.../

Joe Hockey and the Broadband Network of Doom, Sortius is a Greek
I’ve not come across more misleading comments about both 4G & NBN deployments than Joe has come up with during his ABC 936 interview. It only makes Joe Hockey look an tit, and degrades the debate to a point where now there are people who incorrectly think you can compare 4G & fibre optics
http://sortius.is-a-geek.com/?p=40

Rubbery electricity price rise claims from the NSW Government in June 2012, Clarence Girl, North Coast Voices
should be noted that, because power supply infrastructure is not fully privatised in New South Wales, a significant proportion of the full retail and business price rise is directly attributable to the management style of the O'Farrell Coalition Government.
northcoastvoices.blogspot.com.au/.../...laims.html

2012 Parliamentary sittings
The Parliament's sitting calendar amended on 14 March 2012.
www.aph.gov.au/About_Parliament/Sitting_Calendar

Remember the census- It's about to change, big-time,
Peter Martin The savings will amount to $100 million of the $454 million it costs to run each census. Initially they will all be used to beef up the technology. By 2021 the survey will be barely recognisable. Individually-tailored questions will be added to the core questions asked for 100 years.
http://www.petermartin.com.au/

How GST has sprung a leak, Ross Gittins
When John Howard introduced the GST in July 2000, he neutralised opposition from the premiers by promising them all the proceeds from the tax in place of the feds' former general revenue grants. So GST is a federally controlled and collected tax that benefits only the states.
www.rossgittins.com/.../...st-has-sprung-leak.html

TODAY’S FRONT PAGES
Australia Newspaper Front Pages for 18 June 2012
www.frontpagestoday.co.uk/index.cfm

Lyn

June 18. 2012 07:38 AM

2353

It seems that the Greek election result will sooth the furrowed brows of the financial markets for a while.  I suspect there will be another "crisis" sooner rather than later but may hay while the sun shines. . .

TT @ 04:23 - Suffice to say I have stated here before why I don't call anyone anything but their name - and I will continue to hold that position.

2353

June 18. 2012 07:42 AM

Lyn

Good Morning Ad

Thankyou very much for another in depth thoughtful article, your work as always is the highest of high quality.  We do value your work and effort millions Ad Astra.

Make sure you read Victoria Rollinson in Today's Links. Victoria compliments The Political Sword, thankyou Victoria.

The Mainstream Media have Jumped the Shark, Victoria Rollinson
victoriarollison.com/.../

SmileSmileSmileSmile

Lyn

June 18. 2012 07:44 AM

Psyclaw


Michelle Grattan just stated on RN that "the government is alleging that somehow Mal Brough is involved in the Ashby matter".

What slimey, smearing,toneenj still purposely chosen wording from this over-the-hill hack.

Psyclaw

June 18. 2012 07:49 AM

Psyclaw

TT, Comrade

What is the derivation of Wormtongue?

Does it contain enough "despicability"?

Does it sufficiently describe him as the dishonest, ideologue driven pug that he is and reflect that he is from the very bottom of the barrel?

Psyclaw

June 18. 2012 08:46 AM

42 long

Go one better and use "trenchmouth"  A re run of Crassidy's "OFF" siders.. They must use the same notes. The use of Grattan by the ABC is too taken for granted. She is adept at getting the message that is required across, and the "slant" she uses/implies illegitimacy when she wants it to. She's had plenty of practice. It's time some younger person with more passion for integrity replaced her. It's not her age but the exposure to the corruption of thought, and superficial "smartness" that surrounds the Canberra press gallery.
   Lazy journo's refer to the stuff they have already gathered and it has to "fit". You "never" or "hardly ever", have a re-visit. Errors are never corrected or only reluctantly admitted when FORCED and the retraction is pages on in small print when the original incorrect version was FRONT page.
   Balanced reportage  by the mainstream media? So rare, and almost a distant memory only.

42 long

June 18. 2012 08:55 AM

jaycee

The difficulty with swinging the electorate back to the left is a lack of political education and savvyness to see through the Liberals lies. If one was to reflect upon the patterns of political and social disasters down through history, it will become apparent and supremely ironic to observe that as "we" become better educated and informed, the mistakes become more ridiculous and stupid!
Taking that magnum opus of Edward Gibbon ; "...Decline and Fall..." one can trace such social and political disasters over a time-line of fifteen hundred years of one continous system and the behaviours of players within that system would sometimes make you wince and bring tears to the eyes! Unfortunately, with the voting public of this nation receiving most if not (in some cases)all its' information from a cowering or cosy media, the right-wing seems to hold most of the cards. Labor has to "take on" this cabal of distorting culprits if it is to get a fair run in the next election.
It has to implement the Finkelston(?) findings or bust!

jaycee

June 18. 2012 09:01 AM

Ad astra

LYN'S DAILY LINKS updated: www.thepoliticalsword.com/.../...-DAILY-LINKS.aspx

Ad astra

June 18. 2012 09:14 AM

janice

Good morning Swordians.
My apologies for my lack of posts but rest assured I'm still faithfully reading Ad astra's wonderful pieces and the insightful comments that follow.  At the moment I'm having some difficulty with my eyesight which I hope is only because I need my specs upgraded - have to wait until July 3rd which was the first appt I could get.   Anyway to make matters worse, my specs fell apart the other day because a couple of those minute screws fell out so I've had to resort to using my old ones until I can get into the Optometrist to have them put back together.

Ad astra, I haven't read Peter Hartcher's book - in fact I haven't bothered to even read much of his stuff since 2009 when I concluded that he appeared to succumbing to group think.  IMO he went completely feral when Rudd lost the confidence of his caucus and Julia Gillard replaced him.  It seems to cause him much pain to give the PM the credit she deserves for delivering stable government to this country in the face of the huge difficulty in presiding over a hung parliament that requires negotiation with the Greens and cross benches to deliver the best outcomes for this nation.

Hartcher is just one more narrow minded journalist who cannot see beyond the era of the past when the 4th estate reigned supreme and the general public were left to read between the lines to sort out the information from the propaganda.  For some unfathomable reason, the media did not see the change coming and are now left scrambling to find a way to retain some relevance.  It must be dawning on them now that their attempts to stop the roll out of the NBN is fruitless and their days as kingmakers is fast coming to an end.

Again, it is only my opinion, but I believe this minority government lead by PM Gillard is the best thing that could have happened to this country.  PM Gillard's strength and determination, her willingness and ability to negotiate for the best possible outcomes and her refusal to "lay down and die" in the face of all the dirty tricks, scuttlebutt and scaremongering is leadership of which we can all be proud.  Therefore, I object strongly when she, and her party, are tarred with the same brush of those who would stifle and retard the progress of this nation as it moves into the future with confidence.  

janice

June 18. 2012 09:23 AM

TalkTurkey

Psyclaw @ 7.49 AM asks


TT, Comrade

What is the derivation of Wormtongue?

Does it contain enough "despicability"?

Does it sufficiently describe him as the dishonest, ideologue driven pug that he is and reflect that he is from the very bottom of the barrel?

Gríma Wormtongue

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Gríma
Tolkien's legendarium character

Aliases
Wormtongue, Worm

Race
Men

Book(s)
The Two Towers (1954)
The Return of the King (1955)
Unfinished Tales (1980)

Middle-earth portal

Gríma, called (the) Wormtongue, is a fictional character in J. R. R. Tolkien's The Lord of the Rings. He appears in the second and third volumes of the work, The Two Towers and The Return of the King, and his role is expanded upon in Unfinished Tales. He is introduced in The Two Towers as the chief advisor to King Théoden of Rohan and henchman of Saruman. Gríma serves as an archetypal sycophant, flatterer, liar, and manipulator.

The name Gríma derives from the Old English or Icelandic word meaning "mask", "helmet" or "spectre".[1][2] It is also possible to link the name to the English word "grim", which among other characteristics means "ugly"[3] in Old English.

Does that sound despicable (and apt) enough? He is a really horrible character.

42 long, there's many Trenchmouths in the Abborttians but only one Wormtongue!

2353, follow your heart by all means. But if I can do anything to help to bring Wormy low I will. He is attempting to bring down our Government using OUR ABC as his soapbox!  

TalkTurkey

June 18. 2012 09:29 AM

TalkTurkey

42 long
Same as what I said to Psyclaw @ 6.36 pm on June 17.
Thanks and do please keep posting here.  

TalkTurkey

June 18. 2012 09:56 AM

Psyclaw

TT, Comrade

I'll meet you half way.

From now on I will refer to the jerk as Wormtongue, but at times I'll have to add a further descriptor eg "Wormtongue the pug" or "Wormtongue the hypocrite" etc as the particular context demands.

As I develop this practice I will not take offence if you have to gently remind me that I have forgotten to use the jerk's proper title, Wormtongue

Psyclaw

June 18. 2012 10:00 AM

Lyn

Hi Ad and Everybody

Twitterverse is a bit early this morning.  The Chemist has instructed me to go immediately to the Doctor, because of my scalded hand.  This morning all the little blisters have turned into one big blister overnight.  Not paining though one good thing.

John Pratt‏@Jackthelad1947
Burke's pair request vetoed. Rabbotts team put party politics before the country. #auspolhttp://www.theage.com.au/opinion/-20ibc.html

Latika Bourke ‏@latikambourke
Good on Gina for investing in journalism, says Oppn Leader Tony Abbott http://www.theage.com.au/opinion/-20id9.html

Damon Young‏@damonayoung
My thoughts on Rinehart and redistributive taxes (Canberra Times): http://j.mp/LZsp3a

Tom Cowie‏@tom_cowie
Huge story RT @abcmarkscott: SMH and Age to go tabloid. Metered paywalls. Printing plants to close. 1900 jobs to go http://bit.ly/MzSEfV

Stephen C‏@2FBS
Paywall for Fairfax ... oh well... Just have to get my news from the other 367,844 free news sites.

Why the Coalition is on a winner - it's all about individual pain, Phillip Coorey,
www.smh.com.au/.../...ual-pain-20120617-20i3v.html

The Daily Telegraph‏@dailytelegraph
Qld ditches welfare stick in favour of carrot http://bit.ly/MjbRkg

wontletyoufly‏@wontletyoufly
Abbott's evil policy work www.theage.com.au/.../...-work-20120617-20hzs.html via @theage

vexnews‏@vexnews
Female power-brokers are the great untold story in Liberal preselections, as this weekend's events confirm #auspol http://vexne.ws/girlpower

John Pratt‏@Jackthelad1947
Anger grows on health spend cuts. Libs always cut back on health. http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/-20ibh.html

sansBS‏@OzFacts
“@latikambourke:bloggers go gaga over PM: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/-20id2.html” Now the question is Blogger VS Journalists,who has more credibility? #auspol

vexnews‏@vexnews
Labor consulted Richard Torbay on wooing Tony Windsor to retain government in 2010 #auspol http://bit.ly/L6PWRB

Lyn

June 18. 2012 10:32 AM

TalkTurkey

Lyn
This is for your poor scalded hand
KissKissKissKissKissKissKiss

TalkTurkey

June 18. 2012 11:15 AM

42 long

Tony abbott in, "good on Gina  for ( insert anything she might do here, in this case buying into fair faux)  goes on to say. "Diverse and sophisticated journalism we have had for a long time"?. There is no end to the sycophantic utterences to his benefactors. Where is the diversity in journalism in this country.
I was personally told years ago when I asked journo's to print the truth. "There are only 2 kinds of Journo's in australia. Those who work for Rupert Murdoch and those who are GOING TO".
    This means we have to say what Rupert wants us to say or we don't work here. Nothings changed YET. but soon?

42 long

June 18. 2012 12:02 PM

Ad astra

Hi Lyn
First, we hope your scalded hand soon settles.  It’s good that the pain has diminished.  TT’s emoticons reflect our feelings.

Thank you for your complimentary remarks about this piece.  Despite its intensity, I enjoyed preparing it because it is mainly a good news story.

Your links and Twitterverse are interesting as always.  The article by Phil Coorey was relevant to this piece in that he asserts that people are more sensitive to sad stories of hardship than to good stories about the economy. I guess that is because the former is personal and easy to identify with, while the latter is impersonal and remote.  This makes it easier for the Abbott of Doom and Gloom to have messages hit their mark than it is for Julia of Good News.

Ad astra

June 18. 2012 12:09 PM

Psyclaw


Lyn

So sorry to hear about your hand. Hope you've got the pain controlled ..... burns pain is not good. Thanks again for all the great reading you've given us today.



Swordsters

From 1 July we all have a new task. Here is the form:

www.accc.gov.au/.../index.phtml

I have put a dozen copies in my car and intend writing the business's name in the relevant section and showing the manager whenever I see carbon price gouging so he/she doesn't get the idea I'm bluffing.

I'm pretty sure the fine is $6K for individuals and $60K for companies. I'll tell 'em that too.

In this matter we should take no prisoners!

Psyclaw

June 18. 2012 01:06 PM

42 long

  Looked at the form. How Nice. If you lie you are going to be looked at. this should encourage reality.
   With electricity generation, the price to the grid (input from the power station) is about 2.5 (two and a half Cents) per Kilowatt Hour.  This is the ONLY amount that is affected by the Carbon tax.
It retails at about 23 cents per Kw/hr, transmission and connection and your retailer are respnsible for the rest, say 20 cents . There's still plenty of lies being put about by liars, cause that's what they do. Hope they get called to brook.
  Listened briefly to 2 GB last night  You can ALL relax the earth is NOT WARMING
  Get this
It's just a media beat-up!!. Tim Flannery is WRONG just like he was about Lindy Chamberlain 30 years ago, by taking heed of the media.
I couldn't believe the argument put forward. Where are all the media saying there is global warming Caused by human activity, in Australia? ( or have I missed something?)

42 long

June 18. 2012 01:12 PM

Ad astra

janice
It’s good to see you back despite the problems with your spectacles.

Thank you for your complimentary remarks.  I share some of your reservations about Peter Hartcher’s writings so let me tell you how this piece came about.

I went to Dymocks looking for George Megalogenis’ latest book, and on the same shelf saw Hartcher’s The Sweet Spot, one I had heard about.  The blurb on the back cover gave me good vibes.  I browsed a few pages and there on page two I was encouraged to read: ”Australia today is closer than it has ever been to fulfilling its promise of a golden land, even the most golden of all lands.”.  It seemed like the book might take a positive stance towards our country.  I browsed a few more chapters and found further interesting paragraphs.  It seemed as if Hartcher had set out to talk up the many positives about Australia, such a contrast to the doom and gloom that we hear every day from Tony Abbott, his bunch of malcontents and his media sycophants.  

So I bought it, and as I started reading it, found it difficult to put down.  Hartcher uses a mass of reliable facts and figures to come to well-reasoned conclusions, information which I shall re-use as a valuable resource.  Indeed it was not until I came to the chapter How to blow it and read his derogatory comments about our PM that I experienced dissonance.  Like Psyclaw and others, I disagree with his view of PM Gillard, whom he regards as opportunistic, lacking in leadership qualities, and preoccupied with power, lumping her in with the grossly opportunistic, power hungry Tony Abbott, for whom he also has little respect.  He made no allowance for the extreme difficulties she has had to overcome every day managing a minority government, nor did he give her credit for her accomplishments with over 300 bills passed so far.  He castigated her for her management of the carbon and minerals tax and the asylum seeker issue, and he still seems angry about the manner of her ascension to Prime Ministership.  This is a consistent Hartcher theme.  He sees the current party leadership as inadequate, if not hopeless, and this is why he feels that the wonderful position Australia now enjoys runs the risk of being ‘blown’ through lack of good leadership.

Once journalists form an opinion, it is difficult for them to abandon it, like the rest of us.  Hartcher’s opinion about Julia Gillard and Tony Abbott goes back a way.  On 23 March 2011, fifteen months ago, I wrote a piece: Hartcherism – a new descriptor for political gymnastics www.thepoliticalsword.com/.../Hartcherism-–-a-new-descriptor-for-political-gymnastics.aspx  It was a critique of a piece he wrote on 19 March titled: Labor’s end – that’s all folks.  You may care to re-read it.  There he says virtually the same as in his book: that both Julia Gillard and Tony Abbott do not cut the mustard as leaders.  In fact he painted our PM as finished, with her party headed for oblivion.  Having just now re-read that piece, I suspect that Hartcher’s views then carried through into his book.  I roundly criticized the views he expressed then, as I do now.

So in summary janice, I found his book well written and informative and will return to the factual evidence he uses in it.  I was disappointed when I got to page 237 to read his anti-Gillard tirade, which I must say was somewhat less intense than the invective he used against Abbott.  It would be uncommon to read a book with which one could agree in its entirety.  This one got close, but left me in strong disagreement near the end.

Ad astra

June 18. 2012 01:19 PM

Ad astra

janice
I can't get the link to Hartcherism - a new descriptor for political gymnastics. to work but if you copy the whole URL below into your address line, it should work:

www.thepoliticalsword.com/.../Hartcherism-–-a-new-descriptor-for-political-gymnastics.aspx

Ad astra

June 18. 2012 02:04 PM

2353

Courtesy of ABC - the name of the "senior" LNP member who may be getting involved in the Ashby/Slipper thing.

www.abc.net.au/.../4076846?section=qld

2353

June 18. 2012 02:51 PM

janice

Ad astra,
Thank you - I accessed your HARTCHERISM piece by going to the archives.   Because of your critique of Hartcher's column I do remember reading the tripe he wrote in it and I don't think I could stomach reading his book, however well written it may be Smile   I guess it sticks in Hartcher's craw that the PM is still standing and strongly governing successfully despite his predictions to the contrary.  If he could admit to himself that his judgement of the character and motivations of the PM were wrong, that her government is legitimate and made up of elected representatives of the Australian people, that she herself, was legitimately elected by her party to lead, then he just might get over his bias and dummy spit he's been carrying since Rudd was removed when he lost the confidence of his caucus.

When Hartcher and his ilk have the gall to tar the PM and Labor with the same brush as the incompetent dill brains that inhabit the coalition, it is to insult the intelligence of the people out here in voterland who care about this country and its inhabitants.  

And, I must say I think that if there were a few dozen journalists in the media with just half the logic, brainpower, compassion and judgement that you possess Ad astra, then the people in this country would be better informed and would not be so easily conned by the bigots and self-serving hypocrits we see making a grab for power at this time in our history.  

janice

June 18. 2012 03:27 PM

Psyclaw


An Apology

The ACCC fines to which I referred @ 12.09pm are not accurate.

In QT this arvo, the fine was mentioned by Mr Combet. It is up to $1.1 million for carbon price gouging.

Mr Combet also gave the new hotline phone number to the ACCC to report carbon price gauging. The number is 1300 303 609.

For assessing whether you have seen/ experienced gouging, any increase above 0.7%  attributed to the carbon price is an example of a business trying to cash in on the carbon price.

I will be generous and use a figure of 1%. So a $4 meat pie should cost $4.04 cents after 1 July.


Slipper Matter

Thank you for the link 2353.

It seems Minister McArdle (Qld LNP I presume) is also one to use a version of Wormtongue Wrecker's  "I have no specific knowledge"s strategy.

McArdle says: "If this is to be litigated in a court before an independent person and that person can make a determination as to what is fact and fiction, I'm not going to throw issues up in the air or make comments in regard to this matter,"

I think "I'm not going to throw issues up in the air" is LNP speak for "I have no specific knowledge"

Psyclaw

June 18. 2012 03:54 PM

TalkTurkey

Psyclaw

You do know that Wormtongue is my name for Tony Jones - not Tony Abbortt - don't you?

"I have no specific knowledge" was of course Abbortt's line.

Abbortt is not actually clever enough to be a wormtongue.

But our *J*U*L*I*A* is an early bird eh!
Watch your tongue Wormtongue.
She'll peck you every time you try a gotcha from now on.
Biased creep.  

TalkTurkey

June 18. 2012 04:14 PM

Michael

Doesn't it sum up the despicable depths that Shouldabeen's cohorts will sink to, Captain Abbott standing on their shoulders, that Coalition asylum seeker policy refers to a 'section' of the Migration Act that Malcolm Fraser has pointed out doesn't even exist. (See Abbott's Evil Policy Work above for the National Times link.)

The Coalition are erecting 'fair dinkum' policy on complete fabrications.

And you are surprised why?

Of course, the duds in the Coalition might simply have got their numbers mixed up.

But if that doesn't worry you about how they'll oversee the Australian economy, then I ask you, what's the greater threat to this country from them - slipshod research that leads to political fabrication, or incompetent digit recognition that delivers economic innumeracy?

Either way...

Michael

June 18. 2012 04:30 PM

Ad astra

janice
Thank you for your kind remarks.  I believe you are right – having made a very adverse judgement about Julia Gillard over a year ago, and having stuck his neck out by predicting that Julia Gillard is finished and taking her party to oblivion, he is not going to retreat from that, even as the polls improve.  He would be hoping for a continuation of poor Labor polling, as this would reinforce his steadfastly held views.  When the polls reverse, would he issue a mea culpa, or stick doggedly to his position?  As you say, her success in getting so many pieces of legislation through, many of them significant reforms, must stick in his craw.  Journalists hate to be wrong, and even more hate to be shown to be wrong, so we should not hold our breath for a change of heart.

Today’s news at Fairfax must be unnerving for its journalists.  Even the experienced must be wondering how secure their position is.  Some of them might now be wondering what they need to write, or not write, to curry favour with Gina Rinehart, who, with her current almost 19% holding, now wants two places on the board of Fairfax and influence over editorial policy.   I note that Malcolm Turnbull has already come out condemning such a move, as, in his words, Fairfax would become a mouthpiece for the mining industry.  I bet that statement will not go down well with Tony Abbott, who applauds Gina’s involvement!

Ad astra

June 18. 2012 04:41 PM

Psyclaw



Comrade TT

No. My mistake. I'll have to pay attention better.

Psyclaw

June 18. 2012 04:44 PM

Ad astra

Michael
Referring to the Opposition, you ask, in view of their fabrications about asylum seeker policy, ”…how they'll oversee the Australian economy”.  On their current form, the answer would be ‘horribly’, but that is not how the people see it, at least those polled by Essential Research.  In all but one of the fifteen parameters measured, the Liberals were judged by them to be more competent than Labor (twice as competent in the treatment of asylum seekers).  Take a look, but be warned, it is disheartening reading that defies logical explanation.  It seems that at least these respondents are harboring a number of myths that won’t die, despite the abundant evidence to the contrary.

essentialvision.com.au/category/essentialreport

Ad astra

June 18. 2012 04:57 PM

Lyn


Hi Ad and Everybody

Twitterverse for you, Question time and some other information:-

Julia Gillard is more than Just our  PM
At our morning tea yesterday I saw Julia as a person for the first time rather than just a politician. Yesterday I met a genuine, empathic person who was keen to listen to the voice of my blogging community, and to my thoughts too.
www.mymummydaze.com/.../...e-than-just-our-pm.html

ABC Q&A‏@QandA
Joining #QandA tonight: Lenny Henry, @PruGoward, Brian Schmidt (@CosmicPinot), Susan Ryan and @Joe_Hildebrand. 9.35 ABC 1 & #ABCNews24

ABC News 24‏@ABCNews24
Tonight on #TheDrum: What do you think the #Fairfax restructure means for the future of journalism in Australia? Best tweets on air 6pm AEST

Possum Comitatus‏@Pollytics
Essential Report results are pretty funny, especially the trust and community interests issues http://bit.ly/LUqLyo (pdf)

ABC NewsRadio‏@ABC_NewsRadio
Monday's House of Representatives Question Time is available for download. http://bit.ly/ParliPodcasts #qt

Cameron Burge‏@CameronBurge
Having insisted @Tony_Burke stay for #qt and miss a UN conference, has the LNP asked him a question on Marine Parks or indeed anything else?

Mr Jitters‏@Jitterry
How many questions were asked by the #lnp to @Tony_Burke today

Tony Burke‏@Tony_Burke
@Jitterry none until I stood up and said how ridiculous it was they weren't raising it. After that came 2 qs from backbenchers.

MisdaMagoo‏@MisdaMagoo
Yes where are all those oh-so important environment questions for @TonyBurke that just had to be asked????? #qt#auspol

auspoltragic‏@auspoltragic
Argument that Burke should stay behind to face Question Time would carry more weight if the Opposition used #qt for questions, not theatre

Jill Hall‏@JillHallMP
Member for Dawson the opponent of sustainability who lacks understanding of fishing industry has left the chamber #q

Olivia Illyria‏@OliviaIllyria
Member for Dawson 94a'd

TheFinnigans天地有道人无道‏@Thefinnigans
@CraigEmersonMP Emmo, you are on fire at #qt

Justin Barbour‏@justinbarbour
Pyne upset that Swan referred to Abbott's stament as a lie - Speaker orders Swan to withdraw. #qt

archiearchive‏@archiearchive
Was the Opposition's lack-lustre performance in #qt today due to an imminent #libspill ? #auspol

An imaginary dog‏@EnoTheWonderdog
I wonder if @TonyAbbottMHR is regretting not letting @TonyBurke go to Rio after that spray. Once again the slopposition look stupid

Olivia Illyria‏@OliviaIllyria
@AlboMP is slamming O'Farrell over failing to provide funding for the Pacific Hwy. #qt

Turn Left-gate‏@turnleft2013
Gillard's fight with the media barons; Word is that media policy is coming up for cabinet consideration soonwww.smh.com.au/.../...a-barons-20120610-2041c.html

Not Rupert Murdoch‏@RupertMurdochPR
Between #Fairfax and #NewsLtd, Australian media job cuts will total more than 2700. Astounding.

Government trying to bully Slipper accuser: Abbott, ABC
Opposition Leader Tony Abbott has accused Government ministers of trying to "bully" James Ashby into withdrawing his sexual harassment case against Speaker Peter Slipper

This idea that the [case] is some kind of a Liberal Party stitch-up is completely false," Mr Abbott said."It's absolutely, completely and utterly false
www.abc.net.au/.../4076902

DBCDE‏@DBCDEgov
In the news, cloud computing has saved US agencies about $100 million http://bit.ly/LZWX4K

Possum Comitatus‏@Pollytics
Imagine if someone asked in 1974 what the economic impact of something would be in 2012 in Parli #qt 2050 eh - break out the goat entrails

UT Media‏@QUTmedia
Lack of investment in Oz #newspapers may make Rinehart's #Fairfax bid irresistible says #QUT #media's @flew www.sbs.com.au/.../Rineharts-Fairfax-bid-irresistible

The West Australian‏@thewest_com_au
MPs to delay gay marriage vote. http://yhoo.it/MIdSVC

Lyn

June 18. 2012 05:16 PM

Lyn

Hi Talk Turkey

Thankyou for sending me some sunshiney kisses because I have a very sore hand. You cheered me up a lot.

Thankyou Ad for your kind wishes.

Pysclaw thankyou for your nice wishes and caring thoughts.

The Doctor has bandaged my whole hand but my fingers are free after the knuckle. Dr said don't get wet be very careful of infection the whole top of my hand is one big blister.  There is no pain now so I am not complaining at all.

I have never had a scald or burn before and you are right Pysclaw the pain was excruciating.

You would have seen in the Twitterverse where Abbott has accused the Government of bullying James Ashby, stupidification

one tweet below:

Dafid‏
AlboMP @CraigEmersonMP@TonyAbbott who's bullied Craig Thompson within an inch of his life accuses Gov of bullying James Ashby.. Mans Mad

SmileSmile

Lyn

June 18. 2012 05:31 PM

Ad astra

Hi Lyn
Thanks for the Twitterati.

I see a lot are about QT, where the Opposition was pathetic.

Ad astra

June 18. 2012 06:36 PM

42 long

  What's Gina really going to do for Fairfax? Buying shares doesn't put any capital into the running of the business.
  The direction she will try (and probably succeed ) in taking it won't do it's reputation  for independence) any good.
   Is she buying it for the future of the paper or her own ends?
  Turnbull has summed that one up, (and he would have a fair idea)
   If she divests herself of it, it will DIVE in value.
   Explain REALLY how she is doing a good thing to invest in the media Tony. You must think we are all pretty dumb.

42 long

June 18. 2012 07:03 PM

TalkTurkey

Psyclaw
Abbortt is my name for Abbortt. No humour at all. Just Turkey venom.

But don't you think Wormtongue is perfect for Wormtongue Jones?



TalkTurkey

June 18. 2012 07:29 PM

Psyclaw

lYn

Glad to hear your not in pain at the moment.

Thanks for more links/tweets.

I like Dafid's everyday language description of Abbott the pug ......"Man's mad"

Psyclaw

June 18. 2012 07:36 PM

42 long

  He has other names out there. Aren't you being a bit hard on worms?
  Seriously though, I don't want to go too far down the name-calling thing but some of them are appropriate, and clever. Tony does use terms like "Rotten" prime minister but he IS known to exaggerate isn't he? and he is definately not a "nice" person, and he says things you can't possibly believe, sometimes?/ most times/ all the time?

42 long

June 18. 2012 08:30 PM

2353

Psyclaw - not only is the "man mad" - he's broke!  

In our mail tonight was a personally addressed letter from Abbott asking for donations to the Liberal Party (interestingly enough not the LNP in Brisvegas) to help him fight the Carbon Tax.  It included a card for the suitable response (including suggested donation amounts).  I decided a suitable response (which isn't fit for publication on this blog) - wrote it on the card and then used the supplied pre-paid envelope to return the card to its sender.

I suspect "outing" myself by reporting this won't matter - I wouldn't be the only person in Australia who sends the card back without a cheque attached or credit card number on it!

2353

June 18. 2012 08:39 PM

2353

Sorry Lyn forgot to ad to the last comment - For Pete's sake Lyn, take care - where would we be without Tweety?

Hope the hand improves rapidly and the pain either isn't too bad (or the pain relief is good) Laughing

2353

June 18. 2012 09:20 PM

Jason

2353,
    I feel unworthy now! my household is yet to get a card from Abbott or anyone else in the Liberal party asking for money!
I feel discriminated against now, perhaps I should see Ashby's lawyers!

Jason

June 18. 2012 10:19 PM

Psyclaw

2353

All I'd give him is my worst wishes.

Best wishes to you.

Psyclaw

June 18. 2012 11:14 PM

Russell in Glendale

Have just watched Emma Elberici interview Julia Gilard. Can somebody please tell Chris Uhlmann this is how an interview is to be done. Interesting, well prepared, some awkward questions but well conducted with good pace where full answers were allowed. I do not expect a free or easy ride for our politicians but as least some decorum as this interview shows this evening. Well done and please, please we need much more of this.  

Russell in Glendale

June 19. 2012 06:47 AM

2353

Jason & Psyclaw,

In retrospect what I should have done was attach the en envelope to a large box with some weight in it. The postage would have been horrendous!!!

2353

June 19. 2012 07:14 AM

Lyn


TODAY’S LINKS

A Hard Rains Gonna Fall, Peter Wicks, Wixxy Leaks
$9,898.35 at supermarkets and bottle shops. $9,185.86 on Homewares, including $1,025 at Bunnings. $1,600.06 on Foxtel, gee, I hope he got the adult channels for that price. Over $9,000 in Hong Kong and China. Over $29,000 in restaurants and bars, at least he didn’t go hungry. And, of course $2,410 in brothels.
wixxy.wordpress.com/.../

Shoot To Thrill, Wixxy, Wixxy Leaks
being told that 10,000 were going to lose their jobs at the hands of the Coalition, that the states power generators were going to be sold (a broken election promise), the government buses could be sold soon, cut-backs left right and centre , and we still have $1Billion worth of pain still to be announced, we need a bloody good show.
http://wixxy.wordpress.com/

WELCOME TO JACKSONVILLE, Independent Australia
This dedicated Jacksonville page will be updated and adjusted as new information comes to light and articles are published. It is arranged in reverse chronological order.
http://www.independentaustralia.net/jacksonville/

Ex-Fairfax editors on cuts: bold, brave, danger for democracy, Matthew Knott, Crikey
The newspapers can survive and find a market if they stop covering so much celebrity pap and food and wine. TV and radio do that so much better. They aren’t going to be able to continue the traditional role of being a watchdog unless they get rid of most of the other stuff — all the lifestyle stuff,” he said.
www.crikey.com.au/.../

Media Concentration just got a little more concentrated, Turn Left 2013
I guess we can all get active to protest that, make our voices here – I don’t know, we could tweet our outrage to each other and tweet politicians and click like on a facebook group, that should work.The time to act is now, it may not achieve anything, but if we wait, it WILL be too late
turnleft2013.wordpress.com/.../

Why Politicans Should Be Chameleons, Only the Depth Varies
There’s little evidence yet that Premier Newman’s team has found its feet, and no evidence that Tony Abbott ever will. In the meantime, the electorate has had more than enough campaigning.
http://onlythedepthvaries.blogspot.com.au/

What's Wrong With Asking What's In It For Me, Ian McAuley’, New Matilda
Laura Tingle has written at length in the current Quarterly Essay, is about a culture of entitlement. It’s come to the stage that people who are clearly well-off feel no embarrassment about claiming, publicly, that they are entitled to welfare payments
newmatilda.com/.../what039s-wrong-asking-what039s-it-me

Galaxy: 56-44 to Coalition, William Bowe, The Poll Bludger
Essential Research records two-party preferred steady at 56-44, from primary votes of 33% for Labor (up one), 49% for the Coalition (steady) and 10% for the Greens (steady).
blogs.crikey.com.au/.../

Prime Minister starting to leverage the influence of bloggers, Craig Thomler, EGov Au
However, to my knowledge, governments and government agencies in Australia have, with a few exceptions, largely ignored the existence and influence of bloggers.
There's also been limited research by governments in Australia into understanding the reach and influence of bloggers, and few attempts at integrating co-ordinated or long-term blogger outreach into communication and stakeholder engagement strategies
egovau.blogspot.com.au/.../...ing-to-leverage.html

SECRET WOMEN’S BUSINESS: Liberal preselections in Deakin and Corangamite dissected VEXNEWS style, Vex News
Another, who closely monitored the situation told us “O’Dwyer has fallen out with most of her federal colleagues from Victoria, who look upon her self-promotion with disdain. (She is) looked upon as a trouble-maker by Tony Abbott.”
www.vexnews.com/.../

Photomanipulation by The Age – Of an AFP Photo?, Peter, Aussie Views News
You would think the Australian newspaper The Age has enough on it’s plate without acting unethically by manipulating photos, again. (The last time I found it was only 3 months ago.) Like a possible takeover bid, loosing market share, reduced advertising income and being forced to both lay off staff and go
www.aussieviewsnews.com/.../

George Brandis- the carbon price killed Fairfax, Bernard Keane, The Stump
George Brandis in Senate Question Time to link the Fairfax
prize for crass opportunism and straight stupidity by an allegedly intelligent politician. Indeed, Brandis goes further than merely linking it, he outright says in his third question that the 1900 Fairfax jobs will be destroyed by the carbon price
http://blogs.crikey.com.au/thestump/

Editorial Independence, GetupToday
it was confirmed: Gina Rinehart is behind a massive buy-up of Fairfax Media, publishers of some of the major mastheads in Australia, such as The Sydney Morning Herald and The Age. She's recently bought some 140 million shares over 3 days, increasing her stake to 18.67% -
www.getup.org.au/.../editorial-independence

I’m gonna stand by my woman now, Jennifer Wilson, No place for Sheep
I’m not referring to disagreement or critique, I’m talking about spite, judgement, contempt, and downright bitchiness that does nothing to progress civilisation, of the kind that feeds an exclusionary dynamic and precious little else
noplaceforsheep.com/.../

Marriage: it’s a ritual, Cafe Whispers
In 1958 Sir Robert Menzies vowed that discrimination would never be written into Australia’s marriage laws, but in 2004 John Howard did just that.
cafewhispers.wordpress.com/.../

Present gloom is more political than economic, Ross Gittins
The release of two downbeat indicators of business and consumer confidence last week serves only to deepen the puzzle over the gap between how we feel and what the objective indicators are saying about the state of the economy.
www.rossgittins.com/.../...ore-political-than.html

TODAY’S FRONT PAGES
Australia Newspaper Front Pages for 19 June 2012
www.frontpagestoday.co.uk/index.cfm

Lyn

June 19. 2012 08:25 AM

42 long

  Just heard lord Monkton is on the board of ALL of Gina Rinehart's ompanies.

42 long

June 19. 2012 08:30 AM

Psyclaw



Lyn
Up and at 'em already. Good work!

Russell in Glendale
What did you think of this performance by Alberici?

"Isn't it the case that it was luck that got us through the GFC?"..... this is barely a question, and only so in that grammatically the appropriate punctuation is a question mark.....just...... although it's really just a silly comment....... followed by words to the effect "isn't it a bit smug to be lecturing other countries" (when all we had was luck).

IMHO this was more tabloidism by an ABCer who should know better.


Swordsters

Following the Alberici example from last night, FKelly just asked John Curtin from the "Uni of Toronto G20 Research Unit " is the Australian economy really admired by the G20. He quickly replied "of course" but then went on to laud JG saying that the admiration was quite personal and that she is personally highly valued by the rest of G20.

He said that it was the G20 view of JG personally that lead to Australia's selection as G20 host in 2 years time.

Then came immediate hurry up from Kelly and a quick close down of the interview.

Can't let too much praise for JG through on their ABC.

Psyclaw

June 19. 2012 08:37 AM

Ad astra

LYN'S DAILY LINKS updated: www.thepoliticalsword.com/.../...-DAILY-LINKS.aspx

Ad astra

June 19. 2012 08:40 AM

TalkTurkey

Good Morning Lyn
I do hope your hand is healing fast
Yes burns are terrible
I mentioned old Thomas Bilney, first great English reformer, being burnt at the stake in England in 1529 for heresy
But the amazing thing was, the night before his auto da fe he knew he was about to be burnt next day, so he "tested his flesh against the morrow" by burning through his finger in a candle flame . . .

there's a quote about
"who seeks to hold fire in his hand
by thinking on the frosty Caucasus
"

Sounds good in theory but . . .

There was a faith healer of Deal,
Who remarked, "Although pain isn't real,
If I sit on a pin,
And I puncture my skin
I dislike what I fancy I feel!"


Hopefully Lyn your burn though extensive is not too deep, and a few days will see you right, just don't get it infected, be very careful, you have our best wishes. And thanks as always for your Daily Links, you are our little dynamo making the whole Blogosphere and Twitterverse waaaaay more effective.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

2353 I thought about that notion of sending a brick back C.O.D with that Coalonic begging letter, but of course the taxpayer pays for that. Throw the brick+letter through his electorate window would make a point though. "Delivered by hand!" Smile

TalkTurkey

June 19. 2012 08:48 AM

Michael

'Lord' Monckton and Gina Rinehart 'in bed' together??

Get outta here!


en.wikipedia.org/.../Christopher_Monckton,_3rd_Viscount_Monckton_of_Brenchley

An oddly sad bio.

Michael

June 19. 2012 08:52 AM

TalkTurkey

That quote is from Shakespeare's Richard the Third

It was written 20 years or so after old Thomas' death, and the play relates to Norfolk, which is where he was burnt. I wonder if my namesake influenced old Bill's writing?

Who can hold a fire in his hand By thinking on the frosty Caucasus?
Or cloy the hungry edge of appetite By bare imagination of a feast?
Or wallow naked in December snow By thinking on fantastic summer’s heat?

NOT ME!

TalkTurkey

June 19. 2012 09:00 AM

2353

TT - the accompanying letter did state that the mailout was produced at Liberal Party expense.  I commend your wrapped brick isuggestion.

Abbott's office window would be something the taxpayer would be required to fund if it was broken.  Liberal Party HQ on the other hand . . .

2353

June 19. 2012 09:01 AM

TalkTurkey

Just a coupla months back I thought Emma Alberici was going to be fair and just.

But SWS (Stepford Wife Syndrome)'s got her too it seems . . .

TalkTurkey

June 19. 2012 09:41 AM

Lyn

Good Morning Ad and Everybody

Twitterverse for you all:_

Latika Bourke ‏@latikambourke
'Finger-wagging Miss Goodie-Two-Shoes' Gillard at G20: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/-20kbr.html

ABC News‏@abcnews
Fairfax has announced hundreds of job losses and News Ltd could soon follow suit - follow developments in our live blog http://bit.ly/KglFtw

vexnews‏@vexnews
James Ashby's wicked web of secret meetings ensnares LNP cabinet minister #qldpol #auspol http://bit.ly/L9M5TO

Mr Denmore‏@MrDenmore
A wounded Fairfax tries to reinvent itself 10 years too late; now Rinehart picks over its bones. See The Failed Estate http://tiny.cc/m293fw

Latika Bourke ‏@latikambourke
Mining magnate Gina Rinehart asks for 3 #Fairfax board seats + editorial input: www.afr.com/.../fa7f80b2-b910-11e1-bb02-2b45fb913cdc

John Hanna‏@John_Hanna
+10 RT > @SkellorTurnbull and Conroy: Rinehart should sign charter www.theage.com.au/.../...arter-20120618-20kco.html via @theage

Chris Barrett‏@selga55
#LNP takes on public service #herewejohagain Government belt-tightening extends to public service pay www.brisbanetimes.com.au/.../...0120618-20k11.html@brisbanetimes

The Australian‏@australian
Breaking news that shocked Fairfax editors http://fb.me/CWiyyHND

Latika Bourke ‏@latikambourke
'Finger-wagging Miss Goodie-Two-Shoes' Gillard at G20: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/-20kbr.html

Stephen Koukoulas‏@TheKouk
@latikambourke ? She has every right to wag her finger. Australia avoided recession, europe, UK et al still in it!

Stephen Koukoulas‏@TheKouk
Leaders of zombie economies at the G20 like a student caught cheating in an exam & blaming the examiner for calling them out.Gillard spot on

Stephen Koukoulas‏@TheKouk
@mumbletwits Each leader at G20 makes a speech: SHould they forego that? No delusions of grandeur from Howard or Gillard. Doing their job!

Toastman‏@toastman51
Rinehart seeks three board seats www.smh.com.au/.../...rd-seats-20120618-20kdi.html via @smh Abbott, the puppet, will be rubbing his hands together at power of new master

Bridie Jabour‏@bkjabour
The Federal Gov't has accused the Brisbane Council of exaggerating the impact of the carbon tax www.brisbanetimes.com.au/.../quirk-warned-not-to-blame-carbon-tax-for-h

wontletyoufly‏@wontletyoufly
Coalition pursues work-for-dole scheme a dud in UK www.theage.com.au/.../...in-uk-20120618-20kau.html via @theage

ABC Radio Brisbane‏@612brisbane
Listen back - @PeterJBlack's weekly look at technology including what your net usage says about your mental health - http://bit.ly/NIi3Y8

Ken ‏@KoenjiEikaiwa
Malcolm Turnbull supports marriage equality http://bit.ly/MjfGaZ Tony Abbott a confessed liar allows his RC religion to cloud his judgment

vexnews‏@vexnews
James Ashby's wicked web of secret meetings ensnares LNP cabinet minister #qldpol #auspol http://bit.ly/L9M5TO

Ken ‏@KoenjiEikaiwa
Tony Abbott has an eachway bet as the Liberals get tangled up in James Ashby's web of rumours & innuendo http://bit.ly/PbwqkB BROUGH PYNE 2

Bridie Jabour‏@bkjabour
QLD public servants have been offered 2.2% pay rise though Campbell Newman slammed Labor last year for capping at 2.5% www.brisbanetimes.com.au/.../...0120618-20k11.html

Mr Denmore‏@MrDenmore
The time to have gotten out of newspapers was in the late 1990s, says Reuters columnist Jack Shafer http://reut.rs/NtwGhN #Fairfax

George Williams‏@ProfGWilliams
Will Australia still hold two referendums in 2013?www.smh.com.au/.../...rsuasion-20120618-20k9d.html

Lyn

June 19. 2012 11:37 AM

Ad astra

Hi Lyn
We hope your hand is improving steadily.  Thank you for continuing to provide us with your links and tweets.  There is such a lot of valuable information therein.  You keep us up to date.

We are witnessing the most profound changes in the MSM for several generations, changes that some believe should have taken place ages ago.  I wonder how widely the significance of these changes is appreciated. These changes open up countless opportunities for the Fifth Estate, the importance of which will rise as newspapers fall and their online duplication disappears behind paywalls.  

There are interesting, albeit busy times ahead.  

Ad astra

June 19. 2012 12:02 PM

42 long

  I would be moore concerned if we were losing something of real value. The press have abdicated their responsibility in a democracy of which they are an essential part, for a long time now. Perhaps some of them will reflect on this.
Again the real fault sits with those who pressure the individual editors, but that is why they set-up or invested in the media in the first place.
   In the IT age the ordinary person has the power to communicate ( except in some totalitarian states where it is made difficult).
    Where the MSM have failed to do the job people like us and like wixxy can do the job quite well thank you, so we are not too different from the third world countries there. We just thought we had a "NEWS" media doing the right thing. ( Like we think we have rights that we actually don't)
   We do indeed have a "turmoil" going on, with the media. Go and find a real job away from the current media. It will feel different (for a while) but you might feel cleaner and you might have nicer friends.
  With the web, once the word gets out, information will flow to people like Peter wicks. he won't have to wear out shoe leather. he has to follow leads and sort out the trolls
  We need think tanks made up of people who seek truth with a passion and want a world fit for their descendants to inhabit. NOT unlimited money in YOUR pockets NOW and no care for the only world we have.

42 long

June 19. 2012 12:03 PM

Ad astra

Russell in Glendale
I thought that Emma Alberici’s interview was patchy.  She started off admirably with an open question: ”What are you hoping will be achieved from the G20 meeting there in Mexico this week?”, and then a little more directly, in response to Julia Gillard’s answer: ”What exactly is that decisive action you're looking for?”  

Then came the impertinent question to which Psyclaw reacted: ”It's a little unfair, isn't it, to compare European governments with your own? I mean, when you took office back in 2007, you arrived with a $21 billion surplus and unemployment around five per cent, and now you have no surplus five years later, unemployment is still around five per cent. We escaped the Global Financial Crisis, but many suggest that has more to do with good luck than good management. I mean, we have a bounty of resources and our chief trading partners are in Asia. It's hardly right for Australia to be smug about those things, isn't it?”

Despite Emma’s rudeness, Julia responded politely, beginning with: ”Well, anybody who said that would be completely wrong, Emma,…”, a delectable way of saying: “You are completely wrong, Emma…”

Perhaps set back a little with Julia’s answer, Emma asked some sensible technical questions, but I suspect, itching to get onto the ‘lecturing to Europe’ theme, Emma asked: ”Given the relative strength of the Australian economy, do G20 countries seek your counsel about how they might improve their lot?” and ”And do you have the kind of relationship with Angela Merkel for instance where you might be able to persuade her of your point of view?”

Again, Julia’s direct answers cut that line of questioning, so Emma got onto more technical issues in a neutral way.

I thought it was symptomatic of how the interview turned around from impertinence to courtesy when Emma concluded, in a heartfelt way: ”Thanks very much for being there for us, Prime Minister, and all the best of luck for a very busy week ahead.”

For me, it illustrated that Julia Gillard’s polite but firm handling of a rude question, her unwillingness to be intimidated and angered by Emma, is a strategy that will serve her in good stead.  We have seen it before, and it works, even with truculent News Limited bullies.

Here is the transcript of the interview: www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2012/s3528040.htm

Ad astra

June 19. 2012 12:12 PM

Ad astra

42 long
Well said. As the Fourth Estate stumbles, the Fifth Estate needs to step in and fill the void.  Apart from a few, such as Peter Wicks, who gather news, we in the Fifth Estate analyse the news and express opinions, opinions that in many instances are as well documented and argued, sometimes better so, than opinions expressed in the Fourth Estate.  We ought not to be ignored.

Ad astra

June 19. 2012 12:41 PM

42 long

  Usually if there is not a "quid" in it, it doesn't get done.  Most of the developed world is hooked on Money and Hydrocarbons and a GOD of somekind that justifies what they do.
Yes  WE ought not be ignored. I am sure that many are concerned about the power of the internet and will try to restrict it by some excuse or other. That will be a threat for the future. People who are living on the fat of others will fight to maintain their position, and they have more to work with.
I am sure KJ thought she had all the contacts in high places she needed to get away with her actions.
  Ad, we do have a ringside seat to interesting times. Thank you for your comment. My posts never get near something i would call significant, but I feel I am among concerned thinking feeling people here.

42 long

June 19. 2012 12:44 PM

BSA Bob

psyclaw @ 8.30
I thought Alberici's question re "luck" was pretty disgraceful. She asked it with a sneer on her face which wasn't there once Gillard had answered her. And I read somewhere this morning that the ABC's PM swallowed hard, fixed bayonets & went over the top in a desperate bid to give some credence to Brandis' remarks about Fairfax & carbon policy.
Perhaps my blood pressure would benefit from ignoring the MSM entirely, as it is I only really watch it to see where the bullets are coming from.

42 long @ 12.02
I too would feel sorrier if I thought anything of real value was being destroyed, but on the other hand several Christmases have surely come at once for Gina & Rupert who will certainly see opportunities in this. Both of them are seemingly unconcerned by mere financial concerns of profit & loss such as worry Fairfax. Impending reductions at Ltd News won't mean it doesn't try to encroach on Fairfax territory.
Paraphrasing a point made some time ago by, I think, Mr Denmore, the real advantage of owning print media today is that the mass of folk buying it to read about sports, social stuff, etc, absorb by a kind of osmosis the "Labor bad!!!" theme on the pages they pass by.

BSA Bob

June 19. 2012 01:13 PM

TalkTurkey

KJackson was pure as a pixie
Til she was unmasked by our WIXXY
And Ashby & Pyne
A fine pair of swine
Look as sick as a rabbit with myxy

TalkTurkey

June 19. 2012 02:06 PM

adelaidegirl

Hi Ad Astra

Sorry to say that I became frustrated and did not read all of your article.  I used to read Hartcher but find that his writing has become so biased that I don't bother.

From you:
At least Hartcher hands out blame in equal measure to both leaders; in so many instances journalists lay most of the blame, most of the criticism on Julia Gillard, and let Tony Abbott off the hook almost completely, most of the time.

This is like saying, "at least one broken leg is better than two."  I disagree.

From you:
wanting to be onside with the nation’s next leader

But why don't they want to be "onside" with the current leader?

You sum it up well, here:
Fairfax journalists, of whom Hartcher is one, might believe that should that media empire collapse, News Limited might be their only refuge, and a history of antagonism to Tony Abbott and the Coalition would not be a positive in seeking employment with that anti-Government, pro-Coalition organization, one intent of ‘regime change’.

This may for a part of it but, as jaycee notes, they have a choice to:
strike for self respect and decency or get on their knees and beg

I don't see this as a viable excuse for demeaning their profession and deceiving their customers.

If I misconstrue you, I apologise.  I will try to slog through your quotes of Hartcher's opinionated, self-important rubbish when I have more time, and respond to any more positive comments by him or you.

Are you and Pete friends Smile

adelaidegirl

June 19. 2012 02:06 PM

Gravel

Ad Astra

Thank you for this great article.  I have to say I am surprised by what Hartcher has written in his book about how well Australia is doing.  I am not the least surprised about his attitude to our Prime Minister.  As others have stated already, his dislike for Julia has been visceral.

Lyn

Please do take care of you hand, burns are very nasty things.  Have patience as they take a while to get past the infection stage.

Psyclaw

May I just echo your response to Ad Astra, and to everyone else also.

Gravel

June 19. 2012 02:11 PM

Ad astra

Folks
Following up from the Emma Alberici interview on Lateline last night where she ever so gently edged toward the ‘lecturing Europe’ theme with: ”Given the relative strength of the Australian economy, do G20 countries seek your counsel about how they might improve their lot?” we now have our MSM at full bore criticizing our PM for having the temerity to address the Europeans.  Several bloggers of note: Stephen Koukoulas, Greg Jericho, and Mr Denmore have tweeted their amazement and disapproval of the MSM attack, but a comprehensive rebuttal is to be found at Crikey, where Bernard Keane has written: Europeans verballed while IMF adopts the Gillard-Swan 'lecture'.  I’m sure that neither Crickey or Bernard Keane would object to his piece being reported verbatim below:”

It was a European summer day in July 2002: John Howard strode into a meeting with German business leaders in Frankfurt, at the start of a two-week European trip and proceeded to ... lecture them. After reciting how successful the Australian economy was and the benefits of reforms that Howard had either undertaken himself or supported in opposition, he told them "we don't find very acceptable a situation where the level of subsidy to agriculture from the European Union is 35% of the total value of agricultural production." Howard even told them to stop focusing on aid for developing countries.

"We've just had a meeting of the G8 in Canada and pleasingly one of the things that came out of that was a new commitment to economic development of assistance in Africa. Very worthwhile, very laudable, and something that Australia strongly supports. But can I gently but nonetheless relevantly make the point that removing trade subsidies is worth by degrees of three or four the total value of current foreign aid by the developed countries to the developing countries."

“Back home, there was nary a whisper about Howard haranguing foreigners. No criticisms from News Ltd columnists. No whingeing from the shadow Treasurer. Silence.

“Scroll forward almost exactly a decade and Julia Gillard is copping plenty for writing a letter to G20 leaders about Europe and giving a speech in which she suggested business leaders consider what had happened in Australia.

"The Prime Minister and the Treasurer are taunting European leaders with a barrage of public statements," shrilled Dennis Shanahan, accusing Gillard and Swan of having "no new ideas or solutions and only serves to build their own reputations for economic management at home." Indeed, in a newspaper that is normally quick to attack Europe's sclerotic economic management, the Europeans had found a doughty defender. "Europe won't be 'lectured' by Julia Gillard, EC chief Jose Manuel Barroso has said" read the headline this morning from another article by Shanahan.

“Joe Hockey joined in the attack yesterday, accusing Gillard of "lecturing the world" and issued another media release this morning declaring it "embarrassing". Simon Benson in the Daily Telegraph, unsurprisingly, went further and claimed that Gillard had been "slapped down" by Barroso.

“But if you read Shanahan's article carefully, you'll see the headline was plainly wrong. Barroso had not mentioned Gillard or anyone else in his comments about being lectured. In fact, a Canadian media outlet reported Barroso's comments were directed at Canadian Prime Minister Stephen Harper, whose tough talk has allegedly "irritated" the Europeans.

“And apart from verballing Barroso, News Ltd and Hockey didn't bother doing some basic research.

“Gillard and Swan yesterday urged Europe to pursue financial services reforms for "a more integrated banking system" and aim for fiscal sustainability "in the medium term", "while using all available scope to support growth and jobs in the short-term", in particular by bringing forward infrastructure projects. They also urged Europe to undertake "structural reforms. These reforms include opening up competition in services and key product markets, encouraging flexible labour markets, and tax reforms and entitlement reforms that enhance productivity and improve incentives to work. Ultimately, structural reforms will have the most significant positive impact on lifting global growth and creating more employment opportunities."

“Gillard's B20 speech covered the fiscal components of those recommendations. The "Australian way" she referred to was stimulus during the financial crisis and then return to surplus. This "lecture" isn't new and nor is the Prime Minister the only one delivering it. Last week, Gillard issued a very similar statement with South Korean president Lee Myung-Bak that identified exactly the same strategies.

“Overnight, the IMF issued a paper on Europe. What did it recommend? Structural reforms including "product and service market reforms, underlining the importance of tackling vested interests in sectors such as distribution and regulated professions. The North should focus on increasing labor participation and improve services efficiency, while the South urgently needs better functioning labor markets."

“All of which Gillard and Swan mention.

“The IMF also said that while such reforms would work over the medium term, "these reforms need to be complemented to sufficiently boost growth in the short term; hence policymakers must supplement them with policies to promote demand, external in some cases, internal in others... The pro cyclicality of nominal fiscal targets during an economic downturn could be substituted with a focus on improving structural fiscal balances, where there is fiscal space." Translated, that means don't cut spending when you're already in a recession. Oh, and the IMF recommended financial services reforms for "centralised regulation and supervision".

“In short, the Gillard-Swan "lecture" to Europe was exactly what the IMF delivered overnight as well. If Gillard needs to apologise, so does Christine Lagarde and Lee Myung-Bak. If Gillard has "no new ideas" then the presidents of the IMF and South Korea don't either. And maybe not Stephen Harper, too.

“As usual, that sort of detail got lost in the News Ltd rush to attack the government.

“As the example of Howard from 2002 shows, there's a fairly blatant double standard here. Liberal Prime Ministers are apparently allowed to lecture the rest of the world; Labor ones aren't. And when Howard harangued German business leaders, the RBA cash rate was 5%, not 3.5%, inflation was over 3% not 1.6%, participation was a full two percentage points lower and unemployment 6.3%.

“In fact, let's be blunt -- if a Liberal government had these sorts of economic figures, the nationalist tub-thumping from the media would be ceaseless. Instead it seems any suggestion that anyone could learn from the local economy is the height of presumption -- even when the "lecture" is not merely endorsed but repeated by the IMF.”

Ad astra

June 19. 2012 02:23 PM

adelaidegirl

From you again, Ad Astra:
That’s his view, and it’s consistent with the views he expresses in his columns.   We do not have to agree; indeed we strongly disagree.

Exactly.  So why, in a book that you say is good, does he feel the need to insert these partisan opinions and omit some factors?  He is right about how great this country is but I won't be buying his book because he can't seem to keep it straight.  Is he so frightened that he can't even write his own book without slamming JG?

PS  sorry about the lack of proper quote protocol.  It never seems to work for me.

adelaidegirl

June 19. 2012 02:29 PM

Patriciawa

Lyn!   You put me to shame.  Here you are up and about after  serious physical injury and what must have been considerable pain as well as shock to your nervous system.   I'd have used that as an excuse for time out to recover!  But here you are bright and cheerful, linking us all up with some choice reading and the the twitterverse.

Just catching up now with own reading after much daytime sleeping after my toil over the midnight oil last week!  I feel blessed having the leisure to do that.

Watching Lateline last night, AA, I thought Alberici was pretty snide in that interview. Nasty piece of work she seems now, compared with the freshness she brought in with her.  Have you noticed how all of the ABC women TV journos are glamorised these days.  They no longer look natural, and I suspect their interviews are pre-scripted to match the meme of the day.  Last night's is everywhere this morning - the PM is lecturing the world! Miss goody two shoes!   Nasty stuff.  

Patriciawa

June 19. 2012 02:54 PM

Ad astra

adelaidegirl
Thank you for your comment.  No, I’m not friend of Peter Hartcher.  I know of him only through his columns and his book.

janice raised concerns about Hartcher’s writings, as you have done.  May I suggest you read my response to her on June 18 at 1.12 pm.

I have made it clear that, like Psyclaw and others, I disagree strongly with Hartcher’s characterization of our PM, beginning on page 237 of his book.  But that does not stop me from appreciating the quality and value of what he has written prior to that page.  Frankly, I have seldom seen a better collection of facts and figures and well reasoned conclusions than those that characterize most of Hartcher’s book.  I often dislike what he writes in his columns and in fact wrote a critical piece about “Hartcherism’ in March 2011.

I disagree with his opinion of our PM as recorded in his book and in his columns.  But that dislike does not and will not turn me away from the useful information that characterizes most of his book.  I was surprised it was so positive about our nation, and was delighted to reflect that positivity in my piece to counter the incessant negativity that emanates from the Opposition leader.

I am able to tell the difference between gold and dross.  Peter Hartcher’s book has much gold and some dross.  I am able to accept the former while discarding the latter.

Ad astra

June 19. 2012 03:26 PM

Lyn

Hi Ad and Everybody

42 long you said "My posts never get near something i would call significant, but I feel I am among concerned thinking feeling people here".

Significant your posts are wonderful, I always enjoy every one of them, you are a very valuable contributor to TPS I feel lucky to have the opportunity to read your opinion every day, thankyou very much.

2353 thankyou for caring, your posts are always enjoyable, I read every word you are an asset to TPS.

Talk Turkey 08:40 AM thankyou for your bright and cheerful posts you made my hand feel better, your best wishes are appreciated very much.
ummmm I love being a little dynamo.
You know how important you are Talk Turkey, sprinkling our blog with smiles and grins day after day.

Pysclaw thankyou for your encouragement, I do get a lot of pleasure from your posts and love your opinion.

Patricia thankyou for your heartfelt concern, you are always an inspiration , your posts are always interesting, you bring awestriking talent to TPS.

Gravel a delighful little delicate sweet thankyou for your loyality and undivided support, I love your posts too.

Ad Astra thankyou to you for your qualified wise thoughtful words, you make me feel safe having you for a  friend is Gold.
Apart from your superb articles, your posts are eye sparkling.
Your summary above of Emma Alberici interview is just plain terrific
thankyou.

Lyn

June 19. 2012 03:28 PM

Psyclaw


AA

I know you read everything here carefully, but you have been obviously busy here today.

Concerning the criticism of JG lecturing the G20, I refer you again to the second half of my 8.30am post, which is an objective, impartial, external, independent assessment of our PM's role in Mexico.

In fact to save scrolling, with your indulgence here it is again:

Swordsters

Following the Alberici example from last night, FKelly just asked John Curtin from the "Uni of Toronto G20 Research Unit " is the Australian economy really admired by the G20.

He quickly replied "of course" but then went on to laud JG saying that the admiration was quite personal and that she is personally highly valued by the rest of G20.

He said that it was the G20 view of JG personally that lead to Australia's selection as G20 host in 2 years time.

Then came immediate hurry up from Kelly and a quick close down of the interview.

Can't let too much praise for JG through on their ABC.

Psyclaw

June 19. 2012 03:38 PM

Michael

www.abc.net.au/.../4079460

Premier Campbell Newman says Queensland has 20,000 more public servants than it can afford.

20,001. How about "last in, first out, Can Do Do?"

Michael

June 19. 2012 03:49 PM

Psyclaw


From Mirabella's website, courtesy of Per Adua


GOVERNMENT BULLIES INDUSTRY INTO SILENCE

19-June-2012

Industry, business and consumers have been dealt yet another blow by the Gillard government’s ACCC witch-hunt into post-July 1 price increases.

“This is an aggressive campaign against industry and individual businesses,” said Sophie Mirabella, Shadow Minister for Industry, today.

“These are businesses who have been forced by the commercial realities of bad policy to raise prices.

“The ACCC has failed to stand up for consumers and is simply just doing the Gillard government’s bidding in its feeble attempts to justify cost of living increases under the carbon tax.

"The government started with the carbon tax lie, has continued its arrogant disregard for industry concerns and is now trying to bully industry into compliant silence.

“This is just further evidence that the government has failed to explain this toxic tax to not only consumers but also to business,” Mrs Mirabella said.

“This is a government running scared that been reduced to effective censorship,” Mrs Mirabella concluded.

Psyclaw

June 19. 2012 04:07 PM

Ad astra

Gravel
Thank you for your comment.  Peter Hartcher’s dislike of Julia Gillard goes back a long way, I suspect to when she took over from Kevin Rudd.   I was unsurprising that it continued in the latter part of his book.  Looking at his title: The Sweet Spot:  How Australia made its own luck – and could now throw it all away, his theme is that Australia is a great country, has made its own luck rather than just coasting along on the mining boom, and has the promise of a great future, but that it might ‘throw it all away’, in Hartcher’s view because of poor leadership.  I’m sure most of us who blog here would see that as a distinct possibility should Tony Abbott ever become PM, and I’m sure from what he has written, so does he.  

However, we do not agree with him that Julia Gillard is in the same category as Abbott.  We see her as doing a splendid job as PM despite all the brickbats that are hurled at her daily.  Indeed, contrary to Hartcher’s view, one he has held now for ages, we believe that this nation is prospering under Julia Gillard and her team of first rate ministers, and will continue to do so.  We see Hartcher’s views warped by his dislike of Julia Gillard, or as you put it, his ‘visceral’ dislike of her, to the extent that he cannot see the positives, and dwells only on what he regards as the negatives.  He has such an adverse view of her, (and of Tony Abbott too) that he sees Australia in danger of throwing away all it has gained through ‘making its own luck’.  We believe he is wrong, and I suspect that nothing we think or say would convince him otherwise.  Only time as it unfolds will reveal to him his error of judgement about this, and even then he will likely be slow to be convinced, so entrenched are his views.

Ad astra

June 19. 2012 04:11 PM

Ad astra

Hi Lyn
Thank you for your very kind words and the attention you pay to our bloggers here.  You always make them feel welcome and valued; you are their guardian angel.

Ad astra

June 19. 2012 04:38 PM

Ad astra

Psyclaw
I have read all the comments and just now have caught up with Julia Gillard’s evening press conference at the G20, where once again she was assailed by questions about her ‘lecturing’ Europe, notably from Dennis Shanahan, who had written a caustic article in The Oz about her schoolmarmish lecturing.  Her answer to him debunked the substance of his article.  She said that she had mentioned to European Commission President Jose Manuel Barroso that his name was all over the Australian press as having taken her to task, and he had responded amusedly, because his remarks were not directed at her.  In fact it seems that his remarks were in response to a question from a Canadian reporter who was referring to the North American scene.  So again Dennis seems to have got his story wrong, or has misinterpreted the facts, something that has become for him an art form.  Having been rebuffed, he came again with a similar question, only to be rebuffed again.  Although he is so often wrong in his estimations, his stubbornness drives him to insist that black is white, or vice versa, which ever suits him.  Journalists hate being shown to be wrong; Shanahan especially.

Today’s conference demonstrated how on top of all areas of government she is.  Every question was answered with assurance.  She is a quality performer but most of the MSM refuses to acknowledge this, preferring to criticize her on some paltry issue, usually trumped up.  By the way, she was wearing only a lapel brooch today – you would have thought that our PM would at least wear some pearls!  If for no other reason than to show how prosperous a nation we are.  Goodness gracious me!

Ad astra

June 19. 2012 04:48 PM

42 long

Mirabella's got no class. There are NO items ( I nearly wrote facts, something she doesn't use) in her statement that couldn't be completely refuted. Do rants like this do anything or is it to just look as though she is doing something, for Party consumption?.
   30 years ago I spent a couple of months in France. You would see people reading magazines as thick as Womens Weekly which were basically political comment.
   TT ( Tony's Technique) wouldn't gel there. People were THINKING about politics.

42 long

June 19. 2012 04:58 PM

Psyclaw

`

AA

Weren't pearls a trademark of Mr Howard's foremost "facelesss man" (Mrs Howard).

Psyclaw

June 19. 2012 05:34 PM

Lyn

Hi Ad and Everybody

There is a huge commotion going on about what Julia Gillard said at the G20, the journalist's have gone crazy reporting distortion about
words that President of the European Commission Jose Manuel Barroso
has said.  Seems Denis Shanahan, and Simon Benson being no 1 and 2 offenders:

I can't give you any tweets much about QT today because nobody has said anything, obviously too boring.

Twitterati:

Annabel Crabb‏@annabelcrabb
Watch it here if you want. (Goes for 45mins though!) ec.europa.eu/avservices/video/player.cfm?ref=86307 Barroso remarks are at the 33-minute mark.

Crikey.com.au‏@crikey_news
Keane: verballing Barroso & ignoring the IMF - the truth behind Gillard's "lecture" of the Europeans & their reaction http://ow.ly/bFsDV

jillsinger‏@snooplady
UNBELIEVABLE. Instead of apologising to Gillard and Barroso 4 getting story so WRONG Shanahan keeps at it http://bit.ly/L9wrI6 @newsltd @G20

Kersebleptes‏@Kersebleptes
@abcmarkscott An apology for the false story regarding the PM & G20 must be broadcast immediately. Or are apologies only for true stories?

EyesWatching‏@Eyes_Watching
. @David_Speers lying about @JuliaGillard and Barroso. Stop the lies Speers!

Annabel Crabb‏@annabelcrabb
Thanks @mattwordsworth for this link to Canadian press reporting the Barroso remarks as a slapdown for ... Canada! www.cbc.ca/.../...ico-harper-europe-crisis-eu.html

Matt Wordsworth‏@mattwordsworth
@GrogsGamut I was also trying to find the source... the Guardian pins it as a remark against Nth America. www.guardian.co.uk/.../g20-summit-barroso-eurozone-crisi

Annabel Crabb‏@annabelcrabb
Just listened to the entire Barroso press conference. His rant about criticism of Europe was in response to Canada. Not Julia Gillard.

Jack Sumner‏@preciouspress
The Tele's Simon Benson rides hot on the fecal heels of Shanahan "Gillard 'slapped down' at G20 summit" Deception squared

PM Julia Gillard 'slapped down' at G20 summit by the President of the European Commission Jose Manuel Barroso
by:SIMON BENSON in Los Cabos Mexico From: The Daily Telegraph
www.couriermail.com.au/.../story-e6freooo-1226400667769

Daniel Hurst‏@danielhurstbne
#Fairfax journos tell major owner Rinehart to guarantee editorial independence www.brisbanetimes.com.au/.../...0120619-20lg7.html (Full letter: www.brisbanetimes.com.au/.../...0120619-20lgc.html )

The Masked Crusader‏@themaskedcrus
@Roaldan1000 @CraigEmersonMP I have rung News Ltd & lodged two complaints. SkyNewsNZ reported our PM as being viewed as"rude"by G20 leaders.

Australian Labor‏@AustralianLabor
Hi @aza711, depending on your income you & your partner might receive a tax cut after July 1. Check out www.alp.org.au/.../ to find out.

Mike Kelly MP‏@MikeKellyMP
IMF backs carbon price http://www.theage.com.au/opinion/-20k9k.html

Dafid‏@davidlen2
@AlboMP @CraigEmersonMP Abbott says PM admonished a LIE, accurate report of G20 head's comments ...NO MENTION OF PM : http://bit.ly/KZESz8

Pamela‏@Pamela_November
Factbox: Carbon taxes around the world http://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/1492651@TonyAbbottMHR So important you do not miss this .given your ignorance #auspol

Victorian Liberals facing 'funds crisis', Costello refuses to hand over money (he never did like doing that...) www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-e6frgczx-1226398087245
Peter Costello 'breaking funds rule'
Christian Kerr From: The Australian June 18, 2012 12:00AM
HOWARD government treasurer Peter Costello has been accused of breaking Liberal Party rules as the battle over his Higgins 200 Foundation's funding war chest becomes increasingly bitter.

Honorific Spud‏@SpudBenBean
Do you believe the ridiculous question from the lame Oppn that kept @Tony_Burke from attending the Rio conference? #qt

Bernard Keane‏@BernardKeane
Julie Bishop looks strangely unimpressed with being found out by Tony Burke. #qt

Justin Barbour‏@justinbarbour
. @scottmorrisonmp asking racially driven and factually inaccurate questions in #qt, as usual.

Lyn

June 19. 2012 05:49 PM

2353

Thanks for the links Lyn (hope the wingless Tweety is continuing to improve)- plenty to digest.  Two things of note.  

Interesting that Costello - who is being paid a small fortune to find the imaginary black hole in Queensland Government's finances (with a spectular lack of success I might af) won't hand over funds he squirrelled away for political campaigns in Victoria.  Says something for his honesty.

Your link to the Brisbane Times reminded me of this story -> www.brisbanetimes.com.au/.../...0120619-20ljf.html.  Apparently the web based paper is not going behind the Fairfax paywall.

2353

June 19. 2012 05:51 PM

2353

D'oh - that should read-> (with a spectacular lack of success I might add)

2353

June 19. 2012 05:53 PM

Sir Ian Crisp

For assessing whether you have seen/ experienced gouging, any increase above 0.7%  attributed to the carbon price is an example of a business trying to cash in on the carbon price.

I will be generous and use a figure of 1%. So a $4 meat pie should cost $4.04 cents after 1 July.

I have put a dozen copies in my car and intend writing the business's name in the relevant section and showing the manager whenever I see carbon price gouging so he/she doesn't get the idea I'm bluffing.

I'm pretty sure the fine is $6K for individuals and $60K for companies. I'll tell 'em that too.
Psyclaw


Psyclaw, you may need to rework your formula for price increases. The case you mentioned is an interesting one. The pie shop is at the end of a supply chain. The pie shop owner buys his meat from a wholesaler whose power bills will increase. The wholesaler will pass on his costs to his customers, in this case the pie shop owner. That’s a well established business practice. The wholesaler might have a small fleet of delivery vehicles that are maintained by the local motor workshop. The motor workshop faces an increase in power bills so it has no option other than to pass on those costs to the meat wholesaler. The pie shop owner has to buy the ingredients to make the pie cases and the supplier of those ingredients also faces an increase in power bills. Those costs will be passed on to pie shop owner. The pie shop owner also faces a rate increase for garbage collection because the relevant council has to pay more to use the local waste disposal site. Council rate increases also apply to the meat wholesaler, the supplier of pie making ingredients, and the motor workshop. They will pass on those costs to the last person in the chain; the pie shop owner. We can’t expect the pie shop owner to absorb all those costs. He is facing costs from all sides. I don’t know that .04 cents on each pie will cover those costs.

It might be prudent if you don’t accuse the pie shop owner of gouging. If you ask him he might explain why his pies have gone up by more than 0.7% or he might invite you to bend over and grab your ankles. We know what follows that.

So while you hand out your ACCC  forms to retailers and tell them they are up for a fine approaching $60k you might want to tell them what formula to apply to their products. While you’re at it give the ACCC a ring and let them know you’ve worked it out because no one else has worked it out.

It’s all supposition at this stage of the game.

Sir Ian Crisp

June 19. 2012 06:02 PM

Lyn

Hi Ad

I will put this link to Greg Jericho's article in Today's Links again tomorrow.  I am posting now as relevent to the fabricated missleading reports coming from the MSM and the ABC's Simon Cullen:

Fairfax and G20 visits – What do we need- What do we trust-, Greg Jericho, Grog’s Gamut

Note how Shanahan infers Mr Barroso’s comments are linked to the Prime Minister’s letter. Note how the headline uses direct quotes and specifically has Barroso’s statement directed to Gillard? Shanahan then went on to get this comment from a “spokesperson” for Mr Barroso:

http://grogsgamut.blogspot.com.au/

SmileSmileSmile

Lyn

June 19. 2012 06:17 PM

Psyclaw


SIC

Already a hairdresser has been fined in my home town for increasing prices by 10% "because of the carbon tax". This was 8 weeks ago.

She was an ineffective crook, having explained her price rise on a sign in her shop window.

Your mob have been sitting out there for many months licking their lips and greasing the palms of their hands in anticipation of a gouging windfall on 1 july just as they did with the BER and Pink Batts.

You will have (purposefully) forgotten about Kings Butchery on the north coats of NSW. About 10 months ago whilst on a dress up frolic, your fool of a leader said that the cost of the butcher's electricity would go up many thousands .....  $18K.

Later that week Lenore Taylor travelled to the town for an in depth with the butcher and to check Abbott's claim ..... the butcher happily cooperated. Turns out that when related to his actual usage of electricity, the $18K rise was very low.

The cost increase they calculated for a kilo of rump was a whopping 2 (TWO) cents.

BTW, I just saw a national weather forecast and they stupidly gave a forecast for Whyalla. What a waste of money. Who gives a toss about the weather in Whyalla when it's going to disappear in 12 days time.

PS ..... you've got a fictional supply chain cost for pies already worked out ......... sounds like you're a pieman ready to strike at the taxpayers. I've often suspected that you are a pieman.

Psyclaw

June 19. 2012 08:00 PM

Sir Ian Crisp

ddd
PS ..... you've got a fictional supply chain cost for pies already worked out ......... sounds like you're a pieman ready to strike at the taxpayers. I've often suspected that you are a pieman.

Psyclaw


Are you saying that the pie shop owner opens his doors every morning and there waiting for him is a fresh supply of meat, flour etc with no hint of how they got there? May we know his secret?

Please inform the debate about how to apply the carbon pricing formula.

Sir Ian Crisp

June 19. 2012 08:21 PM

Psyclaw


SIC

There's never any debate with you.

My statement is simple:

Many of your mob are sitting there waiting to gouge under the cloak of the CO2 pricing. Many of us will be waiting to report them to ACCC.

The max fine announced yesterday is $1.1 million.

Simple really.

They won't get away with doing to the CO2 pricing what they did to the BER and Pink Batts......your mob!

Psyclaw

June 19. 2012 08:27 PM

Ad astra

Hi Lyn
Thanks for Twitterati. What a beat up News Limited perpetrated on Julia Gillard over her written statement.  Shanahan was at it again, and although caught out misrepresenting the situation, continued on the same theme at the PM's press conference.  He is shameless.

Ad astra

June 19. 2012 08:30 PM

TalkTurkey

Swordsfolks have been busy today!

Ad astra as usual we agree about a matter of the first order of importance, this time about the fact our PM ought to wear a necklace, as I said she should do on Q&A.

Compare: . . .  JULIA . . .   with . . .  *J*U*L*I*A* . . ! . .

I like her either way but girls go good with sparkles eh.

It's not really sexist, our clothing is though, blokes would have ties . . .

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

42 long *TT* is taken, and it don't mean nothin' to do with Tony Abbortt!

As for your comment My posts never get near something I would call significant, I don't think that's for you to judge anyway! I, and I know there are others, would so estimate you, so just keep writing, one day you might write a whole magnum opus.

(I have already written one, well that's what the publisher said when he sent it back, he said This is a magnum o' pus!)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Russell in Glendale you sound nicer than me, well at least you judge Emma Alabichi a lot more positively on last night's performance than I do.

Re my unpleasant habit of calling people nasty names (a la Alabichi) I only do it when I think they deserve it. With such as *Laura*Tingle* I'm more inclined to put their name up in lights!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
*L*Y*N* thank you for all the work today, you set us so much homework! All pleasurable, and all informative. If it were not for you I would never have found much of what is now my daily fare, and you are such a welcoming, encouraging, peregrinacious spirit! We are all hoping for your hand to get better without complications. Be careful of it. Keep us posted please.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Michael It is always good to see you here.

Abbortt's just as mad and bad as ever though, you still got heaps of ammo!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Patriciawa, Adelaide Girl, Gravel, gee we got a real Girls' Brigade on TPS, feels good, good on you. You help to make our blogsite feel like home.    
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Jason Obelix is not thinking hard enough about going for a seat in SA. He has a long deep knowledge of Labor politics and a good deal of insight, with unusual angles and colourful comments to make people think in new directions. Give him a shove Folks!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

When I was doing Educational Psychology we were taught to do *sociograms* to find which kids were popular and who were isolates. Well if there is someone in Swordland  clever and motivated enough, with a better grip than I on all the players and all the dynamics and relationships in Ashbygate, Jacksonville and Utegate, it would be good to see them all arranged graphically and helpful to all interested parties, perhaps even to Craig Thomson and Peter Slipper in their court cases. Anyone? On a preliminary doodle it looks like a very tangled web . . . with a spider named Lewis right in the middle.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Ad astra for the first time in recorded history I was WRONG about the next, (now last), "Poll" results. I predicted we'd be a bit up, well we were a bit down, but did you read the sorts of questions! Deliberately built-in bias! That they had so to skew the questionnaire tells me what I wanted to know, DYWAT!
(DON'T YOU WORRY ABOUT THAT!)

  



TalkTurkey

June 19. 2012 08:37 PM

DMW

PatriciaWA and all other Sandgropers who visit here.

A call to arms this is URGENT

Please PWA you must rally to this cause and encourage all your fellow Sandgropers to do the same.

Western Australia must secede NOW. Immediately and forthwith without delay.

Why?

Well that would make Gina (and Twiggy) foreign nationals and Gina's tilt at Fairfax would be subject to review by the Foreign Investments Review Board and would most likely be quashed.

So West Aussies it is time to do something for the greater good.

Look I realise there may be a few downsides for those in the west like the possibility that Julie Bishop would become WA's Foreign Minister but there would be upsides like, well, Aussie Rules would become an international sport.

So come on all you West Aussies do the right thing.

Cut the ties NOW.

DMW

June 19. 2012 09:05 PM

TalkTurkey

DMW
Not sure about this *secede* bizzo.

But in my next post I'll tell you something that just has to succeed.

TalkTurkey

June 19. 2012 09:06 PM

TalkTurkey

A Parrot with no teeth, ha ha. Smile

TalkTurkey

June 19. 2012 09:09 PM

Sir Ian Crisp


Many of us will be waiting to report them to ACCC.

The max fine announced yesterday is $1.1 million.

Psyclaw


We won't have to wait long for a test case.

Council blames rate hike on carbon tax
Updated June 19, 2012, 12:59 pm

Brisbane City Council rates are set to rise - and the increase will be blamed on the carbon tax.

The increase is included in the council's new budget which will be handed down tomorrow.

The Federal Government has criticised the council for blaming the carbon tax for the rate hike.

Parliamentary Secretary for Climate Change Mark Dreyfus has written to Lord Mayor Graham Quirk.

He has questioned council figures blaming the tax for a 1.9 per cent rate increase - or an extra $36 on an average rateable property.

Mr Dreyfus says the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission (ACCC) is ready to respond to false claims about the tax.

A spokesman for Mr Quirk says the figures in tomorrow's budget are correct.

au.news.yahoo.com/.../


The council will be fined AUD$1.1 million or it will set a precedent for others to exceed the .7% as long as it can be justified.

Interesting times ahead. Still no formula?

Sir Ian Crisp

June 19. 2012 09:41 PM

Michael

Bad Abbott to come... to a town near you.

Abbott plans carbon tax tour/SMH

news.smh.com.au/.../...ax-tour-20120619-20lxt.html

A 'carbon tax tour', at taxpayers' expense, from the man who billed us all $590,000 extra expenses in the first six months of 2011, and hasn't done anything different in the twelve months since to suggest his cumulative bill is likely to be any lower for them.

The 'tour' is rank politicking, essentially campaigning for the Coalition parties, paid for by the citizenry of this rather gullible country. Abbott must laugh himself to sleep every night!

Michael

June 19. 2012 10:02 PM

Russell in Glendale

Good evening to everyone at the Sword. It seems that I have started a few fingers to wag at the keyboard with my comments toward the Emma Alberici and Julia Gilard interview. I am not is disagreement with the above observations. Yes I also believe that Alberici was out of line with several questions. I guess my point is that compared to the usual abusive, disrespectful diatripe that is supposed to pass for an interview, this was at least a large step in the right direction. Could it be improved certainly, could a follow up question on where Australia's purchasing behaviour help europe be asked? What of the impacts to our largest energy export market Japan? I know the PM would be able to answer these questions yet usually all we are served up with is leadership gossip.
On another note I see that 7:30 at last has explained that the increase electricity charges are far more to do with vested interest over building pole and wire assets rather than a modest carbon price which is fully compensated in most cases.
Russell

Russell in Glendale

June 19. 2012 10:15 PM

jane

......Dennis seems to have got his story wrong...

You're too kind to that lying charlatan Shamaham, Ad astra. I think he intentionally misreported and continues to do so to present the PM in a bad light.

Like Peter Hartcher, but for different reasons, they utterly refuse to be truthful about the PM.

Hartcher continues to lump her with Liealot as a political opportunist and a poor leader who is a slave to populism and has turned her back on reform and good legislation, despite all the evidence proving him utterly and completely wrong.

Not once does he acknowledge her brilliant negotiating skills which enabled her to persuade the three conservative Independents to allow her to form a minority government.

Not once has he given her credit for maintaining their continued support.

Not once has he acknowledged that she enjoys the confidence and affection of her team.

Not once has he acknowledged the volume and importance of her reforming legislation, like the carbon pricing scheme, MRRT, national disability insurance scheme (particularly relevant to me as a parent of two children with disabilities) to name just a few.

Not once has he acknowledged her courage, enthusiasm and unfailing good humour in the light of some of the most vitriolic and disgusting attacks on anyone in public life.  

Like Hartcher, Shamaham not only demeans and refuses to give her any credit, but lies without shame about her; the latest being the egregious flimflammery of the "lecture."

      

jane

June 19. 2012 10:48 PM

Patriciawa

Watching the PM's press conference I loved the way she laughed at all the misreporting, and said she had spoken to Barroso and laughed with him about how it was being reported in Oz and had the rebuke applied to her she would surely have known about.  Well of course Annabelle Crabb had blown the whistle on News and the rest of them on twitter, hadn't she?  Simply, as Grog says, by going to the orginal speech.   I loved what he had to say about not trusting most news commentators any more. As he said, who needs them?  Who has time for them?

Thanks for those links, Lyn.  

Julia Gillard is a great example of grace under pressure.

Patriciawa

June 19. 2012 11:20 PM

42 long

It's nobody's business who leads the Parliamentary Labour party but the party itself. In this respect julia is safer than anybody else in the scene.
The media invent challenges. Rudd did an ill advised run and convincingly LOST. He went from a "Happy" foreign minister to a sullen bachbencher as a result. What else would he expect. Cop it Kevin.
As far as the opposition bringing this up constantly as a piece of advice to the labour party the idea of going back to Kevin. Why would that be a runner. IF that was a good idea? That is the LAST thing that would be good for the Liberals, if what they say is true.
  They BAG the greens. THEY are the REAL enemy of the LNP. So bad that they preference LABOUR in front of them.
  The LNP is a co-alition. A convenient alliance of two parties who have the potential to divide on plenty of issues.
Currently they are good pals on the premise of  "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" This is a partnership of convenience. as is the relationship between the greena and Labour' though idealogically thay have much in common.
  The greens resemble a situation where  "with friend like them you don't need enemies" . They shoould realise  that without labour ( from whom the steal votes) they are "friendless" and should be a bit more "pragmatic". Meaning you can't get everyting you want straight away.

42 long

June 19. 2012 11:24 PM

TalkTurkey

Poor Limpy Crisp! I know it's tough,
I know he writes mean nasty stuff,
But I no longer blast him -
I just scroll right past him -
He's simply not interesting enough.

   Fun *  With * Trolls

           Smile

TalkTurkey

June 19. 2012 11:41 PM

TalkTurkey

Jane said
You're too kind to that lying charlatan Shamaham, Ad astra.

I agree too, Ad is way too tolerant, it p's me off often, but  in fact it is his best most lovable characteristic of all and it is at the core of this great blogsite.

TalkTurkey

June 20. 2012 06:51 AM

Lyn

TODAY'S LINKS

Goading and Politics, Andrew Elder, Politically Homeless
The Coalition has put all their eggs into the basket of stunts and skulduggery rather than policy. That's all gone now, egg on faces all 'round (well, it looks like raw egg - that's as close an analysis as we need, thank you very much). That debacle means the Coalition is left with nothing. One reason why you don't risk winning ugly is because losing ugly is so unbearable.
http://andrewelder.blogspot.com.au/

Who is Gina Rinehart? , Frances Jones
And as the mining boom keeps spitting out millionaires and billionaires, Rinehart will need to prepare for a new battle: the Aboriginal landowners who are becoming incensed at what they consider the double standards over royalty payments.
francesjones.wordpress.com/.../

Fairfax and G20 visits – What do we need- What do we trust-, Greg Jericho, Grog’s Gamut
Note how Shanahan infers Mr Barroso’s comments are linked to the Prime Minister’s letter. Note how the headline uses direct quotes and specifically has Barroso’s statement directed to Gillard? Shanahan then went on to get this comment from a “spokesperson” for Mr Barroso:
http://grogsgamut.blogspot.com.au/

News Limited Deliberately Lying Again, Dan Gulbery, The Daily Derp
A swipe at a Canadian journalist has somehow morphed into criticism of the Australian Prime Minister.  The Murdoch Virus in action.
thedailyderp.net/.../

We have to go back!!!, Ash, Ash’s Machiavellian Bloggery
So we really have to go back. Back to when newspapers reported news and the odd opinion rather than opinion and the odd news. Back to when journalists reported what was said rather then their interpretation of what is said. Yes that journalist can still give an opinion. But not in the headline. In a summary
ashghebranious.wordpress.com/.../

Europeans verballed while IMF adopts the Gillard-Swan ‘lecture’, Bernard Keane Crikey
The Prime Minister and the Treasurer are taunting European leaders with a barrage of public statements,” shrilled Dennis Shanahan, accusing Gillard and Swan of having “no new ideas or solutions and only serves to build their own reputations for economic management at home.” Indeed, in a newspaper that is normally quick to attack Europe’s sclerotic economic management, the Europeans had found a doughty defender.
www.crikey.com.au/.../

Why social media shouldn’t replace good journalism, Turn Left 2013
Rinehart’s message and Tony’s ambition neatly fit together. He wants power, and a media to give it to him, she wants an outlet for her mining propaganda and a prime minister that will let her do anything she wants.
turnleft2013.wordpress.com/.../

Gina Rinehart, Fairfax and the ‘war’ politics of the Australian right , Geoff Gallop, The Conversation
What a dream come true for Australia’s right-wingers.First of all they can point to Gina Rinehart’s wealth (“the richest woman in the world”) as a sign of Australia’s arrival as a capitalist power and a land of opportunity.
theconversation.edu.au/gina-rinehart-fairfax-and-the-war-politics-of-the-australian-right-7739

The Journalism We Really Need, Jake Lynch, New Matilda
Then there was the political reporting. The paper’s lead story last Saturday, in what might be its last weekend edition as an independent publication, was a typical piece of Canberra insiderism: an involved tale about sexual harassment allegations against the Parliamentary Speaker.
newmatilda.com/.../journalism-we-really-need

Rinehart and Rupert: Australia’s media future, Paul Barry, The Power Index
Of course, it's not only Fairfax that is battling to survive. This week we're likely to see more cuts in the industry, with 400-odd journalistic jobs tipped to go at News Ltd. Those that remain in both media groups will be working harder and filing more often to update their newspapers' online sites. And they will be worrying too about whether
www.thepowerindex.com.au/.../201206191463

Journalists call for Rinehart to commit to Fairfax Charter, Media Entertainment and Arts Alliance
The public’s right to information and respect for the truth are fundamental principles of journalism. “The Fairfax business plays a vital role in a functioning democracy. Its audience chooses to read Fairfax editorial content because it is independent journalism protected from editorial interference. And advertisers choose to advertise
www.alliance.org.au/journalists-call-for-rinehart-to-commit-to-fairfax-charter

Annabel Crabb and Peter Reith, Jennifer Wilson, No Place for Sheep
Now I wonder why Ms Crabb decided to so wholeheartedly endorse him, and in such a personal fashion. I thought we’d just established through the shaming of Stephen Long, that it is not the job of ABC journalists to express displeasure or favour towards any public figure.
noplaceforsheep.com/.../

And now for the good news, Miglo, Café Whispers
Hundreds of other posts have attracted more (passionate, at times) comments but I doubt as many different commenters, or especially new commenters to the blogosphere (to go with the hundreds of comments across the social media spectrum). It showed me that there are people out there in readership land who are starved of good news
cafewhispers.wordpress.com/.../

Reporting the G20- Australia’s Giggling Media, Stephen Koukoulas, Market Economics
The media coverage is dreadful. Rather than judging the leaders of the Zombie economies and calling them out for their on-going humiliation in economic management and the dreadful social probelms than come from that, our media prefers the “attack on Gillard” line.
http://www.marketeconomics.com.au/date/2012/06

Business lobby on another planet. Smith on tax and investment, Peter Martin
A key member of the Henry Tax Review has rounded on business lobbyists calling for a cut in the company tax rate saying the government was right not to cut it and it’s wrong to say the review wanted it to.
www.petermartin.com.au/.../...er-planet-smith.html

Fairfax and recognising the end of the newspaper, Joshua Gans, Core Economics
Today that has been replaced by email links, Twitter posts and, of course, Facebook. Those are the platforms that ask “did you read about x?” and those are the platforms we visit to ensure we are not left out of the conversation. Put simply, when the paywalls rise, there is no social risk to the reader from not climbing them
http://economics.com.au/?p=8982

Australian journalists catch on to the digital revolution... at last, The Guardian UK
Their main problem remains the one facing the Australian newspaper industry and the world's newspaper industries - the inexorable move from print to screen. Everyone knows it now, but as Andrew Jaspan pointed out, the Australian newspaper owners were too slow to catch on
www.guardian.co.uk/.../fairfax-media-downturn

Posts from the ‘Daily Fix’ Category
australianpoliticstv.org/category/daily-fix/

TODAY’S FRONT PAGES
Australia Newspaper Front Pages for 20 June 2012
www.frontpagestoday.co.uk/index.cfm

Lyn

June 20. 2012 08:14 AM

TalkTurkey


Gee Lyn it was still dark here when you put your Links up this morning, at a time when folks on Twitter are complaining about the lack of action there! You really are a Working Class Hero(-ine) and you know what that is!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zZ89B1WUzVM

Ad astra I hope you survived the sky falling in Eastern Victoria, well we were warned about that bloody CARBON TAX!

TalkTurkey

June 20. 2012 08:32 AM

Ad astra

LYN'S DAILY LINKS updated: www.thepoliticalsword.com/.../...-DAILY-LINKS.aspx

Ad astra

June 20. 2012 09:10 AM

Psyclaw


TT Comrade

it was still dark

SA is a dark place. It spawned Downer. TT is the redeeeming feature.



Swordsters

Does anyone know if Dick Smith has the cereal variety Fruit Loops in his range of Aussie made products.

If not it is a shame, since that would be his signature and self titled product.

Later today when the link is available I will have a bit more to say about his I/V with FKelly this morn.

Psyclaw

June 20. 2012 09:52 AM

Gravel

Dash it, I was asleep and missed the earth tremor.  Got woken up being told someone was trying to break into our front door, but then found it was the tremor.  Phone rang, son said did you feel it, sorry was asleep.  Lots of calls on 774, luckily everyone is okay.

Gravel

June 20. 2012 10:51 AM

Lyn

Hi Ad and Everybody

Twitterverse:

TAWNBPM‏@TAWNBPM
NATIONAL PRESS CLUB TODAY. 12.30 ABC 1: GREG COMBET.

MrRabbitt‏@Antibolt
“@darinsullivan09: NSW Libs confirm cuts to #WorkCover for #NSWisconsin http://post.ly/7qtdH”Disgraceful.

Wendy Bacon‏@Wendy_Bacon
News Ltd makes offer for Consolidated Media Holdings. More concentration. Just what we needed! news.smh.com.au/.../news-ltd-offers-197b-for-cons-media-
20120620-20mwk.html

Justin Stevens‏@_JustinStevens_
ASX statement re. #News Ltd proposal to acquire Consolidated Media at a cost of A$1.97 Billion: http://bit.ly/LyIpum

nickpmclaren‏@nickpmclaren
Senior Fairfax journalists speak out (short video): media.smh.com.au/.../...-independence-3387287.html #Fairfax

Wendy Bacon‏@Wendy_Bacon
Newman axes service to some Qld's most vulnerable people. www.couriermail.com.au/.../story-e6freoof-1226350980038

National Times‏@NationalTimesAU
Tony Burke missing out on fun, sun and stunts in Rio www.nationaltimes.com.au/.../...0120620-20mwj.html via @NationalTimesAU

ABC News‏@abcnews
Here's our story http://bit.ly/Kj68Js RT @Simon_Cullen: Consolidated Media Holdings says it has received a takeover bid from News Limited

Bianca Hall‏@_Biancah
News Ltd expected to announce major job cuts today, on the back of Fairfax's announcement on Monday. www.smh.com.au/.../...que-book-20120620-20mw7.html

IndependentAustralia‏@independentaus
@theaustralian editorial claims Fairfax's problem was that it was too left wing. Not sure if this is satire. www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-e6frg71x-1226401615728

The Age‏@theage
News Ltd set to announce up to 1000 job losses as company launches takeover bid. www.theage.com.au/.../...-book-20120620-20mw7.html via @theage

Financial Review‏@FinancialReview
News Ltd lodges conditional, non-binding proposal for Packer’s #ConsMedia at $3.50 a share. #ausbiz www.afr.com/.../news_bids_for_packer_consmedia_baNXrfBkcAktVoXWbMh9qK

Chuck‏@chakko
Melbourne quake 2012: Twitter first on the scene: www.thevine.com.au/.../ mt latest for @TheVineonline

Lyn

June 20. 2012 11:12 AM

Patriciawa

.
Sure TT, a working class hero is something to be.  I am sure Jimmy Barnes would agree! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pwIdbN1QW24.  I tried this because heroinejust doesn't work.  Not sure if this does either. Does it ring true?  Too long?  I really would appreciate your comments.

Working Class Girl

Hear about that ranga Sheila,
Fighting the big end of town?
Boofhead Abbott says he’ll beat her.
“No worries mate! She’ll soon lie down.”
But oh no!  She’s a working class girl!

Raised in a working family
She believes in a fair go,
But she’s no revolutionary,
She would be if she had to though.
Oh yes, she’s just a working class girl.

Made friends around the neighbourhood,
Went to school on the local bus,
They keep in touch as old mates should.
"She’s great!" they say. "Still talks like us."
'Course she would,  she’s a working class girl.

Dad worked hard to make a living
Nursed sick oldies in their pain
He taught his kid how to be strong
But helping others is no strain.
Yes, for sure, she’s a working class girl.

Learned too as her mother’s daughter
A woman’s work aint ever done.
And never paid how much it oughta
As if she’d been her father’s son.
That’s life for a working class girl.

So now she’s gonna change all that
Help working folk like me and you,
Who always had to  pass the hat
For battlers without a brass razoo.
She knows, cos she’s a working class girl.

Patriciawa

June 20. 2012 11:12 AM

42 long

Monkton suggested to Gina the purchase of media. The purpose doesn't even need to be speculated on. The evidence is there. Anyhow it's not illegal, although, if she gets on the board and changes it's direction and that causes the value to tumble   ( Hypothetically of course), would the other shareholders have any redress at Law?

42 long

June 20. 2012 12:20 PM

Psyclaw


Swordsters

Here is the link to the FKelly I/V of Dick Fruit Loop Smith this morning. What I have quoted is pretty close to verbatim:

mpegmedia.abc.net.au/.../bst_20120620_0744.mp3

This was about GRinehart's "takeover" of Fairfax.

Among DS's loopier statements were:

1. GR's action is exciting.

2. He doesn't know why Mr Swan would see it as any threat to democracy. (0/10 for understanding of the concept "informed electorate")

3. No-one ever says this about Murdoch. (DS's head must have been buried in sand these last 2 years)

4. The Charter of Independence is ridiculous. (No comment needed)

5. He always intervened with writers on Australian Geographic when he owned it. (Australian Geographic's role was not to inform society about the full range of news)

6. If Rinehart introduces bias, people won't buy the SMH.(They buy the Australian)

7. Anyway the SMH is only read by Sydney intellectuals and academics.(No comment needed)

8. If Murdoch can own News, why can't an Aussie woman do likewise. (Is Rinehart a mere Aussie woman)

9. Complaints about the Rinehart buy-in to Fairfax are only because she's a woman. (No comment needed)

10. Rinehart is an entrepreneur.(Or is she a beneficiary of her father's exploration ..... what has she done that is "entrepreneurial")

11.  Rinehart is buying-in as an investment and she won't therefore self harm Fairfax. (Several commentators have said in past days that she doesn't give a stuff about the money she's put in. If the share price goes bust she'll loose a relative pittance, but if she can control editorial content and gain the policies she wants, she'll make another fortune)

12. He doesn't know what Rinehart believes in but she'll be pro Australian. (She'll be pro-Rinehart. If she was pr-Australian she'd support the MRR)

The Fruit Loops of the world will be proud of this convoluted crap from DS.

Psyclaw

June 20. 2012 12:41 PM

TalkTurkey

Patricia
I haven't tried to sing it, yet, because I don't know the tune well enough, yet, it's more complex than the bush ballads which are about my limit, but I can say already that this particular effort would stand even as a piece of prose, it is splendid as verse, I'll just assume it's potentially perfect musically too. If not just go through it a few times with the music in your head and make any adjustments. It is the simple common touch, both hers and your own, that comes through and makes this powerful - especially to women, where powerful means having the potential to change minds. You are doing noble work Comrade Patricia, this is some of your best.  

Oh and Psyclaw said
TT Comrade

it was still dark

SA is a dark place. It spawned Downer. TT is the redeeeming feature.


Redeeeeeeeming! Smile Gee you say the nicest things.

Yeah Cory Barnardi, Minchin, Hill the Nastier, Oh yeah but we also had Don Dunstan who was worth an infinite number of Them.

TalkTurkey

June 20. 2012 12:47 PM

Patriciawa

Thanks, Psyclaw.  Dick Smith can be an idiot sometimes.  Was it he who described Rinehart as a new media mogul on the Australian scene?  I'd disagree with that since she has hardly made a fortune in the media, and as you so rightly point out she has not been an entrepreneur who made a lot of money, she just mined it.

There weren't any media moguls or mining magnates when John Milton wrote his "Areopagitica" defending freedom of expression against a tyrannical monarch. But his message is relevant still today.  He would be appalled to see what we've allowed to happen to that freedom.

“True Liberty Is When Free-born Men Speak Free!”

John Milton’s Areopagitica,
Crying freedom for the press,
Back in 17th century England,
Resisted monarchy’s excess.

His tract was a mighty weapon
In democracy’s progress.
We are the beneficiaries
Of his most eloquent address.

But we ‘free-born’ were complicit,
As we watched and acquiesced
While that freedom was abused
With a brazen shamelessness.

We encouraged one man’s ambition
To buy up, control, possess
As property our thoughts in print,
And we applauded his success.

We shared profits with this behemoth
Who then destroyed our happiness
And published his news of our world,
Writ as he commanded it expressed.

Now another mogul joins him!
The time has come to re-possess
What has now become a licence
To break all rules and decency transgress.

Our precious freedom so perverted
Has caused democracy’s regress.
Let’s use our laws while we still can,
Redeem ourselves, and truly free the press.

Patriciawa

June 20. 2012 12:59 PM

TalkTurkey

So Patricia, were you working on Working Class Girl even as I was calling Lyn a Working Class Heroine?

That's a bit synchronicitous isn't it?

Both with Workers as their subjects?

Both based on staunch radical songs?

[As I write this Combet synchronicitously says: I've worked for working class people almost all my life. . . and more and more about looking after working people. Bravo Greg.]

Both replacing male subjects with female?

That's gotta tell yous something.  

Double the fist Comrades of both genders.
Women are punching so hard now.
There's more of them than us too fellers. Cool.

"Gutless opportunism" says Greg. Whoopee. It's all coming together.

Labor is GO.

TalkTurkey

June 20. 2012 01:20 PM

Paul

Here's the link to Grog's piece.

- http://grogsgamut.blogspot.com.au/

is it any wonder why we don't trust the media?

Paul

June 20. 2012 02:05 PM

Patriciawa

Not quite synchronicity TT, a blogger at PB, Lynchpin, who I think is an arranger, asked if I had done anything that could be sung. I've never tried, and since Jimmy Barnes came up in that context and I'm an Aussie patriot as well as a Julia fan I thought I'd give this one a go. I did that draft a couple of weeks back and I keep looking at it.  It's got a rhythm and rhymes etc. and reads okay on paper as a pome.  But can it be sung easily? Does it have beat, and heart? Most importantly I don't want it to be sycophantic.

Your talking to Lyn as 'working class hero/heroine' gave me the excuse to ask your opinion.  So, any comments at all?

Patriciawa

June 20. 2012 02:20 PM

Ad astra

Patriciawa
That is good verse and well matched to the Jimmy Barnes song.

Folks
I’ve just now watched Greg Combet’s very good NPC address.  The last question asked before the broadcast ended was from Peter Hartcher.  What do you think it was?  Having heard Combet describe Tony Abbott’s opportunistic negativity, Hartcher picked up on that and asserted that Julia Gillard was equally opportunistic.  Combet answered him calmly and convincingly, but from the look on his face, he was not convinced, nor will he ever be.  This is his theme, one he pushed near the end of his book, which to that point extolled the virtues of Australia, economic and cultural.  He asserted that what he liked to call opportunistic leadership on both sides could ‘throw it all away’.  Like a dog worrying a bone, he will not let this tasty morsel go.

Ad astra

June 20. 2012 03:09 PM

Lyn

Hi Ad and Everybody

Twitterati for you:

News Limited:

Mark Colvin‏@Colvinius
News Ltd CEO Kim Williams will talk to me live on the Local Radio PM. Tune in at 6pm on local radio or stream at http://abc.net.au/pm

Terry Flew‏@flew
On #abcnews24 at 4pm to discuss #fairfax #newslimited and #newspapers

Mr Denmore‏@MrDenmore
So Murdoch will now control the entire pay TV industry and 70% of metro print media; Rinehart will control the rest (plus Channel 10)

ABC News‏@abcnews
#NewsLtd boss announces massive restructuring of the way it delivers news. Take a look at our blog for all the latest: www.abc.net.au/.../4080756

Greg Jericho‏@GrogsGamut
Nothing like an infomercial

Séan‏@esseeeayeenn
@ABCNews24 So you're running a promotional video for News Ltd instead of question time in the House of Representatives? #auspol #qt

Simon Cullen‏@Simon_Cullen
News Ltd boss Kim Williams: We can not say today how many positions will be made redundant

Darryl Snow‏@lapuntadelfin
I assume this infomercial is an act of gratitude to News Ltd for providing all of the ABC's content #ABCNews24

Simon Palan‏@SimonPalan
#Breaking Kim Williams confirms News Limited has purchased Business Spectator and The Eureka Report.

Not Rupert Murdoch‏@RupertMurdochPR
Between #Fairfax and #NewsLtd, Australian media job cuts will total more than 2700. Astounding.

Julia Gillard‏@JuliaGillard
From today 1.3 million families will start seeing the Schoolkids Bonus in their bank accounts http://www.alp.org.au/families/schoolkids-bonus #CashForYou TeamJG

Greg Combet national Press Club Address:-

Le Grace‏@bow_and_arrow
"Gutless, political opportunist" - Combet describing Abbott. #iloveyou #npc

Greg Jericho‏@GrogsGamut
Combet @re-frames question as: "Did I anticipate Tony Abbott would be a gutless opportunist?" #npc

Question Time

Marian Dalton‏@crazyjane13
Bradbury - after nearly being shouted down - gleefully reminds everyone of Coalition dirty tricks with pamphlets during 2010 election

Matt Martin‏@LeftyMatt
Good lord. How did the opposition not realise such a question to Bradbury would be a pure gift? Now their back for more! #qt

Misha Schubert‏@mishaschubert
Luke Simpkins, the Liberal MP most often conflated with ABC political journo Mark Simkin, booted from #qt

Olivia Illyria‏@OliviaIllyria
Member for Cowan 94a'd. Burke should've just gone to Rio anyway.

sortius‏@sortius
BAHAHAHA, Pyne complaining about an "abuse of #qt"? LNP really are losing their marbles now. July 1st is the day their rhetoric dies

Chris Johnson‏@seearjay
Tony 'Gazelle' Abbott getting pwned brilliantly by Albo. How much damage has Ankles done to the Liberal brand? #QT

Greg Jericho‏@GrogsGamut
@AlboMP in full "fighting Tories" mode #qt

Séan‏@esseeeayeenn
Convenient for @AlexHawkeMP to forget his own leaflets lamenting the fact his electorate won't get the #NBN before Abbott destroys it.

Lyn

June 20. 2012 03:10 PM

Patriciawa

Thanks, TT and AA, crazy the way one hesitates before posting something.  And the only way to know if it can be sung is to send it off to a pro' which I will now do.

Re Hartcher et al ever admitting they were wrong about the PM.   That would be asking them to eat crow and apologise for almost everything they've written for almost two years.

Does Hartcher really believe that Julia Gillard is opportunistic in being honest, fair and constructive in response to Abbott's lying, bias and negativity?  That she has decided to say YES as often as he says NO, to ignore his tirades and to smile in the face of his rages?

Maybe she has in some sense.  But being honest is hard to fake.
And so is the development, writing and passage of a huge raft of legislative reforms which required careful and patient negotiation.

Patriciawa

June 20. 2012 04:02 PM

Psyclaw


The last question at QT today saw Albo at his very best.

A very naive Colonition Member (from Mitchell) had earlier asked a question of David Bradbury (Asstnt Treasurer) about a pamphlet he had put out bragging about the surplus prematurely ...... it won't be actually seen to be delivered until the 2013 budget time.

Bradbury's seat is Lindsey, where Jackie Kelly's team had put out a racist pamphlet in the 2007 election (or 2010, I forget which, but tempus fugit) which cost her the seat. So Bradbury gave the questioner a caning about that.

But Albo's office was on to it and 20 minutes later Albo had in his hand the questioner's own recent electorate pamphlet bemoaning the fact that the electorate had been omitted from the NBN next-to-be-done list.

The very same NBN that the questioner and his Abbotteer mob have voted against and criticise on a daily basis.

Well! What hilarity! What uproar! What joy to me!

Albo exploded into a speech which effectively turned the Abbotteers into a mob of wincing, embarrassed, head hanging sheep as though lined up on a Monday morning outside the doors of the local abattoir waiting for the chop. The hypocritical appearances of Abbotteers at BER openings was of course also used by Albo to subdue the foe.

And to the dismay of the Abbotteers on that very high note for the government, Mr Swan was right on cue moving that all further questions be put on the notice paper.

Generally QT again was a clear win for the government.

It is so pleasurable to watch the retreat.

Psyclaw

June 20. 2012 04:33 PM

Tom of Melbourne

No wonder so many here just love Gillard, and argue that she’s not opportunistic. Here are a couple of examples.
•  Wants taxpayer funded school chaplains - genuine principle or political expedience/opportunism?
•  Hate marriage equality, knowing that ostracising homosexual youth is a major cause of high rates of youth suicide - genuine principle or political expedience?
•  Panders to Andrew Wilkie when it was politically expedient
•  Deceives Andrew Wilkie when it was politically expedient
•  Says “there will be no carbon tax” when it was politically expedient
•  Want a carbon tax because it became politically expedient
•  Says a emissions reform/carbon tax will fail “without community consensus”, because it is politically expedient
•  Wanted a big committee to make the decision for her, until it became politically inconvenient.
A woman of high principle, no doubt.

Tom of Melbourne

June 20. 2012 04:49 PM

Psyclaw


ToM

Good to see you back. That was a long hide!

In an earlier post you mentioned that Keating could bring off an "embraced" reform and that JG didn't have the requisite skills to do so.

I note 2 weeks back at the Mabo anniversary the film of Keating speaking to the Annual Dinner of the Minerals Association of Australia (the then version) in the early 1990s about Mabo. He walked right into the den of thieves and gave it to them straight! "Embraced" indeed!

This was the last occasion when your mob screamed lies of blue murder .... the sky will fall .... all our backyards will be taken by our indigenous brethren ...... oh woe is us ..... we'll all be rooned. And we're still suffering! Ha! Ha!

I trust you recall this although I know you won't concede (A bit like Paul Barry to Mr Loss-of-Memory Bond when Mr Bond trampled Barry's business card "So you do remember me Mr Bond" said PB)


I'm still waiting for the reforms "embraced" by the electorate ..... one eg will do.

Psyclaw

June 20. 2012 05:00 PM

Pikiranku

Just catching up here ... Talk Turkey, how did a fella from Corny Point ever manage to produce a thinker of your calibre and persuasion?  We're SYP-dwellers here and we often feel as though we're about to drown in an ocean of tories and rednecks!  That's why we need all you bloggers so badly - you're the voice of sanity in our lives.
By the way, is it just my imagination or is there a disproportionate number of South Australians contributing to this blog and to PB?  I've often wondered (if it is actually the case) whether it's because our local newspaper is so appalling that people here have been driven earlier and in greater numbers to find alternative sources of information and opinion.  If Fairfax newspapers go the way of their respective Murdoch rivals (so far right and so dishonest they have no credibility) then all those compliant journos could be simply accelerating their own demise. In the new world of journalism, which I suspect is approaching faster than any of us realise, they might have to go freelance and sell their products to websites which are sustained by advertising.  That'll be a change for them - they might actually have to produce something original to make a living instead of regurgitating one another's work.
Last question: I know I'm a bit part-time but can I please be included in your girls' brigade?

Pikiranku

June 20. 2012 06:42 PM

Tom of Melbourne

By the way, was expressing “complete confidence” in Thomson, followed quickly by “he’s crossed a line” which deserved ejection from the party, a principled position, or was it “opportunistic”?
------------------------------
I have no idea what you’re on about. But if you want to argue that Hawke and Keating didn’t introduce far reaching reforms, which weren’t accepted and embraced by the electorate, then go ahead.

Tom of Melbourne

June 20. 2012 06:44 PM

jane

TT, as well as Donny Dunstan, we had Des Corcoran, nurtured a young Hawkey, the fabulous Penny Wong, Kate Ellis, Steve Georganas, Amanda Rishworth etc and a certain bloodnut.

Patricia, Rinehart also inherited her mining business, so she hasn't exactly done the hard yards.

Re Hartcher. Not once has he made ANY reference to the fact that Julia Gillard negotiated support from the three conservative Independents to allow her to form the minority government and that she continues to enjoy their support.

Not once has this clown acknowledged the raft of legislation that her government has successfully passed, nor the reforms that have been put in place by this government, nor the support she gets from her team.

To suggest that she is cut from the same cloth as Liealot is not only a lie but stupid in the extreme.

AFAIC, Hartcher has negated all his arguments in his book. Epic fail, Mr Hartcher! You have showed your self in your true colours. I pronounce you a lying charlatan, no better than that other lying charlatan Shamaham!

Oh look! ToM's trolling again! Who woulda thunk?

jane

June 20. 2012 06:49 PM

Tom of Melbourne

Not at all Jane. Your use of the “troll” label just demonstrates the lack of capability to reply rationally. It’s a short way of saying “I can’t think of a reply to support my position”

Tom of Melbourne

June 20. 2012 06:59 PM

Jason

jane,
    Yep it's ground hog day! ToM singing the same old tired tune.

Jason

June 20. 2012 07:07 PM

BSA Bob

ToM
Did Julia Gillard say "he's crossed a line"? I don't think so.

BSA Bob

June 20. 2012 07:21 PM

jaycee

Having winced through some of Shanahan's "reporting" of the G20 meeting, I have to grudgingly concede he has perfected a style of writing openly promoted through rigorous training methods within, but not restricted to, New Slimedited. It is suitably titled "Sphincta-script" and involves a dexterous manipulation of a writing tool subtly inserted in situ. Trouble is, once a statement is committed to paper, it cannot be retracted without causing grevious injury!...This style of opinion writing has been adopted, you'll notice, by many right-wing commentators as it precludes all possibility of admitting error without dire consequences! There is but one fault, however..:there is great risk of spoiling ones' copy-book when at the last moment of placing that full-stop on the piece, when such extra effort of making a force-full point can quite often result (as we have seen in the Shanahan piece)in a spectacular effluvial deposit! But all is not lost, as those who seek opinion from such a source as New Slimedited are not put off by the smell!  

jaycee

June 20. 2012 08:03 PM

Psyclaw


ToM

I'm still waiting for the reforms "embraced" by the electorate ..... one eg will do.

Any past PM's reform will do. It's been more than a week now and you still haven't put up.

And I see you're still using "embraced" ....... as someone  (many) have written,  conservos just have no shame.

Guess you'll just have to put your creative hat on again and make up an example. But we're on to you about your creative writing ..... it's incredible, really incredible.

Psyclaw

June 20. 2012 08:28 PM

Tom of Melbourne

That makes so much difference to political opportunism, doesn’t it?

Have it your way then. Gillard repeatedly expressed her “complete confidence” in Thomson.  Soon after her expression of confidence (apparently arbitrally) kicked him out of the caucus and the party, without him crossing a line.
--------------------------------
Really I have no idea what you’re on about Psyclaw, but if it makes you feel good, presume you’ve won a point.


Tom of Melbourne

June 20. 2012 08:50 PM

Psyclaw


ToM

Well ToM, one fact of life is that when you tell porkies you have to remember them. I have no doubt that your pissy retort Really I have no idea what you’re on about Psyclaw, but if it makes you feel good, presume you’ve won a point. simply refelects your reluctance as a conservo to be truthful.

Of course you know what I'm on about! And I'm not the only one who knows that you know!

I don't want to win "a point". But I do want to discuss matters on a level ie truthful playing field.

Psyclaw

June 20. 2012 09:01 PM

TalkTurkey

Pikiranku
That is two comments today to give me a swelled head!
Thank you and glad if TPS can leaven your SYP lump a little.
It sure leavens my Adelaide one.

Actually Eyre Peninsulans are a lot more bigoted imo, and a lot richer on average, than their YP cousins, and I should know, I have cousins on both peninsulas.

SA at least seems to hold its head up here, though I've only ever met one of us, the redoubtable Jason Obelix. One day we will arrange another meeting in town for as many Crowies as can make it; we had lunch with Ad astra in February the memory of which Jason and I treasure, and we want to do it again; even if he's not here we can have a good time . . . Chance you might ever make it?

Funny you wonder about SA's lack of a real newspaper (or rather, the presence of the SAdvertiser!) as a motivator to find alternatives: just this morning an old (ex-Adelaide)Labor friend rang from her 11th floor penthouse hovel overlooking the slums of Potts Point - (it's bloody breathtaking! ), saying Oh woe, what will I read on the train in the mornings when the SMH is gone, I told her, Make the transition to the 5th Estate! and I know she will too, she is very media savvy, but "I like the feel of a real newspaper", well stiff cheese, never mind the material, look at the text! The reading here is so-o-o-o much better, I don't just mean TPS, I mean we get Bushfire Bill and Grog's Gamut, Poll Bludger and Cafe Whispers, we get Twitterverse and Peter WIXXY Wicks and Craig Emerson, YO! Everything that's happening, sans spin.  

You get Youtube!
You know how I feel about that? I'll let it tell you itself:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPStw1SzcQc

By default to a disgraceful degree, we are sort of cutting edge when it comes to political communication - (The Political Sword itself comes to mind as I write that!) -
By default, because it should be the Fourth Estate informing and advising and educating but they are as Mr Denmore has long said, the Failed Estate. We are having to do it ourselves.

Think of what Investigative Journalist First Class Peter Wicks has achieved - and how utterly failed has been the MSM, but worse, so much more menacingly, reeking of complicity in minimising the huge issues of honesty involved - in everything up to and including the preparedness to wage war in places we have no business. In the case of the WIXXY XXXFiles, they will not tell the truth! What!???

And cutting edge, because we are having to feel our way, how to deploy this amazing hyper-communicative tool to challenge and vanquish the might of the Merdeochs and Rindlards, all the staunch Leftish bloggers on all the staunch Leftish blogsites, but our TPS in supremely special, because our host Ad astra dedicated it from its inception to bringing politicians and commentators to account, exactly right, and because we are blessed with the residency of the Most Fantastic Ignorance Fighter the World has Ever Known, our Tweetie Bird Lyn, sprinkling magic feather dust to open everyone's eyes to Truth in the early early morning . . .

And just that Ad's blog is unique in that dedication, and that Lyn has been able, indeed impelled, to become uniquely pivotal in interconnecting the whole Australian political web - that is cutting edge imho, and as far as I am concerned it makes it incumbent on me to do the best I can for TPS, because it's the best way I know of supporting this great Government and keeping the pigs and jackals from tearing my homeland to pieces.  

So Wow. I love it.

But most of all I value it as a weapon against the Forces of Darkness, and they are very very real.  

What are we to do? Well no-one has an answer but when one comes up it will be here. In the meantime we must make this the best medium we can, because it is our first and last resort. [/i]

WRT your "Last question: I know I'm a bit part-time but can I please be included in your girls' brigade?" . . .

. . . Well, h'mmm, if you are a nice bloke I'm sure the girls won't mind but you better ask them I guess.

If you're a girl (as I suppose but am not certain) who am I a mere bloke to say nay?

Either way though you are full-time! Smile

Thanks again, and Psyclaw too. I love the thought that something I say might lift folks' spirits and resolve even a little. - As you help lift mine you see.

This is a fighting blogsite and I am prouder than I can say of our Swordsfolks. All I can really say is, Comrades, double the fists and set the jaws, we MUST win and we will by doing our best to force the bastards to ackowledge the Truth.

VENCEREMOS! No pasaran!

(*We WILL win! They SHALL NOT pass!*)

(Sandinista Warcry. Staunch eh!)

TalkTurkey

June 20. 2012 09:04 PM

Tom of Melbourne

Hawke won a succession of elections, Keating won the unwinnable one. They delivered many significant economic, industrial and social reforms, I’ve previously listed a few.

No one ever campaigned to re-regulate the banks, end enterprise bargaining, unfloat the dollar, end the Button car industry plan.

No one ever campaigned to overturn their reforms because the public was persuaded that they were in their interests, they “embraced” reforms. The reforms endured beyond their period in government because everyone recognised good public policy.

Gillard doesn’t have the credibility to achieve this. That’s a big difference.

Tom of Melbourne

June 20. 2012 09:20 PM

2353

Nice try ToM but it doesn't cut it.  LOTO is not "just saying no" because the policy being brought forward by the Government is bad - he is doing so in pursuit of a strategy to demean and destroy because in his simple little mind, the population gave the wrong decision in 2010 and he was too aggro when it came to negotiating skills (probably because he can't compromise).

If the policy was bad, the independents and the Greens would certainly signal their belief and the Government would either amend or withdraw the legislation - as has happened in the current term of Parliament - the "offshore processing of refugees" legislation was and is a bad idea, regardless who does it.  That is good Government.

The CPRS is I think about 10 bills.  That leaves around 290 that have sailed through with just a murmur (if that).  So  by your own definition lets say 250+ items of legislation passed by the current Government in the current term have been "embraced" by the public as No one ever campaigned to overturn their reforms because the public was persuaded that they were in their interests, they “embraced” reforms. .  I suspect a lot of them will endure beyond the current Government as well - we'll have to wait and see.

All of which means that  Gillard does have the credibility and you still need to prove your point to psyclaw.

2353

June 20. 2012 09:38 PM

Pikiranku

ToM
Are you really seriously saying that a price on carbon is not good public policy?  You obviously didn't hear Greg Combet at the National Press Club today.  If anyone had needed convincing I'm sure they would have been by him today.  It was a brilliant performance - intelligent, well-argued, lucidly expressed, visionary.
I believe that this policy and many of the other major reforms achieved by the Gillard government will eventually be accepted by the public and that Julia Gillard and her extremely capable team will gain the recognition they deserve.
TT I didn't express myself too well there - when I said 'your' girls' brigade I didn't mean yours personally but TPS's.  
It would be great to catch up with you one day but we can't do it soon - we're about to disappear over the horizon in our little camper-trailer, do the grey nomad bit, for a few months.  But we have invested in a lap-top, solely so that we won't be information-deprived while we're away. so we'll still be able to hang on your words.  See what you bloggers have done to us!  I've yet to work out how I'm going to get through all of Lyn's Links and see Australia at the same time! (Lyn, you're a star!)

Pikiranku

June 20. 2012 09:45 PM

Psyclaw


2353
Nice logical argument:

So  by your own definition lets say 250+ items of legislation passed by the current Government in the current term have been "embraced" by the public as No one ever campaigned to overturn their reforms because the public was persuaded that they were in their interests, they “embraced” reforms.

ipso facto  JG has the credibility to have 250+ pieces of legislation embraced.

And once again for you ToM, Keating got the Mabo legislation through when it was not only not embraced, it was subject to an intense fear mongering campaign just like the carbon pricing scheme.

And now   ........ it's law, L-A-W and the fear campaign is all forgotten.

As to the carbon pricing (and other JG reforms) about which you conservos continue to manufacture and scream fear, it is also now L-A-W and in a few short years some will wonder what all the fear hoo haa was about.

And we will tell them it was about the times when the conservos folded up and submitted to the influence of an unethical, power seeking, self interested pug.

That it was about the time when the conservos all lost their backbones. And hopefully we will by then be able to say "but XXXXXX (Turnbull?) turned it around, got rid of the pug and the conservos are once again credible, decent humans, if politically misguided."

Psyclaw

June 21. 2012 07:18 AM

Lyn

TODAY’S LINKS

More Of That Jazz, Wixxy, Wixxy Leaks
Waiting to greet her apparently, with open arms and a big smooch was Andrew Lillicrap, Andrew and Kathy then proceeded to have a lengthy, behind closed doors, meeting. This was also done in Union offices, which some some would say makes a mockery of Justice Flicks orders.
wixxy.wordpress.com/2012/06/20/more-of-that-jazz/

The mysterious Pell, Barry Everingham, Independent Australia
In the past few weeks, we have been presented with cover stories of Australia’s two most extreme right-wing figures – Sophie Mirabella and George Pell – and we can live in hopes that Narastek will soon share with us a doubled edged trifecta — a 2 of Us look at Andrew Bolt and his guide, mentor, and employer, Gina Rinehart.
www.independentaustralia.net/.../

News Ltd restructure:merged divisions,no cuts yet,Andrew Crook, Crikey
News Limited CEO Kim Williams has refused to say how many of the company’s 8000 staff will be sacked in a homely video address to the nation this afternoon announcing his plans to slash the media giant’s cost base.
www.crikey.com.au/.../

Illusionary wealth and the housing bubble threat, Greg Jericho, The Drum
During the GFC, both the fiscal and monetary arms of economic policy worked together. One of the consequences of the GFC is that due to lower inflation and lower interest rates, if another recession comes headed our way from overseas, the fiscal side will most likely have to do more of the heavy lifting.
http://www.abc.net.au/unleashed/4081306.html

Personal Carbon Price Countdown , Alex Schlotzer
It’s not long until Australia joins many other economies around the world taking economic measures to address greenhouse gas emissions. From July 1 the carbon price comes into affect. It means that Australia will price the pollution from the 500 biggest emitters in our country.
http://alexschlotzer.wordpress.com/

After Fairfax- what’s the  price of a free press-, Overland Org.
In the past Australia spent public funds to create a rail network, a telephone system, a national bank, a postal network and an airline and we are currently spending billions of dollars on a National Broadband Network, so why not establish a publicly funded model to maintain a free press?
overland.org.au/.../

The decline and fall of reason, Mungo Maccallum, The Drum
Hartcher maintains, the victims of a long bout of overindulgence. In Europe, the symptoms are already obvious; in America and Japan, they are becoming more so as a result of gross overspending by governments. And in Australia, they are the product of a feeling of entitlement that has grown up through the profligate vote-buying of the Howard government through buckets of middle-class welfare.
http://www.abc.net.au/unleashed/4081726.html

The Rant #11: Oh Little Electron, Why Art Thy So Costly? Deknarf, The Australia Blog
It was presented with little or no fanfare, and left with barely a squeak from the media. What was this fanfareless squeak you might ask? It was the report prepared by CME for the Energy Users Association of Australia, entitled; ‘Electricity Prices in Australia: A Comparison’ (March 2012). The document can be found at
deknarf.wordpress.com/.../

Fairfax and Gina Hancock, Archie, ArchieArchives
Gina, will have the momentum to run for another decade but by then the signs of decomposition will be apparent to all. Not only has Gina no media savvy, she is going into a dying print industry. One wonders how many of her billions she is willing to waste in propping up a flogged dead donkey.She will push her anti-tax, anti-socialiast
archiearchive.wordpress.com/.../

Geoff Gallop writes Gina Rinehart, Fairfax and the ‘war’ politics of the Australian right, Turn Left 2013
If Tony Abbott says it will be a good thing, he means for him, not the country, not you or me. However, not everyone agrees that this is a good thing
turnleft2013.wordpress.com/.../Premier

The Blackest of Abysmal Hyperbole, Only The Depth Varies
Newman’s slash and burn solution to the Labor Government’s economic legacy is to cut – cut – cut. I’ve lost track of the number of projects and programmes that have been seen funding cut or cancelled altogether. Underlying all of thathas been the constant threat that public service jobs were in danger
http://onlythedepthvaries.blogspot.com.au/

The sloppy ABC takes cues from sloppy News Limited, ABC Has Gone to Hell
Likewise, it was shown that ABC’s AM Radio program featuring G20 correspondent Jane Cowan was guilty of the lesser crime of being ambiguous in her language and confusing criticism meant for Canada as also applying to Australia.
www.abcgonetohell.net/.../the-sloppy-abc-takes-cues-from-sloppy-news-limited

INDEPEN-DENSE: Fairfax fiends fiddle with Gina while home burns, Vex News
The radio assets – talk-back radio whose employees include former One Nation MP David Oldfield and boofhead ex-FM radio refugee Paul Murray who boasted on-air recently that he was on Kathy Jackson’s “side” in the HSU scandal (despite worrying primary document evidence about her rorting circulating online and pretensions to be a journalist) www.vexnews.com/.../

The Great Global Media, Gonzomeetsthepress. Com
DisruptionYet publishers are also aware that clinging to print makes it more difficult to become fully digital, responding to new technology breakthroughs and to fast-changing audience needs and market opportunities.
gonzomeetsthepress.com/.../

The Seagulls Pounce on the Chip – Media Watch and Fairfax, Preston Towers, The Preston Institute
Even today, though, we still have the article available where Simon Benson is reporting it as fact, ending with an “Abbott agrees with “the Europeans”, which demonstrates not only bias but a sudden conflation of the “criticism” to more than one European. In a usual pattern, in the morning, ABC news outlets picked up the News Limited line and ran
prestoninstitute.com/2012/06/20/mediawatchfairfax/

Not many #lolBolts left, Jeremy Sear, Pure Poison
There’s not much time left for the gentle amusement of #lolBolts, but the great man is doing his best to send us off in style.
blogs.crikey.com.au/.../

With Gina poised, a new class of conservative elites now rule the roost , Mark Davis, The Conversation
For years, in the tabloid media and on talkback radio, we’ve been hearing about the domination of Australian politics by a “new class” of left-wing “cultural elites”, but the Rinehart ascendancy at Fairfax confirms quite a different trend: a new conservative elite now rules the roost. One backed by cold hard cash and reported demands for control of editorial agendas.
theconversation.edu.au/with-gina-poised-a-new-class-of-conservative-elites-now-rule-the-roost-7761

John Fairfax – more road kill on the superhighway, Paul Budde , The Budde Blog
Sadly, John Fairfax is becoming another piece of road kill along the superhighway, alongside others such as music companies, retailers, Kodak, Nokia and Blueberry. The message is the same every single time – trying to protect a dying business/industry is futile
www.buddeblog.com.au/.../

To Sophie Mirabella: “Meh” is a Loaded Word., New Anthropocene
If young people are disinterested in democracy, it’s only because they have grown up in an age where it has barely been expressed within Australia. Their living memory consists almost entirely of the Howard years and the petty war since his demise. All they know of mass demonstrations is the sedate and ill-defined “Occupy”
newanthropocene.wordpress.com/.../

A Modern-Day Passion Play, Zoe Krupka, New Matilda
The Slipper saga has dominated the headlines but beyond the scandal lies an age-old question - can a crooked road take us where we need to go? Zoe Krupka talks compromise
newmatilda.com/2012/06/20/modern-day-passion-play

Kim Williams’ Big Wednesday sees him get stuck in at News, Angela Priestley, The Power Index
Indeed, Williams' Big Wednesday has seen him ramp up his digital media credentials. ConsMedia owns 25% of Foxtel, and the takeover will also give News the final 50% stake in Fox Sports that it doesn't already own. His long-awaited major restructure will see him make significant staff cuts to consolidate the empire's digital
www.thepowerindex.com.au/.../201206201468

Four reasons Abbott won’t repeal the carbon tax, Daniel Palmer, Climate Spectator
Let’s also say that Abbott wins the next election, but not in a landslide. For the purposes of crystal balling, we also have the luxury of predicting Abbott’s popularity to remain linked to the ‘un’ prefix. With this and double dissolution history in mind, a fresh election a year after gaining a first term as prime minister would be brash, dangerous and just plain stupid
www.climatespectator.com.au/.../four-reasons-abbott-won-t-repeal-carbon-tax.

Neil Mitchell moves from Seven to Nine, Mumbrella
Mitchell said: “I’ve always admired and respected Nine’s commitment to news and current affairs and I’m now privileged to be a part of it. I believe that good journalism is audience driven and Nine clearly follows that philosophy too. I’m sure we will work well together
mumbrella.com.au/neil-mitchell-moves-from-seven-to-nine-98091

Abbott, Hockey mislead again on NBN funding, Renai LeMay, Delimiter It is clear that the NBN investment is an investment expected to make a return, not an expense. This is a fact, and the Coalition should start to recognise this as a fact. It’s not an issue which can be meaningfully debated, without throwing currently accepted accounting standards out the window.
delimiter.com.au/.../

Posts from the ‘Daily Fix’ Category
australianpoliticstv.org/category/daily-fix/

TODAY’S FRONT PAGES
Australia Newspaper Front Pages for 21 June 2012
www.frontpagestoday.co.uk/index.cfm

Lyn

June 21. 2012 08:23 AM

Ad astra

LYN'S DAILY LINKS updated: www.thepoliticalsword.com/.../...-DAILY-LINKS.aspx

Ad astra

June 21. 2012 08:25 AM

Gravel

PatriciaWA

Your pome is just fantastic, well done again.

Lyn

You seem to be indefatigable, all your links and twitter links, thanks heaps.

Talk Turkey

I just love your enthusiasm, keep it going.  

Gravel

June 21. 2012 09:16 AM

TalkTurkey

Gravel said and I second

PatriciaWA
Your pome is just fantastic, well done again.
Bard(ine) of the Blogosphere!

Lyn
You seem to be indefatigable, all your links and twitter links, thanks heaps.
I think Lyn is the single most valuable contributor on the entire Blogosphere (If there is an inclusive term for Twitter and websites et al that's what I mean.) Even if it weren't for her welcoming and her own encouraging and her own comments, her Links by themselves would be enough to make her so. We are blessed. Without her there wouldn't be her!


Talk Turkey

I just love your enthusiasm, keep it going.

Yeah but yous-all gotta sing along!

Smile  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMddte6yD2w  Smile

     That's the way to do it!


TalkTurkey

June 21. 2012 09:26 AM

TalkTurkey

Well if a dog can do it, there is still hope for us, (watch till the end because it gets more complicated)

http://www.wimp.com/dogpitch/

. . . with Dog on our side!

TalkTurkey

June 21. 2012 09:52 AM

TalkTurkey

Gravel
If you tweet
check out our Tweetie's tweets in the last hour or so!

She is a one-canary phenomenon!

TalkTurkey

June 21. 2012 11:03 AM

42 long

I recall John Howard telling us that we all had plenty of wealth in out houses and other assetts, and we had never been better off. Well......
   When things get tough, It's a job you need, or you have to sell your house, and when everybody else is doing the same, it goes pear shaped, and your asset becomes a liability.
People who get conned into going into the share market using their equity in the family home are gone totally. Greed?  probably.
  No-one could get into a house if they had to pay cash for it.
  National infrastructure would surely be a similar concept, as it increases efficiency. Roads , rail, airports  NBN? etc..
   You can overdo that as Japan has done.
   Lets see if the "slash and burn" technique of the "new" state governments does much besides slowing the economy down and giving hardship to the ordinary people.
   People out of work don't pay tax and have some cost burden  maybe including being gaoled for stealing food, after you have cut off their injury benefits. I suppose that's one way of looking after the homeless. fitting I suppose, wasn't that the way most of the early english got to live here. FREE transport too. That was going a bit overboard.
   Don't worry Barry, those people don't vote liberal anyhow

42 long

June 21. 2012 11:41 AM

Lyn

Good Morning Ad and Everybody

Twitterverse:


TheFinnigans天地有道人无道‏@Thefinnigans
Christine Lagarde, the stylish head of IMF, has only praise for PM Gillard's dress sense - that’s a BISONette - www.perthnow.com.au/.../story-e6frg12c-1226403700987 via PB

TheFinnigans天地有道人无道‏@Thefinnigans
@CraigEmersonMP Emmo, this cant be left unchallenged. Another blatant CP impact lie by #NewsCorpse (via PB Bilbo) - blogs.crikey.com.au/.../#comment-1309615

Toastman‏@stman51
Rudd support's Gillard again www.smh.com.au/.../...s-circle-20120620-20on0.html via @smh Get over it you clown, there is far more interesting news to report!

archiearchive‏@archiearchive
Phil Coorey making junk up again! It must be a public polling weekend coming up. http://is.gd/hkELeR

Concera Vota‏@conceravota
@pthr9 Coorey is getting as ridiculous as Grattan. They're like dogs with bones who try to fashion their world according to their desires

Ashley Leahy‏@AshleyLeahy
Haha #newspoll weekend > "Rudd shadows Gillard again as supporters circle" www.theage.com.au/.../...ircle-20120620-20on0.html

Honorific Spud‏@SpudBenBean
#Newspoll starts tonight? Phil Coorey on the #Leadershit bandwagon again?

Andrew Elder‏@awelder
@SpudBenBean He's decided to go out in a blaze of piffle
Financial Review‏@FinancialReview
#NZ #economy grows at twice expected pace as good weather boosts #dairy. [free] www.afr.com/.../nz_economy_grows_at_twice_expected_mKA8j2FDG6xbe8wNevh0IO

Lenore Taylor‏@lenoretaylor
www.smh.com.au/.../...greement-20120621-20p66.html

Brisbane Times‏@brisbanetimes
Miles Franklin winner savages Premier Newman over literary award axing www.brisbanetimes.com.au/.../...0120621-20p79.html

Not Rupert Murdoch‏@RupertMurdochPR
A small sampling from @Crikey_news of how @RupertMurdoch Oz media covered the gutting of its own #NewsLtd media.crikey.com.au/.../News-news-wrap-June-21.jpg #Murdocracy

Not Rupert Murdoch‏@RupertMurdochPRExpand Collapse Correction: The @Australian has more than 9 photos of #NewsLtd CEO Kim Williams on its website today under 'news.' #Murdocracy

Matthew Ross ‏@Matt_Ros
“@roooney83: The #brokenpromises Barry O'Farrell will live to regret http://bit.ly/KO1rNZ #hillstransport” #1termpremier

Lyn

June 21. 2012 12:02 PM

Psyclaw


42 Long

O'Farrell's cutting of Workcover might come back to burn him as did his attempt just 12 months ago to cut back the solar panel feed-in benefits. He had to do a backflip on that about 4 weeks later.

The NSW firies general strike today .... their first since 1956 ie their first in 56 bloody years will perhaps give him the message.

That he is cutting benefits retrospectively is a disgrace.

With the exception of Queensland (who would be so courageous as to guess how the turkeys up there might vote .... they kept Joe in for 2 decades so their thought processes are quite questionable ...... sorry to use your name in vain TT ...... apologies to the Qld Swordsters who obviously didn't vote for Joe)  having conservo governments in the states is probably an asset to JG .... their slash and burn rorts so far and over the first half of 2013 should alert even the dumbest of voters what they stand for.

Psyclaw

June 21. 2012 12:18 PM

Lyn

Hi Ad

Wonder if the MSM will put this on their front page, I think not

Gillard to co-chair UN group tackling poverty ,Lenore Taylor @11:28AM

Ms Gillard replaces former Spanish prime minister Jose Luis Rodriguez Zapatero, who lost office last year, and her co-chair is the Rwandan President Paul Kagame.

After the announcement, she and Mr Ban sped through the crowded conference grounds in a golf buggy to their next public event - the launch of Korea's Global Green Growth Institute, to which Australia has pledged $15 million. Scores of golf buggies are being used to ferry VIPs around the huge site.
www.smh.com.au/.../...-poverty-20120621-20pdw.html

Lyn

June 21. 2012 12:23 PM

42 long

The actions of all conservative state governments HAVE to be a plus for Federal labour. Normally the issues are fairly local but there is a strong case to suggest that Abbott has the same recipe and enough might be enough  with the timing of the next Federal election.
  Abbott's strategy would not have envisaged that time frame, applying. It was supposed to happen quickly.
  Slipper and Thomson are not going to be the answer. As time goes by they are increasingly shaping up as a potential serious if not terminal disaster, for the current leadership of the conservatives.  

42 long

June 21. 2012 01:00 PM

BSA Bob

Lyn at 12.18
Of course they won't put it on their front pages. The real question is whether they'll mention it at all. I'll have to look at at least one tabloid 6pm news tonight to see if it gets any mention. I believe Abbott gave a presser this morning, so a sycophantic coverage of that may suffice as the "political" story of the day. I hope I'm wrong, even if Julia's new appointment is mentioned there'll be little positive coverage, I think.

BSA Bob

June 21. 2012 01:18 PM

NormanK

Psyclaw

Lay off Queensland. For 18 and a half of the last 20 years we have had Labor governments, something no other state can boast. Do we get credit for being the most progressive state over the last two decades? No, instead people want to hark back to the days of Joh (note spelling) who had a stranglehold on the state through a gerrymander.

I despise this habit of describing groups of people as though they have some collective mentality or way of thinking. Did you just take it on the chin if someone said "Australians were in favour of invading Iraq"?

With your background, I would have thought that you would be one of the first to acknowledge that human beings are strange creatures capable of perverse and contradictory behaviour.  You don't just insult me, you insult my neighbours and friends who each had their own reasons for voting the way that they did in the last election. There were a wide variety of factors at play and I don't regard 'questionable thought processes' as being high among them.

NormanK

June 21. 2012 01:45 PM

Ad astra

Hi Lyn
What a contrast – her party opponents are supposedly ‘circling’ her, while she is shining on the world stage, being appointed to co-chair an international committee on poverty, selected by Ban Ki-moon to make a "final push" for implementation of the millennium development goals by the target date of 2015, selected because of her "vision, leadership and commitment".  And IMF chair, Christine Lagard thinks she has great dress sense.  Who would have thought it.

Suggested Shanahan headlines in The Oz:

PM Gillard appointed to chair international committee on poverty
She has vision, leadership and commitment says UN Chief.

Ad astra

June 21. 2012 01:57 PM

42 long

The collective vote may not be what most individual voters even considered. For example, someone  just want's to give them a lesson and a warning, I'm going to vote against but usually votes for. The " so called "swinging" voter. The size of that group would be flexible.
  I put it down to a single media monopoly in Queensland as much as anything else I can think of.
   There was no point even mentioning Julia up there for a long time. I just had to keep quiet. The criticism was always couched in the same potted terms. Someone had really done a "job" up there. probably made a big deal of the "local Boy" Kevin being diddled by those mexicans cockroaches south of the border . WA uses this all the time. It's always good for a run. Locals battle against Canberra (eastern staters.) etc
Western Sydney seems similar. Clubs and shock jocks I believe it's difficult to not go along with it when you are bombarded constantly with radio and newspaper coverage. IT works. That's why they put in the effort, and the MONEY. Who owns Macquarie radio?

42 long

June 21. 2012 03:34 PM

psyclaw


NormanK

Your reprimand is accepted. I was being mainly  tongue in cheek, but not quite 100%.

My inclusion "apologies to the Qld Swordsters who obviously didn't vote for Joe " was meant to convey that I wasn't tarring all northerners with the same brush.

psyclaw

June 21. 2012 03:44 PM

Patriciawa

Psyclaw re Queensland. One always assumed that the pendulum swing, having been so far left for so long, meant inevitable defeat for Labor this time round, no matter how good a Premier Anna Bligh might be.  As well, however well founded the attacks on Newman's character, that last minute tactic of attempted character assassination just made Labor look so bad and so desperate. It sealed Labor's fate, but I don't think it reflects on the common sense of the electorate, so much as giving voters a more solid reason to vote against Labor than just being tired of them.  This looked like dirty tricks to stay in power.  Get rid of 'em!

Patriciawa

June 21. 2012 03:50 PM

jaycee

has anyone got a link to the Herald's interview where Keating describes LOTO as a capuchin monkey?

jaycee

June 21. 2012 04:16 PM

Gravel

Talk Turkey

Thanks, yes I'm even following you on twitter.  I don't comment just read all the ones I follow most days, and Lyn is there every day.  Oh my twitter 'handle' is @lynsan.

I think as far as how people will vote federally next year is up in the air.  All we can do is watch and wait to see what happens.  I was totally disgusted with how Julia's overseas visit has been reported here.

What is so wrong with our Prime Minister asking other Country's to look  at what Labor and has done and maybe learn a few things.  It is wonderful to see the respect Julia is getting overseas.  Like other world leaders are sighing about our wonderful economy, I sigh at other media around the world are praising Julia.

Gravel

June 21. 2012 04:23 PM

jane

ToM, your singing from the same old tired song sheet has been responded to time and again with facts and evidence. And yet.....you just cut and paste the same utter crap again and again.

Living under a bridge may not be absolute proof of being a troll, but it's pretty convincing evidence of it.

When you finally come up with some content supported by evidence, not regurgitated lies, innuendo, allegations and bullsh!t gleaned from Dolt, Anal and the Liars Party handbook, I might start believing you're not a troll.

Until then, enjoy your life under that bridge.

[quote]....IMF chair, Christine Lagard thinks she has great dress sense.  Who would have thought it.[quote]

Anyone who doesn't read the Murdoch press, Ad astra. lol

jane

June 21. 2012 04:44 PM

Lyn

Hi Ad and Everybody

Twitterati

vexnews‏@vexnews
Australians deserve a "kick in the bum'' if we elect "obstructionist capuchin'' Abbott as PM says ex-PM Keating #auspol http://bit.ly/MzLLrg

Paul Wiggins‏@paulwiggins
RT @nicchristensen: Fairfax suffers Canberra Times bureau confusion www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-e6frg996-1226404398532

vexnews‏@vexnews
Premier Campbell Newman accused of going beyond Sir Joh's excesses by trying to cut-off union funding to ALP #qldpol http://bit.ly/KNH9nv

Jackson Court Case today:

ABC News 24‏@ABCNews24
The East branch of the #HSU has been placed into administration. For more we're joined by @JamelleWellsABC http://bit.ly/abcnews24

Frances Jones‏@FrancieJones
Kathy Jackson, David Rofe QC & many others are in court, including ABC radio & TV reporters Jamelle Wells and Matthew Kearney. Packed house.

Frances Jones‏@FrancieJones
@lynlinking @woolkebb @TKYC @independentaus @madwixxy I'll do my best. Things all seem very interconnected to me. eg is 2UE owned by Fairfax

Peter Wicks‏@madwixxy
Today Kathy Jackson spits in Justice Flick of the Federal Court's face, leaking her affidavit in open contempt #jacksonville #hsu #auspol

National Times‏@NationalTimesAU
Jackson loses job as HSU East put into administration www.nationaltimes.com.au/.../...0120621-20puq.html

Brigadier Slog‏@BrigadierSlog
Jackson loses job as #HSU East put into administration. Next step open the books to public scrutiny www.smh.com.au/.../...stration-20120621-20puq.html

Louise Hall,  Court Reporter for Sydney Morning Herald. Tweets heavily censored due to non-publication orders, suppression orders, legislative

Louise Hall‏@LouiseCHall
As Justice Flick about to give judgment in ‪#HSU‬, her barrister applies to reopen the case

Louise Hall‏@LouiseCHall
Justice Flick rejects Kathy Jackson's submission that she hasn't had a fair trial ‪#HSU‬

Louise Hall‏@LouiseCHall
Kathy Jackson's latest attempt to derail ‪#HSU‬ East being put into administration fails

Louise Hall‏@LouiseCHall
HSU placed into administration

Louise Hall‏@LouiseCHall
See Kathy Jackson's and Chris Brown's reaction to HSU decision on http://smh.com.au soon @smhonline

Louise Hall‏@LouiseCHall
Kathy Jackson says she is disappointed with decision to demerge ‪#HSU‬ East branch and will consider an appeal. She's lost her job.

Frances Jones‏@FrancieJones
In the Financial Review today, Aaron Patrick has written about Kathy Jackson's 80pg affidavit which Justice Flick & others refused to accept

Shorten abused and threatened me, says Jackson, Financial Review

The claims are contained in an ­80-page affidavit prepared by Ms Jackson for a recent Federal Court case that led to the union’s main branch being placed under the control of an administrator.

Judge Geoffrey Flick did not allow Ms Jackson to submit the affidavit as evidence following objections from lawyers for the federal government and other union leaders that the allegations in it were scandalous and not relevant.

The judge indicated he would not release documents to the media that contained explosive allegations.
afr.com/.../shorten_abused_and_threatened_me_SOv2bPJRkmwjb5BAKn4QHK


NSW FIRE FIGHTERS PROTEST:

Frances Jones‏@FrancieJones
Wall to wall fire engines on Macquarie St on strike re Workers Comp changes. Fire fighters from Mona Vale fi http://instagr.am/p/MHx7XaCOPD/

Max Phillips‏@maxphillips
Video: blasting state parliament ‪#nswpol‬http://twitvid.com/2MNNP

Sunrise‏@sunriseon7
Loudest protest ever in Martin Place right now! #firies #Sydney http://socialcam.com/s/Bwpkme2q

Equal Love Brisbane‏@EqualLoveBris
@CarlKatter EMERGENCY RALLY - 6:30pm @ parliament house in Brisbane to oppose Civil Unions reforms!! PLEASE RETWEET!!

Carla‏@carlajd1
When you look at NSW, Vic and QLD it's worth remembering majority of those losing rights voted those Govts in. #thinkbeforeyouvote

smh.com.au‏@smh
National News: O'Farrell attacks striking fire union http://bit.ly/PxhVI1 #australia

QUESTION TIME:

Jack Sumner‏@preciouspress
@mishaschubert @TonyAbbottMHR When did "gutless"become unparliamentary.. Was used freely at the Press Club yesterday

Annabel Crabb‏@annabelcrabb
Bronwyn Bishop and several tranquillised marmots seek a point of order. #qt

Eschertology‏@Eschertology
#QT Shorten can beat the entire LNP frontbench with one hemisphere of his brain tied behind his back

Agnes Mack‏@AgnessMack
#qt Suspect @CraigEmersonMP 's "Noaconstrictor" tag may stick to Abbott, that acknowledged fan of the herpetological metaphor.

Possum Comitatus‏@Pollytics
Why is Bronnie wearing a possum skin toilet seat cover over her shoulders? #qt

fiz‏@fiztig
@Pollytics Don't visit Canberra anytime soon Poss, you might end up as a Bronnie accessory. #qt

Carbon price fan‏@CarbonTaxFan
@CraigEmersonMP Abbott the Noooaconstrictor...who is living in the 70s .....and is going to bellyflop after July 1 #qt #auspol

imaginary dog‏@EnoTheWonderdog
I wonder if @TonyAbbottMHR is regretting not letting @TonyBurke go to Rio after that spray. Once again the slopposition look stupid. #

PAUL KEATING ON TONY ABBOTT, 21 June, 2012. Story in full:
"AUSTRALIANS will deserve a "kick in the bum'' if they elect Tony Abbott the "obstructionist capuchin'' as prime minister, Paul Keating said.

The former prime minister today warned the Opposition's negative tactics were having a damaging impact on the Australian economy.
www.facebook.com/permalink.php

Lyn

June 21. 2012 05:57 PM

Psyclaw


PatriciaWA

Do you recall the QandA 2 weeks back from Toowoombah? Do you recall the questions and the widespread follow up comments about their fundamentalist and simplistic nature on the bloosphere the couple of days after?

Many of the questions were directly out of The Handbook of Quirky and Selfish Voters, written by the foreign author Dohne Tu Worryboutthat.

Obviously the place was almost 100% full of Northerners and not all can be held responsible for the questions.

You would have seen the encouragement given to WA to secede over the past week or so on PB. I'm sure it was not directed at good sensible folk like you, but there are some WAers who would be better of in some utopia they create for themselves.

My home state of NSW has more than its share of fools too; many are in my very street.

Psyclaw

June 21. 2012 06:07 PM

DMW

On any list of the top 100 inventions of all time some that I think would (should?) be in the top ten would be the wheel, reticulated water, sewage systems including the flushing toilet and harnessing/reticulation of electricity.

Very interesting to read this quote:
The report, produced for IBM by international strategic forecasting firm IBISWorld, positions high-speed broadband as "the new utility", comparing it to the utilities that underpinned previous transformations in society — such as the water- and steam-driven mechanical power utilities of early industrialisation, and the electricity grids and telephony systems of later industrialisation.

Aussie broadband to make a trillion in 2050 Stilgherrian @ZDNet.com.au
www.zdnet.com.au/...trillion-in-2050-339339712.htm

DMW

June 21. 2012 06:19 PM

DMW

NormanK @ 1:18 PM
you have my sympathetic ear and I hear you loud and clear.

Spare a thought for we 'mere citizens' of Canberra who are vilified and thought to be lower than a snakes armpit all because of those rotten fly-in fly-out politicians that the rest of Australia elect to the federal parliament.

Canberra has hit us again ... Canberra raises our taxes ...   blah, blah, blah.

Bu@@er off all those bloody whingers about Canberra it is the fly-in, fly-out pollies you blighters elect that are doing you down not us real people who live in and love Canberra.

Surprised  Tong  Kiss  Wink

DMW

June 21. 2012 06:32 PM

Jason


I don't think you will be missed!

Statement by Senator Fisher

21 June 2012

I am today announcing my intention to resign my position as a Senator representing the people of SA,effective 10 August 2012.I do so on medical advice and after experiencing a further panic attack, similar but less severe than the one which caused such grief 18 months ago.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/97774643/Statement


Jason

June 21. 2012 06:36 PM

jaycee

Interesting to see the ABC's. excuse for Mr.Kohler to be able to be a News Ltd. employee and work at the ABC. at the same time!...I'm afraid the national broadcaster is now little more than a right-wing tuck-shop where various leeches drop in from time to time to display their wares and help themselves at the expense of the long-suffering taxpayer.
Time, WAY PAST TIME, to play a little "travelling music" for Mr. Scott. I'm sure a good wage could still be earned polishing J.W.H.'s shoes.

jaycee

June 21. 2012 06:37 PM

NormanK

Psyclaw

Not picking a fight Smile but you did read Dee's (@PB) explanation of how questions are vetted and arranged for Q&A didn't you? It is about as spontaneous as MasterChef without the randomness of recipe outcomes. The whole thing is stage managed. I didn't watch the Toowoomba programme but if you came away with the impression of that city (therefore Queensland) being a conservative heartland then that is the impression that the producers wanted you to get. These days Q&A is a complete sham. Just about the only part of it that appears to be spontaneous is when there are follow-up questions or the occasional raised-hand question - even then I'd be sceptical that it wasn't prearranged in some way. Watch Jones when the discussion gets away from him, he reins it in quick smart and gets it back on to the predetermined theme. Even the Tweets are heavily vetted so trying to draw some sort of conclusion from that avenue is equally fraught with danger.

NormanK

June 21. 2012 06:42 PM

Jason

Yet more drama from Mary Jo, no wonder she's resigned!


Senator Mary-Jo Fisher 'caught shoplifting again!



SOUTH Australian Liberal senator Mary-Jo Fisher has been reported by police for shoplifting for second time.



Police sources said the senator, who was cleared of separate shoplifting charges in November, was reported by police for allegedly shoplifting assorted goods worth $60.40.

Senator Fisher has not returned calls for comment today.

Senior Liberal sources said Senator Fisher was ''in a very bad way'' and being cared for at home by her husband and close friends.

They said her political future was now clouded with an announcement expected in coming days.

It is understood doctors were trying new medication to treat her well-documented mental health problems when she had a massive anxiety attack on the weekend.

www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-fn59niix-1226404681902

Jason

June 21. 2012 07:05 PM

DMW

NormanK
re QandA

I recall Hillbilly (or was it Feral) Skeleton mentioning that she had been selected to ask a question on that programme.

To bastardise a quote When you can stage mange spontaneity you've got it made

DMW

June 21. 2012 07:29 PM

Tom of Melbourne

Jane, the cloying characterisation here of Gillard not being “opportunistic” is unjustified on both the facts and on good taste.

There is ample evidence that she is a most opportunistic politician, it is delusional to suggest otherwise and my comment was just a few easy examples that spring to mind. This was characterised by you as “trolling”.


It is truly a reflection of your intellectual laziness that you’re so willing to lapse into labelling responses.

Tom of Melbourne

June 21. 2012 07:49 PM

Jason

ToM,
   The only opportunist around here is you!
However in order for you to insult us we must first value your opinion we don't.Nice try though.

Jason

June 21. 2012 08:03 PM

jane

ToM, wot Jason said and as usual you've just served up your usual crap. Enjoy life under the bridge.

jane

June 21. 2012 08:15 PM

Psyclaw



ToM

Welcome back.

I'm still waiting for the reforms "embraced" by the electorate ..... one eg will do.

Psyclaw

June 21. 2012 08:19 PM

Psyclaw



NormanK

Like their bottom of screen tweets, I'm sure QandA is not spontaneous.

Nevertheless I have no doubt that those who asked the"primitive" questions had composed them themselves and were willing "askers".

The manipulation IMHO is in their questions being selected to be actually asked.

Cheers

Psyclaw

June 21. 2012 08:30 PM

Psyclaw



I put this on PB @7.21pm (5854)

I am the last person on earth to support the Opposition. But anyone who is prepared to judge a mentally ill person knows nothing.

To those pontificating in judgement about MJF, your chances of understanding mental illness some day are pretty good …… very few of us go through life without direct contact with mental illness in family, friends or other ones close to us.

Then you will understand.

Psyclaw

June 21. 2012 08:36 PM

Ad astra

Hi Lyn
What a collection of Twitterati, and what a circus Kathy Jackson is creating.  This whole crazy saga is beyond belief.  Now she talk of appealing to the High Court.

QT was a laugh a minute today, with Craig Emerson in full flight.  I don't know why Abbott and Co. persist with their inane questions as they get beaten into a pulp every time.  It's as I contended a little while back - Tony Abbott does not have a Plan B.

Thank goodness there is only one more week to endure before the long winter break.

Ad astra

June 21. 2012 09:20 PM

Tom of Melbourne

Jane & Jason, when so many here deny that Gillard is “opportunistic”, there is so much cloying and sycophantic repetition of the latest government press release, it is entirely reasonable to point out that my comment only provides some balance.

”No wonder so many here just love Gillard, and argue that she’s not opportunistic. Here are a couple of examples-


• Wants taxpayer funded school chaplains - genuine principle or political expedience/opportunism?

• Hate marriage equality, knowing that ostracising homosexual youth is a major cause of high rates of youth suicide - genuine principle or political expedience? 

•  Panders to Andrew Wilkie when it was politically expedient

• Deceives Andrew Wilkie when it was politically expedient 

•  Says “there will be no carbon tax” when it was politically expedient 
• Want a carbon tax because it became politically expedient 

•  Says a emissions reform/carbon tax will fail “without community consensus”, because it is politically expedient 

•  Wanted a big committee to make the decision for her, until it became politically inconvenient.”


The above comment is balanced and factual. Gillard is simply opportunistic the actual facts demonstrate this.

Tom of Melbourne

June 21. 2012 09:59 PM

DMW

Hi Ad
Thank goodness there is only one more week to endure before the long winter break.

The break is about six weeks, which is six very long times in politics.

What is worse about this break is that paragon of virtue, the speaker of only truth, the one that has taken it upon himself to inform the nation of all the ills that are about to befall us is cranking up for a tour of every nook and cranny to keep us updated on the impending doom and reinforce the gloom.

To add insult to injury it will be 'reported' to us verbatim with no serious questions allowed to be asked and little, if any, serious analysis of what the oracle spews.

DMW

June 21. 2012 10:04 PM

Jason

ToM,
   Stop it or you'll go blind!
Apart from the school chaplins that the high court ruled yesterday were funded wrongly (thank you JWH), the rest of your tripe we've answered all year!

Are you such a slow learner the we have to keep repeating ourselves?

Jason

June 21. 2012 10:11 PM

Psyclaw



ToM

Welcome back for the second time tonight.

I'm still waiting for the reforms "embraced" by the electorate ..... one eg will do.

Come on Tom ..... just admit it ...... you know you were just hyperbowling and gave no mind to the truth or the facts.

Psyclaw

June 21. 2012 10:17 PM

Tom of Melbourne

I really have no idea what you're harping on about. I've given about 5 examples and you've given one.

Get over it.

Tom of Melbourne

June 21. 2012 11:24 PM

BSA Bob

Jason at 6.42 quotes the Australian as saying Mary Jo was "cleared of separate shoplifting charges in November.."
Wasn't she  convicted, but with the conviction not being recorded? I think so. I wonder how the security guard in that little effort's getting on, nobody seems interested in whether she's been traumatised.

BSA Bob

June 21. 2012 11:42 PM

Jason

BSA Bob,
       That's right found guilty but no conviction recorded, but during the trial the defence tried to argue the "store security guard" licence was in somehow invalid! I wonder how many other "shop lifters" that have had "legal aid lawyers" that have followed and with the same judge were treated as well as Mary Jo?

Jason

June 21. 2012 11:56 PM

BSA Bob

I've just been looking at an ABC site that says MJF was acquitted of the shoplifting charge but found guilty of assault without the conviction being recorded. So I guess the Oz is right, she beat the theft charges & assaulting a security guard's not worth a mention. I still wonder how the guard's doing.

BSA Bob

June 22. 2012 12:02 AM

Psyclaw



ToM

Come on, you know what I refer to. Anyway welcome back for the third time tonight.

I'm still waiting for the reforms "embraced" by the electorate ..... one eg will do. I suspect other readers are also interested to see if for once you "put up".

Come on Tom ..... just admit it ...... you know you were just hyperbowling and gave no mind to the truth or the facts.

I don't have to give any example. You made the claim as the basis of smearing the PM. And you haven't yet given one example.

You are an excellent writer of fiction, even if quite transparent.

Psyclaw

June 22. 2012 02:50 AM

jane

School chaplains-introduced by the Rodent.

Marriage equality-Gillard has never been in favour of gay marriage and still holds that position.

Wilkie-his pokie reform was part of Labor platform at the last election. Wilkie's proposed bill was never going to pass, so another option has to be explored.

You may be stupid enough to think that doing the same thing over and over again will produce different results, but obviously the PM, like most people with at least one functioning brain cell, doesn't.

Says “there will be no carbon tax” when it was politically expedient 
• Want a carbon tax because it became politically expedient

Blatant bullshit ToM as you very well know. You keep peddling the same old lie; it was a lie when you first spruiked it and it's still a lie.

Seems the only one telling porkies as usual is you.

Epic fail again, ToM. You're not talking to Dolt or Anal, now. Get back under your bridge.

jane

June 22. 2012 03:30 AM

TalkTurkey

Mary-Jo Fisher says it wasn't such a big panic attack this time - (only $60 worth instead of nearly $100!)

She is claiming mental illness, OK, how many other mentally-ill people have full-on convictions for lesser offences?

What DID happen to the closed-circuit TV record of the original offence? It just DISAPPEARED!

What efforts were ever made to hunt down the disappearer?

Remember this woman's fancy lawyer QC Michael Abbott has been appealing for public funding to cover her first case saying she was so important that she deserved the very best legal representation! Namely him! I wonder if he'll be in a hurry to defend her this time. I do understand she's been hokeyed in the pokey already, uh-oh Gal you done it good and proper this time.  

OK so she's mentally ill - well she's a mentally ill thief!

She says she's been persecuted by the DPP and the cops,
- Could it be that they were stymied by the 'disappearance' of the original CCTV and have been out to settle a score?
Cops don't like to be messed with, they look after their own jealously, they've been made fools of in her first case and I don't blame them. But still, she had to do this second yes alleged crime herself, didn't she, how crazy.

Which brings me to an interesting point. She has proved she is crazy beyond all possible doubt. Either because she is just plain crazy, or she is pretending to be crazy to draw attention to herself for whatever reason - perhaps for sympathy, perhaps to prove she really is a poor little crazy pixie not just a nasty little thief . . . Well try to get inside that! . . .  or is she just a nasty little thief? Is she in fact 'a kleptomaniac'? WTF does that mean? Oh it's not her fault poor thing she's a kleptomaniac? Well is that crazy or not? Or what? Any way you cut it she is not right in the head, it makes me wonder about the very nature of mental illness, and it puts me in mind of the central concept of Catch-22.

[Catch-22 was a wonderful simple concept, around which the whole amazing lovable book was based. There is always a catch in the Army says Doc Daneeka to Yossarian, it's a doozy called Catch-22.

There was only one catch and that was Catch-22, which specified that a concern for one's own safety in the face of dangers that were real and immediate was the process of a rational mind. Orr was crazy and could be grounded. All he had to do was ask; and as soon as he did, he would no longer be crazy and would have to fly more missions. Orr would be crazy to fly more missions and sane if he didn't, but if he was sane, he had to fly them. If he flew them, he was crazy and didn't have to; but if he didn't want to, he was sane and had to. Yossarian was moved very deeply by the absolute simplicity of this clause of Catch-22 and let out a respectful whistle.

"That's some catch, that Catch-22," he observed.

"It's the best there is," Doc Daneeka agreed.
]


So what Mary-Jo Fisher has done is a sort of inverted Catch-22, she has put her dysfunction beyond doubt but she is still on all the evidence a thief, I say so on what I reckon is enough revealed facts, even if bizarrely she has so far never been convicted for theft. Not yet. But can't you just hear the cops who were thwarted in failing to get her convicted last time . . . "This time Fisher . . . We'll get you this time!"  
  
But (as Jason Obelix observes) justice is meant to be for all, not with special exemptions and exceptions for the rich and those close to the centre of power. The issues involved in this case go deep into the problem of social privilege in Australia, where Fisher is at the tip of those to be handled with kid gloves, and indigenous people at the bottom. It is still so. It is a blot on our society, the biggest possible blot of all.

Privilege. Inherited Inequality. Undue influence.  Hypocrisy.  All still there with a vengeance.    

Limited Liberty. Fraying Fraternity. Equality before the law, now that's a joke right?

Social revolution is still the Light on the Hill. And it is still afar off.

If the Forces of Darkness prevail in 2013 it will be too late forever to make this a decent society.

But they will not prevail because we will prevent that.

Now is the time for all good Lefties to come up with good ideas.
Humour especially. For humour is the edge that cuts at a touch.

How about like -

Someone/s (a la Chasers) write a really funny really acerbic and poignant mock-opera?
Or
Make nodding-head Abbortts for cars? Hundreds of thousands of the little b*gg~rs for sale to raise funds for the ALP?

Well there's two. That's a start. Come on Brains Trusts.

By the way has anybody else realised that Abbortt has a natural abbot hair-cut? Abbots, like I think the Capucins Smile, pluck off the hairs on the crowns of their heads you know, to make them look like Abbortt's does now naturally! So he don't need no plucking off, his Maker has plucked him off of his own accord already. (Didn't I always told yous he was plucked?)

But I only just now saw that his head was preparing him for a long period of reflective solitude. Finding solace with his Mother Mary Mild, or maybe rather sharing single malts in meditative seclusion with Archbigot Pell.

But maybe he could turn his Capuchin DNA and credentials to becoming the Greatest Primate Of Them All . . . Popus Antoninnius (Ninny for short)  

"And what became of the Monk ?" Smile  

Anyone know that song?
"I went to the animal fair
The birds and the beasts were there
The big Baboon by the light of the moon
Was combing his auburn hair
The Monkey he got drunk
And sat on the Elephant's trunk
The Elephant sneezed
And fell on his knees
But what became of the Monk the Monk  . . .
But what became of the Monk?[/i]

A Happy Memory
To All Those Who Are In Love
and All Those Who Can
Re~[i]memmm
~ber . . . Smile

   from

TalkTurkey

June 22. 2012 07:15 AM

Lyn

TODAY’S LINKS

Kohler's untenable conflict of interest, Ben Eltham, ABC
Kohler should do the honourable thing and stop working for the national broadcaster now that he has taken on this new role. If he doesn't, ABC boss Mark Scott should stand Kohler aside, in the interests of the ABC's audience and Australian citizens and taxpayers.
http://www.abc.net.au/unleashed/4084362.html

ABC's response to Kohler conflict of interest claims, Kate Torney, ABC
At the time we first contracted him to provide a range of content for us, Alan was working for Fairfax. The ABC looked closely at this and determined that the accurate, balanced and editorially ethical journalism he was producing for Fairfax was entirely compatible with the accurate, balanced and editorially ethical journalism he would be providing for the ABC.
www.abc.net.au/.../4084604

The Conclusion, for now., Frances Jones
One reason I became interested in this story is because I have never seen a story covered in the Australian media with such blatant bias. Most of the media has been obsessed with Craig Thomson for the past year, but now he’s long forgotten. The silence has been deafening since Peter Wicks published evidence of Kathy Jackson’s complicated finances and other matters.
francesjones.wordpress.com/.../

Queensland’s sinister civil union changes, The Conscience Vote
After Labor’s devastating defeat at the last election, the new Liberal government moved fast to entrench itself as sole occupiers of the palace by locking the tiny Opposition out of the Parliamentary offices, and started unravelling many of their predecessors’ reforms. Premier Campbell Newman stated his intention
consciencevote.wordpress.com/.../

Professional journalism…R.I.P, Massive Spray, Spray of the Day
Kathy Jackson’s hypocrisy and dodgy dealings in the HSU. Far from being the whistleblower poster child the MSM would like us to think she is, she is even more dodgy than Thomson is claimed to be with mounds of documentary evidence being provided to back up these claims…unlike the Thomson saga itself.
sprayoftheday.wordpress.com/.../

Tony’s Lust For Glory Without Power, Archie, Archiearchives
In the end he may well end up in the Lodge, with its pissing possums and dry rot, but that is almost all he will have.Oh yes. He will also be able sit in the PM’s chair at the dispatch box and to move that further questions be placed on notice.Other than that, he will do as he is told. His bullying nature will ensure that his cowardice
archiearchive.wordpress.com/.../

Abbott's uncertain legacy beyond warring opposition, Robert Simms, ABC
Industrial relations, for instance, appears to be a ticking time bomb for Abbott, and despite his attempts to keep Work Choices dead and buried (and cremated!), many of his colleagues are still committed to life after death. The temptation for some form of resurrection if in government would surely be difficult for them to resist. The debate would be messy at best.
http://www.abc.net.au/unleashed/4083730.html

Mr Robb’s Embarrassing Lack of Understanding, Stephen Koukoulas, Market Economcs
Shadow Finance Minister, Andrew Robb, mouthing an analysis of Australia’s debt and fiscal position that would be humiliating to any high school economics student, let alone someone wanting to run the budget of Australia’s $1.5 trillion economy. In The Australian today, Mr Robb is quoted:
www.marketeconomics.com.au/1379-mr-robbs-embarrassing-lack-of-understanding-2

Extra! Extra! Stop The Presses. No, Really, Mike Seccomb The Global Mail
Advertising revenue was down even more sharply. The papers got skinnier. We'll spare you more numbers; you get the picture. But, like we said, this is a global problem for newspapers, and different publishers responded in different ways. Some opted to maintain the quality of their products as much as possible, even if that meant taking a hit to profitability. The New York Times
www.theglobalmail.org/.../

New Media revolution’s here, Turn Left 2013
If you think “someone should do something, and that someone is us” – whether as contributor, assistant, organiser, publicist, or information provider – or just want to be part of a New Media revolution, let us know you’re in by email, comment, or tweet.
turnleft2013.wordpress.com/.../

Our Environmental Paradox, Ben Eltham, New Matilda
The heady days of the late 1980s and early 1990s — or even the enthusiasm about climate action of 2007 — seem eons ago now. In 1990, Labor campaigned very successfully on environmental issues; many considered its stance on the environment to be a crucial factor in its election victory. Similarly, Labor’s climate change policies in 2007 played no small part in helping
newmatilda.com/.../our-environmental-paradox

Newspaper cuts: who will shed a tear for the non-journos?, Matthew Knott, Crikey
Despite talk of “tears on the newsroom floor”, it is not journalists but the forgotten employees in sales, clerical and administration who have the most to fear from Greg Hywood and Kim Williams’ razor gangs.
www.crikey.com.au/.../?utm_r

Turnbull says trust in ABC ‘crucial’ as newspapers fall, Justin Norrie, The Conversation
We don’t have any plans to do anything other than support the ABC. If there’s an Abbott government, I’ll be the communications minister and I’ll be responsible for the ABC. I think the ABC has to be run efficiently and taxpayers have to get value for money. It’s got to be absolutely scrupulous in its objectivity and balance.
theconversation.edu.au/turnbull-says-trust-in-abc-crucial-as-newspapers-fall-7805

Dr Kim Williams tries to ease the pain for News Ltd, The Power Index
But coming back to those pesky papers, which Rupert loves so much, one can't help feeling that, despite Dr Kim's soothing words, the future's a little bleak, especially if you work in the industry. It will be one with fewer journalists, working harder and faster,
www.thepowerindex.com.au/.../dr-kim-williams-eases-the-pain-for-news-ltd-patient

How PRs will need to adapt to the Fairfax and News Limited upheavals,Tina Alldis , Mumbrella
“I would like to apologise on behalf of the Mango team for this opinion piece. While I encourage my team to have opinions and be active in the industry and media landscape, this piece is insensitive. We hold journalists in high esteem and apologise for the offence caused.
mumbrella.com.au/how-prs-will-need-to-adapt-to-the-fairfax-and-news-limited-upheavals-98657

Nick Harmsen ABC Political Reporter. Sandgroper by birth, Croweater by abodeSouth Australia · http://www.abc.net.au/news/sa
Mary-Jo Fisher says she's resigning from the Senate (from August) on medical advice after suffering another panic attack
docs.google.com/.../edit?pli=1
The Australian‏@australian June 21, 2012 6:05PM
Mary-Jo Fisher 'caught shoplifting': SOUTH Australian Liberal senator Mary-Jo Fisher has been reported by police... http://bit.ly/Py4mZ7

Clean Up HSUeast!,
This website is sponsored by a group of concerned members of HSUeast in NSW (you can read about us here) and by Kathy Jackson, the National Secretary of the federal Health Services Union and Executive President of HSUeast. This website has been created for the benefit of members of HSUeast.
http://www.cleanuphsueast.com/index.html

Working Class Girl, Patricia WA, Polliepomes
So now she’s gonna change all that, Help working folk like me and you,Who always had to pass the hat ,For battlers without a brass razoo.She knows, cos she’s a working class girl.
polliepomes.wordpress.com/.../

Unions complain Fairfax breached moral code on sackings, World Today ABC
The ACTU says Fairfax Media breached legal and moral obligations by not consulting about the company's dramatic restructure. ACTU secretary, Dave Oliver, has demanded meaningful negotiations and says no redundancies will be accepted until a deal is brokered
www.abc.net.au/.../4084328

Posts from the ‘Daily Fix’ Category
australianpoliticstv.org/category/daily-fix/

Today’s Front Pages
Australia Newspaper Front Pages for 22 June 2012
www.frontpagestoday.co.uk/index.cfm

Lyn

June 22. 2012 08:48 AM

Ad astra

LYN'S DAILY LINKS updated: www.thepoliticalsword.com/.../...-DAILY-LINKS.aspx

Ad astra

June 22. 2012 09:39 AM

Psyclaw


When pressed for an answer by FKelly this morning, News CEO Kim Williams strongly asserted "Fran, I'm not going to engage in media sport"

I'm pretty sure his "media sport" is what our PM was referring to when she said "don't write crap".

So his own kitchen is too hot for Williams ..... "media sport" (ie crap) is the forte and raison d'être of his organisation.

Like a true conservo, changing the goalposts at whim is de rigueur for News and for Williams.



TT Comrade

I think we should not direct all efforts against Senator Fisher. When touched by mental illness let me assure you that normal behaviour really does go out of the person's control. And as far as I know, she has had nothing to say about CT.

All attack should be aimed at the Abbotteers who have strategically applied unrelenting pressure on CT despite no charges etc whilst protecting, and sympathising with MJF.

I am certainly prepared to concede that the vote of a mentally ill senator is quite likely to be not well thought out and thereby "tainted" .......... so MJF's votes are equally acceptable or rejectable as CT's. In this, the hypocrisy of Abbott has been of course palpable.

It is quite vomitous to hear the Lieberal parade of "understanding" and "empathic" comments about MJF this morning, and especially those of snake oil Minchin, usually the epitome of nastiness-with-a-smile.

Psyclaw

June 22. 2012 10:57 AM

TalkTurkey

Psyclaw
Sure and sure, I'm not vindictive but just as murder is murder, theft is theft. Mental illness may turn murder into manslaughter but the victim is still a murder victim eh, and goods don't walk out of a store, when they are removed illegally that's theft, pure and simple. But I don't know if you followed the necessarily Moebiusesque logic, I guess you did you're Psyclaw, I'm saying yes she's mad as a March Hare, she has proved it yet again - first time being Hokey Pokey. But look-you, she's been drawing enviable pay with great working  conditions and entitlements making laws the rest of us are expected to abide If she was so unfit all along she should never have been there, but I have the feeling that she only discovered her panic attacks and depression for the first time after her first apprehension - which if true makes amockery of the defence in my opinion,and devalues the defence where it may be true in other and possibly more serious matters. .  

Yes . . . and the first time with now MISSUS Fisher Smile she was so deliberate in her stashing, so devious and indeed violent in trying to avoid apprehension, so protected subsequently by such skulduggery, well Old Mate we're talking double double standards standards.

But in the end theft is theft and btw in her statement yesterday nowhere does she admit any guilt on her part, au contraire she is blaming the DPP and the cops for hounding her, and now her stinking mob of liars and creeps so keen to denigrate Craig Thomson is suggesting that Labor is complicit in her persecution.

I take no pleasure in another's discomfiture in general really, rather I would just that there were no people so hateful/hypocritical/dishonest etc that I even felt chadenfreude at their being brought low, but given Utegate Slippergate and Jacksonvile and especially with what they have done to Craig Thomson - remember I have championed him all along - well I can't help feeling that the Poetic Justice Angel is passing over the Abborttians. Mrs Fisher is now just a rather parthetic piece of roadkill, she would have been convicted last time if she hadn't had friends in high places.

Imagine an aboriginal person of any age or gender successfully running her last-time defence. Getting the CCTV record erased. Affording Michael Abbott Q bloody C. As if.

Oh yes and she put the blame on the Security Guard! That is really low.

So there are lots before her in line for my sympathy. But there are also lots I despise far beyond her too. Start at Reith!  

TalkTurkey

June 22. 2012 12:13 PM

Psyclaw



TT Comrade

I agree with most of what you have said.

I do wonder what role she actually had in the whole case (other than the actual theft and assault). I suspect that her past case and all it's context and her statement yesterday were stage managed.

IMHO the Lieberals have strenuously stage managed all aspects to reduce any negative flak. This is all good and well and unsurprising.

But one might have expected (in his dreams) a modicum of truth ie "I am ill and will retire" rather than "the cops etc are making life too tough for me" combined with dishonest silence about last Saturday's repeat offence (which obviously precipitated her removal).

Psyclaw

June 22. 2012 01:24 PM

Patriciawa

I agree with both TT & Psyclaw about MJF's blaming others rather than taking full responsibility for her own actions.  I'm still inclined to go along with what I think would be Psyclaw's more sympthatic view though.  For all her obfuscations and inability to admit guilt the woman is still ashamed and still ill.   Kleptomania whether associated with the menopause or not is surely the only explanation for a comparatively wealthy individual risking disgrace by shoplifting grocery items of little value.

Besides, TT, I don't think it furthers Craig Thomson's cause at all.  His is a stand-alone case of an individual persecuted and pilloried by public opinion because of one person's finger pointing.  His hounding by the Opposition and the media has been disgraceful, but that would not justify a similar hue and cry after MJF's proven misdemeanours.   Having his accuser's credibility now in doubt will surely have commentators begin his rehabilitation, at least incrementally.    Maybe the Reverend Tim Costello could start the ball rolling with a retraction of his comment on Q&A, 14/05/12.    

Patriciawa

June 22. 2012 01:58 PM

Lyn

Hi Ad and Everybody

Twitterverse:-

Misha Schubert‏@mishaschubert
Abbott says Mary Jo Fisher has taken a gutsy decision to leave politics to deal with her health issue.

Judge 'n Jury rocket‏@sprocket___
'Mercifully, Justice Flick was not so easily duped by the HSU’s Little Miss Greedy' www.vexnews.com/.../

Ken ‏@KoenjiEikaiwa
Now that ABC's finance guru, Alan Kohler will work for News Ltd he has no choice but to resign from the ABC http://bit.ly/KokHLO

Wendy Bacon‏@Wendy_Bacon
Good interview with Assange on RN Breakfast today. Clarified issues. Missed it? listen here later.#abcrntunein.com/radio/Radio-National-Breakfast-p2344/

TAWNBPM‏@TAWNBPM
This Queensland government is really very scarey...... http://fb.me/1v1ICuUiN

Michael Fleming‏@thatfleminggent
...and to top off the LNP's disgraceful, backwards efforts last night, this from their state secretary www.brisbanetimes.com.au/.../...0120622-20ryh.html #misogynists

TAWNBPM‏@TAWNBPM
This is worth reading. It shows that shareholders like Rinehart signing a charter of editorial independence... http://fb.me/1PJsIVm2e

steve ‏@steveuwa
Farifax does an expose on Mining Super Profit taxes www.smh.com.au/.../...ot-know--20120319-1vfvg.html

ABC The Drum ‏@ABCthedrum
If you're looking for moral tales, don't look to politics: @mariusbenson on Julia Gillard's two years at the top http://bit.ly/NptDVT

The Punch‏@ThePunchHQ
Never mind the Fairfax bollocks, papers can survive: Newspapers are facing a crisis of confidence but like any c... http://bit.ly/Ne6pyc

Possum Comitatus‏@Pollytics
Appears Newman is losing control of another program http://bit.ly/O0husU Hasnt taken long

Chris Barrett‏@selga55
Media dogs would be barking loudly if this was Labor senator Fisher to quit after fresh shoplifting incident www.abc.net.au/.../4084964 @abcnews

SQWOSH.COM‏@SQWOSH
Fisher resignation 'honourable': OPPOSITION Leader Tony Abbott said South Australian Liberal Senator Mary Jo Fis... http://bit.ly/LJanna

Financial Review‏@FinancialReview
Twitter suffered a massive outage last night, taking the site offline globally [free] http://bit.ly/MHULOG #tech

Nick Bryant‏@NickBryantOz
Some of the best commentary on media turmoil this week has come from The Conversation. Here's a wrap from @AndrewJaspan theconversation.edu.au/media-earthquake-panic-disinformation-and-competing-visions-at-fairfax-and-news-7841

Ken ‏@KoenjiEikaiwa
Australia is ''playing its part'' in moving to clean economic growth by introducing carbon pricing on July 1st http://bit.ly/KQf9j6

Lyn

June 22. 2012 02:25 PM

Lyn

Hi Ad

Bushfire bill's opinion on Julian Assange posted by Mark:-

Mark ‏@markjs1
Bushfire sums up my thoughts about “delusional,narcissistic twat” (aka Julian Assange) in this succinct piece: http://bit.ly/MNS4YC#auspol
Julian Assange is a twat. He has a cult following of bored, rich people who pay his way wherever he goes. When he defaults on their bail sureties, they cheer instead of wake up to themselves.
blogs.crikey.com.au/.../#comment-1311175

Lyn

June 22. 2012 03:10 PM

TalkTurkey

Psyclaw
If you are suggesting that Missus Fisher didn't think up the defence's angle of attacking the security guard's credibility, but rather Michael Bloody Abbott Q Bloody C's idea, well I think that is quite likely, but then she must've sanctioned it! That is utterly despicable! Perhaps worse than thinking it up herself! There are few crims so despised by other crims as those who are known to have let other people take the rap for them, honour amongst thieves is very much alive and well wrt matters like that; trust me, if MJF does time (she won't, guess why, she's white, well-connected, and female) it will be that, not her petty theft nor her assault on that guard, but her connivance at sullying a brave vigilant and faithful servant's reputation and good name, that will earn her the distrust and disgust of her criminal equals. I'm sure you'll agree with the foregoing Psyclaw, because as you must know by now I only argue when I know I'm right. Wink  


Patricia said

TT, I don't think it furthers Craig Thomson's cause at all.


>That "it" seems a bit disembodied, I'm sure it wasn't meant to relate to kleptomania the last preceding noun, so what did it relate to please? Because I never said anything about furthering CT's cause, nor shortening it ftm. I pointed out contrast that's all.

and Patricia you said
(Craig Thomson's) hounding by the Opposition and the media has been disgraceful, but that would not justify a similar hue and cry after MJF's proven misdemeanours.

Patricia
Where did I ever suggest anything of the kind? I'm talking about double standards, and privilege. Not revenge. Not persecution. Please don't misrepresent my position even if by unconscious implication - where unconscious = simply rather thoughtless imo. I am not an unsympathetic person, I do believe I have made that abundantly clear, but you know as well as I and all of us do, that aborigines would likely have been gaoled for similar to MJF's first offence, and they'd be looking at real time for this second one. I'm pleading for perspective, for honesty, for equality before the law. Not persecuting anyone.  

I have invited readers to imagine what the judicial response would be if aborigines tried to run the panic attack/ depression defence. I've said it all before. And not just aborigines of course, they're just at the bottom of the heap. In my previous couple of posts re MJF I have pointed to her social significance wrt to privilege, that is the real kernel, MJF is just a dud nut. She might indeed be a *kleptomaniac*, but whatever that might be, so equally might anyone else be so adjudged, but if you are darker in skin tone, or perforce shabbier in appearance, if you lack the influential friends and the money, well I needn't even finish the sentence need I.

Inequality. That's what I'm talking about. Not Missus Fisher.

Who is Missus Fisher anyhow?      

TalkTurkey

June 22. 2012 03:24 PM

42 long

  She's had a relatively easy run. She may have kleptomania. ( It does exis) Being punished for similar actions is often directly related to social status. as said.
   The main reason this is of no real consequence,is that a senate member is just replaced by someone from the party. Ie Bob Carr for Mark Ahbib. The senate is a party thing.
   Anyhow isn't it funny ( Peculiar) that Craig Thomson was the most urgent isssue imaginable in the lower house. (Tainted etc) These days "NOT a MURMUR".
  I hope that the discoveries of "Extra activities and behind the scenes manoeuvering" does get the full light of day in court. Anything less would be unjust.

42 long

June 22. 2012 03:34 PM

Patriciawa

Oratorical excess, TT!  Forgive me.

What is great, as you say, is that the pressure is off Craig Thomson.   I thought he looked a much happier man as he came off that footie field last night.

What we need now is some defining ruling which really rubs Abbott's nose into all the crap he's been talking and the media have been writing.  Oh, to have them made to eat their words!

Patriciawa

June 22. 2012 03:44 PM

jane

What it amounts to wrt MJF, is that the the rest of us without the cash and influence, would have copped a custodial sentence, mental illness or no.

Or at the very least be slung into Glenside and left there at the leisure of the state, not to simply return to a very well paid job, because her mates in the Liars Party put pressure on the shop AND the magistrate, it seems, to go easy on her.

It's very unfortunate that she suffers a mental illness and I do feel very sorry for her, but should she enjoy preferential treatment because she's a Liars Party Senator?

Preferential treatment which is not on offer to other people suffering mental illnesses who may have stolen goods or  assaulted a security guard, who don't have mates in high places.

jane

June 22. 2012 03:50 PM

Tom of Melbourne

’His is a stand-alone case of an individual persecuted and pilloried by public opinion because of one person's finger pointing.

Now that is truly delusional.

The matters involving Thomson were subjected to a 3 year investigation by Fair Work Australia. During most of that period the investigation was overseen by Tim Lee, a former union official and ALP ministerial advisor. The report was released under the watch of FWA President Iain Ross, respected jurist, but also former ACTU official.

Given the actual organisational structure of FWA and the specific unit conducting the investigation, I challenge you to justify how “one person’s finger pointing” resulted in this outcome.

Tom of Melbourne

June 22. 2012 03:55 PM

Psyclaw


Jane


What it amounts to wrt MJF, is that the the rest of us without the cash and influence, would have copped a custodial sentence, mental illness or no.


Who knows .... the mentally ill 20 year old son of a friend belted a bus driver and was not convicted because of his health. This isn't at all rare.

The Thomson case would be unheard of (p47 in the papers!) if JG had a majority of 10 or so. And ditto for MJF if Abbott hadn't acted so disgracefully re Thomson, in an attempt to knock off the government.

IMHO regardless of their failings, both CT and MJF are as well victims of Abbott's get me to the lodge on time quest.

Psyclaw

June 22. 2012 04:03 PM

Ad astra

Hi Lyn
Thanks for yet another set of interesting Twitterati.   There always seem to be plenty to tweet about.

I’m about to post my next piece.  If you feel your Twitterati have not had time enough, please post them again on the new piece.

Ad astra

June 22. 2012 04:04 PM

Ad astra

Folks
I have just posted: When the Fourth Estate falters, how should the Fifth Estate respond? to give you something to chew on for the next few days.

www.thepoliticalsword.com/.../...tate-respond.aspx

Ad astra

June 22. 2012 04:10 PM

Jason

Psyclaw,
       I don't know where the truth lies with MJF and her "mental" state,but for some reason her whole defence thus far seems to be a new way to get around the now defunct "drunks defence"?

Jason

June 22. 2012 10:22 PM

jane

And so far, ToM, who's in court?

jane

Comments are closed