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The scourge of the rent-seekers

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Thursday, 9 August 2012 15:27 by Ad astra
When we were young there was no such word as ‘rent-seeker’. In fact the word was not coined until 1974. Wikipedia informs us that the term derives from the far older practice of appropriating a portion of production by gaining ownership or control of land. In economics, rent-seeking is an attempt to obtain ‘economic rent’ by manipulating the social or political environment.

In our earlier days, we recognized rent-seeking in other ways. Classically, farmers were seen as the ones who regularly complained about their lot and pleaded for, indeed demanded, government help such as tariff protection and subsidies. The phrase ‘the squeaky wheel gets the oil’ was used to describe their behaviour, reflecting as it did the truism that people who complain the most will get attention, and often get what they want. Today, political aficionados know the term well, can quote many instances of rent-seeking, and name many rent-seekers. This piece argues that rent-seekers are a scourge on the body politic because the loudest of them, those with the squeakiest wheels, too often get the oil, while the wheels of the more worthy go unlubricated through lack of a voice, lack of enough squeak. It argues too that rent-seeking is essentially self-serving, self-centered, and unconcerned with the lot of others, and that it is exercised most robustly by the rich and powerful.

While rent-seekers have always been around, during the life of the Rudd/Gillard Governments they have been in our face week after week, pleading their case, predicting dire consequences should they not get their way, and wrapping their arguments in the soft and often disingenuous cloak that unless they get what they want, ordinary people will suffer, prices will skyrocket, jobs will be lost, industries will collapse, businesses will go to the wall. Their arguments draw on the reasonable concept of ‘the fair go’, particularly ‘the Aussie fair go’, and insist that this is what they’re not getting.

Wikipedia has this to say about rent-seeking. It is “spending resources in order to gain by increasing one's share of existing wealth, instead of trying to create wealth. The net effect of rent-seeking is to reduce total social wealth, because resources are spent and no new wealth is created. It is important to distinguish rent-seeking from profit-seeking. Profit-seeking is the creation of wealth, while rent-seeking is the use of social institutions such as the power of government to redistribute wealth among different groups without creating new wealth. Rent-seeking implies extraction of uncompensated value from others without making any contribution to productivity. The origin of the term refers to gaining control of land or other natural resources. An example of rent-seeking in a modern economy is political lobbying for government benefits or subsidies, or to impose regulations on competitors, in order to increase market share.”

We don’t have to go back far to see flagrant examples of rent-seeking. Take the Emissions Trading Scheme. Remember how those dependent on coal-mining trenchantly opposed its early manifestations. Why? Because they would be required to pay for polluting the planet’s atmosphere with carbon dioxide. It would cost them and reduce their profits. Of course we never heard that point argued; who would care if they made less profit but the owners and shareholders? Instead, they argued that it would make them less competitive internationally, that jobs would be lost and go offshore, and that the pollution would continue there unabated. Their argument was that there was no rational reason for the ETS and its imposition of a price on carbon. The risk to the planet of carbon pollution and the consequential global warming with all its dangers was not mentioned, or if it was, it was minimized. The rent-seekers were silent about the risk to agriculture, food production and water supplies. They had nothing to say about the danger of rising sea levels and increased acidity, with its effect on coral reefs; indeed some denied them. Had they mentioned those risks, public sympathy might not have gone their way in opposing the ETS. So they pleaded their case for special consideration, for relief from this imposition, using heart-tugging arguments: loss of thousands of jobs, families left on the breadline, industries and towns decimated, dramatically rising electricity costs, and the ‘unimaginable’ flow on effect to the cost of everything we buy or use. Remember Barnaby Joyce and his $100 roast.

Mining rent-seekers took out full-page ad after full-page ad in major newspapers condemning the idea of an ETS and a price on carbon, pointing to the terrible damage it would do. Mitch Hooke, chief executive of the Minerals Council, was on every TV outlet pleading his case, with his ‘ain’t it awful’ demeanour, castigating the Government for being unreasonably hard on the miners, who after all ‘create enormous wealth’ and ‘employ lots of people’. They don’t actually, but the assertion was plausible. Supported by a compliant media that gratefully sucked up the advertising revenue and hoped for more, and backed up by an aggressively opposed Coalition, the miners’ argument gradually won public support, and persuaded the Government to modify its stance. Great wealth, the opportunity for nation-wide publicity through the media megaphone, spending millions to get it, enabled the mining rent-seekers to at least partly get their way.



The same thing happened with the MMRT. Mitch Hooke was out again. Full-page colour ads festooned the dailies, and the world’s richest woman, Gina Rinehart, bedecked with Paspaley South Sea pearls, accompanied by Twiggy Forrest, featured at a rowdy rally in Perth advocating that the tax be axed. ‘Axe the tax’ they chanted. Their case was that the Government was unfair to impose the tax because the miners took the financial risk, and they already paid ‘enough’ tax in State Government royalties, company tax and on profits. Tony Abbott insisted they already paid ‘too much tax’. Their story resonated with the people. What’s more, they told them, they were the geese that were laying the golden eggs, heaps of them, eggs that they claimed kept our country out of recession, and of course they employed countless people. In fact, mining income played little part in our GFC survival, constituting as it does only 9% of GDP. Mining employed only 135,000 in mid 2009, less than two percent of total employment, and jobs were shed, not increased, during the GFC.



Although much of the miners’ story was shonky, with the golden eggs imagery, the rent-seekers did strike gold, and sympathy rose for the poor miners facing an intolerable and unfair Great Big New Tax. Billionaire Clive Palmer gave weight to their cause. After all, he was a miner too and threatened by the GBNT. The MSM was out there with supportive editorials, and the ever-reliable Tony Abbott chimed in with loud support, backing his opposition to the MMRT with a promise to repeal it if elected. If he was prepared to forego the revenue it generated and still hand out from Joe Hockey’s magic pudding all the benefits it funded, the tax was obviously unnecessary, an intolerable impost on a struggling industry – just another Labor GBNT.

Wayne Swan came out twice tackling these three miners, accusing them of wielding disproportionate power, enabled solely because of their massive wealth, billionaires all. He pointed out that the ordinary man in the street could not afford full-page ads in papers around the nation to plead a cause, no matter how worthy. The ordinary man could not mobilize a powerful and wealthy body like the Minerals Council to plead a cause, could not mobilize such a body to intimidate the elected Government and even threaten to bring it down. The ordinary man could never expect support from the media to shore up a cause, unless it happened to suit it. The billionaires had it all – untold wealth, influence with powerful industry bodies, and a compliant media.

In just the last few days we have seen yet another example of rent-seeking: Peter Anderson, chief executive of the Chamber of Commerce and Industry fronted the cameras with an unhappy face, declaring that the recent independent panel's review into the Fair Work Act that found no major problems, “will be a bitter disappointment to many in the Australian business community.” The panel did not give them what they wanted: the magic ingredient in industrial relations – ‘flexibility’ – which business believes would solve many of its labour problems, but workers believe would leave them shortchanged. Nobody has ever fully defined ‘flexibility’; it remains what Tom Watson would likely label a ‘weasel word’.

Almost every day rent-seekers ply their wares on TV, radio and in the press. You have seen them over and again.

Returning to Swan’s comments about the billionaire miners, he never argued that individuals or groups were not entitled to put a point of view, to press their case, even to take radical action to achieve it. Nor does any reasonable person. After all, many worthy causes have rent-seekers pleading their cause. Unions too have taken all manner of rent-seeking action from negotiation to strike action, sometimes radical and disruptive, evoking a strong counter-action, as we saw in the infamous 1998 waterside dispute. But that dispute was between workers and employers, as most union disputes are. The billionaires and their corporate supporters are not in dispute with workers; they are in dispute with the Government of this nation. Swan’s complaint was that they are exercising a disproportionate influence because of their great wealth and their influential connections. They are rent-seekers writ large, using their corporate muscle ruthlessly.

Less obvious rent-seekers are the battalions of lobbyists that infiltrate parliaments. They are more numerous than the politicians. Each is a special pleader for a cause, a group, a movement, an institution, a company, or an industry. In the US they swarm about the Congress and Senate consuming the time of members and their staff. The tobacco lobby pressures and cajoles those representing tobacco growing states to support their industry, to remove or reduce restrictions, and threaten the withdrawal of their considerable financial and political support; oil lobbyists press for lower taxes, higher concessions and better access to markets, and lubricate their advocacy with mega dollars.

Lobbyists are here too, not in the same grotesque numbers, but certainly in the thousands, making lobbying a multi-billion dollar a year industry. So overpowering are they that their number and behaviour has had to be regulated with a register of lobbyists and a code of conduct.

In my view, there are two objectionable aspects of rent-seeking. First, it evokes questions of fairness and equity, and second, it encourages the disproportionate exercise of power.

In the prologue to his book: Barack Obama The Audacity of Hope (The Text Publishing Company, 2006), in describing what the book was about, Obama writes that it offered: “personal reflections on those values and ideals that have led me to public life, some thoughts on the ways our current political discourse unnecessarily divides us, and my own best assessment…of the ways we can ground our politics in the notion of the common good.”

It is ‘the common good’ that is at the nub of the rent-seeking issue, yet that notion is distant from the minds of rent-seekers, focussed as they are on their own wants and needs, or those they represent.

Fairness and equity
Rent-seekers by definition attempt to gain advantage for themselves, irrespective of any disadvantage that it might inflict on others. The notion of fairness, equity, and sharing is lost in the clamour for benefits for themselves. While this might pass unnoticed when the cause is a laudable charity, it nonetheless exists, and diminishes the worthiness of the cause. It is a case of ‘look at me’, ‘give me what I want’, but don’t worry about those who will miss out if I do get what I want.

But when the rich and powerful are the rent-seekers their efforts seem obscene. Why are billionaires rent-seeking for benefits, in their case paying less or no tax, when the benefits of the tax are to be distributed to a wide audience of those less well off? When the taxes are to fund better superannuation, elevate the tax-free threshold, reduce company tax, give benefits to small business? Foregoing all of that seemed to be of no concern to the mining rent-seekers in pursuit of their ‘axe the tax’ agenda. They showed no concern for the ‘common good’.

Disproportionate exercise of power
It was this disproportionality that Wayne Swan found to be offensive, unfair, and contrary to the common good. He saw miners like Gina Rinehart, Clive Palmer and Twiggy Forrest as not just putting their case, as any group is entitled to do, not even putting their interests above all others as many others do, but using their immense wealth and power to push their case in a way denied those with lesser means. Twiggy Forrest is even using his vast wealth to fund a High Court challenge to the MMRT, something the ordinary man cannot do.

Swan was angry that they were using their wealth and power to influence public policy, policy designed to redistribute the wealth derived from the mining boom to a wider audience, to those not now benefitting from it, to those less well off. He was angry because the miners’ self-interest, indeed their selfishness, was contrary to the common good. I for one applaud his stand.

Of course Joe Hockey and Tony Abbott labelled Swan’s stand as ‘class warfare’, demonizing the rich, pitting the poor against the rich, penalizing success. All the tired old clichés were trotted out. Swan’s move had nothing to do with class warfare; it had everything to do with fairness, equity and the common good.

While no one would promote a ban on advocacy, especially for laudable causes, we should acknowledge that it comes at a cost, a cost to those who miss out, or receive less because of the success of others.

The cost seems grotesquely obscene when those that miss out do so because of the wealth, power and influence of the vastly rich, because those with disproportionate clout born of their affluence exercise it ruthlessly with no concern for the common good. The three mining billionaires are unseemly examples.

Rent-seekers are a scourge on us all.


What do you think?

Comments (209) -

August 9. 2012 04:02 PM

Michael

Talking about "rent seekers"...

Mellifluous Meaningless Malcolm (Turnbull, of course you knew that!) talking more bs about the NBN on the ABC this afternoon.

Why does no-one in the Press ask him why Abbott gave way when he shifted from Shouldabeen's order to "demolish the NBN" to his current 'keep it in parts' stance?

Perhaps because he actually hasn't, that Abbott PM will demolish the NBN, and all of Malcolm's blatherings will be revealed as a... what's the word of the day? Furphy.

Michael

August 9. 2012 04:12 PM

2353

AA - well argued, can do nothing but agree.  The problem here is that those "seeking the rent" usually have considerable resources to prosecute their case - and in the 21st Century the easiest way to do this is produce glossy (one-sided) advertising.  You can't ban the advertising, rthere is already a complaints mechanism to address falsehoods and it world be difficult to respond to every issue.  Hopefully someone here comes up with an answer, someone in the Government reads it and implements it.

The LNP should get on board with this one, as a glossy advertising campaigns aren't limited to mining and pokies.  Anyone remember the Workchoices campaign?  While I supported teh Wrkchoices campaign, I'm sure others support the other ones I've mentioned.

2353

August 9. 2012 04:12 PM

LadyInRed

I agree Ad astra. Good article. Yep, they are a scourge.

Untold wealth and wanting more. Trying to use people's fear via MSM to get what they want. That photo of the people begging at the throne of Twiggy.....ooohhh....not nice. I note Julie Bishop in the bckground.

Go Swan. I loved the way he came out punching. I also love the way Julia has come out punching this week about electricity.

TAbbott has been using the 'war' word too often.

LadyInRed

August 9. 2012 04:29 PM

Ad astra

Michael
In my view Malcolm Turnbull has never had his heart in Abbott’s instruction to ‘demolish the NBN’.  Turnbull is a tech-head who loves the Internet.  He set up OzzieMail.  I suspect the words to ‘keep it in parts’ are his, and Abbott is leaving them unchallenged because even he can see that dismantling the NBN, or even stopping it in its tracks, would not be popular, particularly among those who have it and can see and realize its benefits.  

As I have written many times, Turnbull is convincing when he has his heart in what he is saying, but unconvincing when he has not.  His many utterances about the NBN and his version of fast broadband have been unconvincing.  Yet he is bound to make these utterances, lest Abbott and Abbott supporters castigate him for not doing enough to oppose the NBN.  Abbott knowingly handed him a poisoned chalice when he asked him to demolish the NBN; Turnbull has struggled with it ever since.

Ad astra

August 9. 2012 04:38 PM

Ad astra

2353
The well off always have an advantage, and money for advertising is one of them.  It is this unfair advantage that Wayne Swan spoke about in his essay in The Monthly and in his John Button Lecture, which is good reading: www.treasurer.gov.au/.../022.htm&PageID=003&min=wms&Year=&DocType=1

It is the disproportionate power and influence of the very wealthy, the billionaires, that Swan finds distasteful and harmful to our nation.   And this is heightened by their selfishness and their unwillingness to share.

Ad astra

August 9. 2012 04:48 PM

Ad astra

LadyinRed
Thank you for your comment.  Yes, that was Julie Bishop with Twiggy.  For the carbon tax rally, Tony Abbott had with him the other Bishop, Bronwyn, along with the Coalition's chief female attack dog, Sophie Mirabella.

I too like Swan’s approach, not intimidated by Abbott and the critics in the MSM, able to stick to his guns.  His John Button Lecture was well written: www.treasurer.gov.au/.../022.htm&PageID=003&min=wms&Year=&DocType=1

It is appropriate that there is a Lecture in John Button’s honour.  I went to school with him.  He was a fine man and a fine politician, whose work and memory we honour.

Ad astra

August 9. 2012 05:12 PM

Marilyn

The worst rent seekers though are government departments like ASIO, DIAC and the AFP who have appalling records but still want more and more money and influence.

Add the ADP to that, a department that pretends our soldiers are 20 foot tall super heroes instead of many of them being racist, sexist nutcases.

Marilyn

August 9. 2012 05:30 PM

Ad astra

Marilyn
I noticed former ADF chief Peter Leahy out yesterday complaining about cuts to the Defence Budget, and in typical rent-seeker style insisting that these cuts would ‘put troops’ lives at risk’.  There is always a heart-tugging element to such special pleading. Can you imagine these rent-seekers trying to muster support by insisting that the budget cuts would deprive the Armed Forces of their shiny new toys?

Leahy’s claims have been rubbished by Stephen Smith and current ADF chief General David Hurley,  

Ad astra

August 9. 2012 05:44 PM

LadyInRed

Ad I remember John Button well, and as you say a fine man, sadly missed. How intersting that you went to school with him.

LadyInRed

August 9. 2012 05:51 PM

jaycee

I suspect we should expect the "rent-seekers" and their political flatulants to do some dirty manouvere very soon. The Liberal States are setting up the ground for a conservative govt'..they need a conservative federal executive to back them up with their "small govt'"agendas.
If you notice, the mincing poodle and all those other yappers have gone very, very quiet. Methinks there is plotting afoot!

jaycee

August 9. 2012 06:02 PM

Ad astra

jaycee
I suspect you are right. Parliament recommences next week.  I imagine that strategy meetings are occurring to see how they can attack PM Gillard in the next session now that the steam is running out of their carbon tax scare campaign, although I suppose they will make things up and lie, as usual

Ad astra

August 9. 2012 06:18 PM

jaycee

One thing I and many others are finding increasingly frustrating is the clear run the LNP. are getting in both the Ashby/Jackson affairs. You notice it has shifted from Slipper/Thomson as they seem to be lesser players in the set-up!
There is increasing disquiet at the silence of the judiciary in both these matters when a lay-investigator like Wixxy can turn up so much detail that LOOKS like criminal activity, yet the authorities seem reluctant (and that is the only interpretation one can put on it after all this time) to act. Perhaps they do not want to disturb the dream run the LNP. are getting in the polls till next election...Post!
Surely the judiciary, like Caesar's wife, must be above suspicion.

jaycee

August 9. 2012 06:27 PM

42 long

I know I am repeating myself but the LNP have to be the best politicians that money can Buy. I condemn that mob because of the3 people they accept money from. You don't fund a party without expecting a return. BIG Tobacco for one.
  Tony is concerned about the superprofits tax but where the states have elevated the royalties that apply whether you are profitable or not. NOT A PEEP OUT OF HIM. He is a GFC denier also We just didn't have it in Australia.
   If the business council types were in  europe or somewhere like that they would have something to whinge about. Get some good management into your businesses, and stop blaming workers wages for all your troubles. The high dollar is some of it. It is high because the rest of the world likes it..Triple A rating. When did that happen before?

42 long

August 9. 2012 06:36 PM

Psyclaw



AA

"In my view Malcolm Turnbull has never had his heart in Abbott’s instruction to "demolish the NBN’"

Ever since he was de-throned as leader and installed as the communications shadow, Turnbull's non verbal behaviour has has given him away as being someone simply following instructions without to any extent at all having his heart in what he is doing. You only have to watch him ipadding away throughout QT to see that his heart is not in the Opposition's modus operandi and general stance at all  ...... his non verbals shout "embarrassed" and "bored"  constantly.

This arvo I saw him ingenuously putting the case for discontinuing the NBN in its present form and more or less arguing for fibre to the node rather than to the house when they gain government. He looked so poor in health as he spoke that had I not been aware of the info in my previous paragraph I would have thought he was actually quite ill.

Now to the subject of Rent Seekers AA!


It is interesting that so many have been spawned by the mining industry. But it is more interesting that some of them actually produce little and that the punters generally are so unaware of this.

For example it is fairly well known that Fortescue ie Forrest pay little tax. This is because it is still mainly in the exploration and set up phase in most of its major projects. And at this stage government handouts via various exemptions, subsidies and tax concessions are generous enough to ensure that while Forrest himself can enjoy a luxurious company-paid-for lifestyle, his company trots along paying minimal tax.

And it is said of Palmer that he is not really a Miner at all, having actually mined and sold nothing at all. He is rich and enjoys a luxurious lifestyle founded on the wealth of his leases vis a vis their future productive potential.

It is significant that such huge wealth can derive simply from the promise of future production. This stamps the value of our still-in-ground commodities as so infinitely and unbelievably high that any argument against the MRRT cannot have  legs.

Your acceptance and elaboration of Mr Swan's stance is IMHO on the money. It is not the right of the rent seekers to hold and pursue their own political views per se that the Treasurer attacks. Rather it is the fact that they use their immense fortunes derived from enterprises which harvest publicly owned in-ground resources to attack the government itself and especially its social policies, using public institutions to do so.

In the case of Mr Hancock's daughter, this behaviour is blatant   ..... purchasing TV ownership and newspaper ownership in an attempt to lock up all her riches and protect them from legitimate tax obligations. She nailed her colours to the mast when she actually led the protest chant at the well publicised anti Super Profits Tax rally.

As for Forrest, he has attempted to curry public favour by his various projects to support the training and employment of Aboriginal people ..... to shore up his role as a rent seeker. Again the punter in the street is easily taken in by this. As the relevant Four Corners program showed he has adopted a divide and conqueror approach in Aboriginal communities, indeed within Aboriginal land councils, to get his way.

And his "way" is simply to control ultimate and permanent ownership and management of the mining-on-particular-land enterprise by paying off the local indigenous community in the form of training and employment guarantees together with promises of minimal percentage royalties being returned to the local community.

Mr Forrest is no philanthropist and anyone in doubt of this should read Points 148 and 176 especially about Forrest's screwing of his mate Joe Guttnick in the case Edensor v Anaconda www.austlii.edu.au/au/cases/vic/VSC/2001/502.html

Psyclaw

August 9. 2012 07:04 PM

Gravel

Ad Astra

Another great topic.  I bristle every time I hear the words "class warfare".  I know that the neediest people is our society are going to cop it in the neck.

Talking of "warfare", does anyone else notice the use of violent words, in particular by Abbott?

Talk Turkey

Glad to read your great news, being independent once again in regards to  your water works.

Gravel

August 9. 2012 07:04 PM

2353

jaycee said If you notice, the mincing poodle and all those other yappers have gone very, very quiet. Methinks there is plotting afoot!  Perhaps they've decided on a small target strategy while Newman does his best?  The other more probable option is since Slipper and Thomson worked so well (sarcasm intended), maybe there is another one coming up.

2353

August 9. 2012 07:08 PM

jaycee

Thank dog for Monty Don.....Friends, we are in deep trouble..If we apply a methodology I call ;"Logical truth", which operates on the simple principle that, excluding parrallel universes and existentialism, anything that truly exists, has to go through a series of logical steps of raw material and construction..like a loaf of bread, for instance.
We have the LNP. in the most favourable position in the polling..at the moment!..How do we have this situation, given the lying, evasions, complete disregard for Parliamentry proceedure?
If we strip away all the obfuscation, and get back to the logic and the truth, we are left with a collection of incompetents on the front bench, supported and financed by, in turn, a lying media and a disreputable bunch of "rent seekers".
So the nation of Australia is at the risk of being "administered" by a coalition of absolute liars, a coterie of bloated scheming moguls, both shielded from public scrutiny by a mischievious, malevolent mendatious media..and THAT is only the ABC.!..the commercials are just filth...absolute filth!
Now...aint THAT the truth!?

jaycee

August 9. 2012 07:32 PM

janice

Good evening all.  Sorry I've been AWOL once again - I've been grounded or should I say, disabled, by my crumbling spine which decided to stack on a gander for no good reason.  Anyway, I am now able to sit for short periods whereas previously I was forced to lie flat or stand!  Lucky for me No.1 son turned up with a lap top so I've been able to keep up with the goings on but unable to type posts.  

Yes, Ad Astra, the rent seekers are in fine voice these days.  What really gets me is that people who have least are the first to front up with placards supporting them.  I watched those MRRT rallies in Perth and was completely gobsmacked at the apparent adoration with which people seemed to look upon the likes of Gina and Twiggy.

PatriciaWA I am pleased to read how well you are doing with your recovery.  Love your pomes as well.

Talk Turkey, I wonder if you heard my applause ? to read you are now on the mend, have ditched the catheter and can pee again.  Smile

janice

August 9. 2012 08:05 PM

LadyInRed

Ad astra

You should be proud you are nearly always ahead of the rest. Looks like others are getting on the media is behind TAbbott, and Tabbott manipulates the media:

Mr Abbott is not being judged on his ability to run a government, but on his ability to manipulate the media coverage by refusing to address a central question about a major policy

http://www.abc.net.au/unleashed/4188322.html

LadyInRed

August 9. 2012 08:19 PM

Ad astra

Psyclaw
Thank you for your informative input into the discussion.  You expose the subtle way these rent-seekers operate, and how Twiggy Forrest cloaks his actions in seemingly laudable intent, such as aboriginal employment, which he has been at pains to publicize.  I glanced at the details of the Edensor Nominees Pty Ltd v Anaconda Nickel case.  What a complex tangle that is/was.

As for Malcolm Turnbull, I don’t know why he bothers sitting on Abbott’s front bench.  He doesn’t need the money, he is bored and disillusioned, his intellect needs something better to swim in than the cesspool of Coalition politics, and he has no hope of returning to leadership while Abbott and his ultra-conservative group run the show.  Yet he is the choice of leader of those polled, and many Labor supporters like him too.  It is a pity he wastes his time.

Ad astra

August 9. 2012 08:22 PM

James Adelaide

Help,

i think I am in an alternate universe,

The Australian and Telegraph are running informative, unbiased news stories.

Please tell me I am not dreaming....


www.dailytelegraph.com.au/.../story-e6freuy9-1226394898802
video.theaustralian.com.au/.../Labor-hits-sixmonth-high-in-Newspoll
www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-fn59niix-1226446593729

James Adelaide

August 9. 2012 08:28 PM

Ad astra

jaycee, 2353
I can’t explain what’s happening with the Thomson or Slipper matters.  I suspect that as there seems to be less and less in these matters for the Coalition, they have gone quiet on them.

42 long
Of course he who pays the piper calls the tune, and we know who ‘pays’ Abbott and Co.  So he sings their tune.  Simple.

Ad astra

August 9. 2012 08:38 PM

Ad astra

Janice
I’m sorry to read of your health problems.  I hope that like Patriciawa and TT you will continue to improve.  We are thinking of you all.

Those rallies in WA were astonishing in that those billionaires could evoke such public sympathy and support for their fight against paying their fair share of tax on mining our minerals.

Ad astra

August 9. 2012 08:43 PM

Ad astra

LadyinRed
That Tim Dunlop article was spot on.  Surely those he criticizes must squirm with professional embarrassment when they read what he writes.  His conclusion is a devastating commentary on contemporary MSM journalism:

“Tony Abbott is playing the media for fools, dishing up the sort of content that he knows they find, in their weakened state, impossible to decline. By accepting it uncritically, they have created a positive feedback loop where he and the media now feed off each other.”

Ad astra

August 9. 2012 08:51 PM

Ad astra

James Adelaide
I’m glad to see you back on TPS.  Your links give truth to the old saying that ‘truth will out’.  Abbott has lied his way to where he is now, but eventually, like the boy who called wolf, he will get his comeuppance.

Ad astra

August 9. 2012 08:58 PM

Patriciawa

Hi Janice, I'm sorry to hear about your indisposition, and very sad to think that it's not going to improve in future. I imagine the the long term prognosis for a crumbling spine is not that good. But isn't that laptop a treasure for keeping one in touch with the world!

My own time out was limited but having my think pad made even those few days bearable.  Being hospitalised after the accident made me very aware of how blessed I am and have been, not having been near a hospital in the almost half a century since my children were delivered in maternity wards.

Like you, I'm really pleased to know that TT is out of pain and on the mend.

PS  Thanks for your lovely comments on my latest pomes.  You have have been a loyal follower.  I'm not sure if you saw this one, but Ad Astra's post makes it relevant again.  So this is for you!

Starting Wars Is Not Swan’s Way

Wayne Swan did not declare this war
It was Clive Palmer crying poor
On Lateline not two years ago
When Kevin Rudd was all aglow,
Insisting miners pay more tax.
That night Clive said he’d get the axe;
Promised a miners’ revolution
To bring about Rudd’s execution.

So it was.    Twiggy and Gina
Came charging into the arena.
They roused the citizens of Perth
To claim states’ rights to sell their earth.
Well known Aussie mining magnates,
Victorious,  this band of mates,
Then refused negotiations
And Gillard’s terms with corporations.


Billionaires on the back of trucks
Got Tony Abbott thinking,  “Shucks!
We’ll have a nationwide revolt!
Bring carbon pricing to a halt!”
But somehow his People’s Rising,
Urged on by his catastrophizing,
Flopped.   It did not eventuate
He’d get what he thought his ‘due’ estate.

Abbott couldn’t make the distance,
So Clive now has to lead resistance.
The manpower of a footie team,
Plus  ‘National Treasure’  title,  seem
To enlarge him,  make him bigger,
Into a massive public figure.
Ally Twiggy gets his jollies
In Canberra,  nagging pollies.


It wasn’t hard to find a part
Ideally played by Ms Rinehart.
In charge of all their propaganda,
She made sure their memoranda
Were written up, had wide report
In her media outlets newly bought.
That’s when Swannie sounded the alarm!
“Oz beware! Our democracy could come to harm!”



Patriciawa

August 9. 2012 08:58 PM

Ad astra

Gravel
Thank you for your complimentary remark.  

I too find the term ‘class warfare’ not just inappropriate, but offensive.

Abbott is a bare-knuckle street fighter.  ‘War’ and fighting is his game, as I first pointed out in The pugilistic politician.  He knows nothing else.

www.thepoliticalsword.com/.../...c-politician.aspx

Ad astra

August 9. 2012 09:02 PM

Ad astra

Patriciawa
How appropriate that you should post your telling pome about Wayne Swan.  Thank you.

I’m glad to read that you are recovering steadily.

Ad astra

August 9. 2012 09:21 PM

Ad astra

Folks
I'm calling it a day.

Ad astra

August 9. 2012 09:41 PM

Truth Seeker

Aa, another well thought out and balanced article, exposing the mendacity of those self promoting rent seekers.
I agree with all that you said, so eloquently, with only a possible reservation in regards to Turnbull, who, I used to think, was one of the few in the LNP who had some level of personal integrity. I was, however, sadly disappointed, after watching his performance on QandA, coming to the conclusion that he was gutlessly following the party line to the nth degree, and to his own detriment, taking a step too far back into the the moral abyss, inhabited by the rest of Abbott's front bench and relegating himself to the ranks of the morally bankrupt and self serving LNP rent seekers.
I do agree that he looks bored and totally disinterested in his current role, half heartedly going through the motions of his  portfolio brief with little or no conviction , which only goes to emphasise his good little LNP team player persona and diminishes his leadership potential.

Keep up the good work Aa the country and our party need you

Cheers

    

Truth Seeker

August 9. 2012 10:02 PM

TalkTurkey

Ad astra
I actually didn't know the meaning of 'Rent seekers' until now.
But I sure do know what you mean now. Why people are so sycophantic towards these filthy-rich pigs of people is beyond me, I suppose they hope that the pigs will leave a bit of swill for them, fat chance, Rindlard won't even give her kids any until 3000 AD or like that. Looking at her photo here, doesn't she look like her next utterance will be Snort-snort, there's no way you can write the sound a pig makes, I know because I once wrote a play called SNORT about crooked pigs in the Drug Squad, but it was pronounced like the real sound. Smile

And for at least once I agree with Marilyn, though I think she means ADF by ADP, no criticism, I take it it was a typo.

Military madness is killing the planet, not just Australia's economy suffers, the whole world does.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=czUx2gvjdJk

Janice Dear, my sufferings are at an end for the time being, or mostly, still feels a bit like peeing on an electric fence but OHHHHH the relief of freedom from constant deep pain and catheter, I'm feeling really good actually! I'm amazed! So now I am passing on to you all those wishes for me, as I passed on to the Nurses' Station counter the bouquet of perfect pink camellias a friend of my darling J**** sent me, where it delights the eyes of the many instead of just me.

I know my wellwishers will be happy to let me do so, though I'm sure many will want to send their own specifically to you. You have a tough row to hoe now, and we do not forget that you are the Platinum Swordie of us all, the first who ever replied to Ad on this fightingest of sites.

Anaesthetic dulls and stupefies the mind, though in my case Jason says, situation normal. But I know there are many wellwishers I have missed out on thanking, Please take this as personal thanks to every one of you. It is what Socialism, caring for one's fellows, is all about, and it is the only clear teaching that I take from the Bible - and one that Abbortt does not. But let not Religion take the credit for humanist empathy, it belongs to the individual Humans like the Good Samaritan, he was a humanist and socialist and specifically not a Jew, and not a Christian either! Nor was he the first ever to take responsibility for his fellow being, he was an ordinary decent man.

Pre-white-contact Australian Aborigines did the same for Ulm, an airman who was lost in the NT in the 30's I think, I can't vouch for the details but I know they chewed his food for him when he was so near death he couldn't chew for himself. That ought to keep us all humble!

So many good points on this thread already! I can't answer them all (I'm too busy insulting the ABC right-wing vipers on Twitter Smile )  but I will say, Ad, little John Button was one of my brother's closest friends, G. was devastated by his early death, what a great little far-sighted man JB was.

But having my own being back in working order, I feel SO upbeat now about the politics I am feeling "glad all over"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yrrch43CweU

Abbortt IS on the run and losing, not just his newly-dyed hair neither, he's done for. No longer the darling of the media, they are at last seeing through his hollowness and bored by his going-nowhere stunts and his refusal and inability to answer real questions. We've got him corralled Pardners, and if they do try to ride him all the way to the election they'll've backed a loser and they are becoming horribly, deliciously aware of it. I'm VERY confident about my bet with Sportsbet, drinks'll be on me not far into Election Night, Jason'll be lucky to roll his way home that night!

Cheers Comrades, just keep doing what we're doing, We'll succeed at last you betcha. Check these lyrics!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=18EAqHx2lMk

VENCEREMOS!  

TalkTurkey

August 9. 2012 10:43 PM

Wake Up

DMW, 2353 and ToM should have a look at this................

www.independentaustralia.net/.../

Wake Up

August 9. 2012 10:52 PM

Wake Up

Don't you just love the hypocrisy of Abbott............ this morning in the face of the 'Aboriginal Meme' affair he invoked a Coalition ' task force' to look at social media including 'stronger takedown powers for the regulator' yet only three days ago he was heroically swinging to defend 'free speech'.

Wake Up

August 9. 2012 10:52 PM

TalkTurkey

I meant to comment on Turdball too, O yeah, he is to Abbortt as Rudd would like to be to *J*U*L*I*A*, but where she trounced Rudd and all Murdoch's forces and all Murdoch's pens couldn't put Kevin back up there again, Turdy lost by just one vote (and that an absentee!) and he has been continuously humiliated and as Ad says forced to accept the anti-NBN poisoned chalice he doesn't even believe in, he must be smarting and fuming, because however much I dislike him, Blind Freddy can see that he is altogether a superior being to the utterly despicable Abbortt, and they BOTH know it! And so does their party, all the ones with any brain or decency anyway. What fun for us!
When will Turdy Challenge? Will he take a lesson from spineless Costello, or just lie down and be buggered? Obviously when Abbortt loses, if he's still LOTO until then, NOBODY much will want the LOTO's job, certainly not Turdy, he's got better options, as Abbortt has not. So if he's going to challenge he MUST do it soon, he is corroding Abbortt's base without saying much at all, but NONE of them, Turdy, J Bishop, Snotty Joe, Poo-Poo or anyone, has the wide appeal to carry more than half the party - indeed most would be resisted by more than half - but neither has Abbortt their confidence now, they have an embarrasssment of poverty in talent with no-one up to the task.      

No hubris Comrades, that would be fatal, we ain't there yet, but this coming Spring Parliamentary session is going to see our confident, successful champions landing blow after blow, backed by the best BISONs in the world, and Pyne and Brough and Uhlmann, and all who have aided and abetted them, are going to look very sick indeed in a few weeks. Some should end up behind bars. Yippeee!Smile

TalkTurkey

August 9. 2012 11:21 PM

TalkTurkey

Oh Patricia!
I reckon this is your very best, it has real punch, and it's clear that you have cracked the Rhyming Barrier, sommething I claim for myself too, perhaps a little vainly, but isn't it FUN, English, when you KNOW you are going to find the onomatopoeia and the alliteration, the rhymes and the nuances you need to put together a delight like yours above.

Do you read your pomes to little Tacker? Do your own rhymes ever make you cry? Dam, some of mine do that to me! Smile

Ad astra I LOVE The Political Sword. The way it summons up the blood might well be the critical factor in our eventual win.

Oh and I feel GOOD tonight! Smiling, well, and confident. Yea!

TalkTurkey

August 9. 2012 11:29 PM

TalkTurkey

You can get it if you really want
You can get it if you really want
You can get it if you really want
But you must try, try and try
Try and try, you'll succeed at last

Persecution you must bear
Win or lose you've got to get your share
Got your mind set on a dream
You can get it, though harder them seem now


You can get it if you really want
You can get it if you really want
You can get it if you really want
But you must try, try and try
Try and try, you'll succeed at last
I know it, listen

Rome was not built in a day
Opposition will come your way
But the hotter the battle you see
It\'s the sweeter the victory, now


You can get it if you really want
You can get it if you really want
You can get it if you really want
But you must try, try and try
Try and try, you'll succeed at last

You can get it if you really want
You can get it if you really want
You can get it if you really want
But you must try, try and try
Try and try, you'll succeed at last

You can get it if you really want - I know it
You can get it if you really want - though I show it
You can get it if you really want
- so don't give up now

TalkTurkey

August 9. 2012 11:52 PM

Psyclaw


Wake Up @ 10.43pm

Thanks so much for the IA link.

So the 6o Minutes of old is different to the current mob! Now whoda thought that?

And all the physical evidence handed on a plate to PW by a HSUee and then handed on a plate by PW to a number of MSMs has not been reported! Whoda thought that?

And the MSM is attacking the government per se, not just their policies, and is protecting the dishonest Abbottter narrative! Now whoda thought that?

On a brighter note For some reason the Scott's ABC Lateline agenda is very ill tonight.

Tom Iggulton? just presented an expose placing Abbott in a very poor light ...... the first so clearly balanced report I have seen on the ABC for years. Yes years! So glad I watched! (Note: a perfectly balanced report will always favour the government, because all honest reporting of Abbott will by definition have to report his lies ...... his daily lies   ...... ie daily criticisms of his honesty deficits and the lies he has presented in the immediately past 24 hours)

Iggulton? bowled the ball straight at middle stump, no frills, no herbs and spices.

He said Abbott has had a very bad day. He did say it! You doubting Thomas Swordsters will just have to believe what I say, or review Lateline online!

They showed clips of him at the Ekka saying the "gold plated " poles and wires agenda is not responsible for the price rises over the past few years, it's the ETS. Then they showed a clip of Turnbull today and a previous clip of Newman specifically and in detail arguing the opposite, ie supporting JG. They really did show this!

Then they presented the info of McFarlane and Abetz saying (begrudgingly) that today's employment stats are OK and contrasted this with Abbott saying the opposite. Yes they did!

In an unrelated post last night I discussed the issues of foreseeability and 20/20 hindsight. I admitted that I had plenty of the latter and only a limited amount of the former, since I am not totally clairvoyant. One thing I certainly didn't forsee was an episode of Lateline like the one that hit my telly tonight.

Dog Albitey I am in shock.

What other unforseen turns by worms await us? Here's hopin!

If the MSM generally begins to present even a slightly balanced treatment of both sides then Abbott is shafted. So much for the premature speculators all over the place who have been calling his 2013 victory with certainty for more than a year now.

Psyclaw

August 10. 2012 12:23 AM

Psyclaw


AA

The Edensor v Anaconda case (Twiggy v Joseph Guttnick) is a case of Promissory Estopell (PE).

This action in law was confirmed for Australia in a HC case in which Waltons (as in Waltons n Sears) screwed a tenant a few decades back. Basically it is the legal action which catches out and punishes con artists.

The required elements for the action to succeed are that:

1) the conman convinces the victim that they have entered a legal binding relationship with obligations (they haven't ..... the "legal relationship" is the crux of the scam)
2) the bait is a promise (apparent obligation) for the conman to do something beneficial to the victim, if the victim does what the con man suggests
3) the victim complies
4) the victim suffers damage/harm (usually financial) as a result

This was proved against Forrest and of course it cost him many $s.

Of great significance in the case are the facts that:

1) the judge said that Forrest was dishonest in his evidence
and
2) Forrest's behaviour towards his friend Guttnick was "unconscionable". (This term is the most powerful statement the bench uses to describe a person's poor character.)

All in all, to be a loser in such a case would to most people be the most embarrassing experience of their life. Most normal people would naturally go into hiding and avoid the media like the plague for 4 or 5 decades.

But not all are "normal"!

Psyclaw

August 10. 2012 12:24 AM

Psyclaw


Lyn and Gravel

Thank you both for recent kind comments.  Smile Smile Smile Smile Smile

Psyclaw

August 10. 2012 01:17 AM

TalkTurkey

Psyclaw,
I didn't see lateline but I admit to astonishment that Iggulden (correct spelling) would be anythig but one of the most outrageous Abborttian shills of all on Their ABC. I despise him. I have never seen anything from him but putdowns of Labor.

So this Lateline I must see. What could it presage? Surely, only possibility is that he (and his ilk too it seems) are quite suddenly becoming apprehensive that Abbortt will not lead them to glorious victory, but to defeat both ignominious and probably detrimental to their future career advancement prospects. He is a creep of the first water, he makes my flesh crawl.

I'm'a go looking on iview. Ta for headsup..  

TalkTurkey

August 10. 2012 07:17 AM

Lyn

Today’s Links

The Usual Murdoch Dirty Tricks (63): The Good Newspoll, Bob Ellis
Newspoll has been explained by O’Shannessy as people ‘turning off politics’ during the Olympics. A better explanation is that it is the first honest Newspoll in quite a while, because people were home watching the Olympics to take the call as never before in the last four years they were home to take the call and not out on their mobiles uncontactable.
www.ellistabletalk.com/.../

How Jacksonville junked mainstream media credibility, Independent Australia
There is no doubt in my mind whatsoever that the ABC is compromised as a purveyor of the truth with respect to the affairs of the Australian Parliament and their reporting of events surrounding Craig Thomson and his alleged wrongdoing. And their silence on Jacksonville confirms this bias. They have a Charter to inform the Australian public in a balanced way they have breached this promise.
www.independentaustralia.net/.../

Power Shocks Gillard Back To Life, Ben Eltham, New Matilda
attacking the states on electricity pricing is that it keeps the government on the front foot, and Tony Abbott on the back foot. The Opposition Leader appears to fallen for the trap of trying to deny that any infrastructure gold-plating is going on in the first place — an unfavourable position from which to argue, and one which distracts from his preferred line of attack about the evils of the carbon tax.
newmatilda.com/.../power-shocks-gillard-back-life

If Tony Abbott didn't exist, the media would have to invent him, Tim Dunlop, The Drum
Tony Abbott is playing the media for fools, dishing up the sort of content that he knows they find, in their weakened state, impossible to decline. By accepting it uncritically, they have created a positive feedback loop where he and the media now feed off each other.
http://www.abc.net.au/unleashed/4188322.html

Since the carbon tax started: Edition 6, Stephen Koukoulas, Market Economics
With the jobs data and more markets news, there is a little more news about the post-carbon tax economy. The data today showed a 14,000 rise in employment and a 0.1 percentage point fall in the unemployment rate. Financial market variables keep rolling on and they have been updated in the table below.
www.marketeconomics.com.au/2201-since-the-carbon-tax-started-edition-6

Turn the axe around on the state Liberals,  Solidarity Net
In NSW, Liberal Premier Barry O’Farrell is cutting 15,000 public service jobs, has attacked Workers’ Compensation, privatised the ferries, and wants to sell off the ports and power generators. In Victoria, Liberal Ted Baillieu is cutting 1000 jobs, attacking TAFE and de-funding services like homelessness prevention.
www.solidarity.net.au/.../

Labor’s Next Generation, Denis Altman, Inside Story
Labor certainly needs to counter views as distorted as the Australian’s reference to “its partners in minority government.” (Do their editors actually know what a “minority government” is?) But it is hard to believe that intemperate attacks on people who are sympathetic to many Green positions, a significant number of whom are its own supporters, will regain many votes.
http://inside.org.au/labors-next-generation/

Five things Gillard could do to fix the electricity market, Tristan Edis , Crikey
The challenge is that, contrary to Tony Abbott’s ignorant assertions yesterday, the federal government doesn’t hold all the regulatory strings, as the constitution vests the power to regulate power with the states. But not to worry, just take a lesson from the Hilmer competition reforms and make some payments to states contingent on them cooperating on implementation of these
www.crikey.com.au/.../

Abbott says PM ‘misled’ on electricity prices, David Twomey, Eco News
“So every time your power price rises Julia Gillard has a smile on her face because the carbon tax is doing precisely what it is intended to do, if it doesn’t hurt, it doesn’t work,” he said.
Asked whether a coalition government could guarantee lower power prices, Mr Abbott said: “I can guarantee that the carbon tax will be gone under an Abbott government
econews.com.au/.../

Solar panel popularity cuts demand, Christina MacPherson, Antinuclear
The Australian Energy Market Operator’s (AEMO) South Australian Electricity Report (SAER) reveals there has been a five per centreduction in the state’s annual energy consumption in 2011-12 becauseof reduced demand from large industry and the increased popularity of solar panels.
antinuclear.net/.../

The Westminster System is the Problem – Get rid of it!, Ghanpa, Café Whispers
politicians are concerned only with advantage; routine dishonesty is their stock-in-trade, and they have neither the will nor the ability to distinguish right from wrong. They represent themselves first, their faction second, their party third, and their electorates purely by chance, because issues are never considered on their merits,
cafewhispers.wordpress.com/.../

Will the Coalition derail the NBN? Stephen Bartholomeusz, Technology Spectator
NBN Co is managing to stay more or less in line with its original game plan. Indeed, it is now forecasting a minute increase in the return it will eventually generate, from 7 per cent to 7.1 per cent, assuming the NBN rollout as NBN Co and the Gillard government envisage it is ever completed. Tony Abbott and Malcolm Turnbull may well determine that.
technologyspectator.com.au/will-coalition-derail-nbn

Turnbull slams “insulting” NBN delays, blowouts, Renai LeMay, Delimeter
Frankly, I consider this kind of behaviour below the Member for Wentworth, and I have to acknowledge I am disappointed to see an intellectual of his stature stoop to such a level. Why isn’t Turnbull looking at the big picture here, instead of tiny details which don’t tell the whole story?
delimiter.com.au/.../

Liberals not united on power prices, Lateline
The Prime Minister has accused the Opposition of leaving Tony Abbott stranded after prominent Liberals voiced conflicting opinions on the reason behind recent power price rises.
www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2012/s3564655.htm

Today’s Front Pages
Australia Newspaper Front Pages for 10 August 2012
www.frontpagestoday.co.uk/index.cfm

Lyn

August 10. 2012 07:21 AM

Ad astra

LYN'S DAILY LINKS updated: www.thepoliticalsword.com/.../...-DAILY-LINKS.aspx

Ad astra

August 10. 2012 08:03 AM

2353

Wake up, thank you for your post last night.  For your information I have been reading Independent Australia (including Jackonville) for some time and am also amazed that the media in general haven't shouted it from the rooftops.  I think if you actually read my post @ 7:04 last night on this thread I also ask what happened to the Liberal Party publicity for the Slipper/Thomson issues.

I would also suggest if you take the ideological glasses off for a sec and actually read my posts, I have suggested that neither the media or the ALP are blameless for the current media coverage of various issues that would paint the Government in a positive light.

You might remember that an Italian Cruise Liner recently was recently grounded in a shallow channel as apparently the person navigating the ship went too close to the shore.  Your (and others attitudes here recently) could be compared to the person in charge of the ship at the time claiming it wasn't fair that the rocks were there (even though they were a known hazard).

The communication from any organisation cetainly doesn't point out the organisations failures - I know Union communcation doesn't, I would imagine political party communication doesn't either.  Not being a member of a political tribe gives me the advantage of not being subject to the tribal groupthink inherent with this type of communication.

2353

August 10. 2012 08:08 AM

Pappinbarra Fox

Nailed it Mr Astra Sir!
I have needed an erudite explanation of the phrase as I have head iot amny times and interpreted it as a pejorative but not quite sure of its implications and deeper meaning. You're explanation is timely. Thank you.

Pappinbarra Fox

August 10. 2012 08:22 AM

Truth Seeker

TT, good to see you are well on the way back to your passionate best.

Patricia, the pen is as sharp as the sword in the cut and thrust of political discourse.
Nice one.

Cheers

Truth Seeker

August 10. 2012 08:50 AM

Psyclaw


TT Comrade

Sounds like you're at least a bit better than now than what you have endured over the past week or so. I hope you're really on the up and up.

Do have a geek at Lateline and if appropriate please tell me I'm not dreamin.

BTW I am interested to know if you fully were able to keep tabs on the last thread throughout your stupors and pains.

This is not an invitation, prompt or anything of the sort to join the fray..... that particular discussion is now done and dusted and whether it was a win, loss or draw to anyone is up to the judging panel ie Swordsters and (welcome) lurkers.

But since IMHO you are the leader of the TPS when it comes to absolute determination to defend our leader under all and any crossfire, and in exhorting we other mere mortals to pluck up and not go down any path of retreat, I am just interested to what degree you stayed in touch.

I'm out all day so your reply will be something to look forward to on my return.

All the best.

Psyclaw

August 10. 2012 09:01 AM

janice

Good morning all Swordians.
PatriciaWA - thank you for your pome - that is one of your best in my opinion.  I have no illusions about my crumbling spine but am a bit miffed that it suddenly and inexplicably grounded me for no good reason - anyway, whatever shifted and got into the nerve channel has eased its pressure and I have passed the 'acute' stage so that the pain is now manageable. I am always careful not to provoke such events by doing stupid things!

Ad astra,
Dunno if my optimistic nature has taken hold but I get the feeling that there is less antagonism out there wrt the PM and Labor.  I wonder if the 5th estate is making a difference in countering the misinformation and downright biased commentary we are fed on msm.

janice

August 10. 2012 09:16 AM

Ad astra

Truth Seeker
Thank you for your encouraging remarks.

I think we agree about Malcolm Turnbull.  Why does he continue in his role?  His meek submission to Abbott’s demands, with which he is not in accord, an almost zero prospect of ever being elected leader, and his personal wealth, make continuance on the front bench unnecessary and pointless for him professionally.

Ad astra

August 10. 2012 09:27 AM

Ad astra

Talk Turkey
Thank you for your several comments.  I agree that Abbott is losing his grip, and the political momentum is moving against him.  He is sounding more desperate by the day, lying more grotesquely as we saw last night on ABC TV.  His carbon tax story is evaporating; LNP premiers and Malcolm Turnbull are disagreeing with him on the ‘poles and wires’ story; and a few journalists are starting to put him under pressure.  It will be downhill from here.

I like you stirring verse and its conclusion: “You can get it if you really want 
- so don't give up now”.

It was good to talk with you just now and hear you so chirpy.  We all wish your recovery to continue rapidly.

Ad astra

August 10. 2012 09:36 AM

Ad astra

Psyclaw
Starting with Sabra Lane on AM, continuing on ABC TV and finishing with Tom Iggulden on Lateline, Abbott was put under more pressure and subject to more criticism than we have seen before.  Maybe the tide is turning, ever so slowly.

Thank you for reminding us of the judge’s adverse comments about Twiggy Forrest in his case against Joseph Guttnick.

Ad astra

August 10. 2012 09:39 AM

Ad astra

Pappinbarra Fox
Thank you for your kind comment and welcome to The Political Sword family.  Do come again.

I’m glad this piece was informative.

Ad astra

August 10. 2012 09:44 AM

Ad astra

Wake Up
Abbott is the epitome of hypocrisy and deception.  Did you see him last night insisting that the increase in electricity prices over recent times was due to the carbon tax years, before it was introduced!

Ad astra

August 10. 2012 09:50 AM

Ad astra

2353
I’m sure there will be lots more to come out of the Jacksonville drama.  The fact that the Coalition has gone quiet suggests that there is not much mileage in it for them.

Ad astra

August 10. 2012 09:53 AM

Ad astra

janice
I think you may be right.  I’d be pretty sure that the Fourth Estate takes a look at Fifth Estate from time to time, so maybe they are taking note.

Ad astra

August 10. 2012 09:54 AM

Ad astra

Hi Lyn
Your collection of links looks delectable, but as we are hurrying to get on the road to Melbourne and have a very busy day ahead, I’ll have to leave them until later.  I’ll take the iPad and try to take a look on the way.  But likely, I’ll not be able to get back to TPS before this evening.

Ad astra

August 10. 2012 10:12 AM

TalkTurkey

Hi-Ho Lyn and Ad
(first two up and fighting the Good Fight! )
and of course Everybody!

I'm still in hospital but I'm dressed in civvies and back in the Human Race, no attachments, I'm almost sure I'll be going home today with the nightmare at an end. Thank Dog!

Just saying that, "Thank Dog", makes you realize how STUPID is belief in a deity! One creepy bloke on Twitter yesterday replied to one of my own tweets thus:

Peter Madden‏@petermadden2u
@TalkyTurkey @LibtardBanshee @PillsongChurch It is the arrogant assumption of secularists, that Secularism is the rightful religion of AUS

Boy did he get slapped down! Before I even responded several people did it for me, e.g. "Secularism is not a religion you stupid prick"  and I told him he sees everything through religion-#*cked eyes, and that his rotten religion is the cause of wars. It is so good to have the Internet where non-theistic people can join forces, the thing about religions is they physically bring people together so they reinforce each other's stupid superstitious beliefs, where non-theists have no reason, and therefore no opportunity, to coalesce. Now at last we can pool our sanity to smack them down. Dog grant us the power within the next generation of so to send all religion to Hell where it all belongs.

Cleared for take-off at 10 AM!

Janice my thoughts are with you now.  

TalkTurkey

August 10. 2012 10:30 AM

2353

Here comes the "karma train" - although this is also in Fairfax who would love taking it up to NewsCorp.

www.brisbanetimes.com.au/.../...0120809-23x53.html

I'd also question Abbott's strong support for Bolt while talking about limiting comments on Twitter and blogs such as this one.

2353

August 10. 2012 10:47 AM

Lyn

Good Morning Ad and Everybody

Twitterverse

Abbott struggles to find form as the game shifts, Laura Tingle
The shakiness of Abbott’s performance in the past couple of weeks when he has had to deal with issues other than the carbon tax has been particularly notable in a week when the Prime Minister has returned from holidays on the front foot, dusting up the states over the surge in electricity prices over the past four or five years.
afr.com/.../abbott_struggles_to_find_form_as_6T9xNT2nvhcBHpd7dwirUP


Sims’ push on power reform, AFR FREE
The head of the competition regulator will today back the federal government’s push to overhaul national energy market rules and claim state ownership of power networks has contributed to energy price rises.
www.afr.com/.../sims_push_on_power_reform_cCOl20vY75rkRtmbQutM6N

Gillard at least deserves a tick for economy
On any objective assessment, Australia's economy is a gold medal performer. Yet Opposition Leader Tony Abbott routinely condemns ''the worst government in Australia's history''. Coalition Treasury spokesman Joe Hockey, faced with strong growth data, retorted: ''Imagine how well our country could do if we had a good government.''
www.theage.com.au/.../...onomy-20120809-23wyk.html

Carbon tax in soft landing, Tim Colebatch
THE federal opposition's scare campaign against the carbon tax has failed its first test. The Bureau of Statistics reports that seasonally adjusted employment rose by 14,000 in July - the month the tax took effect - while unemployment fell to 5.2 per cent.

While this was only the first test of the carbon tax, if the duo of rising employment and low inflation continues, it could have huge political implications - undermining Opposition Leader Tony Abbott's repeated claim that the carbon tax would be ''like a wrecking ball through our economy
www.theage.com.au/.../...nding-20120809-23x6t.html

AnyoneButAbbott‏   Lenore Taylor
Doesn't seem like Tony is singing off the same page as his party www.smh.com.au/.../...ce-rises-20120809-23x64.html The Liberals can do better than Abbott #auspol

Abbott call on racial slur blasted
Les Malezer, the co-chairman of the National Congress of Australia's First Peoples, also accused Opposition Leader Tony Abbott of ''exploiting intolerance'' by promising that a Coalition government would amend anti-discrimination law to narrow the definition of racial vilification.
www.theage.com.au/.../...asted-20120809-23x2a.html

Joyce spots chink of light in bid for lower house, Phillip Coorey
BARNABY JOYCE'S path to the House of Representatives - and possibly the deputy prime ministership - appears smoother after the Nationals MP he is seeking to replace refused to commit to recontest his seat.
www.theage.com.au/.../...house-20120809-23x60.html

Increase in digital sales allays decline in newspapers
AUSTRALIA'S newspapers have again recorded disappointing circulation and readership figures, with overall weekday circulation down by 5.7 per cent year-on-year. But digital sales have provided some positive news, with many publications recording double-digit growth
www.smh.com.au/.../...wspapers-20120809-23x2y.html

Free speech debate is coloured by hypocrisy
Abbott's clunky speech did not finesse the boundaries. His attack on the government's deliberations on the convergence review and the Finkelstein proposals for a News Media Council to patrol journalistic standards shows that he is quite content with the idea that a self-regulated regime, with one company straddling like a colossus the print and pay TV business in this country, is a great way to protect free speech.
www.smh.com.au/.../...ypocrisy-20120809-23x53.html

Queensland's unemployment worst in the mainland, as State Government job cuts continue
www.couriermail.com.au/.../story-e6freon6-1226447066716

Government axe falls on agriculture jobs
The Queensland Government says some regional jobs will be cut from the Department of Agriculture and Fisheries.
Yesterday, 200 staff were axed from the department's Brisbane headquarters.
www.abc.net.au/.../

Bad boy for Gilmore
like the Nationals as a party, I like their morals and they have a strong Christian component,” he said.He added it was up to the party to decide whether it would preselect him and when but warned he was considering switching to the Liberal Party if the Nationals did not offer him a chance to run and win.

“I’ve been involved in discussions with the Liberals and the Nationals, and if the Liberals offer preselection in a seat I have a chance of winning, I’d be foolish not to give that consideration,” he said.“I want to get in as soon as possible so I can use the time and energy I’ve got available
www.southcoastregister.com.au/.../?cs=203

Lyn

August 10. 2012 11:04 AM

LadyInRed

2353 @10:30am

Thanks for that link.

And while I am at it thanks to everyone who finds stuff and puts a link on this site.

A special big thanks as always to Lyn.

Puting up links is a great resource and saves me such a lot of time. I really appreciate it.

LadyInRed

August 10. 2012 11:20 AM

Tom of Melbourne

Allthe reflections about John Button are interesting. Ialso had a very high regard for him, as well as Jones. While Jones was called a factional player on the last thread, his role in the Victoria Branch of the ALP was similar to that of Button.

About 10 years ago, Button lamented the state of the party, he pointed out that 22 of the last 23 wnnnable seats had gone to union officials.

He also suggested that it was time for an amicabledivorce between unions and the ALP.

I suppose he made these points 10 years earlier than Jones, so will he be dismissed now?

Tom of Melbourne

August 10. 2012 11:41 AM

42 long

Button was a member of the Fabian society. ( just in passing).
  Is Barry a factionalist, because he thinks factions are not good?
   I enjoy the input of non-theists. like independents, they are not bound by anything to stop them analysing clearly.
  Tony treats the independents as if the ARE a PARTY, which is the ONE thing they are NOT.
  Atheists don't belong to the non-god religion. I have heard one theist saying things about "extreme" atheists. as if atheism IS a religion which it is NOT.
   I have heard a definition of an atheist as a "person with no "invisible " means of support, derived from the old definition of a vagrant, identifying with the attitude that it is a crime to be penniless...
    Watch out. It will soon be a crime to have no "god". That monkey on your back is to stay there....
  If Tony is a shining example of the Christian ethic , when he is  a backflipping hypochrite, then the ranks of the non-theists will be swelling enormously soon.

42 long

August 10. 2012 11:44 AM

Ian

Surely there is benefit to the rent-seekers when they do something for the benefit of all?  Can't Gina see that in paying more tax, she is helping small businesses in Australia so that the whole country, INCLUDING HER, can benefit?  Or does the vision of rentseekers extend no further than their noses?

Ian

August 10. 2012 11:52 AM

2353

Ian - the question is "what do I get out of it now?  Reinhart etc aren't prepared to wait for the "trickle up" effect.

2353

August 10. 2012 12:03 PM

LadyInRed

I often wonder what's is the point you are trying to score ToM? Point scoring is so yesterday. We can have different opinions ....its OK.

Your comment would have been so much more engaging if you had just left the last senetence off!

I recall someone pointing out that Jones was once a factional player himself. You call that discounting I call that interesting to note.

I do wish you and others would stop generalising about people on this site. If I want to be bullied, or read other people being bullied, I can go to alot of other sites for that kind of commentry.

LadyInRed

August 10. 2012 12:03 PM

2353

Completely off the topic - but funny (in a scary way) brisbanetimes.drive.com.au/.../...20810-23xu1.html.

2353

August 10. 2012 12:25 PM

Jason

ToM,
   Button and Jones can make all the points they like! The fact is when they were in a position to start the long progress towards the reform they now trumpet they did nothing! they were just innocent bystanders who despite their standing just had no authority what so ever to do anything, and now it's everyone elses fault.

The party like any organisation except the church should be in a constant state of change! yes hold core beliefs but as society and work changes so should the party.




Jason

August 10. 2012 12:52 PM

LadyInRed

2353  Thanks for that post very funny.

Jason - I think its called brilliance in hindsight.

The unions are having a resurgence in Queensland. So I guess they are irrelevant when everything is going well but indispensible when the s***t hits the fan.

LadyInRed

August 10. 2012 12:57 PM

42 long

Got to agree with jason there. politics is the art of the achievable ( at the time) It is always a compromise.. If you want absolutes get a dictatorship. (You might be getting one soon).
   The Labour party has it's genesis with the unions and probably the worker abuse in the coal  mines. A fair go for workers. It is still a fundamental ethic of the current ALP, although the ties with the union movement are less distinct, it still espouses a fair go for other than just the plutocrats.
  I'm an equal opportunity person essentially not a wealth equaliser. Real people shouldn't worship money, there are other values, worth seeking. Certainly obscene amounts ensure some live in a different world with power to control that must have limits for us to have a fair society.
   It's the manifest power imbalance that has to be addressed. Everyone talks democracy but it only works when people can be informed fully. That process has been corrupted severely in the western world by media, supposedly the bastion of free speech but in practice opposing it every inch of the way to gain even more power, for some. This applies domestically as well as on the worlds stage.

42 long

August 10. 2012 01:42 PM

DMW

Thanks for the link Wake Up. I did read that earlier yesterday.

LadyInRed I endorse your comment re links 1010% and endorse the bit re Lyn 2020%

DMW

August 10. 2012 02:12 PM

adelaidegirl

Hey TT and other crowies, would love to be involved in a catch-up - as soon as you are fully recovered and ready!  Just dipping in and out at the mo' so haven't caught up on your recovery but I hope it is going well.
Cheers x

adelaidegirl

August 10. 2012 02:20 PM

TalkTurkey

Home!

A couple of days have gone missing somewhere between Tuesday and where was I.

Feeling OK sort of but the whole thing, its eventual resolution yesterday included, is sort of setting in like jetlag, and some of the drugs have made me woozy and wobbly, glad I didn't have to drive home.

Ad I don't know if you realised it but the words of
'You can get it if you really want' belong to the song I linked to just before. Jimmy Cliff from the album The Harder They Fall, inspirational stuff eh.

Psyclaw I'm not ignoring you, I'm thinking. And I think I need to lie down for a while now.


TalkTurkey

August 10. 2012 02:20 PM

Tom of Melbourne

I’m merely pointing out that Button has made exactly the same points as Jones about the affiliation/control  of unions. But Button said his piece 10 years ago.

The greatest sign of disrespect I have ever seen (for an outstanding politician) was when Rudd declined to attend Button’s funeral because he was too busy. A shocking misjudgement by Rudd, but at the many barrackers decided they would excuse him.

Button was an outstanding intellect and a committed politician, the fundamental problem of the ALP is that they can’t get people like him into parliament now, as Jones correctly points out.

Tom of Melbourne

August 10. 2012 02:28 PM

Michael

Far be it from me...

No, darn it, I did tell you so, a few weeks back when I noted how rattled Julie Bishop seemed when addressing some Coalition gabfest.

I predicted then that Shouldabeen's days were numbered, and I'll opine here again that what we are seeing is the Coalition back-up boys and girls realising that Abbott really is a One Trick Tony.

The deflated '"carbon tax" wrecking ball' is exposing him as an increasingly shrill Chicken Little impersonator.

Man, he looked tough and on top of his game when baldfaced lying and testosterone snideness was enough to be the 'most successful Leader of the Opposition ever', a claim he happily applied to himself regularly, but lies and misogyny were always going to run thin.

And so they have. Julie Bishop sat in an inner shadow cabinet meeting and saw scenes from 'Downfall' playing out before her, not only with her inner eye, but looking straight at their Number One Guy.

The Coalition needs at least another two terms in Opposition to become the elected members of a legitimately policy-shaping and political-philosophy embodying party.

Flush out Howard's leftover has-beens who can't handle not being, but also try the patience and expose the transparency of the untergauleiters like O'Dwyer, Bernardi, and Briggs.

'Politicians' who are only in politics to kiss-ass at Kirribilli House, but won't have the patience to be forever hanging out for free-passes to that Harbourside truffles-stuffed trough with so many other gravy trains (and the years) passing them by.

Michael

August 10. 2012 03:12 PM

2353

Michael,

What's Julie Bishop got to worry about? From memory she was deputy to Nelson, Turnbull and Abbott - I'm sure she'll adapt Laughing

2353

August 10. 2012 03:36 PM

42 long

TfM don't think you will get a fight here about KRUDD's political judgement. some in QLd have a "slightly" understandable loyalty, but those who support his reinstatement are not doing so for the benefit of the ALP.
   Thinkers in the LNP, ( there must be some left) should have been more risk averse than put all their hopes in the  "weird one, mad Monk" who really is a "one act play", who has so much baggage on file ( as Rudd does) that once he starts to fall it will be an avalanche of ridicule not pretty to watch. Politics is a tough world. It would be justice to have a lot of the rubbish and deceit he has dished out be his downfall.

42 long

August 10. 2012 04:53 PM

Psyclaw


Michael

Another great post from you. Thanks.

"untergauleiters like O'Dwyer, Bernardi, and Briggs"

I have never heard this word before, but my gut feeling says that it means something along the lines of "loudmouth twits of shallow character who are unaware of their own intellectual limitations, and as well, being totally unaware of how silly most of their utterances are, are unable to grasp that they are an embarrassment to themselves and their party".

Or something along those lines!

Psyclaw

August 10. 2012 04:57 PM

TalkTurkey

Bad Turkey just tweeted

TalkTurkey‏@TalkyTurkey

Ad astra & TweetyLyn SINCERELY WELCOME the Hon Julia Gillard MP Prime Minister of Australia to http://www.thepoliticalsword.com/http://www.google.com.au/url

TalkTurkey

August 10. 2012 05:41 PM

42 long

gauleiter is head of a nazi administrative district.
o'dwyer is a petulant airhead. Why don't they serve up someone of substance. ex Costello staffer.  Peter's final revenge on the liberal Party for not making him the anointed one?
  Peter though Gillard's "moving on" saying was worthy of contempt. I noticed one of the LNP "notables used it( without acknowledgement) the other day.

42 long

August 10. 2012 05:43 PM

TalkTurkey

Dam those two links work fine on Twitter, sorry they don't here.

But they say
Ad astra and Tweety Lyn SINCERELY WELCOME The Hon Julia Gillard MP Prime Minister of Australia to The Political Sword
Smile

and the other one carries the quote from The Electric Kool-Aid Acid Test by Tom Woolfe THE MERRY PRANKSTERS WELCOME THE BEATLES

What fun, Twitter and TPS, but let us diligently explore the political possibilities. Lyn is leading the way. And *J*U*L*I*A* is a thoroughly competent typiste you know. (wtte "If a girl can type she can always get a job" - Julia's mother.)

[Oh but Tony can ride a bike!]

We are SO winning now. THEY are so LOSING! Shrivel, Abbortt.
The Ides of September,
Good Swordsfolk, remember?
Open challenge: November.
Dead ash by December.

Abbortt is DEAD ON TARGET according to Eye of Time. And for exactly the predicted reasons.

Where are we now, in Aussie Rules parallel not quite halfway through the 3rd Quarter. (I count breaks too.) The Coalons haven't kicked any goals since before quartertime, Labor's picked up from 1-1 to their 8-8 at quarter time, the score is now 3-11 to 8-11. Lots of points to Labor but not many goals, we keep hitting the posts that the MSM keeps shifting! But the Guvnors will have the wind in the last quarter, they're full of running, the Coalons looking disorganized dysfunctional and dismayed. Rattled. We're five goals down with a quarter and a half to go? Meh.

Honest, anybody, but Ad in particular, if you were THE power broker in the Libs now, what would you counsel?  Glad it's not my problem!

    

TalkTurkey

August 10. 2012 05:49 PM

Gravel

Janice

Glad to hear you are now out of pain.  I have missed reading your posts.

Patriciawa

Another brilliant pome, I really enjoyed it.

Talk Turkey

Well you were firing on all cylinders there for a while, hope you are getting some good rest now, and welcome back to your home, nothing better eh!

Okay, we have had the MSM do this to us before, they appear to be showing Abbott up and then bang they are backing him and hiding the truth once again.  TT knows I am a bit of a pessimist, and where the media is concerned, I will always be a pessimist.  They are probably lining up a whole new row of ducks against Labor to be let loose in the next couple of days.  The latest being that the asylum seekers are now causing cracks in the naval rescue boats.  I laughed but many gullible Aussie will go along and agree.

Gravel

August 10. 2012 05:50 PM

wordsmaydestroy

Thankyou for an interesting article.

Once upon a time the term carpetbaggers was used to describe people with many of the same intents as rent seekers. Carpetbaggers conjures up a great mental picture for me.

I am expecting the carpetbaggers at the AOC to mount a big campaign for increased funds for sport. They have no doubt been doing some appropriate lobbying of The Federal Minister while she is in London.

wordsmaydestroy

August 10. 2012 06:00 PM

Ad astra

Hi Lyn
I’m now in Melbourne and catching up with comments posted today. Your Twitterverse links as always are interesting.  

Laura Tingle’s piece may turn out to be prescient.  Here are her prophetic words: ”There has long been a fear in Coalition ranks that behind the ruthless effectiveness of the “stop the tax, stop the boats” Abbott attack, there may lurk a more chaotic machine in which the Coalition’s policy positions remain chaotic.  The Opposition Leader has said he wants the election to be about the carbon tax. And it is certainly the case that the hostility towards the Prime Minister that is bound up with the carbon tax issue may have already set the election outcome. But a position against the carbon tax alone will not get the Coalition through the next 12 months, or through the first year of government.” And so say many of us here on TPS.

afr.com/.../abbott_struggles_to_find_form_as_6T9xNT2nvhcBHpd7dwirUP

The Age editorial Gillard at least deserves a tick for the economy  concludes: ”The Westpac-Melbourne Institute index of consumer confidence reveals a disconnect between such facts [about our strong economy] and public opinion. Labor voters score 124 and Coalition voters a gloomy 79. The disparity belies their access to the same economic facts. So vital is consumer confidence that all responsible political leaders must be wary of ''talking down'' the economy. Whatever the sins of Julia Gillard and her government, gross economic mismanagement is not one of them.”  Bravo.

www.theage.com.au/.../...onomy-20120809-23wyk.html

Tim Colebatch’s piece too expresses doubt about the Abbott strategy.

This paragraph says it all: ”With the election not due for another year or more, the real test of the tax's impact on jobs and inflation lies ahead. But if the economy thrives over the coming year despite the tax - as most forecasters expect - it could become the political ''game-changer'' Labor is hoping for, discrediting the Coalition and its leader.

www.theage.com.au/.../...nding-20120809-23x6t.html

I feel the tide is turning.

Ad astra

August 10. 2012 06:23 PM

DMW

This tweet appealed to my sebse of humour

Elmo Keep ‏@Elmo_Keep (Retweeted by Mark Colvin)
And so ends another week on the Internet, where no one was upset by anything and the national dialogue was calmly advanced forward. Wait.

DMW

August 10. 2012 07:19 PM

42 long

i would have never committed to such a risky strategy. It was always all or nothing. I've said that for yonks. Is this the way the LNP would attack their international and monetary decisions? what sort of a precedent have they established. SCARY people!!. I think a lot  would be starting to realise this. It appears to not be Abbotts nature or ability to change his motus operandi. IF you study the history of this person why would you be surprised?
  I could not venture any suggestion as to how the LNP could start to get themselves untangled from the deadly web they have woven for themselves. I have watched it with amazement and alarm for months now. Is the LNP SO isolated from the REAL world that they thought they could FOOL/ BUY/ SCARE Their way through to when the ultimate prize just falls to them.
  They in fact have been extremely laxy and neglectful of doing their HOMEWORK. That is why you get as many different stories from as many sources. It's been all smoke and mirrors.
Just a rabble ruled by a "loopy"  weirdo. Hope they don't let him go overseas to embarrass us again.

42 long

August 10. 2012 07:23 PM

TalkTurkey


Ad astra said (among the odd other remark)

I feel the tide is turning

www.lyricsg.com/.../changes-iv-lyrics

can't you feel the change a-comin youtubeCat Stevens
Changes Iv

Don't you feel a change a coming
from another side of time
breaking down the walls of silence
lifting shadows from your mind
Placing back the missing mirrors
that before you couldn't find
filling mysteries of emptiness
that ysterday left behind

And we all know it's better
Yesterday has past
now let's all start living
for the one that's going to last
Yes, we all know it's better
yesterday has past
now let's all start living
for the one that's going to last

Don't you feel the day is coming
that will stay and remain
when your children see the answers
that you saw the same
when the clouds have all gone
there will be no more rain
and the beauty of all things
is uncovered again

And we all know it's better
Yesterday has past
now let's all start living
for the one that's going to last

Don't you feel the day is coming
and it won't be too soon
when the people of the world
can all live in one room
when we shake off the ancient
shake off the ancient chains of our tomb
we will all be born again
of the eternal womb

And we all know it's better
Yesterday is past
now let's all start living
for the one that's going to last

Don't you feel a change a coming
from another side of time
breaking down the walls of silence
lifting shadows from your mind
Placing back the missing mirrors
that before you couldn't find
filling mysteries of emptiness
that ysterday left behind
And we all know it's better
Yesterday has past
now let's all start living
for the one that's going to last
Yes, we all know it's better
yesterday has past
now let's all start living
for the one that's going to last
Don't you feel the day is coming
that will stay and remain
when your children see the answers
that you saw the same
when the clouds have all gone
there will be no more rain
and the beauty of all things
is uncovered again
And we all know it's better
Yesterday has past
now let's all start living
for the one that's going to last
Don't you feel the day is coming
and it won't be too soon
when the people of the world
can all live in one room
when we shake off the ancient
shake off the ancient chains of our tomb
we will all be born again
of the eternal womb
And we all know it's better
Yesterday is past
now let's all start living
for the one that's going to last


From the album Teaser & The Firecat

TalkTurkey

August 10. 2012 07:29 PM

2353

Seems all isn't well in Campbell's Kingdom.

www.abc.net.au/.../4191292

Could the LNP at state level be fighting for the spoils of defeat already?

42 Long - must be a pattern here - Mitt Romney didn't exactly cover himself with glory overseas either.

2353

August 10. 2012 08:13 PM

Ad astra

wordsmaydestroy
Welcome to The Political Sword family.  Do come again.

There is some resemblance between carpetbaggers and rent-seekers. Both are into exploitation.

Wikipedia say this about carpetbaggers: “In United States history, carpetbagger was a pejorative term Southerners gave to Northerners (also referred to as Yankees) who moved to the South during the Reconstruction era, between 1865 and 1877.
The term referred to the observation that these newcomers tended to carry "carpet bags," a common form of luggage at the time (sturdy and made from used carpet). It was used as a derogatory term, suggesting opportunism and exploitation by the outsiders. Together with Republicans they are said to have politically manipulated and controlled former Confederate states for varying periods for their own financial and power gains. In sum, carpetbaggers were seen as insidious Northern outsiders with questionable objectives meddling in local politics, buying up plantations at fire-sale prices and taking advantage of Southerners.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carpetbagger

Ad astra

August 10. 2012 08:25 PM

Ad astra

TT
Good Cat Stevens music and good verse.  Thanks.

Keep improving.

I'm calling it a day.

Ad astra

August 11. 2012 08:07 AM

jaycee

I don't know about the rest of you, but I find I am "settling in" to the preferred sites I go to for my news and information sources. For instance, I now rarely go to the ABC. for anything but as a back-up for the weather...the forums I find sickly, sticky with buffoonery right-wingers....I don't know how anyone bothers any more with such mullock! As for the commercials...trash, absolute trash.
This tells me that there is a feeling of "permanence" with the fifth estate as the, now, most legitimate public news and views format....thanks to people like AA, Miglo, Wixxy, IA and the rest too many to run through.
I feel a congratulations is in order....Bloody good work, people!..The future looks bright indeed.

jaycee

August 11. 2012 08:28 AM

Ad astra

jaycee
I'm glad you have found a home among the Fifth Estate blogs.  You are very welcome here.

Like you, I find offensive the violent comments that infect some blogsites, especially many in the Fourth Estate.

Ad astra

August 11. 2012 08:52 AM

DMW

Interesting

That baby faced assassin PvO has an 'expose' on the governments tactics.

Gillard's new shock tactics www.pressdisplay.com/pressdisplay/viewer.aspx

The link, via Mark Colvin and Latika Bourke takes you to the Press Display site and you should be able to read the whole thing without $ or jumping paywalls.

Beware there is some obligatory 'leadershit' specking in there as well.

DMW

August 11. 2012 09:21 AM

Ad astra reply

DMW
I couldn't find the PvO piece via that link, even using 'Search'. But what an amazing service is Press Display.

Ad astra reply

August 11. 2012 09:31 AM

Psyclaw


Swordsters and TT Comrade especially

The power of non verbal communication was classically highlighted by Abbott last night on Lateline.

Speaking about the Houston report, Abbott sincerely stated in words that he would certainly consider it. As he said those actual “yes” words his head turned sideways from left to right and back several times.

While his mouth said “yes” his body contradicted with “No!, No!, No!”.

This example of body language contradicting verbal communication is (as many here know) always the first example demonstrated in any Non-Verbal Communication 101 course.

So as well as knowing Abbott is lying by checking if his lips are moving, we can all double check by seeing if his head shakes.

As I write this I'm reminded of the guy in the Vicar of Dibley..... it brings a smile to my face .... "yes, yes, yes, yes, no" .... but I think that guy's intent is totally benign, unlike Abbott the tool's.

The first recaptcha word is "drange" (deranged!). Dog Above is agreeing with us about his failed recruit!

Psyclaw

August 11. 2012 09:54 AM

Psyclaw


Swordsters

Also see this. Apologies to the sweet tweetybird if this link has already been cited.

www.theage.com.au/.../...ntent-20120810-2401f.html

Here MGrattan has actually written a fairly balanced piece ...... not totally  ..... it contains a couple of jibes ..... but along with Thursday night's Lateline it is clear evidence that the wider MSM is sniffing the breeze coming from the few sensible colleagues they have.

Her article is nearly all fact...she lists the JG ammo for the Spring sitting ...... carbon issue dying, Houston, gold plated power infrastructure, NDIS, Gonski. And she also mentions the Colonition's confusion about these issues and how various shadows have been making statements contradictory to Abbott's ..... some of those statements being supportive of JG's.

There were a few snipes eg WTTE "JG says it will take a few months for people to suss out the fact that the carbon price isn't the end of the world, but she refuses to say how many months"

Dear dear dear! Very slack of the PM in refusing to be a clairvoyant, and having the sense to refuse to give Grattan a big stick so Grattan can belt her with it later on.

And Grattan says that Labor is pursuing reforms that people value "but they are costly". What insight! What major reforms have ever bee un-costly?

Grattan gives another oblique backhander to the PM viz ...."she insists that they (her reforms) are a three year strategy"  Why not "she has always said that ........"

I'm sure the MSM's stance hasn't totally changed for the better yet. At the moment I would rate the MSM as "running with the hares and hunting with the hounds" ...... a welcome change from the exclusively "hunting with the hounds" they have been doing for a few years.

Psyclaw

August 11. 2012 10:09 AM

DMW

Morning Ad
try this link: http://latika.me/PKDy59

DMW

August 11. 2012 10:10 AM

Macondo

Excellent article, but I think you've been reading too much Tom Watson - 'Dial M for Murdoch' - as have I, and have conflated him with Don Watson, the originator of 'Weasel Words'! Of course, Tom details many thousands of weasel words in his exposure of the evil ways of that criminal rent-seeking organisation, News International. Rent seekers are basically thieves, when all is said and done, which is why we live in a kleptocracy. Or should that be Murdochracy?

Macondo

August 11. 2012 10:31 AM

Psyclaw


Jaycee @ 8.07

Couldn't agree more. That's why I left The Drum, and only go there now very occasionally to put up a faux comment lest I lose my registered name (for lack of use).

AA

Did you watch Taggart on ABC last night? In solving the murder, the clue was the fact that the victim , tied up, had managed to carve "Ad Astra" on his arm.

The goodies won, and Ad Astra was the saviour / solution to the problem.

A good portent hey!!!!

Psyclaw

August 11. 2012 10:39 AM

Ad astra

DMW
Many thanks.  That article is worthy of note.  Despite the several caveats that PvO throws in, I still get a small hint of him ‘approving’ Julia Gillard’s strategy of attacking the LNP premiers instead of Tony Abbott, but of course he ‘wisely’ pronounces that this move should have been made earlier.  Interesting!

Ad astra

August 11. 2012 10:49 AM

Ad astra

Macondo
Welcome to The Political Sword family and thank you for your kind comment.  Do come again.

I have read Don Watson’s Recollections of a Bleeding Heart and Watson’s Dictionary of Weasel Words.  He also has a website http://www.weaselwords.com.au/ which makes interesting reading.

You say “Rent seekers are basically thieves”, and indeed they are when they take and others lose.

Ad astra

August 11. 2012 11:13 AM

Lyn

Good Morning Ad and Everybody

Psyclaw  thankyou for caring, you  do have impeccable manners, but please don’t worry about duplicated links. TPS is a wealth of information and I would be unhappy if I thought anyone
holds back from posting any valuable information links just because of duplication.  Please everybody just  post away.

Here is some Twitterverse for you, note Dennis Atkins quite scathing of Tony Abbott, Tony Wright has good words for Wayne Swan. Peter Van Onselen well! I think he must sit inside Julia Gillard’s head he seems to know what Julia is thinking, Clever smartie.

Ad Astra I think you are right the tide is turning.

Gillard's new shock tactics , Peter Van Onselen
First it was the National Disability Insurance Scheme, which saw state premiers resist funding trials, despite relatively modest requests for money. Next Gillard will call on the states to offer fair and reasonable funding in support of the Gonski report's recommendations for education. For now, the PM's attacks are focused on electricity price increases of between 50per cent and 70 per cent in recent years.

Helping the disabled, taking pressure off family budgets by doing something about electricity prices and ensuring an education system that gives children the best possible start in life. That's not a bad agenda for a Labor government to promote, especially if it can contrast its approach with a conservative movement showing disregard for such challenges
www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-e6frg6z6-1226447873547

Music may well soothe the savage political beasts, Tony Wright
When the federal Treasurer, Wayne Swan, set out to invest his recent John Button lecture with an exposition of his long love affair with the music of Bruce Springsteen, he undoubtedly knew he was setting himself up for mockery. A lot of us who write about politics weighed in, and I wrote a sketch that began ''What did Bruce Springsteen ever do to deserve this?''

His willingness to embrace music as an inspiration made him more than a politician. Who can be altogether unkind to anyone who is moved by song?

His diverting address reminded us that we could do with less drone and more melody in our public discourse; more cadence and less discord; more swing and less tumult.
www.nationaltimes.com.au/.../...0120810-23zhp.html

It's game on for Gillard holding the deck, says Dennis Atkins
Abbott proved in recent days he will not shy away from any untruth in his campaign to brand Gillard an untrustworthy liar. It is the most reckless and audacious politicking most observers including this one can remember.

Whether Abbott makes a lie out of employment numbers by conflating June and July results or blames Gillard for an electricity pricing regime set up by the Howard Cabinet of which he was a member, the Liberal leader is taking the demeaning tactic of not caring what he says to new depths.
www.couriermail.com.au/.../story-e6frerdf-1226447788584

Ken ‏
Typical LNP Jeff Seeney NB Typical Liberal Campbell Newman has smeared his own name He'd lose Ashgrove now http://yhoo.it/P2c7p7 NO CAN DO

The Australian newspaper is reporting LNP party bosses are concerned Premier Campbell Newman is trying to by-pass them and set up an in-house fundraising entity to solicit donations for electoral campaigns.

Worst is over for Labor, says PM, Phillip Coorey
www.smh.com.au/.../...-says-pm-20120810-23zrc.html

Public sector faces award squeeze
Public sector workers are set to lose their entitlements to holiday leave loading and additional paid leave for caring for sick family members under changes the state government is seeking to make to their award condition
''These are vital reforms needed to ensure effective fiscal control of the NSW budget,'' he said. But Mr Cahill said the changes ''are all about cost-cutting and a major attack on the working conditions of public service workers''.
www.smh.com.au/.../...-squeeze-20120810-23zou.html

James Ashby balanced competing interests before going public, writes Lenore Taylor
James Ashby seemed aware from the outset how close his new job brought him to influence and power.

www.smh.com.au/.../...oyalties-20120810-23zna.html

Paul Bongiorno‏@PaulBongiorno
Free speech = the freedom to write badly..to be obnoxious and objectionable.Author: Tony Abbott.

Lyn

August 11. 2012 11:16 AM

Ad astra

Psyclaw
Thank for the reference to Tony Abbott’s appearance on Lateline last night, which I missed but have now reviewed.  His head oscillations were impressive!  I agree with your analysis.

The Grattan article was a change from her incessant knocking of Julia Gillard.  But did you notice that almost all the positive parts of her article were direct quotes of Julia Gillard.  Grattan has not endorsed Gillard’s views; she has just repeated them in a ‘she said’ fashion.  Perhaps Grattan’s most telling sentence was: “As always, in whatever adversity, Gillard is disciplined, never publicly showing a hint of weakness or self-doubt.”

Still, it is welcome departure from Grattan’s negativity, and may be yet another straw in the wind that the tide is turning.

Read more: www.theage.com.au/.../...ntent-20120810-2401f.html

I thought the same when I viewed the interview with Phil Coorey.  The tone is no longer ‘Gillard is doomed’, but ‘could she make a comeback?’  

Ad astra

August 11. 2012 11:40 AM

Psyclaw


AA

"Still, it is welcome departure from Grattan’s negativity, and may be yet another straw in the wind that the tide is turning."

That's exactly what I thought. Despite being JG quotes they were a list of facts, sans MG's usual value laden (ie anti JG) commentary.

Psyclaw

August 11. 2012 11:41 AM

Ad astra

Hi Lyn
Thanks for you Saturday Twitterverse.  What an interesting collection.  Several support the notion that the tide is turning.  

PvO is too ‘smart’ for his own good, but at least he realizes something is changing.

Tony Wright does a rare mea culpa about his ridicule of Wayne Swan’s use of Bruce Springsteen as an inspiration.

Dennis Atkins’ most savage words were: ”On carbon, Gillard will face an unabashed continuation of Tony Abbott's relentless negative assault on the price impacts of the scheme, especially during its tax phase.

“Abbott proved in recent days he will not shy away from any untruth in his campaign to brand Gillard an untrustworthy liar. It is the most reckless and audacious politicking most observers  including this one  can remember.

“Whether Abbott makes a lie out of employment numbers by conflating June and July results or blames Gillard for an electricity pricing regime set up by the Howard Cabinet of which he was a member, the Liberal leader is taking the demeaning tactic of not caring what he says to new depths.”


He sounds pretty cross. I don’t know why he spent so much time on a possible Rudd return.

The rest of the items show how much Newman is slipping.

I couldn’t make much sense out of Lenore Taylor’s piece, which had no conclusion.  Why did she write it?

Is there a link for the Paul Bongiorno tweet?

Ad astra

August 11. 2012 11:46 AM

jaycee

Agree AA. that link of the interview was good reading..Do we all detect a mea culpa redress moment and a turning of the tide...a King Canute moment!?
But be wary...the low-life will be out with the knives yet awile....and get ready with the rotten eggs for those Murdochians/Molochians.

jaycee

August 11. 2012 11:47 AM

Ad astra

Psyclaw
No, I didn't watch Taggart, but am enchanted with the 'Ad astra' reference.  But then it does mean 'to the stars'.  Let's hope our combined efforts can help propel Julia Gillard to the stars, or should I say: 'stardom'.

Ad astra

August 11. 2012 11:53 AM

Ad astra

jaycee
It would be unwise for us to assume a turning of the tide, but it's nice to contemplate.  We should anticipate a renewed  attack on our PM, not so much from individual journalists, who pride themselves as being prescient and picking winners, but from the bosses and particularly from Rupert Murdoch, who always need to have his way.

Ad astra

August 11. 2012 12:07 PM

TalkTurkey

Abbortt is bouncing off the walls.

No one in their right mind is believing him now.

He's a FFFFFRRRROOOOOOT LLLLLLLOOOOOOOOP !

When shall we do with a used-by Abbortt?
Stick it in your bin with Pyne Dognabit!
DeeFuncked Poodle and DeeFuncked Rabbit
Junk Truck comes next morning!

Swordsfolks you know what REALLY pisses me off, It's that I write LOVELY verse, Pretty, clever, nice verse, I'm bloody good at it and I love it, and this rotten lying bastard is preoccupying my best thinking time I have left on this poor little Earth writing rotten shit like this here. You know, when I started here you never saw a dirty word from me. The first time I saw someone else Smile use that word I was frankly shocked, partly because I felt it was sort of reflecting on me somehow, well now this dirtyrotten lying divisive crazy man is making me - making me - write shit like this. I'll get you you bastard, with my words I will wound you, I swear to Dog.
You have injured my country to the core. You shall not pass.

Comrades when we win this next election, when this insanity I call Abborttianism is buried, I further swear you will never hear any more impolite terms for humans ever again.

We will not lose.

We MUST not lose!

VENCEREMOS!

TalkTurkey

August 11. 2012 12:29 PM

42 long

  Noted an interview with Abbot and after with Morrison.ABC N 24.Today.
  Abbott doesn't need  expert advice from anyone, ( already has a policy) and Morrison says the best advice the experts could give is for "an early election".
    How inadequate is that? Absolutely Bl88dy pathetic.
  Morrison wouldn't let the ALP use the LNP "solution", in any case and LNP are on record as saying so..
  Considering the ongoing "boat" situation, there IS a need to address the problem, and we are past the stage where objective analysis would under the circumstances, blame the Gillard Government.
  The LNP's assumption that more boats is bad for the ALP may not hold as their (LNP) position is to obstruct any solution, and people are seeing this and don't like it. Notice the backlash against the greens over it. Their stand is more "naieve" than the LNP's totally immoral position where they don't appear to regard the facy of lives being lost as time goes by and more people come by boat.
   Calling them illegals and people smugglers is only inflaming the situation and is a misrepresentation, A technique constantly used in the despicable tactics of the Abbott led Australia's reputation wrecking crew.
   The high performance  Australian Navy Boats, specified by the Liberals, need maintainance. that's no real surprise.
   Most commenters seem to agree that a regional arrangement involving co-operation with Foreign Governments, who are logically on the route from where the refugees start from to their destination seems to be the inevitable way to go.
  I wonder what the effect of being involved with the series. "Go Back to Where You Came From" will have on Peter Reith? Good on him for doing it.

42 long

August 11. 2012 12:38 PM

DMW

Have to mention Mike Carlton's article on the rent seekers from the Aus Olympic Committee. He nails it in his own peculiar way.

No end to the games politicians play @NationalTimes
Blame for our Olympic shame must be hammered home: on the cabinet table of the Labor government in Canberra.
Likeable Kevan Gosper, Australia's heavy hitter on the International Olympic Committee, nailed it on Monday, slamming the government for a lack of public funding. ''The money is the difference between silver and gold,'' he told ABC radio.
Exactly. It's the same old Labor story. Sport is top priority for millions of Australians. The entire world has marvelled at our triumphs on the track and in the pool. But Rudd-Gillard Labor has ignored this while frittering away billions on such pie-in-the-sky follies as school libraries, aged care, new hospitals, the national broadband network, and now the National Disability Insurance Scheme.

www.smh.com.au/.../...ans-play-20120810-23z99.html

I just loved this:
... must offer big tax breaks to Olympic and Commonwealth gold medallists who contribute eggs or sperm for an in-vitro fertilisation program to manufacture the stars of the future.
These superhuman kiddies would train at their allotted sport from the day they can walk, with just enough formal education for them to become Channel Nine Olympic commentators when they retire.

DMW

August 11. 2012 12:49 PM

2353

AA - Dennis Atkins spent so much time on Rudd because he (Atkins) is from Queensland.  Maybe Atkins likes being able to make a local cll to talk to him Cool.

DMW - thanks for the Mike Carlton link.  It used to be repeated on the Brisbane Times but they don't seem to bother any more Frown.  Off to have a read.

2353

August 11. 2012 01:03 PM

42 long

Gosper is not from Qld. He is from Newcastle, and who said he was likeable? He is consistently self serving ( Like Murdoch.)
  Comment... Once people start saying things like "Our gold medals cost the taxpayer 15mil each", I switch off. ( Although I am somewhat switched off before then by the coverage).
  There ARE a lot of good aspects from these "games", but obsession with medals is overdone. Individual effort from some of the less well off countries, should be applauded.

42 long

August 11. 2012 01:10 PM

Bacchus

Psyclaw @ 09:31 AM
As I write this I'm reminded of the guy in the Vicar of Dibley..... it brings a smile to my face .... "yes, yes, yes, yes, no" .... but I think that guy's intent is totally benign, unlike Abbott the tool's.

Close Psyclaw - it's "no, no, no, no yes." Brings a smile to my face too:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=InTAt2hI_kg

Bacchus

August 11. 2012 02:21 PM

Janet

This has to be the most inspiring blog for anyone hoping that a Labor government can continue. Thank you Ad, and all.

Now, has anyone yet seen the blog post 'The price of power' at 'Politically Homeless'? at:

http://andrewelder.blogspot.com.au/

(Forgive me if the link has already been posted.)

Another lap at the shore on that seemingly turning tide.

Janet

Janet

August 11. 2012 03:16 PM

jaycee

Yes, Janet..a very good read. I commented but I don't know if it got up yet...it is one of those sites where it seems too complicated to give a nom de plume so I use Anon'.

jaycee

August 11. 2012 03:26 PM

42 long

Thank you for the link janet. Lyn's links are very helpful and get you to other places  that help you to believe that all is not lost.  We don't just hope that A Labor gov't can deservedly be re -elected,  but that we may contribute to that worthy outcome, by getting the message "out there", despite the concerted efforts of the MSM. to run a consistent ( so far) contrary line. There are signs of that changing.
   Perhaps we get comfort out of having a few like minds here. We are entitled to that.  It is a refreshing respite from the frenetic and nasty stuff that exists in many places, where put downs, labelling,  name calling, insults and lack of argument are the order of the day.

42 long

August 11. 2012 04:20 PM

Lyn

Hi Ad

There is no link with Paul Bongiorno‏'s tweet so I assume it's his opinion, he is pretty straight with his tweets.

Julie Bishop it seems has been on Sky Agenda or has done some kind of speech and seen the need to promote Tony Abbott's caring credentials everybody is being sick.

Hello Jane welcome to "The Political Sword, what a lovely thing to say thankyou:-
" the most inspiring blog for anyone hoping that a Labor government can continue. Thank you Ad, and all"

Australian News‏@LatestAusNews
Gold-plating lifts power prices: Turnbull: Opposition MP Malcolm Turnbull says the "gold-platin... http://bit.ly/P6DQFh #ausnews #uavaus

Gold-plating lifts power prices: TurnbullOpposition frontbencher Malcolm Turnbull says the carbon tax has contributed to electricity price rises, but has backed the government's view that the "gold-plating" of state government electricity infrastructure has contributed much more.

That's contrary to the view of Opposition Leader Tony Abbott, who says price rises are wholly down to the carbon tax, accusing Prime Minister Julia Gillard of fabrication in blaming the states.

Julie Bishop spruiks feminine and caring Tony Abbott
Opposition deputy leader Julie Bishop has called on Liberal party members to spruik the feminine and caring credentials of leader Tony Abbott, dedicating much of her lengthy speech to him as the party prepares for an election at any time.
She suggested Treasurer Wayne Swan's references to Bruce Springsteen as his inspiration showed he was preparing to take over as prime minister.

"I think Julia Gillard should watch out, Wayne's putting his hand up," she said.
www.watoday.com.au/.../...bott-20120811-240yk.html

Lyn

August 11. 2012 04:22 PM

Michael

The Cockroach gets desperate!

www.watoday.com.au/.../...bott-20120811-240yk.html

"Julie Bishop spruiks feminine and caring Tony Abbott."

Michael

August 11. 2012 04:23 PM

Lyn

Sorry Janet I have left the "T" of the end of your name.

CheersLyn

Lyn

August 11. 2012 04:28 PM

Ad astra

Janet
Welcome to The Political Sword family, and thank you for your kind remarks.  Do come again.

Thank you too for the Andrew Elder link.  It is great reading.  I'll quote him in my next piece.

Ad astra

August 11. 2012 04:31 PM

Ad astra

Hi Lyn, Michael
I'm sure Julie Bishop would be able to recognise a feminine and caring male when she saw one.  So Tony must be just that.  Q.E.D.

Ad astra

August 11. 2012 05:31 PM

KHTAGH

Man I take 3 days off the TPS to dig in the garden repair the glass house after 5 roosters decided to fly THROUGH it $90 of glass later & 5 dead roosters I'm back & it take 3 hrs of reading to catch up, at least it is good reading.

I too wondered what a rent seeker was, not now. I thought someone was having a go at me for being a landlord snicker snicker. I'm glad I'm not in that bunch.

I too was a night owl & saw Ad Astra was "to the stars" on Tagget [repeat] it didn't have the same significance the first time I saw it as it does now.

Good to see you are home TT nothing like it after a stint in hospital is there.

Well I'm off to see how the hives are going over winter, seeing I'm allergic to the buggers I might be the next hospital poster on the TPS. [yes I carry an Epipen at all times] My other name "BeeCzar" [yes it is on YouTube] bee rescue & relocation services in Tasmania. Not advertising I don't need as I'm the only!! person state wide that will do it.

As a single male of 54 with no dependents I now have a family... TPS

KHTAGH

August 11. 2012 05:35 PM

KHTAGH

3 hrs + 2 glasses of red.

KHTAGH

August 11. 2012 05:46 PM

Lyn

Hi Talk Turkey

Is this tweet from Stephen Koukoulas interesting for you, yes I thought so good on you.

Stephen Koukoulas‏@TheKouk

Federal election betting: ALP into $4.75; Coalition out to $1.16 on Luxbet: Were $5.40 and $1.14 earlier.

Cheers Lyn

Lyn

August 11. 2012 06:01 PM

Lyn

Hello Khtagh

How lovely of you.  Well I tell you what we love having you on here, we are lucky You found TPS.

'As a single male of 54 with no dependents I now have a family... TPS'.

This is an interesting twittchat, Coalition start talking about cut backs and selling stuff will cause a riot considering the uproar over Newman's methods:-

Mike Kelly MP ‏
Joe Hockey says Coalition wants 2 privatize the Snowy Hydro. Have a feeling there will b a little bit of interest in that around these parts

Mike Kelly MP ‏
jamesmassola Joe Hockey doesn't seem to like Eden-Monaro. Wants to hack 30,000 jobs in 96 repeat. Now coming after the Snowy Hydro workers.

  Craig Emerson MP ‏
.@MikeKellyMP @jamesmassola Hockey eyeing CanDO Audit Commission as process for justifying slashing jobs&services AFTER an election #auspol

Craig Emerson MP ‏@CraigEmersonMP
@lynlinking @mikekellymp @jamesmassola As encouraged last weekend by Jeff Kennett, who knows a thing or two about slashing




Lyn

August 11. 2012 06:13 PM

Miglo

Jaycee,

I'm honoured to be included alongside the names Aa, Wixxy and IA. Thank you kindly.

Miglo

August 11. 2012 06:52 PM

Gravel

KNTAGH

Would you mind if I just called you Knee High, I'm having trouble remembering just the letters.

Okay, so you're allergic to hives......sorry, I got a bit of a giggle, then you mentioned the bees that go with the hives.  Take care of yourself though.  There is no better place than here when you are not well, I was ill for a while ages ago, missed nearly two months of The Political Sword, and it took me another month to catch up as I refused to miss a word anyone says here.  The support and well wished I got was a real tonic and I'm sure helped me recover quicker.

Lyn

Had to laugh at Abbott being described as feminine and caring.  He's spent the last two to three years showing us all how macho he is and now we are supposed to believe he is feminine and caring,  what a joke.

Gravel

August 11. 2012 07:04 PM

42 long

That stuff Julie Bishop is spruiking is straight out LNP "nice to hear" drivel. She loves Tony"s Muscles. "He is really fit". Is Tony feminine? Interesting question. I think he would recoil at the prospect. He regards women as subservient to men. He would fit in with the Taliban there. Bet he thinks they are made from Adams Rib or something equally ridiculous.
   After the primative "fundamentalist" stuff that was passed at the LNP conference in QLD recently. (Which appears to have got little cover in the press), without some refutation of this, free thinkers should start to be really concerned about just what sort of a government we have in waiting, for Australia. Would it be something like Spains Franco years or would we go right back to the Spanish Inquisition? Don't forget this was passed by a large MAJORITY.of "educated" people( supposedly)
    I wonder how  Turnbull can see this "morphing" to the extreme ridiculous right going on all around him, and cop it. This party has been "stolen", by the Abbott Minchen Abetz, group and believe that copying the Tea Party/radical Republican brand that they will win the day. They can't even make a plan for themselves, and Australia. They have to COPY one from America.
  It's NOT even a certainty to work THERE, and it would be foolish to think that american political thought music and social values are identical to ours .

42 long

August 11. 2012 07:27 PM

Jason

42 long,
       A couple of tweets about Abbott's feminine side lol!

Tads‏@Tadlette

If LNP wanted Tony Abbott to look more feminine, why didn't they just stand him next to Sophie Mirabella? #auspol



Whit Goughlam‏@leftocentre

Julie Bishop thinks Abbott is caring and feminine compared to her, so technically she's correct.

Jason

August 11. 2012 07:27 PM

KHTAGH

42 long

I might be throwing a spanner in the works here, but here is a scenario that I hope comes about :-
  Obama wins the next election [I hope so my sister lives in the US & hopes the same] by this stage the lieberals are in decline here because the Ashby & Thomson affairs see several lieberal MP's charged with sedition.
  Abborttian is replaced by bullturd & is promptly defeated with a Gillard government swept to power with the greens holding the balance in the senate.
Ah we can dream can't we. Dreams often come true for the true believers.  

KHTAGH

August 11. 2012 07:30 PM

KHTAGH

Gravel
Knee High no probs.

KHTAGH

August 11. 2012 07:40 PM

Patriciawa

Hi, Psyclaw, I see you watched Taggartlast night too. I make allowances for the violence of that show because it often is a part of the Glasgow scene and the characters and stories are so authentic.  But last night's episode seemed unnecessarily sadistic and brutal.  It was only the ad astra reference which kept me watching.  Didn't you think those torture scenes were beyond the pale?  

Patriciawa

August 11. 2012 08:15 PM

Patriciawa

Very late getting around to Lyn's Links today, for which many thanks, as usual, Lyn.

I found Laura Tingle's stuff, as always, interesting, but this week I did wonder about her still believing in the stunningly effective way (Abbott) has pursued the government over the carbon tax.   After all, after almost two years of lobbying he's had no success at all in stopping it's passage into law, from his peoples' revolution on, and seems to have little impact now in trying to stir up passions against people's lived experience of the tax.  Is it really going to be a vote winning election issue?  

Patriciawa

August 11. 2012 08:24 PM

Psyclaw


Hi PatriciaWA

Yep, Taggart had a pretty awful beginning, but thankfully, other than the few shots of the AA arm, the story didn't require a lot of re-visiting the first scenes.

It's not a particular favourite of mine though i do enjoy the Scottish theme. The acting of Bourke, Robbie and Jacquie is pretty wooden and predictable most of the time.

Who was the young baddie cop from London? I've seen him in a few shows but couldn't place him .....probably so obvious I've overlooked it?

Psyclaw

August 11. 2012 08:26 PM

wordsmaydestroy

Ad Astra,
thank you for your kind welcome.

Also thank you to all those people that are giving links. There is so much good reading.

I don't know if I should be thankful for the link to Mike Carlton as everybody in the house has wet their pants.

wordsmaydestroy

August 11. 2012 08:33 PM

jaycee

I particularly like the Taggart episode where the inspector takes Robbie to task for : "Shagggin''n scroooin' an' rrraggin' an'beein' a dirrrrty, dirrrrty bahstid'!"....or somethin' like that!

jaycee

August 11. 2012 08:34 PM

TalkTurkey

The Political Sword

http://www.thepoliticalsword.com/

   WELCOMES

The Hon. JULIA GILLARD MP
PRIME MINISTER OF AUSTRALIA

TalkTurkey

August 11. 2012 09:42 PM

TalkTurkey

KHTAGH Little Grasshopper or Knee High or  "BeeCzar" by any name at all
You do indeed instantly feel like kin. And Yes TPS is family. More about that in  posts soon to come I suspect (and intend indeed).

I got a few stories about bees too. You'd bee surprised, urgghhh sorry. I will write those stories too now I have someone specific to write them to. Well not right now.

But you are more welcome than you would even know, you are archetypical of what sort of turn of mind we need in people in the process of eradicating this scourge of fundamentalist rageism that is being fomented by Abbortt and
Megaphoned like Maoism at the Masses by Murdoch.

[Thought you'd-all like that bit of alliteration.  Smile]  

Well it's not working is it! Abbortt is flipping out.
Manic,
like a wild rat in a cage!,
or for that matter,
(in a personal *spooneristic scoop* Smile)
like a wild cat in a rage!

I try . . .

But the BIG news - WOOOO-HOOOO! What'd I tell you folks?
I told you, place your bets NOW!
(but NOW was now THEN, when Labor was at SEVENS!)
Abbortt was at $1.10

Now Lyn quotes Stephen Koukoulas‏@TheKouk

Federal election betting: ALP into $4.75;
Coalition out to $1.16 on Luxbet:
Were $5.40 and $1.14 earlier.

I don't know whether that's Sportsbet though. I'll check that later but you won't get sevens or better on Labor any more.

The $1.16 on Abbortt today  means hat almost all the money is on him. But guess what, that's a relatively few rich pigs guffawing in mutual paunchy self-assurance that their robot rabbit will beat the Power Fox without ever touching the ground. Well we got News for Yous, Porkers All . . .

And check this tweet from Lyn too
Mike Kelly MP ‏
Joe Hockey doesn't seem to like Eden-Monaro. Wants to hack 30,000 jobs in 96 repeat. Now coming after the Snowy Hydro workers.
and just think,
Gina Rindlard alone
could make
EVERY ONE OF THOSE 30,000 PEOPLE
a MILLIONAIRE!

She could set a MILLION young people up in small businesses!

Look at that pig-of-a woman's photo up there again. What a charmer. It's not a disease of her glands, it's gargantuan gluttony and gigantic greed. She is truly disgusting, she won't even share her obscene pile with her own brood.

URRRRGGGGHHHHHrrghhhhh.  

And lots of people support those pigs . . .

Now that truly is a phenomenon.

TalkTurkey

August 11. 2012 10:18 PM

TalkTurkey

Psyclaw,
I'm still working on a reply to you!

But about sedition . . . Have you any information about whether such a charge against, say, POOEY or Brough is possible?

Because imo they are almost certainly guilty of it, and what a boilover it would be if such a charge were laid against Pyne!

Meanwhile Peter Wicks goes on offering the scoop stories of the decade and the MSM goes on, surely deliberately, turning a blind eye.

We the People must not let these matters go unpunished. Not at the polls, and not in the courts. They are treasonous, the attempting by deception, entrapment and theft of private government documents to overthrow the legitimate Government of Australia. These are very grave offences.  

TalkTurkey

August 11. 2012 10:23 PM

TalkTurkey

Miglo said
Jaycee,
I'm honoured to be included alongside the names Aa, Wixxy and IA.

Yes Migs You are honoured for your own blog Cafe Whispers, and loved for your logo and your logic when you come here. What did you expect? Smile

TalkTurkey

August 11. 2012 11:08 PM

Ad astra

Folks
I've been working on the next piece.  I'll be back tomorrow.

Ad astra

August 11. 2012 11:45 PM

Patriciawa

Hear!  Hear!  TT, re Miglo.  He is a very generous blogmaster too and even at times of ill health and stress I found him a great help and support to myself as I learned how to post and edit my pomes and commentaries.

Patriciawa

August 12. 2012 12:19 AM

paul walter

It's bludging and extortion. When idiot bureaucrats try to get politicians to buy censorship of the internet for security, using organs like the Sydney Morning Herald yesterday, the "security" they want is to do with stopping whistleblowers and is further evidence of dumbing down, because then people will be starved of  evidence of rent seeking and forget they are being exploited by big business allowed to operate carte blanch, without scrutiny of their activities.

paul walter

August 12. 2012 01:03 AM

Psyclaw



TT Comrade.

Pre 2005 the fairly ancient laws bearing on sedition included a range of conduct to incite the overthrow the government. Since then, there is a requirement that sedition involves the urging etc( by various means) of violence and force to disrupt the government and or elections.

Don't know that Pooey and Bruff have done that.

Anyway, there are a number of specified defences to the charge, which describe conduct which we would associate with the democratic process, more or less excusing the sorts of things that the anti-government visitors to TPS write about and urge.

In other words, to point out defects and problems in the government's actions and /or policies and to urge others to take lawful action to oppose what the government is doing  will not be seditious.

But if the AD-G/AFP get on the case, I'm fairly sure there are some other bits of commonwealth legislation which put Ashby, Doane and Brough at risk of criminal charges about the dissemination of Slipper's diary. And hopefully Pooey's hands are unclean in that matter too.

We all know that Brough was a recipient but just what use he made of the diaries and whether he sent them elsewhere remains to be seen. Why would he want them when all he did was "advise James to seek legal advice".

However we can accurately guess that his intention was malicious vis a vis Slipper and the government, because that conservo mob is a nest of vipers.

Psyclaw

August 12. 2012 08:31 AM

jaycee

Well Psyclaw..I see your point and froma legalese point you may be correct..but from a perspective of "intent to overthrow", wether by violent or subversive means, one would think there may be a case to answer....I mean, it IS bleedin' obvious!

jaycee

August 12. 2012 09:08 AM

Psyclaw


Hi Jaycee

Subversion has an interesting history and I would think that it is in some ways an anathema to those who choose to visit TPS.

It can be seen historically as the peace time equivalent of treason, and there is no prize for guessing who would want to stifle legitimate democratic discussions and criticisms of the government by the people at large ...... the born-to-rule mob, the big end of town, high society and of course the topic of this thread, the rent seekers.

It originally included the urging of "attacks" against the government by both violent and non-violent means, and the pre 2005 Act still had those provisions. Interestingly there were only about  6 or 8 cases in Australia in almost a century.

The current law was enacted by Honest Jonnie at the "be alert but not alarmed" point in our history, as part of his anti-terrorism campaign.

BTW, this ain't "legalese" ..... but I know what you mean, I think. It's simply the law that currently exists.

But there's no doubt that if the allegations are true, what Ashby and his team have done is wrong .... here's hopin someone (maybe even the Judge's recommendation) initiates action against them for breaches of some of the other laws that cover the use of the Speaker's diary as part of a plan which had the object of shafting the elected government.

Psyclaw

August 12. 2012 10:30 AM

DMW

There is a history of 'overthrowing' governments or, at least, changing a government without an election in Australia.

It is quite legitimate for members of parliament to work with others inside and outside 'the house' to bring about change. It is a given that they need to do that within the law and possibly taking note of conventions.

One of the challenges for people in understanding minority government or the possibility of changing government without election is that, at the federal level, neither has happened within the lifetime of the majority of people.

Much as I would like to blame the carbon tax for peoples lack of knowledge or understanding of Australia's political heritage it probably has more to do with our education systems and most peoples lack of interest.

DMW

August 12. 2012 11:22 AM

Lyn

Good Morning Ad and Everybody

Twitterverse for you the Insiders was fairly mediocre this morning but have collected a few tweets:-

Bushfire Bill
Posted Sunday, August 12, 2012 at 8:28 am
That’s why Atkins’ column yesterday was so important… as late as it was… not because it would have had a large public readership, but because it gave permission for it’s target audience – other journalists – to come out and say what they’ve been thinking for quite a while now

Expect more pieces like this, at first a trickle, but eventually a flood. It’s still just an in-house discussion of savvy, but this time with a negative emphasis. Dennis Atkins was telling us that, for him, the old savvy is over. Time for a new savvy. Halleujah!

blogs.crikey.com.au/.../#comment-1372066

Sam Henderson‏
#investing #smsf Barry's $1 billon power betrayal: BARRY O'Farrell's government will squeeze ... http://bit.ly/P8B56e #financialplanning

Justices of the Peace to replace lawyers and magistrates in plan to clear backlog of Queensland Civil and Administrative Tribunal civil disputes
"It would be like going into hospital and having an orderly conduct an operation," the lawyer said. "Even if it were a minor one, I wouldn't want someone doing it to me
www.couriermail.com.au/.../justices-of-the-peace-to-replace-lawyers-and-magistrates-in-plan-to-clear-backlog-of-queensland-c

Robert Corr‏
Even Baillieu's own MPs think he is bad for democracy: http://www.theage.com.au/opinion/-241i6.html

Toby Bottan‏
“@smh: National News: Fed parliament back http://bit.ly/MMqu50"; Mars landing-yawn Olympics- ho hum More Abbott, Pyne et al - Oh joy!!!

vexnews‏
Claims Liberal Party ''family values' Ashfield Council candidate was the landlord of an unlicensed brothel http://bit.ly/OS2ngM #nswpol

samanthamaiden‏
Children overboard saga's Mike Scrafton in cameo submission at Angus Houston asylum seeker panel m.dailytelegraph.com.au/.../story-e6frezz0-1226448186913

Insiders:-

Agnes Mack‏@AgnessMack
#insiders Abbott will have to start acting like a PMAgnes Mack‏
#insiders George: This second worst week for TA after week he tried to run out of chamber.

Agnes Mack‏
#insiders Abbott has overcooked his #cp story says Karen

Stephen Koukoulas‏
Even with recent price rises, electricity accounts for a palty 2% of the household budget #insiders

Agnes Mack‏
#insiders Agree with @JacquelineMaley Slipper can't return to chair unless there's some resolution of #ashby

Sarah Joseph‏
Will Abbott get away with such a misleading & ignorant statement re electricity prices? #insiders

Agnes Mack‏
#insiders George reckons over next 12 months won't be talking about electricity prices, but childcare & schooling costs

Agnes Mack‏
#insiders George: (prospect of) Campbell Newman & Tony Abbott starting to freak Q-landers out. As happened with Kennett in VIc.

TheFinnigans
Very interesting, @GMegalogenis has publicly linked the negative slash & burn of Campbell Newman to Tony Abbott on the #Insiders

Sarah Joseph‏
Wisdom from Mega George. The combo of Campbell Newman & Tony Abbott is "starting to flip Queenslanders out". #insiders

Elisabeth
#insiders Megalogenis is right. Why has fortnightly political polling become "normal'' - it is part of the destabilisation of the government

Lyn

August 12. 2012 11:37 AM

LadyInRed

Lyn Thanks so much for those links today. The Dennis Atkins article pointed to by Bushfire Bill is well worth the read. I hope the trickle turns into a flood. I loved the Washington Post bit about savvy journalists too.

www.couriermail.com.au/.../story-e6frerdf-1226447788584

LadyInRed

August 12. 2012 12:09 PM

42 long

Since the electricity infrastructure is under consideration somewhat.
  Power usage has been dominishing for a few years now.
  Peak demand appears to be related to hot ( sunny) days. when Solar works best, and airconditionsers are all running
  "Smart" meters may be able to shift the peaks also.
   The current system was designed to shuffle electricity along relatively heavy wires to move electricity across a continent to fit in with the varied outputs that suppliers make available. It would be assumed that peak loads would be from higher cost suppliers.( supply and demand equation).
  The carbon price doesn't JUST increase power costs. It increases cost MOST on those suppliers that have a high carbon usage. It wouldn't increase them at all on something like Hydro ot wind etc. The eventual effect is to give the cleaner source utilities a market advantage, so that they eventually occupy a larger portion of the supply spectrum. With carbon prices rising due to supply costs ( less accessible) and being priced at world parity levels, on one hand and the technology improving with the renewables the move will be in the right direction and ever increasing. The present stakeholders will assess the situation and need stability most of all. With Abbott promising to axe the tax the much needed stability is trashed. We now have owners of very polluting old powerstations wanting much more to close down their power stations because they are betting on Abbott getting in. Abbott is not just an opposition. He is an active saboteur of australias future.

42 long

August 12. 2012 01:25 PM

Psyclaw

"There is a history of 'overthrowing' governments .... without an election"

This infers that non elected governments have ruled Australia on a number of occasions.

I am aware of the Curtin appointment as PM by the GG and the consequent change of government during the war without an election, but I know of no other examples.

Can anyone fill me in on the various other occasions when this has occurred?

Psyclaw

August 12. 2012 01:35 PM

DMW

Can anyone fill me in on the various other occasions when this has occurred?

Yes.

DMW

August 12. 2012 02:11 PM

TalkTurkey

My heart and my head full of rage full of dread I can never quite empty them here
And if I had time I would write it in rhyme, but I must use my time better I fear.

Anyway well let me tell you Folks those hospital drugs have quite messed my mind a bit, bit megalo, bit manic, bit weepy (relief!) bit weak and wobbly too but I'm OK, it's the mind stuff and oh yes I really did forget, the main one, forgetfulfulness! True!

Like this:
Drove round to the servo yesty to repump my flattish tyres, heavy traffic but slotted in nicely to the fuel-pumps - Dam ! on the wrong side for my filler! Never before! So I started to back out before anybody blocked me from behind, managed that , but then I realized - D'UHHHHH! I didn't need petrol at all I came for Air! Shouldna been in the pump lanes at all. Double dumb dumb.

Now I know what it feels like to be ToM.

I mean it about those drugs, not joking at all. I'll avoid more driving until I don't feel wobbly. But they really too have made me megalo as I said, and I think that is what is needed. A healthy bloody dose of megalomania by the Left, ironically! Not hubris - but Dare to Win! Dare to take control at last! Dare to take on these evil "rent-seekers", well to me they're just filthy greedy obscene Earth-destroying couldn'tgiveafuck capitalist pigs whose foulness has infected my very invective for which they must PAY!

The thing is this megalomanic thing impels me to the thought that this blogsite of ours, this blogsite of Ad's alone in point of fact, is really very, and I mean very very, important. It is a place of sanity and reason, a beacon of information through Lyn's selfless devotion to the very same belief in the Sword's importance that I as a later comer have felt from the first.

Just an aside: Ad astra's and TalkTurkey's projections of the shape of developments, I'll claim this now, if it were football tips we would be top of the table! And why, no mystery, because Hell anybody surely could see Abbortt coming to this ignominious mouldy end he has earned himself, because anybody could see he was empty, a boor, a mug, a hypocritical misogynistic supremacist fundamentalist religious bigot.

Well anybody could have seen that, but Dog Alfighty it's taken some work to get people to believe what Ad'n'me've been telling yous all along, Abbortt will implode! and that in footyanalogy here we are halfway through the third quarter, wind in the last, five goals even down on the board, Whaddya reckon Haitch Gee?
The Guvnors have the running and Abborttians have blown out. We got the bestest BISONs ever bred. Why would we doubt ourselves? Why would we doubt *J*U*L*I*A*? She and the Government have done everything right for the People, better, more, above and beyond where anybody except her Cabinet expected. Every good thing has been turned on its head by this hateful Media, and theses weird Polls keep being manufactured, but Blood in the end will tell, the achievements and benefits and projects and programs are in place, too many people with tooo much to lose if Abbort ever got in like Crapsmell Newman. Don't forget Folks, Our Ranga Lass PM is the only person whose name I always put up in lights. Non-theistic - brain unpolluted by superstition. Scrupulously and manifestly honest. Female. quick-witted. And Red-haired. Smile

They call her by their names. Suck eggs.

We call her The Power Fox. We liken her to Boadicea.

Or like Good Queen Bess, she of "The body of a weak and feeble woman, but . . . "Weak and feeble, I don't think so!

I actually didn't clear it with Ad nor Lyn before I started publicly welcoming our Prime Minister to this blog, (those megalodrugs!) but I have now. In Electric Kool-Aid Acid Test Tom Woolfe records the Merry Pranksters, a bunch of freaky tripped out Hippies, on hearing that the Beatles were coming to America, putting up a big sign (no photos exist afa I know) saying The Merry Pranksters Welcome the Beatles, in the hope that the sign would carry self-fulfilling power. That didn't happen, but there is no reason to think that our Prime Minister won't visit us here.

Why do I think this blog The Political Sword is so very important? Well . . . I'll try . . . but how about you tell me what yous think first awhile?

I feel quite good thank you. Barb wire 42000-volt pees, but meh, am I not a man? (Well I'm not quite sure now!)

Thinking of you Patricia and Janice, and Nasking and anyone of our mob in pain or difficulties. Cheers.


    

TalkTurkey

August 12. 2012 03:00 PM

Patriciawa

Know the feeling, TT, just finishing the last of my injections and I can't wait to get back to owning my own body and head!   Mind you, I am grateful for all the pain killers and modern surgical techniques which has restored me almost limp and pain free in less than two months!  Haven't yet got around to driving when I will become truly independent.

I second your message out there to Nasking and Janice et al and now I hear from Miglo that he had minor fall very recently and has a cracked rib to add to his other health woes. Pain is a bugger, isn't it?  But it has its uses!  I am full of admiration for you, TT, in how you are able to think and write creatively through pain.  All I can is dredge through my blog for something I've already written which might have relevance.  Thank you for this particular opportunity

Welsh Strains

Our PM states she has no religion;.
None at all, no, not even a smidgen
Of faith in a God or some afterlife.
Perhaps because she has seen the strife
So often caused by strong belief
Which leads to warfare, deaths and grief.
Now she is the leader of our nation
She should consider Reincarnation
As the ideal Australian opiate.
That would strike and surely reverberate!.
Here she is recognised, praised and seen
To be much like the Tudor Virgin Queen.
They have in common ancestries in Wales,
Giving rise to wondrous and mystic tales,
Of another Celt, mighty Boadicea
Whose spirit surely once again lives – here!
Having left the climes of Borealis
Does she now dwell with us in Terra Australis?

I really enjoyed doing illustrations and notes for this at polliepomes.wordpress.com/.../ over a year ago, and then found the reincarnation theme just too tempting a couple of months later when the Dali Lama visited here and gave an audience to Tony Abbott.  Rather than just link it I'll copy it here but remind you of our discussion at  polliepomes.wordpress.com/.../ on how Julia could make the Greens happy and one up herself over Tony Abbott.  An even more likely option now with Pell and Co so on the nose re cover-ups of child abuse by priests.

Would Tony Abbott Stand For This?

No matter what Julia Gillard stands for,
Abbott’ll find something about it to abhor.
Soon he’ll point out she has no religion.
Think of that! None at all, not a smidgen!

But, what if……..persuaded by the Greens,
She’d met ‘His Holiness’ behind the scenes?
And then his photo op with the Dalai Lama
Made headlines. “Abbott Meets His Karma!”

If the PM, as the leader of our nation,
That day declared that Reincarnation
Was now the religion of the state,
How Aussies would love their trendy opiate!

Their PM ‘recognised’ as one who’d been
In former life the Tudor ‘Virgin’ Queen!
Around their common ancestries in Wales,
The Buddhists might weave some wondrous tales.

Both embodied that other Celt, Boadicea!
Two great spirits, reincarnate, in Julia!
Wise, strong women from the climes of Borealis
Enthroned again down here in Terra Australis!



Patriciawa

August 12. 2012 03:06 PM

Gravel

Knee High

Thanks, it sorta suits you too.  Smile

Talk Turkey

Yes, please avoid driving while your not quite yourself.  Not only for your own sake but for other road users, or even for someone like Patriciawa, who if memory serves, was hit by a car.

I don't know whether I am looking for to the release of the asylum seeker report tomorrow or not.  I do hope it helps to come to some resolution of this (non)problem forever.  I was astounded when it was started again in 2008/9 by the NLP.  I had thought that Australians had grown up enough to treat people decently, and felt devastated when it all blew up again.

All I ask is that everyone will agree with the report and move on.  Impossible I know, but can't help to hope that may happen.

Gravel

August 12. 2012 03:36 PM

42 long

There would be no case to delay it.  The LNP are NOT interested in a solution short of the ALP agreeing to have an election. How childish really of Morrisson, and morally reprehensible. ( Doesn't he preach in a church somewhere?). This is nothing BUT a game for them whatever the cost. I am not amused.
   The matter is of such a nature that it should only be bi-partisan.  It is too important to score points off. I detest the LNP on this issue, for their position and I hope many join me.
   We don't have to worry about the second coming. I think we already had it with the "fabulous" liberals who did everything perfectly under that magnificent Leader. "Honest" Johnnie W Howard.with his "gifted" followers The relic of which sits on the front bench of the opposition, inspiring us and telling us that "the Past IS the Future", and WE will guide you back there. We don't have to go into the details. just trust us to get you away from this "rotten" prime minister. It as a charming little plot isn't it?
  Did anyone actually notice when Tones brain snapped? It's happened but just when was the line crossed?

42 long

August 12. 2012 04:53 PM

Tom of Melbourne


I’d be interested to know exactly what is the orientation of the ”bipartisan” policy that should be supported.

Is it to send some of the desperate people to Malaysia, and others to Nauru? Or send them all to Malaysia, or all to Nauru?

The entire issue is the most ugly race to the bottom ever, but some still think that we need to do something, other than continue to process on shore.

Why is that?

Tom of Melbourne

August 12. 2012 05:38 PM

2353

Exclusive - TfM agrees with the Greens.  How does that work?????

(For proof see above this post.)  I'm sure he'll change his story once Abbott & Credlin tell him what to say tomorrow Laughing.

2353

August 12. 2012 06:07 PM

DMW

Apologies, I had a drop everything moment before I could check my memory on a few dates (good thing I did I was a bit out on a couple)

After the second Federal Election on 16 December 1903 Alfred Deakin was re-elected as Prime Minister

The first 'change of government' without an election was on the 27 April 1904. It was of great moment as, when Chris Watson became Prime Minister, he led the first Labour goverment anywhere in the world. Watson replaced the Protectioist Deakin.

On 18 August 1904 Freetrader, George Reid, replaced Watson and Reid was then replaced by the Protectionist Deakin om 5 July 1905.

The third Federal election was held on 12 December 1906 and Dekin was again re-elected Prime Minister.

Australia's second Labor government on 13 November 1908 without a general election being held when Andrew Fisher became Prime Minister.

Deakin replaced Fisher on 2 June 1909 before te fourth Federal Election was held on 13 April 1910.

That election was also momentous as it saw Labor win 42 of the 75 seats contested and able to govern in their own right.

That was not the end of changes without elections though.

Just as many are totally unaware that the first Speaker of the House left his party and sat (and was re-elected) as an Independent many are unaware that we have had changes in the party forming government without there being an election. Some would be tempted to say that until the WWII we had a rich history of it.

DMW

August 12. 2012 06:16 PM

DMW

2353,
I am forced to stand up for ToM. My memory is that he has always had that view when writing here.

Jason often points out that ToM is (was?) a member of the Democrats and is more in the mould of keeping the bastards honest than in being part of implementing policy though that may be a poor way to say it.

I offer this caution as a word to the wise and a member of the FARWT brigade.

DMW

August 12. 2012 06:33 PM

DMW

Anyone with even a slight interest in Australian political history and in particular our Prime Ministers could do worse than read Mungo MacCallum's The Good, the Bad and the Unlikely http://goo.gl/nk6Q6

You would not only be informed you would also be highly entertained into the bargain.

DMW

August 12. 2012 06:41 PM

2353

DMW - Thanks, I sit corrected.

You post on the mechanics of changes in Government without an election is interesting (and shows those that don't care for history will in the end repeat it.

42long - the ironic thing about Howard's "few" is that Abbott wasn't one of them by all account.  You and others have made posts observing the tide is turning and the media is starting to pick up the same theme I suspect.  I'm sure at some point, someone with influence amongst those in the Press pack will write an article discussing when Abbott overcooked it.  This will "give permission", as Bushfire Bill suggests. for gallons of printers ink to be dedicated to how, when and why Abbott lost it.

2353

August 12. 2012 07:22 PM

Jason

DMW,
   ToM was also a member of the Labor party and now he doesn't even see fit to vote at least for the last 2 elections.
ToM is nothing more than a professional shit stirrer these days who will be outraged on any one's behalf no matter the subject!  

Jason

August 12. 2012 07:26 PM

Psyclaw


DMW

Thanks for that very interesting info.

It seems that in the beginning of Federation there were the Protectionists, the Free Traders, and Labor.

A naive interpretation of this would suggest that the Protectionists evolved into the Country Party, and the Free Traders into the Liberals.

If this is so, it shows what a strange marriage the Coalition is.

In particular it points out the fact that diametrically opposed views can co-exist . Further it seems to me that the frequent criticism by Abbott that Labor has on this occasion compromised with a party of somewhat different views to achieve this government is a bit hollow.

After all, the Libs and the Country Party with diametrically opposed views on some major issues have stayed "married" for decades, just to gain government.

Without their strange bedfellow, neither party would have have gained government over the last 4 or 5 decades.

It's a pity and plain dishonest that the likes of Newspoll don't publish individual results for the Liberals and Nationals.

Psyclaw

August 12. 2012 07:27 PM

DMW

Hi Jason
you are most likely right hence my 'keep the bastards honest' quip. There is a group of people that think : Everyone is a bastard save thee and me and I am very suspect of thee. and I must ask ToM one day if he agrees Smile

DMW

August 12. 2012 07:28 PM

DMW

and Jason I have my doubts about the professional bit in the description.

DMW

August 12. 2012 07:33 PM

DMW

2353,
one of the things about the lessons of history is, that more often than not in Australian political history, the wrong lessons are the ones that are learned.

Unfortunately for Australia the lesson learnt from the 2001 election by Labor is that to win elections you need to pander to rednecks and vilify refugees among a few other similar ferkin stupid things.

DMW

August 12. 2012 07:57 PM

Jason

ToM
   "The entire issue is the most ugly race to the bottom ever, but some still think that we need to do something, other than continue to process on shore.

Why is that?

Quite Simple ToM under the leadership of Kim Beazley Howard used to like to wedge him, So Labor during this time said "me too" if it looked like it would split the "left and right" of Labor Howard would do it! Labor was to gutless at the time and we now have what we have!

I suspect you knew that but you wanted to see who was paying attention no doubt!

Jason

August 12. 2012 08:12 PM

Sir Ian Crisp

I suspect you knew that but you wanted to see who was paying attention no doubt!

Jason


And an argus-eyed chap such as your good self spotted it. Well done JGuy. You try to pass yourself off as a clumsy yokel but you're as sharp as a tack. Bravo!

Sir Ian Crisp

August 12. 2012 08:18 PM

Sir Ian Crisp


   ToM was also a member of the Labor party and now he doesn't even see fit to vote at least for the last 2 elections.

Jason


That means if he fails to vote in the next federal election he will equal the record of ex-rocker Peter Garrett. Does that mean he will be parachuted into a safe ALP seat?

Sir Ian Crisp

August 12. 2012 08:19 PM

Jason

Sir Ian,
       Don't praise me too much! It's not like you ToM and jj are members of mensa is it?

Jason

August 12. 2012 08:27 PM

Tom of Melbourne

Well it is entirely beyond me that anyone can get passionate about Gillard (or Abbott).

Those that get all excited about the state of the ALP or their ethics or their competence (or those of the Liberals) have failed the IQ test, in my opinion.

I’m an amateur, by the way Jason,

Tom of Melbourne

August 12. 2012 08:30 PM

Jason

Sir Ian,
       "Does that mean he will be parachuted into a safe ALP seat?"
I'm not sure! What was the name of the band he fronted? I suspect it will have the same name as his blog.

Jason

August 12. 2012 08:48 PM

DMW

When it comes to learning from history there are a couple of strands that can be 'bees in my bonnet' (maybe I should call in KNTAGH to help with thatSmile).

I often contend that legislation or decisions based on political reasons more often than not come back to bite you in the bum and that fiddling with the electoral provisions is done it your own peril.

When it comes to fiddling with the electoral laws there is the lesson of the conservative Queensland Premier (whose name escapes me) who first introduced compulsory voting. One of the (political) reasonings was that Labor was better at 'getting out the vote'. He was probably not aware that a lot of potential Labor voters worked on Saturdays and either couldn't get to a pooling booth or were to buggered to bother.

Labor won the next election and to add insult to injury the Premier lost his seat.

I do not have proof positive for this, but, have heard reasonable arguments that Howard's changes to the electoral laws that removed the three day window to enrol after an electionwas called could have cost Abbott that 'one extra' seat that would have meant the LNP won the last election.

Among the reasons for Howard's changes were that it ws mostly young people that were late enrolling and 'they always voted Labor'. Another group unable to vote because of the changes were those that moved residence and forgot to update their enrollment were mostly Labor voters.

Smartarse fiddling may have cost Abbott government and well thank whatever diety you wish for that.

DMW

August 12. 2012 08:56 PM

wordsmaydestroy

On changes of governments without elections what true blue Labor supporter could ever forget Billy Hughes?

wordsmaydestroy

August 12. 2012 09:38 PM

42 long

Bloody Hell . You have got to go a long way back for that perhaps it is time to revisit the dismisssal of the Whitlam Govt and the role of the CIA in it?
Let's get this straight
America can be a real bully. It is paranoid about lefties. Ie anybody who doesn't believe that unrestrained market forces don't sort everything out. is wrong. Well I see that as IF there is NOT a quid in it it doesn't get done.
Corruption of any system brings it down, and doesn't let the true essence of what it is about surface.
  Capitalism is a game of snakes and ladders with the top echelon changing the rules to keep their position superior. It's a stacked deck. The trouble with the RAT race is that the rats win.

42 long

August 12. 2012 10:45 PM

Ad astra

Folks
I've had a busy day, and have just got back to my computer.  I enjoyed reading your comments.

Tomorrow afternoon I'll post the next piece: Journalists awake! You know Tony Abbott is conning you.

Ad astra

August 12. 2012 11:40 PM

DMW

I hadn't thought about quite like this before,

Julia Gillard is Australia's 27th Prime Minister in the (almost) 112 years since Federaion which makes the average tenure of a PM a shade over four years.

If you take out Menzies (18 years, 5 months & 12 days), Howard (11 y, 8 m & 22 d) and Hawke (8 y, 9 m & 9 d) which totals 38 almost 39 years that leaves 74 years between the other 24 PM's for an average of a shade over 3 years each,

We really turn em over and spit em out.

See Terms of Australian Prime Ministers Since 1901 http://goo.gl/rr8JY

DMW

August 13. 2012 07:11 AM

Lyn

Today’s Links

Gillard Will Win, Victoria Rollinson
What can Tony Abbott offer this community? His negativity might be entertaining whilst in opposition (and the media sure love it). But as we get nearer to the next election and people have to start picturing him as their next Prime Minister, they will see a leader who offers only uncertainty. Will he or won’t he scrap the NBN and
victoriarollison.com/2012/08/12/gillard-will-win/

Groundhog News, Mr Denmore,The Failed Estate
So at the start of every week, it is a fair bet that The Australian Financial Review (formerly a pro-market paper, now a pro-business lobby rag) will spin as "exclusives" a handful of front page beat-ups on productivity and the Fair Work Act, along with a couple of hatchet jobs on the NBN
.http://thefailedestate.blogspot.com.au/

The price of power, Andrew Elder, Politically Homeless
Now Abbott should be on a winner with electricity, and he isn't. No amount of PR glitter-rolling, no amount of parliamentary theatrics can give him the credibility and the gravitas he has frittered away.It was understandable that they should give him the benefit of the doubt but now the press gallery embarrass themselves when they
andrewelder.blogspot.com.au/.../...e-of-power.html

#85 Journalist proves the hate media still writes “crap”, Uthers Say
The News Ltd man quotes another News Ltd man Dennis Shanahan who together with another News Ltd man Paul Kelly often set the agenda for the News limited media on the front page of the Australian as providing analysis pieces that offered the sharpest criticism of the Labor Green Alliance when he called for a fresh election before the current government was even sworn in.
utherssay.com/.../

Was That A Whiff Of Panic ?, Under The Milky Way
So, those three streams of confluence, namely reduced antipathy to the Carbon Tax, the perhaps-related ALP poll bounce and the gestational horror in Queensland at a Campbell-Abbott axis providing their governance may have in part or combination produced that whiff of panic enervating Mr. Abbott’s interview performance on AM last Thursday
indifferencegivesyouafright.wordpress.com/.../

Liberals allowed to beat their drum the loudest, ABC has Gone To Hell
oth the IPA and News Limited take an openly hostile position towards the current Labor Government, a position that aids the Liberal Party’s agenda, and serves to further cement the sense of Right Wing bias and anti-Government sentiment that many viewers feel the ABC promotes.
abcgonetohell.net/.../

Tony Abbott, Walking The – - -Archi, Archiarchives
There have been organised attacks on the Prime Minister as Abbott has “played the man”. Images of killing and death, labelling Gillard a liar and worse. Calling her Government a failure. Rather than policy, he has spent his time telling us what he will stop, not what he will create. He has spent the past two years playing the man and not the ball!
archiearchive.wordpress.com/.../

The Manchurian Tony Abbott, Barry Everingham, Independent Australia
Tony Abbott’s behaviour is become more erratic as each day passes. This week, he has been working himself into a frenzy and is telling lies daily about what he perceives to be the effect of the carbon price on electricity prices. The guy is out of control which begs the answer to the question – do we have another Raymond Shaw on our hands and if so who is doing the manipulating?
www.independentaustralia.net/.../

The media loose the plot , Gary Sauer-Thomson, Public Opinion
We have entered a “post-truth” era in politics, and Tony Abbott has actually campaigned that way for the past two years. Everything is seen a political opportunity to use the tactics of fear to show that the incompetent and distrusted Gillard Government just staggers from one crisis situation to the next.
www.sauer-thompson.com/.../the-media-loose.php

Newmania- Jessie the Elephant, Only The Depth Varies
I'd love to hear what my grandmother would say about Jeff Seeney. From the Brisbane Times, we learn that King Campbell's Ministers and MPs are experiencing emotional distress due to their task of cutting jobs from the Public Service.
http://onlythedepthvaries.blogspot.com.au/

Don't believe the lies, critically analyze!,Kurt Rudder, Don’t Believe all those Lies
However, speaking to the ABC Radio's AM program this morning, Mr Abbott again blamed the carbon tax for putting pressure on power bills."The problem is not the regulation of power prices. The problem is the carbon tax putting up power prices," he said."This is a fabrication by the Prime Minister. This is an absolute furphy from the Prime Minister.
kurtrudder.blogspot.com.au/.../...r-causes-of.html

Leading the way on Asylum, J. Olaf Kleist, Inside Story
Australia is currently confronted with another immigration impasse that requires all the hallmarks of leadership: conviction, action and persuasion rather than scape-goating and partisan bickering. The arrival of boat people seeking asylum on Australian shores has led to a series of ad hoc reactions and policies since the first tiny vessel with five Indochinese refugees landed in Darwin in April 1976.
http://inside.org.au/leading-the-way-on-asylum/

Private eyes in journalism — it happens on TV here, too, Matthew Knott, Crikey
There’s no shortage of recent examples of Australian private investigators working with TV reporters. Crikey has confirmed with sources close to the investigation that a private eye was employed by Channel Seven in 2008 to help track down and film NSW government MP David Campbell leaving a gay bath house in Sydney’s eastern suburbs. That story has fuelled calls for
www.crikey.com.au/.../private-eyes-in-journalism-it-happens-on-tv-here

How on earth has Abbott kept his job? Miglo, Café Whispers
Some critics would argue that Julia Gillard is unpopular, but at least she’s had to fight to keep her job. At least she’s working for her money and she knows she is not indispensable. Abbott, by contrast
cafewhispers.wordpress.com/.../

So Hockey Loves The NBN Then?, Michael Wyres
Despite his constant disapproval for the National Broadband Network, Shadow Treasurer Joe Hockey, when discussing the so-called "gold plating" of electricity infrastructure, was heard today to say:“Never heard before the argument that too much infrastructure in essential infrastructure is a bad thing.”
michaelwyres.com/.../

Six Myths About The NBN You Should Stop Believing Right Now, Lifehacker. Com
Ultimately, we don’t have a fully-priced alternative to the NBN from the Opposition, and it was the Opposition in power that ‘privatised’ Telstra while giving it near-monopoly control over the copper network. Under those circumstances, giving random statements from Malcolm Turnbull or Tony Abbott equal weight with a fully-costed plan is not balanced journalism.
  www.lifehacker.com.au/.../

Telstra 12Mbps wireless to surpass NBN: Liberal MP, Renai LeMay, Delimeter
Randall’s claim that Telstra is rolling out a 12Mbps wireless service is factually incorrect. The company already has a nationwide 3G/4G network which features a diverse range of speeds; up to 40Mbps in 4G areas, up to 20Mbps in metropolitan areas and many regional areas outside the 4G footprint, and lesser speeds outside that footprint. However, Telstra has never specifically discussed a 12Mbps wireless service.
delimiter.com.au/.../?utm_source=

Today’s Front Pages
Australia Newspaper Front Pages for 13 August 2012
www.frontpagestoday.co.uk/index.cfm

Lyn

August 13. 2012 07:24 AM

Ad astra

LYN'S DAILY LINKS updated: www.thepoliticalsword.com/.../...-DAILY-LINKS.aspx

Ad astra

August 13. 2012 07:48 AM

TalkTurkey

Check Hanson-young's eyes this AM on ABC24, they are uncoordinated, she is using something!

TalkTurkey

August 13. 2012 08:18 AM

Psyclaw


THe TPS is clearly replete with intelligence ..... it manifests here every day.

So!

Could someone here explain in plain English why an AS in Indonesia would say to himself "Damn! ...... I'm not going to risk a boat trip now ..... the Australians will just send me to Nauru for processing. Then I'll have to wait there a while before I finally get to Australia!"

Morriscum wasn't asked such a question by FKelly a quarter of an hour ago. Nor by anyone else that I can recall.

He just harps on, stressing that tow-backs will be a major deterrent. We all know that tow-backs will occur only once. The international crisis that that will precipitate with Indonesia will soon put an end to it.

And can anyone tell me why an AS would not say regarding Malaysia "Damn! ..... I'm not going to risk a boat trip now ..... the Australians will just fly me back to Malaysia, the opposite direction I'm heading in, and I'll be stuck there for years!".

This assumes that the figure of 800 fly-backs to Malaysia is not set in concrete. I'm sure this figure can be greatly increased by negotiating with Malaysia a substantial quid pro quo recruitment of ASs currently there to be airlifted here, eg four from Malaysia for every fly-back returned.

SWMBO watched Morriscum on Insiders yesterday. She commented "Dog Albitey that bloke is objectionable!". Enough said.

Psyclaw

August 13. 2012 08:22 AM

jaycee

I find it amazing that a political party that wants to be taken seriously is talking policies for their projected term in govt' that got them THROWN OUT of govt' the last time they ruled!!  ???
Deja Vu all over again?

jaycee

August 13. 2012 08:53 AM

Psyclaw


Lyn

Thanks for today's links. Smile

I think Andrew Elder has put into words what and why so many of us have been seeing, regarding a slowly shifting tide by the press gallery.

They are finally realising that writing supportively about Abbott is causing embarrassment to them all, personally.

They are now beginning to spotlight him out of their own self interest ...... who wants to look like a fool.

And as we all know, Self Interest is the name of the only horse we can reliably back.

Psyclaw

August 13. 2012 09:01 AM

DMW

Psyclaw,
In answer to your question last night about Free Traders and Protectionists evolving into the Liberal Party and the Country Party (Nationals) it ain't quite that simple (naturally Smile)

If you go to the Wikipedia page on Australian Prime Ministers http://goo.gl/5Z1Jp you can get a bit of a feel for the sorts of changes as, included in the list of PM's are links to various parties that PM's belonged to.

My memory on it is a bit jaded but there were many coalitions and groupings that suited any particular moment with many pollies forming alliances for the (almost) sole purpose of keeping Labor out of government. Strange that Tong

Really it wasn't until Menzies formed the Liberal Party that things settled down and from memory I think there have only two occasions when the Libs would have able to form government in their own right.

DMW

August 13. 2012 09:16 AM

Ad astra

Folks
I'll be out until this afternoon.  When I return I'll post Journalsts awake! You know Tony Abbott is conning you, which enlarges on Andrew Elder's and Tim Dunlop's pieces.

Ad astra

August 13. 2012 09:32 AM

2353

jaycee - deja poo (the same s*** all over again) is probably an alternative to your suggestion.  The Liberals have to move on from the "Howard years" being the gold standard in political behaviour for them to be taken seriously.  Abbott has stated on a number fo occasions that his response to an issue would be the return of the policies of the previous government.

Now that the media seems to starting to question Abbott & the LNP's behaviour, maybe they can also start looking at why a return to "the way things were done" in 2007 is really not a good implememtation of policy - and accordingly not in itself a good reason to vote for them.

2353

August 13. 2012 09:40 AM

Tom of Melbourne

So Psyclaw, let’s be clear, it seems you support sending the desperate people who seek our protection to Malaysia.

•  Is there actual evidence that this is a deterrent?
•  Why do you support a policy that demonises asylum seekers?
•  Why haven’t you exercised your mind to think about some alternatives?
•  Were you in favour of off shore processing when it was the policy of the Howard Government?
•  Why is Malaysia a great policy and humanitarian, while Nauru isn’t?



Tom of Melbourne

August 13. 2012 10:31 AM

DMW

ToM,
I think part of the problem is we all find it difficult to 'take on board' different thinking on the issue (HT Grog)

DMW

August 13. 2012 11:27 AM

Psyclaw



Swordsters FYI

My email to Morriscum about Insiders.

"On Insiders you bragged about  "no endless appeals" in regard to the "good" rejection rate on Nauru.

I know you are aware of the HC Case M61/M69. On 11 November 2010 the HC said that your processing on Nauru was an invalid  and illegal use of the Migration Act, because appeals were not allowed.

Since you know this, the only conclusion is that you are a liar.

In disgust"

Psyclaw

August 13. 2012 11:45 AM

Psyclaw


Some commenters I don't reply to personally, but I will comment generally on any patent crap that appears here. If it is in my power I will always see that Swordsters get the truth.

1) All opinion says that Nauru now won't be a deterrent. (it really never was anyway.)

2) At Nauru, the private contractors employed by Howard did the processing. They used the Migration Act as their guidelines, except for the appeal provisions. Appeals were not allowed.

3) Their refusal of appeals inflated the rejection rate and deflated the acceptance rate to about 60% or so.

4) On November 11, 2010, the HC handed down its decision about this in the case of M61 / M69. It held that the Howard government applied the Migration Act illegally and incorrectly. Needless to say that case still gets little publicity, and as my email to Morriscum above shows, the Colonitionists actively lie about it.

5) Like the government set price on carbon emission, the return of ASs to Malaysia is intended to be a temporary matter. As described in my post at 8.18am today (second italicised bit), common sense says that this should be an effective deterrent. However if that sentence is not read, or if readers have limited comprehension, they will not understand this fairly simple hypothesis.

If in the end, a couple of thousand ASs are flown to Malaysia, and in return, the boats stop and we accept say 8K of ASs direct from Malaysia, then I think that in this complex matter, an ethical outcome will be the result.

Of course if not for the bloody-mindedness of Abbott and the Greens , it would not be such a complex matter.

Psyclaw

August 13. 2012 11:46 AM

Psyclaw


DMW

Thanks for the info.

Psyclaw

August 13. 2012 12:18 PM

Lyn

Hi Ad and Everybody

Twitterverse for you:-

Paul Bongiorno‏
The big questions will Tony Abbott make TPV's the sticking point? Will the govt adopt "tow back when safe to do so" ?

Andrew Elder, PaulBongiorno No, because he is not offering anything. The game's up

Paul Bongiorno‏
My prediction: The boats will keep coming. There is no humane solution except world peace,economic development and flying pigs

Report undermines need for power sale
''It's now official, NSW does not need any new baseload generation for at least 10 years,'' Mr Foley said. ''Mr O'Farrell's argument that more than $6 billion needs to be spent on new baseload has been blown out of the water. That argument for privatisation of generation no longer exists.''
www.smh.com.au/.../...wer-sale-20120812-242vq.html

Clive Palmer says LNP has failed create a 'can do' climate in Government
He also attacked the mounting job cuts, saying they alone would not create the savings needed to dig the State out of its financial black hole.
If we get rid of 20,000 (public servants) that will save $1.8 billion which isn't even enough to pay the interest on a $100 billion debt," Mr Palmer said
www.couriermail.com.au/.../story-e6freon6-1226448962204

War breaks out between Newman and Palmer
The Queensland premier has accused billionaire Clive Palmer of trying to use his mates in the Liberal National Party to stitch up political favours.

‘‘The government will not be bullied into building something that is frankly over-the-top on the Sunshine Coast.’’

Asked about how the inappropriate contact occurred, Mr Newman said he wasn’t going to go into detail.
www.brisbanetimes.com.au/.../...0120813-243rf.html

4000 more public servants face sack as Newman Government's LNP razor gang sets its sights on Queensland Health
The Courier-Mail has been told the Government believes it can achieve the extraordinary target figure without affecting frontline services.Employees in areas such as preventative health as well as others in non-clinical and administrative positions are in the Government's crosshairs as it seeks to reduce the department's $18 million-a-day wages bill.
www.couriermail.com.au/.../7

Queensland Online‏
Tropic: MP happy to meet union over job losses http://bit.ly/PfGLeM #qld

ManO'Steel(town)‏
@ThumpersAunt Scott Morrison i/view really shows how deceitful the #LNP is on asylum seeker policy #RNBreakfast www.abc.net.au/.../4194456 – yuck

Paul Syvret‏
RT @couriermail EDITORIAL: Pause before a cut, Premier Newman | The Courier-Mail http://bit.ly/QrGpAu Penny wise but pound foolish

TAWNBPM‏
While the government considers the Gonski education reforms, the Libs take a stand: NO. "A Liberal MP has...

vexnews‏@vexnews
WA State Labor MP John Quigley claims Premier Barnett offered him a ministerial position if he switched teams http://bit.ly/MQZPnw #wapol

Jo-Ann Miller‏@JoAnnMillerMP
www.brisbanetimes.com.au/.../...0120812-242iq.html Good article on how cuts are effecting public servants

Bernhard Accola‏
NSW plans to cut public servant entitlements www.abc.net.au/.../4192494 @abcnews Consider what Mr Abbott & Mr OFarrell would do together

Australian News‏
Labor considers reopening Nauru (AAP): Senior Labor figures reportedly are considering reopenin... http://yhoo.it/Ok5SRd #ausnews #uavaus

Lyn

August 13. 2012 12:19 PM

2353

Has Newman overcooked it?

www.couriermail.com.au/.../story-e6freon6-1226448962204

OUTSPOKEN Queensland billionaire Clive Palmer has criticised the LNP's approach to Government saying they haven't created a "can do" atmosphere.
In an interview on ABC Radio, Mr Palmer slammed the decision to axe funding to political parties as risking the "independence" of political groups, and taking Queensland back to a pre-Fitzgerald era.

He also attacked the mounting job cuts, saying they alone would not create the savings needed to dig the State out of its financial black hole.

"If we get rid of 20,000 (public servants) that will save $1.8 billion which isn't even enough to pay the interest on a $100 billion debt," Mr Palmer said

2353

August 13. 2012 12:43 PM

TalkTurkey


I tweeted

Just over an hour till AS report kicks both LNP & Greens in the teeth. Labor always been prepared to negotiate. LNP or Greens - who blinks?

This report will be a game changer. (Speeding?) SH-Y with your eyes everywhere nystagmatically this morning, (did you think we wouldn't notice?) will you again curl up with Morriscum? And you, Milne, will you spread 'em for Tony again? You lot of cynical mendacious excuses for representatives of the People, You've all had it this time, Labor is about to kick the stuffing out of you - "Greens" (huh!) and Abborttians alike.

Because whatever this Report says to the world in a half-hour's time, it will say SORT IT NOW, and Labor, having ALWAYS been prepared to negotiate, will be the only one with BOOTS.

The Greens leadership is a disgrace. Even 'under' Brown the Greens influence since 2010 (torpedoing Rudd's CPRS and almost costing us Government) has been a disastrous. Milne! Hanson -Young! Can't even think of that Melbourne bloke's name, no lie.

Kick 'em out. Only thing they ever did any good (Brown really) was to help prevent the damming of the Franklin, even then it was a Labor Govt that had to do the work!

We are said to share 97% of our DNA with Chimpanzees (well I don't personally, but I guess it's a matter of personal choice Smile), well I do think I must share at least 99% of mine with the bulk of people who have gone to the Greens, (around 43% with Abborttians at a guess) and I do understand their impatience and frustration with Labor not doing exactly or even sometimes (to be fair) not even close enough to their wishes - e.g., protection of whales or wild sites, and Dam, I so agree, protection of biodiversity is my single passion, but by deserting Labor all you do is weaken the influence all such as you would wield if only you were in the Labor Party punching for your wishes instead of outside sledging.  

Aussies AWAKE ! The only Party that looks after the People is the Party of the People and that's the LABOR Party!

Good-hearted Greens voters, even fairish usually-Liberal-but-amenable-to-reason, beware of this egomaniac Abbortt, and be fair to this Government. It has done wonderfully well, give it the credit that is its due. No more shenanagins please, this is a very serious matter for the future of this solitary nation, don't let the rule of law slip away forever on precious whims. Either Labor governs, or unspeakable horrror will reign forever.  Be very afraid, just check the sackings in Queensland by Bjelke-Howard-Abbortt-clone Newman if you want a foretaste of Australia with Abbortt in charge.    

Just getting the news now. Mark my words now, mark me on their accuracy then. OK?





TalkTurkey

August 13. 2012 01:34 PM

Lyn

Hi Ad

Expert Panel recommends Malaysia, Nauru
  An expert panel on asylum seeker policy has recommended offshore processing in both Malaysia and Nauru.
au.news.yahoo.com/.../?utm_source=

Lyn

August 13. 2012 02:07 PM

Jason

Sir Ian
       "bend over and grab your ankles" No one cares what you do down at the "wall" every night!

Jason

August 13. 2012 02:08 PM

LadyInRed

Crisp go away, if that is the best you can do come up with sexist and quite frankly stupid remarks. We have enough mysogyny without you adding to it on this site.

LadyInRed

August 13. 2012 02:10 PM

LadyInRed

The Newman solution

Take a supposed fiscal problem and turn it into a social problem.

Sounds familiar doesn't it?

Can't-do needs to be removed he is killing the great state of Queensland.

LadyInRed

August 13. 2012 02:16 PM

Ad astra

Sir Ian
You really do have a propensity for being offensive.  Lyn was simply linking to a news report and paraphrasing the headline.  If the news report, is in your view, inaccurate, blame Yahoo, not Lyn.

Your overbearing reprimand of Lyn is unacceptable and quite unjustified.  Desist from such behaviour.  

Ad astra

August 13. 2012 02:29 PM

Tom of Melbourne

Right psyclaw!!

It’s a huge problem in Australia, and deserves top billing in our political debate!!  Just send them all away, regardless of whether or not they qualify for our protection.

…and let that be a lesson to any other poor sod who tries it on. I mean we decide who comes here, don’t we…

Tom of Melbourne

August 13. 2012 02:35 PM

KHTAGH

S I C
I personally think you are a total disgrace as a person the only thing people like you would accept as an asylum policy would be line them up & shoot them. Like the whinging wing nut & his team of no talent wastes of space, mincing poodle, mangy morrison, hockey the hysterical hippo, Andrew Robber & julie always second don't have a brain only claws bishop.

KHTAGH

August 13. 2012 02:36 PM

Ad astra

Sir Ian
Your latest comment is a red herring, and you know it.

Apologise to Lyn for your completely unacceptable behaviour.  

Ad astra

August 13. 2012 03:07 PM

Ad astra

Sir Ian
Since no apology to Lyn has been forthcoming from you, I have decided to delete all your comments today.

I will not have Lyn, who contributes so much to this site, be insulted by you, who contributes nothing of worth, only snide comments.

Any further comments from you will be deleted until such time as you act like a gentleman, if that is at all possible.

Ad astra

August 13. 2012 03:10 PM

2353

Ian Crisp(as your recent comments have demonstrated you are not a "Sir" in any way shape of form),

Your last post here does not seem to be an apology, despite the request of the owner of this blog.  If you have a problem withe contents of Lyn's links, you need to take it up with the organisation that published the story.  Surely someone of your claimed degree of intellectual rigour would understand there is little change to misreport an entire article in a precis of the article with a link immediately under it.


To retain the small shread of credability that you have here, apologise now.  We're waiting.

2353

August 13. 2012 03:15 PM

LadyInRed

Ditto AA

Crisp you should apologise. Good and meaningful debate doesn't need to sink to that level. Or as AA rightly called it a red herring.

R-E-S-P-E-C-T - and that goes for everyone as far as I am concerned.

LadyInRed

August 13. 2012 03:51 PM

Patriciawa

Looks like the expert panel have done a good job of applying facts and logic in the asylum seeker issue!  It has discounted on-shore processing completely since that will continue to encourage the people smuggling business.  Its suggestion of Nauru and PNG as immediate diversion points pending an upgrading of the Malaysian plan gives Tony Abbott no excuse for rejecting what they clearly hope will become real progress in regional cooperation already begun by the Bali Process and the Malaysian consultations.  As well the leap-frogging of the earlier barrier of the UN Refugee Convention makes good sense. The stricter conditions on family re-union, though hard headed are not really hard hearted when measured by their immediately likely impact on the attraction of an investment in that first expensive and dangerous boat passage.

There's already a lot of hand wringing by the Greens about how 'cruel' and 'mean' the report is.  Have they listened carefully to everything which Angus Houston, Michael L'Estrange and particularly Paris Aristotle had to say? www.abc.net.au/.../4195658refugee adv  There's nothing kind or humane about encouraging people to risk their lives on a cruel sea to achieve landfall here.  They don't seem to have read beyond the major recommendations to see how the panel are using this as as a crucial staging post to gain bi-partisan agreement on how to achieve better outcomes for all asylum seekers in our region.

Patriciawa

August 13. 2012 04:13 PM

Michael

Scott Morrison kicks off on commenting about the expert panel's findings by totally misrepresenting their recommendation on Malaysia.

That is, he lies. Nah, a member of the Opposition???

Michael

August 13. 2012 04:25 PM

Truth Seeker

Michael, he did not only misrepresent what they said on Malaysia, but the entire report and so did the greens pretty much.
You wouldn't believe them if they told you that 1+1=2, you would have to do the sums for yourself.
What a slimy bunch we have in opposition, and the greens are ideological hypocrites.

Truth Seeker

August 13. 2012 05:02 PM

Ad astra

Folks
I have just posted Journalists awake! You know Tony Abbott is conning you.  Enjoy.

http://www.thepoliticalsword.com

Ad astra

Comments are closed