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The violent clash of political ideologies

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Thursday, 27 September 2012 15:28 by Ad astra
Has it frustrated you that parliamentarians from the two major parties cannot seem to agree on much at all? Is this due simply to cussedness, an intention to disagree on virtually everything, or is there a more deep-seated reason?

In the case of the Coalition, opposition for opposition’s sake seems to be a conscious strategy of negativity that it has exhibited now for the last two years. Under the surface though, there seems a deeper stream of dissent, dissent that seems to be born of ideological positions, positions that differ from those of the Government. This piece explores those differing positions in just two aspects of policy: education and the economy, to ascertain how ideological differences sharply separate the two major parties.

Perhaps the subtitles ‘progressive’ and ‘conservative’ that apply to the Labor Party and the Coalition respectively, express some of these differences.

Education
Labor’s vision for the nation is focused on opportunity and fairness for all, from the poorest, the least advantaged, and the disabled, right across the spectrum of society to those with the best opportunities in life. Labor believes that opportunity is best mediated through education from preschool through school to university or TAFE training and apprenticeships.

We know this even before taking a look at the official Labor Party website. There, clicking on the ‘Agenda’ tab, or on ‘Policy’ at the foot of that opening page reveals several policies illustrated in graphic form; clicking on ‘More Policies’ reveals still more. Each graphic is linked to a page that elaborates.

For example, the School Reform page begins: “The Gillard Labor Government’s vision is to make every school a great school – because in the 21st century, a great school and a great education are the keys that unlock an individual’s potential and the nation’s future. Only with world class schools can we build a high-productivity, high-participation economy that gives all Australians the opportunity of rewarding and satisfying work.” It continues: “In government, Labor is delivering ambitious reforms that are already changing Australia’s schools – achieving more for our schools in less than three years than the Coalition delivered in almost 12”, pointing to the relative activity of the two Governments.

What is the Coalition’s vision? It’s hard to discern. Tony Abbott doesn’t speak about his vision for the nation. He spends so much time criticizing Labor and PM Gillard that he seems to have no time to tell us where he would take the country should he become PM. One has to go to the Liberal Party website to get any idea of the Coalition vision; there is no Coalition website. Three words are centre stage: Hope. Reward. Opportunity, under the heading: Real solutions for all Australians, whatever that means. There is no elaboration. A search for a ‘Liberal policy platform’ yields no results. I could not find a coherent policy statement, but there are tabs for several policy areas.

Since Labor has a strong focus on opportunity and education for all, let’s see what Liberal Party education policy is. We will protect choice is the prime theme, with an elaboration: “Protecting parental choice: All Australian children deserve a high quality education that enables them to develop the skills necessary to realise their potential. Unlike Labor, the Liberals support parental school choice because we actually believe in it. We will not punish parents for investing in their children’s education.”

They are some links to more detailed policy. The one on school education begins: “The Coalition is committed to quality schooling for all children. Schools should be about achieving excellence and equipping our children for happy and productive lives. Education should be a pathway towards prosperity – for individuals, their families and our nation as a whole. Yet under Labor it has been about spin, waste, bureaucracy and ineptitude.

“Nowhere has the waste and incompetence of the Labor Government been more apparent than in our schools. Promising an ‘education revolution’, the Rudd-Gillard Government has instead recklessly wasted billions of taxpayer dollars, leaving countless families disappointed by broken promises and ignored the needs of teachers and schools that face uncertainty about their future funding.

“This gross waste and mismanagement has compromised the education, services and assistance that our students need and deserve. Australian schools are clearly no better off than they were three years ago.”


There is more.

Note that the first paragraph begins with laudable principles, but even before it ends, there is trenchant criticism of Labor – in Liberal Party policy! And the censure goes on through the next two paragraphs, reflecting the Coalition’s incessant negativity towards the Government, which it cannot even keep out of its own policy statements.

The contrast in these two education policies is stark. While both embrace commendable principles, Labor’s is largely positive with scant reference to past governments, the Coalition’s includes many negative comments about the Rudd/Gillard governments.

Labor, through its many statements has made it abundantly clear that a great education is for all, not just for those who can afford private schooling. The Coalition is focused on choice, giving parents the right to choose where their children are educated, and not penalizing those who choose private education, which it claims Labor’s policy does. Clearly, it’s more concerned with choice than equity, which is not featured in its policy.

Labor’s policy has been implemented through initiatives such as the MySchool website, the National Curriculum, NAPLAN, computers in schools, the BER that provided thousands of new school buildings and amenities, enhanced teacher training, performance pay for teachers, smaller class sizes, and the assignment of a vast increase in funding of all sectors from preschool to university and skills training. It has put its money where its mouth is.

The Coalition emphasizes teacher training but eschews smaller class sizes, and believes that giving more money to education is not the answer. The actions of the Baillieu Government in Victoria in substantially reducing TAFE funding to the extent of forcing closure of some campuses, even in regional areas where educational opportunity is limited, illustrate the Coalition principle that reducing funding will produce better and more affordable results.

There you have the contrast – Labor’s equity and opportunity for all wherever they live, as against opportunity limited by funding, and a priority for parental choice and private education that characterizes Coalition policy.

It is sad that there is so little unanimity between the major political parties about education, which is so basic to our future.


The economy
Even more striking is the contrast between Labor and Coalition policies on the economy.


Labor’s policies for the economy are featured under several headings, but the overriding concept is: “A strong economy is important – it generates jobs for working families and helps us build a fairer society. The Labor Government’s response to the global financial crisis protected jobs and small businesses. This has placed Australia in a strong position to capitalise on future opportunities and to confront the economic challenges of the future.”

It’s policies are detailed under several headings:
Creating jobs and skills in Australia
Investing in a creative Australia
Science for Australia’s future
Advancing Australia’s Interests Internationally
A Good International Citizen
Labor’s plan for all small business
Increasing your superannuation to 12 %
My Super
Protecting Workers’ Entitlements
National Trade Cadetships
Tax plan for our future
Mineral Resource Rent Tax
Connecting Renewables
Building Better Regional Cities
Reward for Early Action
Strengthening Australia
Cleaner Power Stations
National Broadband Network
Innovation
Fairer Simpler Banking
Carbon farming initiative
A secure and fair Australia

There is not room for them here in detail, and anyway you have heard them all. There are linked for reference.

The Coalition has similar statements on economic management under the heading Our Plan to get Australia Growing Again suggesting in the title that it is not growing now, which it is, at a substantial rate.

Unsurprisingly, it begins with a tilt against Labor:

“Tony Abbott and the Liberals stand for real action to end wasteful spending and real action to grow our economy. Labor, on the other hand, has turned a $20 billion surplus into record debt and has no plan to pay it back. We will continue to fight for Australian families who are paying the price for Labor's record debt with higher interest rates and rising living costs.”

There is no explanation of the meaning of ‘real’, and of course the ‘wasteful spending’ meme recurs, and incongruously ‘higher interest rates’ crops up despite them being at record lows, much lower than during most of the Howard era.

Beginning with a heading: Rebuilding Sustainable Prosperity, its substantive policy statement implies rebuilding is required. The general statements are reproduced below in some detail, as we have not heard much about them.

They begin:

“The Coalition is committed to sound, sustainable and consistent economic policy.

“Sound and sustainable economic policy leads to strong economic growth with low inflation.

“Sound and sustainable economic policy provides the resources to meet the community’s long term social needs on health, education, aged care, housing and income support.

“Sound and sustainable economic policy provides maximum opportunity for individuals to prosper and pursue their dreams and aspirations.

“Consistent policy based on consistent principles reduces sovereign risk and gives investors confidence for long term decision making.”


There could be little argument about these principles. The statements continue:

“The Coalition’s approach to achieving sound, sustainable and consistent economic policy will be based on a number of key principles.

“At the core is the belief that free, fair and competitive markets should form the basis of our economic system. The rights and choices of individuals are paramount. Individuals, rather than governments, are usually best placed to make decisions that maximise community well being.”


Note ‘free, fair and competitive’ and ‘rights and choices’, and that ‘individuals are best placed to make decisions’.

“The Coalition believes in small government. The Coalition acknowledges that government has a role in raising taxes and other revenue, formulating laws and regulations, and spending money to achieve legitimate social objectives.”

Note ‘small government’.

“However, the government’s powers to spend and to regulate need to be exercised with caution. Taxes must be as low, as fair, and as simple as possible. The Coalition is acutely aware that taxes are other peoples’ money.”

Note ‘taxes must be low’ despite the Howard Government being the highest taxing in Australia’s history.

“The Coalition strongly supports sustainable economic growth. Strong economic growth provides economic security. Strong economic growth ensures rising living standards.

“Fostering strong growth in productivity is an important element of this because it is ultimately the level of productivity that determines our standard of living. The Coalition believes that quality education is a foundation for high productivity. Policies which boost participation in the workforce are also of key importance.”


Note the emphasis on ‘productivity’.

”The Coalition strongly supports the small business sector. The Coalition believes small business is the engine room of the Australian economy.”

Note the emphasis on ‘small business’.

“The Coalition believes in a strong, prosperous and vibrant regional Australia.

“The Coalition believes in fiscal conservatism. The Coalition will restore fiscal rectitude. We will run a budget surplus over the cycle. We will repay Labor’s debt as quickly as we can.”


Note the emphasis on 'fiscal conservatism', 'fiscal rectitude', ‘a budget surplus’ and ‘repay Labor's debt’.

”The Coalition is committed to “light touch” regulation. Australia’s system of financial regulation weathered the global storm better than almost any other developed country. The Coalition will be cautious in saddling the Australian financial sector with more onerous regulation, which arises from the shortcomings of less well-supervised markets overseas. Financial Services is a truly global industry but its impacts are dramatic locally. More regulation constrains credit and inhibits innovation. Australia has led the world in prudential supervision, corporate regulation and market oversight. We must continue this global leadership.”

Note ‘light touch’ regulation, and be amazed at the concession that we have ‘weathered the global storm better than almost any other developed country’.

”Finally, the Coalition believes that government policies must lead to a sustainable Australia. Economic, population and environmental policies must take into account social harmony, quality of life, the provision of adequate infrastructure and the preservation of the environment.”

The details are given to enable comparisons to be made. Most of what is in Coalition policy is also Labor policy. The differences revolve around issues such as ‘free markets’, ‘rights and individual choice’, ‘small government’ and ‘light touch regulation’. Labor also wants low taxes, a budget surplus and to repay debt.

Superficially, it may seem that the differences are minor, yet they influence behaviour in a major way.


During the GFC, the Government took the Keynesian approach of ‘pump priming’, stimulating the economy with cash grants, infrastructure projects such as the HIP and BER, and small business tax breaks, as well as bank guarantees. While the Turnbull-led Coalition supported the first tranche of over just over $10 billion, it opposed the second, preferring tax cuts. The consensus by economists and international agencies is that the stimulus was appropriate and is the reason why Australia came through the GFC better than any other developed country, and continues to be the most robust economy in the world and the envy of other major nations, with its steady growth to trend, low unemployment, low debt to GDP ratio, low inflation and record low interest rates.

What we see here is a stark contrast between Keynesian thinking and that of Milton Freidman, who developed his macroeconomic ‘monetarist’ policy and extolled the virtues of a free market economic system with minimal intervention. He opposed ‘naïve Keynesian’ thought and action, which has now been replaced by neo-Keynesianism.

Another aspect of Friedman’s mode of thought is preference for ‘small government’ and implicitly, low spending government, and low taxes, especially for the wealthy on the grounds that the wealthy generate more wealth, create jobs, and that the wealth generated at the top trickles down to those at the bottom, so-called ‘trickle down economics’. In his book, Zombie Economics (Princeton University Press, 2010), which has the subtitle: How dead ideas still walk among us, Queensland University Professor John Quiggin, shows how a number of economic theories, although now debunked, don’t die, nor are they alive, they are simply ‘un-dead’ – zombie like. I have reviewed his book in Joe Hockey should read John Quiggin’s Zombie Economics.

Quiggin describes trickle-down economics as an idea that whatever benefits are given to the wealthy, they will filter down to the poorest. Quiggin begins: “As long as there have been rich and poor people, or powerful and powerless people, there have been advocates to explain that it’s better for everyone if things stay that way.” While great economists such as Adam Smith, John Stuart Mills and John Maynard Keynes have supported income re-distribution through progressive taxation, and most economists still do today, there are still some who argue that we should let the rich get richer and wait for the benefits to trickle down to the poor. One could be forgiven for thinking that is what Joe Hockey and the Coalition believe, as they insist on giving tax relief to the wealthy.

Quiggin gives example after example showing the trickle down hypothesis is false, and caps this with a telling graph of household income distribution in the US from 1965 to 2005 that shows that those on the 95th percentile for income steadily improved their position by over fifty percent, while those on the 20th percentile and below were static.

The contemporary debate in the US revolves around this trickle down notion. The extreme elements of the Republican Party, the Tea Party, are strong advocates of tax cuts for the wealthy and reduced government spending, even if that means repealing social benefit programs such as ‘Obamacare’ upon which so many of the poor rely for health care. Tea Party pressure has pushed the Republicans to oppose bills that would tax the rich higher so that social benefits could be offered, to the extent that if these bills are not passed by next year, the US might have to default on its obligations, a disastrous state of affairs for such a massive economy, which would have immense flow-on effects to the world economy and our own. This is why Wayne Swan has described these Tea Party elements as "cranks" and "crazies", as they push the US economy towards default, towards ‘falling over a cliff’, as Swan puts it. It is noteworthy that Joe Hockey and Tony Abbott have been quick to criticize Swan, presumably because they hold views similar to those of the Tea Party.

The now infamous Cory Bernardi, previously Abbott’s Parliamentary Secretary, is a strong advocate of these Tea Party policies, so much so that he is said to be ‘Sarah Palin without lipstick’.

In short, this comparison of policies on education and the economy, serves to illustrate that the ideologies behind these aspects of policy starkly differ between Labor and the Coalition, and that it is the ideology that drives the vigorous debate between the parties rather than the policy details. Ideologies are deep seated and invite contention and division. There could scarcely be more profound differences than those that exist on economics between the two parties. While both want a strong and growing economy and higher productivity, with one party focused on equity, the redistribution of wealth, and the provision of social services, and the other on boosting the wealthy at the inevitable expense of the less wealthy, it should not surprise us that ideological agreement between them is impossible. We saw this starkly exhibited on this week’s Q&A when Tanya Plibersek and Kelly O’Dwyer had a sharp clash, not on economic policy, but on ideology.

While Labor accepts debt as necessary to provide services, especially at times of recession, the Coalition regards debt as a sign of failure, and is only too willing to sacrifice expenditure on essential services such as education and health in order to 'repay debt', as we have seen LNP governments doing in Queensland, New South Wales and Victoria in recent times.

We ought not be surprised that because there is so much disagreement on ideological grounds, agreement on policy details is impossible. It seems that as their ideologies can never meet, as compromise of these fundamental principles is unattainable, dissent is inevitable.

What do you think?

Comments (144) -

September 27. 2012 04:06 PM

DoodlePoodle

Well presented article AA.  It has always escaped me why some folk seem to think they are more "equal" than others.  It seems the wealthy become greedy and selfish only wanting to take care of themselves and their well off friends.  How did Liberals always have such a large surplus - lack of spending on health and education.   Labor can be very proud of it's achievements.  

DoodlePoodle

September 27. 2012 04:13 PM

Ad astra

DoodlePoodle
Thank you for your kind remarks.  It seems that wealth begets greed that begets wealth, and so on it goes.

I agree that Labor can be proud of its achievements and should shout them from the treetops.

I have some mowing to do before the weather deteriorates.  Back later.

Ad astra

September 27. 2012 04:52 PM

KHTAGH

Another good read Ad.

KHTAGH

September 27. 2012 05:44 PM

Michael

Conservatives only have one idea, forget ideology.

UOT.

"Us on top".

Their apologists might write a million words on Conservatism, but all they do is boil down to...

UOT.

Michael

September 27. 2012 06:03 PM

2353

A good well argued post AA.  In furtherance of your theme I submit:

www.brisbanetimes.com.au/.../...0120927-26nga.html

The Deputy Premier in Queensland threatening the CMC to make the "right" decisions quickly or he will look at legislative changes.

newmatilda.com/.../barry-burns-firebrigade-funding

The Premier of NSW suggesting changes to the way fire brigades are funded - and letting the insurance industry off from their current 70%+ funding of the NSW Fire Brigade (on the basis that "Freeloaders" who don't pay insurance effectively get the service for nothing!).

2353

September 27. 2012 06:18 PM

Ad astra

HKTAGH
Thanks.

2352
Thank you for your complimentary remarks.  Your links show that Liberals know how to look after their wealthy and influential mates.

As NormanK says, their prime object is UOT – Us On Top

Ad astra

September 27. 2012 06:34 PM

NormanK

Michael

Aa is allowed the occasional slip-up.
Freud was a fool. Smile

NormanK

September 27. 2012 07:21 PM

Lyn

Hi Ad

Thankyou for your new article.  Your writing is always enjoyable,  just like you are talking to me .  We do have some long one sided conversations don’t we.  

Your summary says it all really :-
“We ought not be surprised that because there is so much disagreement on ideological grounds, agreement on policy details is impossible. It seems that as their ideologies can never meet, as compromise of these fundamental principles is unattainable, dissent is inevitable”

I see Mr Abbott is now saying the Carbon Price is like an octopus squeezing the economy, first it was a Python Squeeze. Sounds very academic doesn’t he,  wonder how many other animals he can use in his description of the economy .

Paul Whelan‏
TonyAbbottMHR Carbon Tax...has so many permutations...now octopus...Deliver to You "Octopus Garden" http://tinyurl.com/9mznlx8

Séan‏Cobra strike. Python squeeze. Now the carbon tax is an octopus. Was Bernardi really referring to Abbott in his bestiailty comments

Here is a compliment:-
davie ewan macdonald
Adastra5 Thank you for including a link on your blog to Tony #Abbott: "True Believers" on my blog escalatoroverthehill.wordpress.com/.../tony-abbott-on…-true-belivers

Sorry about those two links.  Seems The Hoopla have been re-vamping or spring cleaning & have changed their format.  Poll Bludger is being finicky.

I think Victoria will be pleased, her article which I note has scored 229 comments .  

Here are the two links again:-

IT’S TIME TO GO… LINDSAY
thehoopla.com.au/lindsay-tanner-time-to-go-boring/

Bushfire Bill
Posted Thursday, September 27, 2012 at 10:39 am
Am I missing something? Why does she need to go by next week?

On planet Hadley, so that the reconstruction of the country (which she has ruined and destroyed) can beging before it’s too late

blogs.crikey.com.au/.../#comment-1420743

SmileSmileSmileSmile

Lyn

September 27. 2012 08:05 PM

Gravel

Ad Astra

Thank you for all the effort and research you have put in for this great article.

All I got from the Liberal stuff was Greed is Good, and you ain't getting any of mine so there!

Lyn

So now we have an octopus to add to the abbott's menangerie.  How quaint.  Isn't it about time someone in the MSM starting laughing at him.

Gravel

September 27. 2012 08:16 PM

Todd

Great article Ad Astra.
This is the first time I have ever posted a comment since i started reading the Political Sword back in February and wanted to take the time to thank you for a great site.
Always look forward to sitting back after work and reading the articles plus the insightful comments made by most the posters here.
Re education it always shits me whenever I hear the conservatives talking about 'class warfare' and 'the politics of envy'
As though their inherent hatred of public schools is anything other than a perverse form of class warfare!
Send your kids to any school you want just don't expect the tax payer to help fund your lifestyle choice.
I will never forget when as a 22 year old, following our mothers death, my sister who was living with me came home with a letter from her public highschool requesting every student bring in a roll of toilet paper as they had ran out and clearly couldn't afford to purchase anymore.
In it's self it didnt seem so bad until that very same night when I sat down to read the West Australian newspaper and read an article about how one of the local elite all girls school were celebrating the opening of their brand new ballet studio.
Needless to say my blood boils when I hear right wingers bleat about the politics of envy.

Todd

September 27. 2012 08:38 PM

Ad astra

Todd
Welcome to The Political Sword family, and thank you for your generous comment.  I’m glad you have now joined our team of commentors, and hope you will come again to comment.

The Coalition’s talk about ‘class warfare’ is yet another one of their distracters.  They have a great collection of clichés that they trot out on cue.  There is little doubt about who they see as the lesser class.

Michael
Apologies for the incorrect attribution.

Gravel
‘Greed is good’ is the catch-cry of those who have done well and need to shield their souls against the nagging of their consciences.

Ad astra

September 27. 2012 08:54 PM

Ad astra

Hi Lyn
Thank you for your always-encouraging and complimentary words.  I’m glad you enjoyed the piece.

Tony Abbott is running out of animals to describe the effects of the dreaded carbon tax.  Next, he ought to try the Loch Ness Monster.  Its likely unreality would be an apt descriptor for the carbon tax’s non-existent ill effects.

Thanks – the Hoopla link now works, but I still can’t get BB’s comment.  I must be doing something wrong.

Victoria is pleased with the outcome of her first contribution to TPS.  There is another coming at the weekend, from her mother, that is a great follow-up to this one.

I'm now calling it a day.

Ad astra

September 27. 2012 10:32 PM

Dan Gulberry

All the Noalition has to offer to combat the cobras, pythons and octupi is unicorns.

Dan Gulberry

September 27. 2012 10:56 PM

Ian

and this is why the ideologies will always be in conflict.

I'm sixty plus years old and haven't bought a newspaper, on a regular basis, for at least 10/15 years. Even the free local community paper, without being read,  goes into the recycle bin. I just don't trust print journalists anymore. As for the talking heads on both commercial and public television...with an exception and warm thanks to 31 in Brisbane....forgedaboudit..insipid, vacous twerps en masse.

The best news, the most insightful analysis and commentary are on the web. Why would I buy a News or Fairfax product or that of their journalists? The time is coming closer to when Governments will be releasing policy statements to websites, directing people to them via twitter and the ever so sensitive Canberra press gallery will look on....rather forlornly I would imagine. Never quite understanding that the deep, insightful, disturbingly incestuous evaluation of each others premise' is of no import to any except those whose agenda they are instructed to help implement.

In truth? Not that much different to fingerpainting time in a kindergarden. Primary colours, or confected beat-ups, swirled and swished around with no thought given to those accidently splattered. The subtle colour of innuendo, the sly nudge, nudge, wink, wink we all know what's going on ....right Guvnor?  Oh oh smells like someone missed the potty time. Well if it was one of us, that's ok. If it's one of them over there?....eeeewwww. Let's tell on them..........Miss,Miss...that red haired girl and all those boys with her made smells....they didn't?....well...they will next time. Just you wait and see.

The Press Gallery journalists in Australia are an intrinsically incestuous and vapid collection of ethics, morals and confected outrage that can be bought with not only coin, but pretty words, empty adoration and, sadly, any twisted truth the vested interests need promoted.

and they have the gall to criticize one of the most intelligent and strongest politicians to ever represent this nation..........parasites, the lot of them.

Ian

September 28. 2012 02:13 AM

Patriciawa

Thinking through the question in your first para, I think I am frustrated not by any clash of ideologies in today's political battles.  After all the existence of different ideologies or systems of belief in various political parties is inherent in our democratic system, the very reason for its existence.  

I think that what frustrates me is that one of these parties is led by an uncompromising ideologue, Tony Abbott. His website as you say tells us much about Liberal Party ideology, but little about policies, except that he is hell bent on opposing everything that Julia Gillard and her government try to achieve.  Every day for two years now we have heard predictions of the doom and disaster bound to result from Labor policies, particularly carbon pricing and and the mining resource tax.

Fortunately he has been singularly unsuccessful in thwarting these policies, though not without cost and inconvenience to many sectors of the Australian economy or groups within our society.  He should have heeded the advice of Peter Hartcher in his smh article which you discussed here in June a few weeks before the carbon price legislation came into effect.

The Abbott opposition needs to show that it can build, not just destroy. It needs an alternative to doomism, and it needs it soon. The first strike against the carbon tax scare story has been delivered, and it's not even July 1 yet.
www.smh.com.au/.../...m-beware-20120608-201el.html

Almost three months on and none of Abbott's prophecies have been fulfilled. The cobra has not struck, nor the python squeezed, but he is still foretelling doom. I think today Greg Combet really enjoyed ridiculing the silliness of Abbott's latest metaphor of impending disaster, the octopus whose tentacles will slowly strangle Australia!

Patriciawa

September 28. 2012 02:18 AM

Patriciawa

Ian, hear hear to your opinion of our Canberra press gallery! What a herd of swine.  They could never appreciate your assessment of our Prime Minister!  She is pearl of a PM.

Patriciawa

September 28. 2012 02:19 AM

Patriciawa

Ian, hear hear to your opinion of our Canberra press gallery!  They could never appreciate your assessment of our Prime Minister!  She is pearl of a PM.  

Patriciawa

September 28. 2012 04:36 AM

Marilyn

Patricia, she is an idiot.

She gets up there in the UN and claims we deserve a seat because of our peacekeeping in East Timor and the Solomons but fails to mention the 25 years of Australia sitting on her hands while almost 200,000 East Timorese are slaughtered and the country occupied by Indonesia and burnt to the ground - it's as if she thinks the whole world doesn't know about our complicity in the genocide.

Nor did she bother to mention that we have been robbing the East Timorese blind over their oil and gas and when refugees fled to Australia to escape the blood shed Paul Keating said they were really Portuguese and could go there instead.   Howard went even further and jailed them and then sent them home with rice and ground sheets.

If that is our effort at peacekeeping I bet most countries hope we stay the hell away.

She also neglected to mention that we are as responsible for the murder of millions of Vietnamese, Cambodian and Laotian civilians with the US, two wars against Iraq, the invasion and occupation of Afghanistan and our cheerleading whenever Israel blasts another country away.

It was embarrassing to hear the member of the UN for Ecuador take us to task for refusing to protect Julian Assange, we failed to protect Hicks and Habib from the US and so on.

A good PM would have mentioned those trifles instead of pretending we are fucking peace keepers.

She would have also mention that she is flogging off and dumping refugees to Nauru where there is no water, food, housing, health care or anything else to appease the racists -instead she assumes that the world does not notice our disgusting behaviour.

WE have promised the world that we will abide by 12 important human rights instruments but we sign and ratify them and throw them in the bin before the ink is dry.

REally and truly Patricia you need to take your head out the place the sun doesn't shine and smell the coffee.

Marilyn

September 28. 2012 04:37 AM

Marilyn

She also forgot to mention that we are complicit in the genocide happening today in West Papua because we want Indonesia to keep right on jailing and killing refugees for us.

Marilyn

September 28. 2012 06:19 AM

2353

Patricia is on to some thing with her ideologue comment above (you just have to scroll the troll to see it from here).  Ideologues believe in the "greatness" of their cause and are usually let down by their delusions of grandeur, leaving some fatal flaw in the strategy.  Abbott (and Credlin?)'s plan has been since 2010 to deride the Government as being illegitimate, pick on a few higher profile differences between the two political tribes and act in a negative fashion (while allowing another 300 odd pieces of legislation through without comment!).  As is usually the case with ideologues (and bullies), sooner or later those that initially fall under the spell realise they have been "taken for a ride".  In reality, Abbott may have been his own worst enemy in playing the short (and easy) game by donning the hi-vis top and dragging the media into various small businesses rather than putting the time into creation of policy for their alternative vision for Australia and then "marketing" the result.

There is no other reason but ideological for the actions of Newman in Queensland - even Costello in his "audit" suggested natural attrition would do the job for him.  The comparison of Newman's "rise" and his method of operation to Abbott's is telling

2353

September 28. 2012 07:06 AM

Lyn

TODAY’S LINKS

The value of experience, Andrew Elder, Politically Homeless
Grattan vouched for Tony Abbott when evidence emerged that he was a bully. She has repeatedly written off Julia Gillard, not least because Grattan, like others, missed the story that she was becoming Prime Minister in the first place: these predictions were without value when first released and have since proven worthless. It is not her job to engage in advocacy or prognostications,
andrewelder.blogspot.com.au/.../...experience.html

We Are Not A Stalinist Party, Archie, Archie Archive
O’Farrell Opera House proudly standing next to the O’Farrell Harbour Bridge in the great Liberal City of O’Farrell. The Rugby League teams will be renamed to match the new suburbs and the Gay Eels and Stoner Rabbitohs will fight for the Flag with the Piccoli Sea Eagles and the Hazzard Bulldogs.Tony Abbott will be applauding this move in his “Non-Stalinist” Liberal Party because it could give him the chance to live in the Lodge in the newly renamed Australian capital city, Abbottsville.
archiearchive.wordpress.com/.../

Language Changes as Fluid as the Changes to the Tax Itself, If Not More, Aussiepollies
The latest expression to be used by the Opposition Leader is that the price will be like an “octopus’ embrace”, its tentacles grabbing hold of various parts of the Australian economy, far and wide, as well as the people. Presumably though, it’s not a Blue-Ringed Octopus as they’re poisonous.
aussiepollies.com/.../

The cries of a frustrated reformer: Lindsay Tanner’s vexed history with the left, Geoffrey Robinson, The Conversation
Lindsay Tanner was one of a generation of Labor activists who came to political maturity in the 1980s. These were challenging years for the Australian left.Labor’s 1983 victory set Australia apart from the right-wing ascendancy of Thatcher and Reagan but Labor confronted a largely conservative electorate: voters in the 80s
theconversation.edu.au/the-cries-of-a-frustrated-reformer-lindsay-tanners-vexed-history-with-the-left-9822

Tony Abbott and the ‘Handbag Hit Squad’, Peter Wicks, Independent Australia
If four women beating up Tony Abbott with handbags is the image that Liberals want us to picture when Abbott debates these women, then what are we supposed to picture when Julia Gillard debates Tony Abbott, Joe Hockey, Christopher Pyne, Greg Hunt or any of the other male members of the Liberal Party? A bunch of blokes beating up a female leader?
www.independentaustralia.net/.../

Richard Flanagan / Tess Lawrence: Gunns and roses and the cargo cult, Independent Australia
The demise of Gunns brings to an end a tumultous three decades of Tasmanian history that began with Robin Gray losing the Franklin Dam battle to the Bob Brown led environmental movement in 1983, continued with Robin Gray losing both the Wesley Vale pulp mill battle and government to a Labor-Green government in 1989, and now the loss of Gunns and Gray’s third white elephantthe Gunns pulp mill.
www.independentaustralia.net/.../

The global economy slows down, Gary Sauer-Thompson, Public Opinion
Globalisation today means that the economy is global, but government is national. This suggests that the flaws in globalisation cannot and will not be tackled effectively unless and until there are much better mechanisms for politicians and people to hold in check global capital and global businesses. How in the hell is that going to be done?
www.sauer-thompson.com/.../the-global-econ.php

That, ladies and gentlemen, is how you win elections, Sal Piracha, Only The Depth Varies
“Whyalla will be wiped off the map by Julia Gillard’s carbon tax. Whyalla risks becoming a ghost town, an economic wasteland, if this carbon tax goes ahead and that’s true not just of Whyalla, it’s also true of Port Pirie, it’s true of Gladstone, it’s true of communities in the Hunter Valley and the Illawarra in New South Wales, it’s true of Kwinana in Western Australia, it’s true of the La Trobe Valley, Portland, places like that in Victoria. There’s not a state and there’s hardly a region in this country that wouldn’t have major communities devastated by a carbon tax if this goes ahead...” – April 2011
onlythedepthvaries.blogspot.com.au/.../...you.html

A Mining Boom Unlike All Other Booms?, Sarah Burnside, New Matilda
Political reporting often fails to use events from even the recent past to make sense of contemporary controversies; Crikey has editorialised scathingly on the "perpetual present" of the nation’s press gallery, referring to a general lack of any context going beyond the day’s talking points. Given the current focus on the "end of the boom" and questions about how wisely our governments
newmatilda.com/.../mining-boom-unlike-all-other-booms

Why Twiggy is right to cut the tomato sauce at Fortescue, Kath Walters, The Power Index
A leaked internal memo, published in The Australian, reveals that the company is now pleading for the support of staff as it slashes the little morale boosters that they have becomes used to: company barbecues at the end of the working week, helping themselves to the stationery cupboard, office catering, coffee from free machines, company-paid airport parking and unrestricted colour print-outs
www.thepowerindex.com.au/.../why-twiggy-is-right-to-cut-the-tomato-sauce-at-fortescue

Tracking a troll, Blitzkrieg Bopp
The above image shows you a number of comments on my blog, there is a range of information but for now we’re only going to take the IP address. Once you have this you can go to one of the many online IP tracker services such as “IPTrackerOnline.com”, type in the IP address in question and hit ENTER. Within seconds you will have a wealth of information.
evertb.wordpress.com/2012/09/26/tracking-a-troll/

Today’s Front Pages
Australia Newspaper Front Pages for 28 September 2012
www.frontpagestoday.co.uk/index.cfm

Lyn

September 28. 2012 07:44 AM

Ad astra

LYN'S DAILY LINKS updated: www.thepoliticalsword.com/.../...-DAILY-LINKS.aspx

Ad astra

September 28. 2012 08:02 AM

Gravel

Ian

It is great to see you back.  How are you going?  Have missed your input.

Todd

You have done great on your first comment, looking forward to more.

Lyn

Great links as usual, will catch up between playing with grandkids.  Thanks heaps.

Gravel

September 28. 2012 08:04 AM

Michael

And, apparently, there are Reds under the bed.

Bad Abbott steps forward to personally ratify every word of AA's post above.

www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-fn3dxiwe-1226483068118

More class warfare taxes coming: Abbott

THE federal government will likely lift taxes and impose more means tests if its allowed to "get away with" its carbon tax, Opposition Leader Tony Abbott says.

Reaffirming his vow to repeal the tax if elected, Mr Abbott says scrapping it is the best thing Australia can do to take the pressure off electricity bills which he says have soared at least 50 per cent across the country.

"(Repealing the tax) immediately means that rather than going up, your power price is going down," he told the Nine Network on Friday.

He said the federal government had been busy pushing the message that no one had been hurt since the tax came into effect.

"If they think they can get away with the carbon tax, you know what that means? More tax increases are coming," he said.

"With this (Labor) mob there'll be class war tax increases, more means tests, (and) attacks on superannuation."


Reported in The Australian??? Does this suggest (it does to me) that they are setting out to make the man look ridiculous? It does to me. Why else could they put his words out there like this?

Michael

September 28. 2012 10:07 AM

TalkTurkey

Israel: a Fascist State?

Eric Campbell says No, it has to have a single dictator according to his definition.

I say Fascist is as Fascist does.

If it's not Fascist, it is anyway a criminal State, ignoring every humanitarian protestation and treating Palestinians as subhuman. It is de facto backed in every action by the USA. Is it any wonder that resentment is at suicide-bombing level?

Dare anyone call a suicide bomber a coward?

Netanyahu is itching to invade Iran. Iran is not about to lie down and take it, this is the most dangerous adventurism since the Bay of Pigs in Cuba in the early 196o's. Nukes may be involved if Israel feels like it. O joy.

Noam Chomsky was a respected political commentator when I was studying Politics in the late 60's. He has only grown since then. Read this:

http://t.co/XJv2QbAo Noam Chomsky

TalkTurkey

September 28. 2012 10:23 AM

bilko

AA,another fine effort, Abbott(Action man himself) with his complete front bench have being "doing a Costello" ie in a hammock for almost three years.

Not one coherent policy in that time.

In fact like Abbott once said the public was sleep walking when we booted Howard well in my opinion the noalition is doing just that.

As Andrew Elder headlines his blog site and which I concur Abbott will NEVER be PM. As soon as his polls tank there will be a rush to put the skids under him and push him into oblivion. I just hope they leave it until it is to late to replace him ie not until after his upcoming election defeat.

bilko

September 28. 2012 10:28 AM

Lyn


Good Morning Ad and Everybody

Twitterverse for you:

Financial Review ‏@FinancialReview
Tony Abbott has a burgeoning budget black hole problem, latingle says [free] http://bit.ly/TIBPG3 #auspol

AFR Magazine Power Issue 2012
So it is that Julia Gillard, the Prime Minister, is once again the most powerful figure in Australia, in the view of the AFR Magazine’s eminent panel. And so she should be. Julia Gillard runs the country. Tony Abbott does not.

Gillard is Prime Minister because she and not Abbott was able to put a case to the Greens and key independents; she showed the powers of negotiation and compromise necessary to lead a minority government.
www.afr.com/.../afr_magazine_power_issue_82sNOZBC6QzI7ReyIUaVQL

Lukewarm Libs may hurt UN bid, Phillip Coorey
THE federal opposition's negativity towards Australia's bid for a seat on the United Nations Security Council is being used against Australia by its rivals as the lobbying intensifies before the October 18 vote.

While the government won't admit it publicly, sources familiar with the lobbying process have confided that the attitude of the Coalition has been detrimental. ''It does hurt,'' said one senior official

This morning, Opposition Leader Tony Abbott said that the UN bid was distorting Australia's foreign policy priorities.
m.smh.com.au/.../...urt-un-bid-20120927-26o1l.html

Abbott brushes aside split in ranks over wheat vote, Michelle Grattan
TONY Abbott has brushed off the latest disunity in the opposition by saying West Australian National Tony Crook, who plans to cross the floor on a wheat bill, ''is not a member of the Coalition party room''
www.smh.com.au/.../...eat-vote-20120927-26o1j.html

fiz ‏
Contemptible. MT robcorr If Qld dept bosses sack more people than asked to, Newman will pay them a $75k cash bonus. www.heraldsun.com.au/.../story-e6frf7kf-1226482467115

Financial Review ‏
Federal budget fix needed to avoid shock [free] http://bit.ly/QgpulN #auspol

John Pratt ‏
The mystery of Abbott's appeal. I don't think Abbott is my kinda politician. #auspol http://www.theage.com.au/opinion/-26o0i.html

David Lewis ‏
thetodayshow so Today is now a branch of the Liberal Party it seems!

sansBS‏
FarmOnline good news for Labor, Barnaby to be given a "prominent role" Aus wide before next election!! LOL http://bit.ly/V2nQIW#auspol

Mr Denmore ‏
TheKouk Standing by for cries of horror from "self-funded" retirees. Also see new ASFA paper on equity in super http://tiny.cc/iwhblw

Lyn

September 28. 2012 11:57 AM

Ad astra

Hi Lyn
I’ve been busy this morning and am still working through your links and Twitterverse.

That Tony Abbott’s negativity is jeopardizing Australia’s chance of a seat on the UN Security Council is appalling in the extreme.  It shows that he has no interest other than thwarting Julia Gillard.  To my mind that is one of the most despicable things Abbott has ever done, and he has done plenty.

Laura Tingle’s ‘black hole’ article exposes the sheer hypocrisy of the Coalition approach, which is founding its campaign on not subjecting itself to budget honesty, making aspirational promises, which are code for ‘non-core’, and thumbing its nose at the electorate every time it says it will tell them its plans and costings when it’s good and ready.  Is there no depth to which the alternative leader will stoop?  The answer is NO!

I see that the headline in The Oz is: Howard revives history wars.  That confirms what many think of that paper – it is history itself.

Michael
Abbott is getting desperate as the carbon tax morphs to an octopus, a benign creature.  Next he’ll tell us the carbon tax is ’krill’, a planktonic crustacean, which although being invisible to the naked eye, pervades everything.  

He is also pulling out all the scare-the-electorate stops now with extra taxes, and means testing, and of course that is ‘class warfare’.  It’s very sick.

bilko
Thank you for your kind comments.

I think we all hope his party will kick Abbott out so that he has no possibility of becoming PM, but closer to the election!

Ad astra

September 28. 2012 12:00 PM

NormanK

Hi Lyn

Thanks for the links - today and always.
You're a keen gardener, what's the opposite of a dirt unit, do you think?
A 'rose unit'?
The Liberal Party Rose Unit?
The Liberal Party Perfume Unit?
Whatever it should be called, it is certainly out in force this week. Amazing what one bad Newspoll can do, isn't it? I suspect Liberal Party internal polling is reflecting a similar trend back towards Labor and even further away from Abbott as an individual.

Peter Craven's "The mystery of Abbott's appeal" today was just nauseating.

♫ "My heat belongs to Tony." ♫

I'm trying to get a comment up on that article now but if I fail I may have to vent my spleen here. That article is wrong on so many levels that I don't know where to begin.
Grrr.

NormanK

September 28. 2012 12:03 PM

NormanK

Oops.

♫ "My heart belongs to Tony." ♫

I'll give Freud credit for that one. Smile

NormanK

September 28. 2012 12:35 PM

NormanK

Spleen you have the floor.

Mr Craven, you should be seriously embarrassed at writing this type of nonsense.
"And what's a bit of wall pounding compared with a youthful enthusiasm morally equivalent to membership of the Hitler Youth?"
Is this Godwin's Law in reverse? "Nothing is as bad as the Hitler-like thing that I sort of did when I was a young fella."
Did your actions have any real consequences for another individual who has since carried that negative experience through the rest of their life?

You express admiration for the bloodiest of all bleeding hearts, SH-Y and yet you would have us believe that you also admire someone who wants to tow asylum seeker boats back out to sea and leave them to fend for themselves.

"At least he stands for something."
Yep, like farmers should be able to lock their gates to keep CSG explorers off their property. Well, he believes that when Alan Jones backs him into a corner. The next day when he has to front up to those same miners he switches his position to the polar opposite.

"His proposed paid maternity leave scheme would be universally praised if it came from the other side."
No, it wouldn't and don't you dare presume to speak for me. I would condemn this policy regardless of its origin. It will drive up the cost of goods and services so that the poor will ultimately pay for the support of someone's rich lifestyle. Incidentally, what happened to "over this government's dead body"? Must have been a different Tony Abbott, not the one you've fallen in love with.

"We watch a dreadful horror show of minority government with a Prime Minister - still revered as a back-room negotiator and administrator - who has more trouble than anyone since Billy McMahon in convincing us that she means what she says and that her political rhetoric relates to a system of belief."
No, Mr Craven, you might watch in "dreadful horror" Julia Gillard as she navigates the uncertain waters of minority government. I watch in wonder and awe. What makes Abbott's statements "credible" and Gillard's "rhetoric"? Perhaps it's that shared long-ago religious upbringing. After all, Gillard can't claim that her beliefs and convictions are grounded in religious doctrine. Shame, Julia, shame!

"He's wrong about the boats, he's wrong about the debt, he's wrong about climate change. But he stands for something. OK, a lot of women are profoundly suspicious of him because of his attitude (not his policy) on abortion."
Women are suspicious of him because he is a misogynistic bully.
If he's wrong on three of the biggest issues facing Australia today, how does his conviction make him suddenly right?

The Liberal Party Perfume Unit is working overtime this week.

NormanK

September 28. 2012 12:50 PM

paul walter

I guess the thread topic is obstructionism, a disease of US political ideology; right-wing libertarianism/contrarianism.
Those of us with good fb connections got to observe the phenomena over recent times close-up in the dreadful attempt by the Tea Party to crash the US economy in the service of overt fascism.
The local example comes from the Abbott coalition, from its bloody minded and dog in the manger approach to asylum seekers, to its embrace of austerity neo liberalism and social conservative authoritarianism on social policy; also ecology.
Had they even once challenged Labor *on rational terms* over issues like asylum seekers and ecology ( eg got shot of environmental denialism )as well as economics from a Keynesian rather than an economic rationalist background, the ALP would have been forced to confront a number of serious issues it has shirked other wise, when offered bipartisanship rather than presented with disruption for the sake of it.

paul walter

September 28. 2012 02:08 PM

Lyn

Hi Norman K , Ad  and Everybody,

NK what are you up to today? I think it’s devilment  or rascality . If this is what Mr Craven & Mr Abbott have done to your mindset & your Spleen you can imagine what they have done to mine.

Thankyou for your brilliant enjoyable post “Spleen you have the floor” @ 12.35PM

The Liberal Party Rose Unit?

The Liberal Party Perfume Unit?

Yes of course they would have to have a pretty name for their “Dirt Unit”  but I think Rose Unit is way too good for them, never mind it’s appropriate.

Very upsetting spleen stuff is these two statements by Peter Craven   “When I say ''like'' I don't mean that Abbott is my kind of politician” & this “My heart does go out to him a bit, however, when he gets abused”
www.theage.com.au/.../...ppeal-20120927-26o0i.html

A  couple of interesting links for you:

wontletyoufly ‏
Our 'first bloke' makes UN history www.theage.com.au/.../...story-20120928-26p68.html … via @theage

Jones wins Ernie for sexist comments
Australia's annual Ernie awards mocking the most sexist public comments in the country used to have a somewhat lighthearted edge.
But campaigners against sexism are warning that this year some of Australia's most influential people are displaying increasingly blatant misogyny.

Last night radio broadcaster Alan Jones took out the main award for declaring: "Women are destroying the joint, Christine Nixon in Melbourne, Clover Moore here, honestly there is no chaff bag big enough for these people
www.abc.net.au/.../4283948

Govt settles Ashby case for $50,000, AFR
www.afr.com/.../govt_settles_ashby_case_for_YMHeCiyBug7ouWbHatmIPJ

Slipper accuser settles with Commonwealth, Louise Hall, Court Reporter
The case against Mr Slipper continues and is listed for hearing at 10.15am on Tuesday.
www.nationaltimes.com.au/.../...0120928-26ph2.html

Syd Walker ‏
James Ashby's pathetic statement concludes his case was "not about money" www.scribd.com/.../Ashby-Statement-28Sept12-FINAL … (as he pockets $50K of public funds) #auspol

Reclaim The Night ‏
For the record, this is the letter from the Commonwealth's lawyers to Ashby's: resources.news.com.au/.../...settlement-letter.pdf

eleanor bloom  
Govt settlement offer with Ashby includes agreement there will be no application from Ashby re costs. resources.news.com.au/.../...settlement-letter.pdf

SmileSmileSmileSmile

Lyn

September 28. 2012 02:38 PM

paul walter

The Slipper/Ashby thing seems a timid response from the government.
Ashby is a scumbag, yet money goes to him rather than his latest victim, Slipper?
Alan Jones ought to be sewn up in a gunny sack and chucked into the ocean off Bondi, perhaps with Ashby for company. They would fit in well with the other "cigars" floating away from the notorious outlet there.
By contrast, Christine Nixon and Clover Moore have hard earned reputations for public service.
Funny how none of Jones' victims are ever Tories. I personally would have Kelly O'Dwyer in a chaff- bag. Noisy, empty-headed, destructive: as useless as a hip pocket on a singlet.  

paul walter

September 28. 2012 02:54 PM

Ad astra

Hi Lyn
Your Twitterati are interesting again.  I don’t know what to make of the Ashby settlement.  We’ll have to wait for a Government statement.  I guess the Coalition will attempt to turn it to their advantage, no matter what.

I don’t know why there was even a contest for the one who made the most sexist statement – Alan Jones is so far ahead of his competitors.

The Craven article was indeed craven.

NormanK
That was a nice reply to Craven.  Were you able to post it on The Age website?

Dan Gulberry
‘Unicorn’ is a good descriptor for the effects of the carbon tax – mythical.

Ian
Welcome back.  

Who could disagree with your conclusion: ”The Press Gallery journalists in Australia are an intrinsically incestuous and vapid collection of ethics, morals and confected outrage that can be bought with not only coin, but pretty words, empty adoration and, sadly, any twisted truth the vested interests need promoted, and they have the gall to criticize one of the most intelligent and strongest politicians to ever represent this nation..........parasites, the lot of them. Almost three months on and none of Abbott's prophecies have been fulfilled. The cobra has not struck, nor the python squeezed, but he is still foretelling doom. I think today Greg Combet really enjoyed ridiculing the silliness of Abbott's latest metaphor of impending disaster, the octopus whose tentacles will slowly strangle Australia!”

Does an octopus really strangle?  Perhaps the Abbottoctopus does?

Patriciawa
You too are enjoying the Abbott animal metaphors.  I enjoyed your conclusion: ”Almost three months on and none of Abbott's prophecies have been fulfilled. The cobra has not struck, nor the python squeezed, but he is still foretelling doom. I think today Greg Combet really enjoyed ridiculing the silliness of Abbott's latest metaphor of impending disaster, the octopus whose tentacles will slowly strangle Australia!”

So far we have several suggestions for Abbott’s next animal metaphor – the ‘Unicorn’ or the ‘Loch Ness Monster’, both mythical; or ‘Krill’, ubiquitous but invisible.  We should run a ‘what’s Abbott’s next animal metaphor’ quest.  The winner gets a carbon tax facsimile – a chunk of dry ice.

2353
Your observation is astute: ”There is no other reason but ideological for the actions of Newman in Queensland - even Costello in his "audit" suggested natural attrition would do the job for him.  The comparison of Newman's "rise" and his method of operation to Abbott's is telling.”

paul walter
”Noisy, empty-headed, destructive are good descriptors for Kelly O’Dwyer.

Ad astra

September 28. 2012 03:20 PM

TalkTurkey

I tried to retweet this message (I've lost the author now) but Twitter wouldn't let me!


"Israel is a rogue nuclear state which stole it's first weapons from the USA & isn't a signatory to Non-Proliferation treaty< Iran is."

TalkTurkey

September 28. 2012 03:26 PM

Tom of Melbourne

Now that the government has coughed up $50,000 to settle with Ashby, I’d imagine a range of contributors here will be lining up to post a retraction of their earlier comments. Nicola Roxon might too issue a retraction.

Tom of Melbourne

September 28. 2012 03:35 PM

NormanK

Ad astra

Yes, my comment(s) went up. I broke it up into into shorter punches rather than risk having the whole salvo rejected.
It serves almost no purpose putting up comments on those types of articles but it did make me feel better. I doubt whether the author even reads them.
In a week where commentators have tried desperately to PhotoShop Abbott into a likeable, child-saving hero this 'former-Communist in awe of the political integrity of Abbott' drivel was a step too far.

NormanK

September 28. 2012 04:06 PM

NormanK

Ashby should drop Slipper case: Roxon
AAP    The Brisbane Times

Now Attorney-General Nicola Roxon says the case against Mr Slipper should be dropped.

"As anyone who has been involved in a settlement will attest to, settlements aren't about who is right or wrong, they are about bringing matters to a speedy conclusion, which the commonwealth has now achieved," she said in a statement.

"The case should now be dropped against Mr Slipper as well, and the whole matter should be brought to a speedy conclusion in coming days."

**********

Mr Ashby's spokesman said the government had retreated from its allegations that the case was an abuse of process.

However, Ms Roxon said the government did not "resile" from its arguments that the claim was vexatious.

news.brisbanetimes.com.au/.../...120928-26pjs.html

NormanK

September 28. 2012 04:08 PM

uriah

Great article AA especially the policy versus no policy.The LNP are treating australians with disdain-right you voted for us now your sacked -your services are slashed your rights at work are gone and if you get injured your no longer covered.Ultimately Australians must decide what sort of society they wish to live in.Keep up the good work.

uriah

September 28. 2012 04:11 PM

Gravel

NormanK

Thanks for venting your spleen, if you hadn't I was going to ask you to.

I am fortunate that I have heard or seen any of this 'perfuming' of abbott. If I had I am sure I would have ended up with a good dose of gastro and diarrhea.

Okay, that media bit about abbott being negative could harm our attempt at a seat on the UN. Nothing on radio or TV.  Is the overall media happy that Australia's reputation is being trashed by this idiot?  I guess they must be as they aren't  doing anything to point out to him the damage he is doing.

What I have seen of Julia (in between playing with grandkids), she is promoting Australia very well and helping me feel very proud.  

Gravel

September 28. 2012 04:15 PM

Jason

ToM,
   They paid him the money to go away and he gets to keeps his job for as long as Slipper remains Speaker!
He is still going after Slipper but the Governments part is finished, so if he's found to have done no wrong with the cab charge he's back in the seat!
With or without him Abbott doesn't have his vote and the government continues on!
It's only you that's worried about how many angels sit on the head of a pin, and I doubt anyone will be rushing out to post a retraction of anything!
I don't give a rats arse about Ashby!


Jason

September 28. 2012 04:49 PM

Ad astra

uriah
Thank you for your kind remarks.  Indeed, "Australians must decide what sort of society they wish to live in."  Let's hope the never decide to let Abbott decide.

Ad astra

September 28. 2012 04:59 PM

Ian

At first blush I didn't feel that the decision to pay Ashby $50,000.00 was all that bright. I felt it would have been better for the Government to pursue him for all they're worth. In essence, crush the the murky little grub. He deserves no less and he will profit from a nuisance litigation and I am against that and fear that the precedent has been set for others to claim an easy fifty grand. Depending of course, on the manufactured circumstances at the time.

However the reality is that Ashby sued the Commonwealth of Australia. He didn't sue the Federal Labor Government. He sued all of us. Labor, Green, Independent and even those who pride themselves on supporting the vile corruption that has become the Liberal party.

As I see it the Australian Government Solicitor has done us proud....and saved us a bundle.

The litigation was never about the morality of the Federal Labor Government. It was about the protections of workers under the Commonwealths work practises.

Now we all know that those who love and support the vile corruption party are going to dispute this. Let them. They need their delusions. In fact, after the last few opinion polls, delusions may be all the policy, bereft of both ethics and morality as usual, they have left. The supporters of the corrupt can bang their gums together as much as they wish. Wont change a thing. The Ashby saga will now be resolved between the thrice nominated former LNP MP, the person pursuing the civil litigation and the heirachy of the vile corruption called the Liberal party of Australia.

Julia Gillard, angel that she is, has extremely clean hands.

Ian

September 28. 2012 05:06 PM

Tom of Melbourne

After all the bluster from Roxon and barrackers, they’ve paid him $50,000.

Claims of (sexual and other) harassment are rarely clear cut, much of it happens in private between 2 people only. It’s always “He said…”, “no I didn’t, that’s a lie”, “no it isn’t here are some texts”, that’s not true, you’ve taken them out of context”,  “no I didn’t…” and repeat this about 15 times.

There’s lots of “s/he asked for it” and “they knew what they were doing”…followed by “they misunderstood, it was all a joke”

The most vile form is the misuse of authority towards a subordinate.

The way people have moved to unilaterally condemn a complainant, in a subordinate position to a powerful politician is shameful.

As I’ve said, the government has chosen to cough up, such was its judgement about its case and regardless of the protestations of Roxon, coughing up cash says something about their case.

Tom of Melbourne

September 28. 2012 05:19 PM

Jason

ToM,
   "After all the bluster from Roxon and barrackers, they’ve paid him $50,000."

They being the tax payer you mean? the Labor party didn't cough up!
Anyway time to move on ToM nothing to see here!

Jason

September 28. 2012 08:44 PM

DoodlePoodle

Ashby probably thinks he has done well but I wouldn't like his chances for future employment.  $50K in the scheme of things is not much to "burn your boats"  

DoodlePoodle

September 28. 2012 08:47 PM

2353

Ashby will probably get employment again with some LNP character - but his claims would have done him no good.

The Government got out of it lightly really!

2353

September 28. 2012 10:26 PM

Truth Seeker

Ad, another great read, well done.


I think that the payout to Ashby was to bring to a conclusion the constitutional appeal that his legal team put forward to tie the whole case up in the courts as a means of keeping Slipper out of the way. The pressure now is on Ashby to put up or shut up.

I think he will shut up...if he has any sense at all...?

Cheers

Truth Seeker

September 28. 2012 10:54 PM

Wake Up

Let's be real here, a $50,000 settlement is pittance and the mere fact that Ashby settled for such a token amount only verifies what a weak case he must have had all along. In fact if you read the settlement letter, the original offer was only $15,000, hardly anything to crow about !!!

Wake Up

September 28. 2012 11:28 PM

Tom of Melbourne

Yeah, right. The government was at pains to point out that the most he could possibly expect was $37,500. It justified this for a range of reasons, including that Ashby couldn't expect to be employed beyond 2013.

So the government paid 25% more than Ashby could possibly win in court, because … ??

The government didn’t want to continue to defend a hopeless case and the dubious Speaker.

Tom of Melbourne

September 28. 2012 11:46 PM

Jason

ToM,
   Unless you're a "barrister" involved in the case why don't you for once in your life shut the fuck up?
You have no better idea than I or any one else as to why the decision that was taken was in the Ashby case, yes you might flog your log but a case it doesn't make!

Jason

September 28. 2012 11:53 PM

Tom of Melbourne

You’ll now have to retract Jason.

I was only providing a summary of  a couple of the specific points made in the offer from the government to Ashby.

I’d have though you’d be familiar with this.

resources.news.com.au/.../...settlement-letter.pdf

Tom of Melbourne

September 29. 2012 12:13 AM

Jason

ToM,
   Not in this lifetime! You might think you're better than the "legal advice" given to government but you're not!

Jason

September 29. 2012 12:53 AM

Jason

Happy Birthday PM!

Jason

September 29. 2012 06:11 AM

Cuppa

So in other words the Coalition is dedicated to SerfChoices (by whatever Orwellian title), running down public education and health, and stripping back public services to Third World standards.

If they just came out and said that, of course, no one but the "One Per Cent" would vote for them. So they mask their intentions behind  a wall of anti-Labor spin - their corrosive cause assisted hour by hour by the disgraced one-party media.

Cuppa

September 29. 2012 07:23 AM

Michael

Over here:

www.smh.com.au/.../...ips-away-20120928-26qj8.html

Lenore Taylor seems to want to have it both ways (surprised?), arguing that there is intended strategy in Abbott hiding away from the media and the public post the Marr essay examination, that he and the Coalition are being 'small targets', and in offering this:

"If Abbott can make it through to sometime close to polling day saying that, like Labor, he aspires to better education, fair disability reform sometime in the future, a good environment, reducing carbon emissions etc, etc - but that he won't stuff things up while achieving these goals, then the ALP's goose is truly cooked.

That's why it's Labor that really needs to pick a fight right now."

...maintaining that Abbott can continue refusing to do what he demands of Labor, in simply throwing out aspirations and predictions, and show us 'where the money's coming from'.

The Coalition is avoiding rising to the 'bait' Taylor offers as examples in her article, not because they are keeping their powder dry, but because they don't want to be caught out explaining their policies, because that will inevitably expose the Coalition-in-government as precisely what the 'bait' is previewing.

It's not small target politics, it's a 'don't say a word, then we can't be held to account' strategy, which works when your opponents are on the public nose, but won't when the public starts to use its ears and eyes.

A fake 'small target' combined with refusal to offer what it demands of the Government, how it will pay, puts Abbott and his Coalition deep into Pat Rafter's "now you're making shit up" territory.

Abbott was quite certain he could, poundingly, coast his way into government. That's not going to happen, the time's passed, the thumps of constant pounding are now sending a different message.

Where Ms Taylor is wrong, and being a journo, she would want this, is maintaining that labor needs to pick a fight "now".

Abbott's the flailing knock them down with one punch guy. Labor is doing him slow.

Abbott the bowlegged frog won't, dropped into boiling water, leap right back out of the saucepan. He'll be heated slowly, basking in the balmy warmness at first, and won't even notice as the temperature increases and the flesh begins to wrinkle and then peel off his bones.

Abbott is quite certain he has Labor's measure. The subtext of Taylor's article is that he does, too.

But Abbott told anyone who would listen he would be in The Lodge the first Christmas after the election, and then the next...

He is now one of the longest serving Leaders of the Opposition in Australian federal politics history. A longevity that most often in that same history has NOT been resolved by winning the Prime Ministership.

Julia Gillard does not 'lie down and die'. That's not her.

Abbott wanders around as if in a post car crash/Golden (Age) Gloves fight daze, doing the same thing every day, trying to alter the spell he casts over his foes by changing the wording but never the intent, displaying the classic behaviour of a concussed accident victim/flattened 'contender'. That's him.

Lenore Taylor might consider the possibility that the Coalition do not rise to Labor's bait because they have no-one with skill enough to demolish it. But plenty, from the 'leader' down, who'll endorse and expand on the warnings in it just by opening their mouths.

That frog will be bleached bones on election day.

Michael

September 29. 2012 08:02 AM

jaycee

Last nights interview with the former head of the future fund and now with the centre for Independant Studies(A far-right libertarian think[?] tank) was little more than a Mark Scott "Maaatees" moment with E Alberichi slinging some soft "Dorothy Dixers" to the interviewee!!
Come off it ABC. What do you think you are broadcasting to...A bunch of Liberal wankers?

jaycee

September 29. 2012 08:07 AM

Ad astra

Truth Seeker
Thank you for your kind remarks.

Michael
Lenore Taylor is becoming adept at backing the horse both ways.

It’s almost as if she wants to stir up a fight.  After all, when Abbott lies low, what is there to write about that’s sensational and entertaining?  It would be too bad if she had to actually analyse Government policy and express a considered opinion.

jaycee
When I saw the interview with David Murray coming up, I turned the TV off, because I could see what it was going to be. www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2012/s3600412.htm

Ad astra

September 29. 2012 08:12 AM

2353

Michael, the small target strategy isn't a bad one for the LNP.  Newman and O"Farrell had a "pillars" theme where everything they talked about was linked back to the "Four pillars" (In Newman's case - I think O"Farrell had five).  IN short the campaign was very short on specific actions they would take once in Government and long on the "feel good" factor - glossy ads, rhetoric, 30 second sound bites and so on.  Sound familiar?

The ALP do need to attack now as the party needs to demonstrate that has the insight necessary to guide the country through the GFC, natural disasters, a mining boom and bust all the time ensuring that those that need help get something - rather than the explosion in middle class welfare Howard and Costello presided over immediately prior to elections.

Recent polls would tend to suggest the trend is towards the ALP.  This demonstrates that Abbott really did "read" Windsor, Oakeschott and Wilke incorrectly.  I'm convinced Abbott and his machine  thought a "short term" (18 months or so) campaign of FUD would "convince" one or more of them to change sides causing a LNP election landslide by now.  In my opinion, the FUD campaign started to lose traction in the 2nd quarter of this year, the introduction of the Carbon Pricing System on July 1 accelerated the process (when [insert name of mining/processing town here] didn't self destruct and some in the media found the approval to challenge Abbott on a range of other issues as well.

The next 12 months will be interesting - Abbott clearly needs a new strategy.  It was reported yesterday that Rio Tinto  has been factoring a "Carbon Price" into their financial decisions for 10 years - BHP claim that the mines they are closing or not expanding has everything to do with a decline in world markets rather than domestic issues which indicates they have been pricing in carbon for years as well.  It is an easy argument to suggest in an election campaign that one of the "pillars" of the Abbott campaign is crap; so the rest probably is as well.  The biggest problem is the ALP seems to urgently find some marketing skills and move to the left to at least get the 2nd preference of those who vote Greens.

2353

September 29. 2012 08:15 AM

Ad astra

Folks
I’ve got a busy week ahead of me with a daughter and two grandchildren from Perth coming for the week, two birthday celebrations tomorrow, a grandchild’s 21st next weekend, and visits to relatives during the week.

So you won’t see a lot of me for the next week.

Tomorrow I’ll post another piece from the Rollison family, this time from Kay Rollison, Victoria’s mother.  It aligns well with the current piece.  It’s titled: ”Ronald Reagan, you were wrong”.

We’re leaving soon for Melbourne to pick up our daughter and grandchildren at the airport.  I’ll try to take a look at the site during the day on the iPad, and I’ll be back this evening.

Ad astra

September 29. 2012 08:32 AM

jaycee

I do think the Govt' paying out Mr.Ashby was a "If it looks too good to be true..." moment...Sure, they have got one nusiance off the books but it was certain he ("He" being the LNP.) would come back at them for some more mileage.
Ashby, himself is a patsy..a thing even HE either doesn't realise or is being put "on a promise" for a greater reward.
The fact that Brandis, that excuse for a boost in sales of "Sorbent toilet tissues"(probably gets a kickback!), is wheeled out to offer "legal advice" (Talk about "The Castle" legal team!)shows how vexatious this saga will be. Mind you, Labor neither wins nor loses with Slipper getting shafted, but one thing I have learnt over the years when embroiled in a dirty street-fight...if you get your opponent on the dirt...NEVER, NEVER let him get up!

jaycee

September 29. 2012 08:44 AM

jaycee

AA. very informative article..however, I believe the point being missed in our debates is the Right-wings use and abuse of post-modernist principles. The disinformation and obfuscation of LNP. policies is a deliberate move to allow change and backflip closer to and in the event of winning the election.
This strategy of splitting and fragmenting positions on the major policies of Labor (NBN. NDIS. MRRT. etc) allows Mr.Abbott movement to chop and change without committing to formed policy...in other words, he cannot be held to acount on a many varied position...then, like Cambell Newman, can implement any policy after an election because he never REALLY held a set policy BEFORE the election.
Postmodernism is the perfect tool for the dexterous machinations of capitalist/economic rationalist political parties.  

jaycee

September 29. 2012 09:51 AM

Lyn

Good Morning Ad & Everybody,

Wishing you a happy day with your family.

Twitterverse for you:-

Denise ‏
So Lenore Taylor doesn't have a problem with Abbott erroneously spruiking 80% price rises in electricity bills due to carbon pricing?

Gillard returns in hope of UN seat, Phillip Coorey
The Age reported yesterday that one factor weighing against Australia's bid has been the negativity of the Coalition.

Senior sources familiar with the lobbying say the attitude of Australia's alternative government is being used by the nation's rivals to argue Australia is not properly committed.

Opposition Leader Tony Abbott maintained his criticism yesterday, saying Ms Gillard would be better engaged talking to Indonesia about boat people.

Mr Abbott brushed aside suggestions that his attitude was hurting the nation's chances.

''If we can't beat Luxembourg, there's something wrong, frankly,'' he said.
m.theage.com.au/.../...un-seat-20120928-26r2y.html

Stephen C ‏
Hahaha Abbott insults Luxembourg... What a wanker

Aspirational Geek‏
Breaking: Luxembourg recalls ambassador after Mr Abbott's insulting remarks & plan to use Security Council seat to sanction Australia.

The Daily Telegraph‏
Sex case against Slipper proceeds: JAMES Ashby will press ahead with his sexual harassment claim against Speaker... http://bit.ly/SJE6zl

JAMES Ashby will press ahead with his sexual harassment claim against Speaker Peter Slipper after settling his dispute with the federal government, which has so far spent more than $700,000 fighting the case.

ACCC silences the knockers with million-dollar win
Neighbourhood Energy and Australian Green Credits have been fined a total of $1 million for not leaving people's homes when asked, ignoring do-not-knock stickers and making misleading and deceptive statements.
www.abc.net.au/.../4285902?section=business

John Pratt‏
When enough is enough - life is for living The aged pension is a great leveller. #auspolhttp://www.theage.com.au/business/-26rga.html

Chris Ogilvie ‏
Will Abbott, newman, Jones, Bolt and MSM call this man a liar a rogue?: Rio Tinto sees man-made climate change www.smh.com.au/.../...e-change-20120928-26pr8.html via @smh

A debate about Labor that’s actually worth having, Laurie Oakes
www.thepunch.com.au/.../

John Pratt‏
“ Tony Abbott talks down Australia again as Gillard returns in hope of UN seat www.theage.com.au/.../...-seat-20120928-26r2y.html via @theage” #auspol

Greg McKenna‏
This is truly a disgrace for the Ofarrell Government - It's not your home it belongs to a developer now www.theage.com.au/.../...r-now-20120927-26msd.html via @theage

Taxing issues for voters
Reform-shy Canberra Liberals need to explain how they will collect enough revenue to pay for essential services.
www.canberratimes.com.au/.../...0120928-26qlm.html

A prime minister who embodies the best of Labor,Steve Bracks
ANYONE who believes federal Labor is not a reformist government is deluding themselves. Just think for a moment about the policy reform agenda under Prime Minister Julia Gillard during this term of office

This federal government will go down as one of Australia's most reformist governments. It is a government that has managed Australia's economy and fiscal position better than almost any other country. A government that has given back the proceeds of this economic growth through progressive social policies. And, of course, it is a government that has done all this without a majority in either the House of Representatives or the Senate. It is truly a government that has embodied Labor's reform tradition.
www.theage.com.au/.../...labor-20120928-26r29.html

It figures why Abbott doesn't want to look at the bigger picture , George Megalogenis
The sense on both sides is the next election will be closer than most pundits have allowed for. This raises two obvious problems. If the frontrunner Abbott can't win in a landslide, his track record tells us he will err on the side of more spending commitments between now and the real poll. This raises the stakes for the first Joe Hockey budget. What is often overlooked in the retelling of Peter Costello's 1996 budget cuts is the task was made harder than it needed to be because he was closing both a Labor deficit and paying for the Coalition's unfunded election promises.

The second problem is the Senate. If Abbott doesn't get control of the upper house, he doesn't get a quick kill on the carbon tax. Abbott won't back down, of course. Pride would compel him to waste the nation's time in quixotic pursuit of a tax that wasn't as toxic as he had predicted. But the carbon tax may well remain "L.A.W. law".

Abbott's pitch doesn't ring true, but not because he is the sexist thug of Labor's imagination. He troubles voters for the simple reason that he offers more of the same - a leader easily panicked by polls, who thinks he can buy his way to victory.

www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-e6frg7ex-1226483581485
SmileSmileSmile

Lyn

September 29. 2012 10:30 AM

Ad astra

Hi Lyn
I've had a quick look at your always-interesting Twitterverse.  Thank you.

We are now getting on the road to Melbourne.   Back this evening.

Ad astra

September 29. 2012 11:34 AM

Gravel

Lyn

You are a living treasure.  The article from Bracks was spot on.  That is exactly how I see the history of this government will be written once all the political rubbish has been flushed away.  Hopefully we will have another term to cement all the actions in place and embark on more good policy's.

Ad Astra

Have a great week with your family.

Oh and a big Happy Birthday to Julia today.  I hope she has a lovely relaxing day.

Gravel

September 29. 2012 02:46 PM

Casablanca

Michael said of Abbott

‘He is now one of the longest serving Leaders of the Opposition in Australian federal politics history. A longevity that most often in that same history has NOT been resolved by winning the Prime Ministership’.

It’s nice to reflect that today, on the occasion of her 51st birthday, Julia Gillard has been Prime Minister for 2 years and 97 days.

On or about 14 January 2013, Julia Gillard will have equalled Kevin Rudd's time in office. (2 years and 204 days) and become the 16th longest serving Australian Prime Minister.

If, as is most likely, this Parliament goes full-term, Ms Gillard, Australia’s 27th Prime Minister, will have leap-frogged over the likes of Sir Edmund Barton ( 2 years, 267 days); Gough Whitlam (2 years, 342 days); Andrew Fisher (3 years, 57 days); and Sir John Gorton (3 years, 60 days) to become the 11th longest serving Prime Minister. Hopefully, Julia Gillard will gain the opportunity to leap-frog over a few more following the election in late 2013.  The signs are good.

Tanja Kovac’s article, ‘Happy ending or not, Gillard a heroine in political sphere: It's no fairy princess tale; the Prime Minister has done the hard yards’ is worth reading again for the catalogue of Ms Gillard’s achievements.

Read more: www.smh.com.au/.../...campaign-20120823-24o31.html

The time in the top office data are from en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prime_Minister_of_Australia

Casablanca

September 29. 2012 03:18 PM

nasking


An informative read Ad that spells out well the differences between the major parties.

Note that the first paragraph begins with laudable principles, but even before it ends, there is trenchant criticism of Labor – in Liberal Party policy! And the censure goes on through the next two paragraphs, reflecting the Coalition’s incessant negativity towards the Government, which it cannot even keep out of its own policy statements.

I don't think I've ever come across an Opposition that is sooo negative...they distort, exaggerate, insult, bully, mock and spin so much I can only assume that Rupert Murdoch's news' empire and certain shock jocks have had a great deal of influence on the present Coalition...as they have the American Republican party.

They are now paying the price for such negativity...and I believe the fact they have catered to extremists and the constant harping negative and BSing aspects of the tabloid media, this will lead them down a path to electoral disasters.

They take the public for being mugs. After awhile the voters wake up to the deceit...and tire of the constant negativity and adolescent ranting...and punish those who have tried to dupe them.

At this present time I see the Republicans as that 'Mad, mad, mad party'.

The Coalition are well on the way with the likes of Tony Abbott as head clown...Barnaby Joyce as his bull in a China shop...Senator Bernardi as the escaped loon from the clown asylum...Sophie Mirabella, Kevin Andrews, and the rest of the motley crew.

Sad and worrying state of affairs.

N'

nasking

September 29. 2012 03:28 PM

nasking


Ad,
have an enjoyable time with yer family.

Thnx to Lyn and others for the valuable links.

Been extremely busy of late...my wife Stacey has now returned home from the hospital after her operation three days ago and I am buzzing around like a busy bee as she cannot do anything but shuffle around for the next few weeks. I'm so pleased to have her home safe and spoiling her all I can. Such a relief...real anxious time building up to that big op.

I've been popping in a reading when I can...and tried to keep up to date with news via my Facebook site:

www.facebook.com/nick.king.1232760?ref=tn_tnmn

Alas, downloading ios6 on my iPad was a big mistake now I realise as I can't load and play any Youtube vids (not even those on Facebook or via Google)...and have huge WiFI connectivity problems...keeps dropping out...particularly before 9am...very frustrating.

Bad stuff Apple.

Cheers
N'

nasking

September 29. 2012 03:30 PM

Todd

I guess I really shouldn't be surprised but the conservatives politically motivated attitude towards Australias UN security council bid is surely a new low, even by Abbotts snake- belly low standard.
Knowing that this grub is secretly cheering on Luxembourg over his own country just so he can try score another cheap shot at Gillard proves what an unfit person he is for the office of PM.

Todd

September 29. 2012 04:08 PM

Patriciawa

Thanks for the suggestion re Tanja Kovac's article, Casablanca.

You are so right.  It's a great article and one that should be shared as widely as possible by way of celebration on this her birthday, and any other day too for that matter!

  Gillard's rise to power is a much more complex story than a few hours before the leadership coup. It encompasses a long march through the boysy culture of law, unions and politics; the non-choices between children and career; and institutionalised, denigrating chauvinism.

In the past few weeks, she has reminded us why Labor entrusted her with leadership. She is a fighter; a woman who rises against the odds; can lose her much-loved father and turn up for work ready for the battle of her life. She's a Labor success story, with a plot twist or two yet to tell.  

Read more: www.brisbanetimes.com.au/.../...0120918-264i9.html

Patriciawa

September 29. 2012 05:16 PM

Lyn

Hi Gravel

Thankyou for your nice words.  Yes Steve Bracks article is a delightful read such a change from all the negative knocking day in and day out.

Nasking glad to hear your wife is doing ok, she has a good caring husband to look after her.  Give my best wishes to Stacey.

With reference to your problem with your Ipad, my Ipad is fairly new so I am not that experienced.  

I had quite a lot of trouble connecting to the internet in the beginning & found Apple to be efficient friendly kind and extremely helpful.  

I purchased their maintenance insurance for future problems, but they provide 3 months service for free.

Apple number is 13622 option 3 goes through Telstra.

NormanK may be able to help you with a few tips.

Todd I agree it is not surprising the Coalition's attitude to the UN Council after all they were too envious of Wayne Swan to say "Congratulations".

Casablanca thankyou, you are always so informative and thankyou for your links up above.

Michael  I love reading your posts in particular when you answer back or mash up the journalists.  Your post this morning @ 7.2am was fabulous.

Jaycee your posts are always fabulous too, most enjoyable.

Hi Patricia, I hope you have mended enough to get back to reasonable normality. Kiss

SmileSmileSmileSmileSmile

Lyn

September 29. 2012 06:20 PM

jaycee

Can you imagine Bob Katter and Barnaby Joyce!!!!!
"Nice hat, Bob".
"Nice mixed metaphors, Barns".
What's that comedy line by Abbott and Costello?...."There's the shovel...take your pick!"...Barnaby and Bob..what a duo!

jaycee

September 29. 2012 08:01 PM

nasking


Lyn,
thnx for yer best wishes...I'll pass them onto Stacey.

We just watched a recording of The Hamster Wheel as we were at the hospital when it first showed...extremely funny...loved the Gina Rinehart and Waterhouse skits.

They also showed the MSM's double standards when it comes to "uprisings" (I didn't even hear about that out of control party in WA where the police were pelted)...I guess the party-goers weren't wearing Muslim gear...just hoodies and baseball caps...nothing to fear there. Those beer cans and bottles musta been made from styrofoam...nothing to worry about there.


N'

nasking

September 29. 2012 08:05 PM

nasking


Can you imagine Bob Katter and Barnaby Joyce!!!!!


jaycee,
Yesss...

the Member for Kennedy...and the Member for Anywhere That Will Have Me So I Can Get A Lower House Seat.

N'

nasking

September 29. 2012 08:28 PM

Patriciawa

Thanks, Lyn!   Yes I am well again.   I was signed off by my surgeon last week.  Almost 100% except for a few things like swimming with the outwards kick and climbing up stairs easily.
Not writing as much as before.  Too much time at the  desk and I find my knee seizing up.  I hope that changes because I worry about the old grey cells doing the same because of inactivity!  Mind you,  I have had you keeping me from mental inertia with your daily Links providing required reading first thing every day with my coffee in bed. Thank you for that.

But it's great to be up, mobile and independent again.  All much sooner than I imagined.   I wanted to say to Nasking and Stacey to hang in there and follow doctor's orders.  Time passes and the body heals.   I am sure that having him there to support her will be a big help in her convalescence.  I found the moral support of family and friends a big help in keeping me from lapsing into self pity.  Good luck, Stacey!

Patriciawa

September 29. 2012 08:39 PM

nasking


Patricia,
thnx for the supportive words. I just read them out to Stacey who really appreciated them.

Great to hear yoy are improving too. We need the great poetess in top form for the upcoming election.

Almost three months on and none of Abbott's prophecies have been fulfilled. The cobra has not struck, nor the python squeezed, but he is still foretelling doom.

Patricia,
he is a silly, desperate man who does not deserve leadership.

Cheers

N'

nasking

September 29. 2012 08:42 PM

nasking


Should be: Great to hear you are improving too...

I can't wait to get that laser surgery.

Tired of looking thru a thick fog.

N'

nasking

September 29. 2012 08:46 PM

nasking



Yes Steve Bracks article is a delightful read such a change from all the negative knocking day in and day out.

Lyn,
indeed...Steve Bracks is a top bloke...I wish he'd run for federal parliament...he'd make a great senator, like Bob Carr.

Thnx for the Apple no...I'll give them a ring.

All the best,
N'

nasking

September 29. 2012 09:30 PM

Casablanca

Another Abbort Gottcha that the MSM missed. Phil Coorey reported without censure or comment www.theage.com.au/.../...-seat-20120928-26r2y.html that Abbort brushed aside suggestions that his attitude was hurting Australia's UN Security Council bid with the following remark:

'If we can't beat Luxembourg, there's something wrong, frankly.'

That would be the same Luxembourg that in 2011, according to the IMF and The World Bank, was the second richest country in the world, with a per capita GDP on a purchasing-power parity (PPP) basis of $80,119. (Australia was ranked 14th by the IMF with a GDP (PPP) of $40,234  and 16th  by the World Bank with a GDP(PPP) of $39,466).

The same Luxembourg that is a member of the European Union, NATO, OECD, the United Nations, and Benelux.

The Luxembourg that is also the seat of several institutions and agencies of the EU, including the European Court of Justice, the European Court of Auditors, the Statistical Office of the European Communities ("Eurostat") and The Secretariat of the European Parliament.

By his own admission, Mr Abbott is no Bill Gates so he would not understand why Luxembourg has a modern and widely deployed optical fibre and cable networks throughout the country. As we know, Mr Abbott has directed his Shadow Minister, Malcolm Turnbull, to destroy the NBN.

Luxembourg ranks 2nd in the world in the development of the Information and Communication Technologies in the ITU ICT Development Index (Australia is ranked 14th) www.itu.int/.../MIS2011-ExceSum-E.pdf  and 8th in the Global Broadband Quality Study 2009 by the University of Oxford and the University of Oviedo(Australia was ranked 13th). The research team found that broadband quality is linked to a nation’s advancement as a knowledge economy and countries with broadband on their national agenda had the highest broadband quality. www.sbs.ox.ac.uk/.../Results.aspx

Luxembourg’s  historic and strategic importance dates back to its founding as a Roman era fortress and Frankish count's castle site in the Early Middle Ages. Luxembourg was the first city to be named European Capital of Culture twice. It has three official languages, French, German and Luxembourgish.

Hey, Mr Abbott, let me couch this in simple language for you: Luxembourg has long had octopus-like tentacles into many high level International institutions and European countries. Luxembourg is a Python that could squeeze Australia out of contention for the Bronze Medal of the UN Security Council, especially when you, Mr Abbott, continue to make cobra-like verbal strikes against our national interest.

Casablanca

September 29. 2012 09:37 PM

Casablanca

Lyn and Patricia,

Thank you for your appreciative comments. May I reiterate my thanks for your respective splendid Links and poems and comments.

Casablanca

September 29. 2012 09:48 PM

NormanK

Casablanca

What a brilliant comment. Thank-you, I knew almost none of that about Luxembourg.
Without wishing to appear to teach you how to suck eggs, are you aware that under the 'Contact Us' link at the bottom of an Age article there is the option of another link where you can provide 'Article Feedback'? It might be an arrow fired into the air but who knows, it could land on Coorey's desk. Worth a shot I reckon.

NormanK

September 29. 2012 10:27 PM

Libbyx33

Hi Ad Smile
Great article! Very apt!
Hope you have a lovely time with your family.
Also, I apologise for not getting back to your e-mail...long story.

2353

www.abc.net.au/7.30/content/2012/s3530737.htm

(I'm sorry, I don't know how to make this a hyperlink - and I, too, heard the same from Marius Kloppers on BHP, but couldn't find the link)

PETER VOSER: Well let me first say that Shell as a company is actually very much advocating that we need a price for carbon on a worldwide basis and we want that to be on a market mechanism. So for years actually Shell has included in all their projects a carbon price of $40 a tonne, so from that point of view we take a very long-term view that the carbon will be priced and needs therefore to be covered in our profitability in the projects.

LEIGH SALES: You say that you've factored in a price of $40 a tonne. Do you think then that Australia is underpricing carbon?

PETER VOSER: I think if you have a market mechanism, it would actually be established by the market. If I look today across the world, I think you don't have too many who would be above that price of the Australian price at this stage, but as I said, we take a 20, 30 years view and over that time we will judge on how our $40 will match all the countries where we are investing into.


The cheek of the Noalition!

Libbyx33

September 29. 2012 10:40 PM

NormanK

I imagine people are going ballistic over this on social media.
Alan Jones - Queen of the Trolls

Alan Jones says Julia Gillard's dad 'died of shame'
by Jonathan Marshall     The Sunday Telegraph

"The old man recently died a few weeks ago of shame," Mr Jones told a group of party members and MPs, including Alex Hawke, Ray Williams and Sussan Ley.

"To think that he had a daughter who told lies every time she stood for parliament.

"Every person in the caucus of the Labor Party knows that Julia Gillard is a liar."

**********

Yesterday, Mr Dore
[event organiser and aspiring MP] said Mr Jones had not made the comments about Ms Gillard's father. Later, informed there was a recording of the speech, his position changed.

"It was a very long speech and I did not hear it. I have always found Alan to be respectful," Mr Dore said.

He said there was "no need" to "pick apart Alan's speech. All you are doing is reducing it to a very small thing which distracts from the issues facing Australia".

www.dailytelegraph.com.au/.../story-e6freuy9-1226484128451

NormanK

September 29. 2012 11:25 PM

Libbyx33

NormanK,
That is surely THE most vile thing ever to come out of that grubby sexist pig's mouth EVER! No one should ever have to hear that, let alone a grieving daughter & her ma & sis.
Really, really disgusting! :-(

Libbyx33

September 29. 2012 11:46 PM

nasking


Imagine the pain this will cause Julia Gillard, our PM's mother? Doesn't surprise me it's in The Australian...the disgusting tabloid Murdoch empire...playing games to get viewers...and money...to spread their sick virus.

Allan Jones wants the attention...he craves it...he wants to get an ALP bashing message out...a Gillard bashing message...to try and grab men voters' attention...

this is gonna backfire bigtime...

Jones is a disgrace because he gets paid so much to bullshit and spread hate...

and doesn't mind going over the crazy edge to try and convince his audience to vote against their own interests..

But more and more we see he's an integral part of the MAD, MAD, MAD COALITION...a party of desperate loons and 'anything goes' extremists.

Time for a change.

Enuff strikes...JONES IS OUT!!!

N'

nasking

September 29. 2012 11:51 PM

NormanK

Libbyx33

I'm trying to follow events as they unfold on Twitter and Facebook but as I'm not signed up (nor particularly interested in doing so) I am doing it through Poll Bludger. It would seem that social media has gone into meltdown over this with fresh campaigns to contact Jones' sponsors and 2GB.

Not for the first time, words fail me with regard to how to describe Jones' comments. He's a grub.
Fingers crossed that this time he may have been caught out.

NormanK

September 29. 2012 11:54 PM

nasking



Mr Jones made several mentions about why Liberal leader Tony Abbott should be Australia's next PM.

"His overweening weakness is his humility. You will never ever hear this bloke argue his ability, his virtue, or indeed his competence," he said.

"He is a man of incomparable integrity and conviction."

The broadcaster said it was vital every member of Mr Abbott's party united behind their leader in the lead-up to the election. Mr Jones said some members of the Labor caucus were scared of the Liberal leader and others thought he was sexist.

Yesterday Mr Jones did not respond to approaches from The Sunday Telegraph.

The event was staged by Sydney University Liberal Club president and aspiring MP Alex Dore. Mr Jones has endorsed his political endeavours.

Yesterday, Mr Dore said Mr Jones had not made the comments about Ms Gillard's father. Later, informed there was a recording of the speech, his position changed.

"It was a very long speech and I did not hear it. I have always found Alan to be respectful," Mr Dore said.


www.heraldsun.com.au/.../story-fndo317g-1226484128451


Jones is the kind of sick grubby character the Coalition use these days to support Tony Abbott...and motivate and educats Young Liberals.

Menzies would roll in his grave.

This will be another nail in the Abbott team coffin.

All fair-minded, decent, socially moderate Liberals should be ashamed of where Abbott & Jones & Bernardi & Mirabella and others have taken this once great party.

Turnbull shoulda done the right thing and gone to the backbench ages ago.

N'

nasking

September 30. 2012 12:01 AM

NormanK

Anyone interested in letting Jones' sponsors know how you feel, here is a list courtesy of Destroy the Joint:

sales@icoolm.com.au, admin@jjmetrowest.com.au, andre@hollywoodbathrooms.com.au, info@harrispartners.com.au, info@grace.com.au, enquiries@harringtonkitchens.com.au, sales@fixatap.com.au,info@waterfordretirementvillage.com.au, info@statecustodians.com.au, sales@renovationboys.com.au, info@parknfly.com.au, info@livenation.com.au, sales@lexusofparramatta.com.au, info@kennedyhealthcare.com.au


Destroy the Joint:
http://www.facebook.com/DestroyTheJoint

NormanK

September 30. 2012 12:01 AM

nasking


I was going to order from Woolworths again this weekend for a Monday delivery...we love their croissants and raisin & oat cookies...but not now after reading this:

During the five-hour event, three spoof songs were sung by Young Liberals member Simon Berger, Woolworths' government realtions manager.

www.heraldsun.com.au/.../story-fndo317g-1226484128451

nasking

September 30. 2012 12:11 AM

nasking




How do bitter horrible agro grumpy dudes like Allan Jones get so big?

...guess they have rich bigwig media supporters like John Singleton...

and pollies like Howard and Abbott supporting them.

Some willing to coverup the gross elements and pay him handsomely for spreading gossip and hate.

Time for a change in the media landscape.

N'

nasking

September 30. 2012 12:22 AM

nasking


Norman,
thnx for the contacts...I've put yer message up on my Facebook site.

Hope others do same.

Allan Jones is a disgrace.

Poor PM Gillard and her Mum and the rest of the family...at this sad sad time of mourning for them.

Jones has NO RIGHT to say how Mr. Gillard felt.

He loved his daughter deeply...was obviously very proud of her...our first ever female PM.

Some misogynists living in the 50s and 40s and 30s in their heads just can't handle the fact a woman is finally PM...after how many men in a row?

Just like so many semi-racists and others in America who still can't their head around there being a Black President in America...after how many white presidents in a row?

Get over it dudes.

This is the 21st Century.

WAKE UP

N'

nasking

September 30. 2012 12:25 AM

nasking



Should be:

Just like so many semi-racists and others in America who still can't get their heads around there being a Black President in America...after how many white presidents in a row?

N'

nasking

September 30. 2012 12:34 AM

nasking



More on the desperate ever ATTENTION-SEEKING Murdoch empire:

Man Commits Suicide Live On Fox News After Car Chase In Phoenix

www.huffingtonpost.com/.../...se-tv_n_1925107.html

Not good enuff.

Roger Ailles and his team are a disgrace.

Phone hacking not enuff for Rupert and his family corporation? Now this too.

And the Tea Party economic vandals...and Obama birther movement hate.

And spreading gossip, hate...fearmongering...yes...Allan Jones and Bolt and Ackerman and Bernardi and Abbott and Barnaby's hate and exaggerations and fearmongering in Australia.

And climate change denialist crap.

And promoting Bush's unpaid for and destructive wars.

Time for a change in the media landscape.

N'

nasking

September 30. 2012 12:43 AM

nasking



More...how could people in the Liberal audience laugh at Jones' abusive comment? What has the Liberal party become?

Reminds me of the Republican debate audience who laughed about a gay soldier's misfortune. The right-wing have become callous to the extreme.


“The old man recently died a few weeks ago of shame. To think that he had a daughter who told lies every time she stood for parliament.”

Gasps and shocked laughter from members of the audience can be heard on the recording.

www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-e6frg6n6-1226484516814

N'

nasking

September 30. 2012 12:50 AM

nasking



THERE are calls for a boycott of radio station 2GB over remarks by broadcaster Alan Jones that the Prime Minister's father, John Gillard, had ''died of shame''.


Attendees at the function were running for cover last night, with two leading Liberal Party members telling The Sun-Herald they had not heard the comments, despite listening to Jones's entire 50-minute speech.

State Liberal MP Ray Williams told The Sun-Herald: ''It was a loud room and a long speech. I recall Julia Gillard being mentioned but not John Gillard.''

Young Liberal President Simon Fontana, a staffer for Community Services Minister Pru Goward, also insisted he did not hear any claim that John Gillard had died of shame.


Last year Jones said of Ms Gillard: ''I'm putting her into a chaff bag and hoisting her into the Tasman Sea.''
Jones has also claimed her behaviour in imposing the carbon price ''borders on the treasonous'', and has agreed with with one of his callers regarding Ms Gillard: ''Yeah, that's it. Bring back the guillotine!''

Mr Gillard, 83, whom the Prime Minister described as her ''inspiration'', died in Adelaide earlier this month after a long illness.


''Above all, he taught me to love learning and to understand its power to change lives,'' Ms Gillard said. ''He always regretted his family background meant he had not proceeded on to higher education as a young man. He was determined that I had the opportunities he was denied. I will miss him for the rest of my life.''

www.brisbanetimes.com.au/.../...0120930-26sy0.html

I really feel for the PM, her Mum and family tonite.

I bet the Libs are running for cover...gutless extremist loving insensitive dickheads and scumbags.

N'

nasking

September 30. 2012 12:58 AM

nasking


Remember this?:

Obama Reacts To GOP Debate Audience Booing Gay Soldier

First Posted: 09/26/2011

At the Fox News/Google GOP debate last week, Stephen Hill, a gay soldier in Iraq, said he had to "lie about who [he] was" to serve in the military up until the recent repeal of "don't ask, don't tell." In his recorded question, he asked the GOP presidential hopefuls if they would work to walk back the recent change in policy.

When the question was presented to the candidates participating in the event, some members of the audience booed loudly.

See what happens Tony Abbott when mainstream parties cater to insensitive, bigoted extremists?

N'

nasking

September 30. 2012 01:04 AM

nasking


Sorry,
link here:

www.huffingtonpost.com/.../...debate_n_981136.html

N'

nasking

September 30. 2012 01:07 AM

nasking


From Cafe Whispers:

Can Alan Jones stoop any lower?


cafewhispers.wordpress.com/.../

N'

nasking

September 30. 2012 01:22 AM

Libbyx33

NormanK,
Thank you for that list of e-mail addresses - all have received an eye-watering (though polite) e-mail from me, as has 2GB. You may request a copy (but I'll have to edit my details out, so it may take a while - I wish I was more techo-minded lol). And thank you for putting me onto the site Destroy The Joint. I've only just had a quick see, & it looks like something to ponder in depth. Well done for following stuff on that blog in real time - I also have no twitter, etc.

nasking,
Time for a change in the media landscape.

I totally agree! Whole-heartedly!
OT - am I mistaken or did I see reference to you living in the Logan, Qld area? If it's true, I also find myself wide awake, yearning for "politics" and spoiling for a (figurative)fight. I think it's too quiet since the bikies left town, lol, not that they were doing anything other than blocking the drive-thru so I could stock up on grandfinal beer! Could also be the rain!
And great game of AFL - congrats to the victors, Sydney Swans. Good luck to the Storm & Bulldogs for the NRL grand final - may the best team win, and may the ref's stay out of it!
"Wink

Libbyx33

September 30. 2012 01:32 AM

Casablanca

Jaycee @ September 29. 2012 08:02 AM

I agree wholeheartedly with your comments about the Emma Alberici interview with David Murray. The interview was a barely concealed piece of free advertising for the Coalition.

Alberici actually has a background in economics and finance reporting but she gave a very soft interview.

Casablanca

September 30. 2012 02:11 AM

nasking



am I mistaken or did I see reference to you living in the Logan, Qld area?

Libbyx33,
spot on.

We live in Waterford West...and lovin' it. So peaceful here. Lots of places to walk...lots of birds and natives. Mornings are superb.

I enjoy goin' to the shops and chattin' to the workers, small business shop owners...and Stacey often runs into friendly students/ex-students and staff from her school...nice place to live.

The media oft try to give us a bad rap because of the odd bad apple. Stuff them...it's a top place to live...and gettin' better by the year.

And our mayor Pam Parker is doin' a fine job.

It's great access here to my wife's family in Beaudesert and Greenbank...and easy to get to Springwood, Logan Hyperdome, Grand Plaza at Browns Plains, Mt. Tambo (Tambourine)...the coast, freeway etc...

whilst our house is across the road from bush...our own paradise with a big garden.

Oneday I hope they give our area even more of a heartbeat with the addition of more ethnic restaurants, a shopping centre with cafes and bakeries...and a big hardware store (we do hit Bunnings but closer would be nicer)...and some shops like Target.

Still, we luv it here. Reasonable rates too.

N'

nasking

September 30. 2012 02:14 AM

nasking


And we'd luv to get the NBN.

N'

nasking

September 30. 2012 02:27 AM

Todd

Alan Jones is an utter low-life.
His comments about Julia Gillards father are the words I would expect from a sad, dirty old man who lurks late at night around a London public toilet, not what I would expect from a 'respected' broadcaster.
................oh wait, I mean...............

Todd

September 30. 2012 02:32 AM

Libbyx33

nasking,
I hear you RE the NBN - my computer's not the latest model, but it's so darned slow at times, even just refreshing this page (dunno how to do that rss feed thingy??).

I'd LOVE an authentic Lebanese restraunt - kebab shops don't cut it lol!

I also LOVE the area we live in. I'm in Eagleby, and a nicer community you couldn't meet. And characters, we have may lovely ones! The only drawback really is a) we live on a main drag (hoon-heaven some nights) and b) the bloody gutters are always full of leaves! Loving the rain tonight tho!

Sadly, we had to have our 2 elderly, sick dogs (humanely) euthanased about 3 months ago, but their water bowl is still filled every day for the plovers, baby magpies & bush turkeys - they know they can always find water here, free from predators.

Would be nice if humans could also always find a safe place to take heed, yes?

L

Libbyx33

September 30. 2012 02:42 AM

Casablanca

Fear the politicians of the future
Ellena Savage September 27, 2012

Abbott is right to point to inexperience and immaturity driving the 'silly' behaviour of student pollies. But we should take note that these bullies are there to cut their teeth for state or federal politics later in their careers. Where they are not held accountable for their indiscretions, their histories follow them into parliament.

Politicians of all ages should be held to higher standards than the rest of us, because the rest of us do not purport to represent collective values and act on such preposterous claims.

Student politicians continue to punch walls in front of each other, plot to smear their peers, and generally create atmospheres of humiliation and harassment for their own political gain. Yes, the smaller the gain, the dirtier the fight. And these people, they are our future. So be afraid.


www.eurekastreet.com.au/article.aspx?aeid=33422  

Casablanca

September 30. 2012 07:55 AM

Michael

Alan Jones speaks for the Liberal Party and its oh so humble 'leader'.

His message from the back room just puts into public what Abbott and company bellow in Parliament, signal with their faces and body language in the wider world, insinuate into every statement about 'bad government'.

Neurotic, ugly, small-minded and vicious. That's Jones, that's Abbott's Coalition, that's what an Abbott-led government (it will never be an Abbott-led Australia, be he in The Lodge or not) will epitomise.

Luxembourg is laughing.

Michael

September 30. 2012 08:28 AM

nasking


Allen West - Republican in Florida: Voting and quotes on issues record:

Prohibit federal funding to groups like Planned Parenthood. (Jan 2011)

Voted YES on barring EPA from regulating greenhouse gases. (Apr 2011)

Voted YES on the Ryan Budget: Medicare choice, tax & spending cuts. (Apr 2011)

Voted YES on repealing the "Prevention and Public Health" slush fund. (Apr 2011)

Opposes public option for health insurance. (Nov 2010)

Redefine "birthright citizenship" to exclude illegal aliens. (Jan 2011)

Supports eliminating the estate tax. (Nov 2010)

Voted YES on terminating funding for National Public Radio. (Mar 2011)

Voted NO on removing US armed forces from Afghanistan. (Mar 2011)
(On the Issues)

West comes across as intolerant and too intrusive when it comes to women's rights. Not forward thinking. War has obviously traumatised him into far too rigid positions. More bikies like West need to be more flexible on issues...stop thinking in an angry, war-mongering, fearful, backward looking way. A real turnoff for many women and progressives who love their bikes but are wary of gangs and over-the-top Christian bikers who act like intolerant crusaders.

N'

nasking

September 30. 2012 08:34 AM

nasking



Interesting.

Fox News using Rasmussen polls this morning to call American election a "tight race"..."in the margin of error":

Wikipedia: TIME has described Rasmussen Reports as a "conservative-leaning polling group".

According to Charles Franklin, a University of Wisconsin political scientist who co-developed Pollster.com, “He [Rasmussen] polls less favorably for Democrats, and that’s why he’s become a lightning rod." Franklin also said: "It’s clear that his results are typically more Republican than the other person’s results.”

The Center For Public Integrity listed "Scott Rasmussen Inc" as a paid consultant for the 2004 George W. Bush campaign.

The Washington Post reported that the 2004 Bush reelection campaign had used a feature on the Rasmussen Reports website that allowed customers to program their own polls, and that Rasmussen asserted that he had not written any of the questions nor assisted Republicans.

Rasmussen has received criticism over the wording in its polls.

Asking a polling question with different wording can affect the results of the poll; the commentators in question allege that the questions Rasmussen ask in polls are skewed in order to favor a specific response. For instance, when Rasmussen polled whether Republican voters thought Rush Limbaugh was the leader of their party, the specific question they asked was: "Agree or Disagree: 'Rush Limbaugh is the leader of the Republican Party -- he says jump and they say how high.'"

Talking Points Memo has questioned the methodology of Rasmussen's Presidential Approval Index.

In March 2012, Media Matters for America criticized Rasmussen Reports for portraying itself as politically independent while headlining two Republican fundraising events.

(Wikipedia)


Fox News...we distort...you deride.

N'

nasking

September 30. 2012 08:44 AM

2353

Libbyx33 - thats for the additional link (which did work) about Shell - this blog software does do some clever things!

I'd also like to thank Alan Jones.  Yes, you read it right.  Let me explain before throwing the rotten eggs.

Jones made one of his regular comments about Gillard.  Up until now, these comments are usually laughed off by a lot of the media (especially NewsCorp) - including the chad bag comment last year.  THIS ONE WASN'T.  First of all News paid to get someone in the room on the quiet so they must have been aware of previous form in this regard.  Secondly the person in the room records the conversation.  Thirdly they ask both Jone and the organiser for comment; Jones doesn't reply, the organiser claims it never happened - yes that phrase was used deliberately - until advised there is a recording of the speech then the organiser claims he didn't hear it; and this is all reported on the News websites and page 2 of the Brisvegas Sunday Mail.

The reporting of this comment will strengthen some of Jones spear carriers but lets face it they would never vote ALP or support anything that Gillard would do anyway.  The rest of us (which is a far larger majority) would be horrified that someone would think along these lines let alone say it out loud and treat Jones with the contempt he so obviously deserves as well as questioning the morals of the group that asked him to speak.

I don't have the time this morning (already in trouble for holding everyone up) but yes - send emails to his advertisers (while a Brisbane City resident complaining to Parramatta Lexus won't do much good, an email to Lexus Australia as well as Toyota who own Lexus might) and so on to add to the others they are no doubt getting.  It would also be an interesting exercise to delve into Jones family and make similar comparisons and put them to Jones and others in an email.  See how I go over the next couple of days.

2353

September 30. 2012 08:56 AM

nasking


I hear you RE the NBN - my computer's not the latest model, but it's so darned slow at times, even just refreshing this page (dunno how to do that rss feed thingy??).

Libbyx33,
can relate...

BTW, even tho my wife's uncle has Telstra fibre optic...he's furious with Telstra...reckons they don't care when he contacts them about problems...force him to have a landline...and he can't select a competitor.

I told him to email John Howard and the Liberal party and thank them for giving Telstra them a virtual monopoly by leaving them in control of the copper wiring after privatisation...and in the process letting them build on their arrogance and anti-competitive behaviour.

The NBN will provide more competition.


I'd LOVE an authentic Lebanese restraunt - kebab shops don't cut it lol!

Totally agree. And wouldn't it be great to get access to a woodfired Italian pizza? And other recipes made by an Italian Australian family? Used to get them in the city and on the coast.

I also LOVE the area we live in. I'm in Eagleby, and a nicer community you couldn't meet. And characters, we have may lovely ones! The only drawback really is a) we live on a main drag (hoon-heaven some nights) and b) the bloody gutters are always full of leaves! Loving the rain tonight tho!

Yea, the hoons are one of the few drawbacks...young people need to get involved in more community groups and spend time studying and/or helping their parents/guardians...even go to rinks and drive-ins rather than hooning around. The noise wakes and scares the elderly, babies...and disturbs those who have been working hard and want some peace at night and on weekends.

Safe driving courses that are compulsory before getting license can help...and bringing responsible racing car drivers into schools who spell out the disasters that comes with hooning, speeding etc also helps.

The ALP started to get on top of the dangerous hooning...but I doubt Newman and co. care less...all talk no action.

Hoons kill police too.

And pedestrians...how many times do we go walking at night only to feel compelled to move over onto someone's lawn as some idiot races past...sometimes getting close to the path.

Govts have a responsibility to help keep people safe.

So do car manufacturers. And the police.

Why can't they work together. Save lives. Keep neighbourhoods safe and less noisy.

N'

nasking

September 30. 2012 09:11 AM

nasking


Of course Mitt Romney will do well in the debates...he's a professional salesman.

His type spend their entire lives learning how to convince people to do what they don't originally want to...

it's in his DNA...and environmental...his Dad being a politician...and big business guy...he learnt like Bush at a young age to spin the BS...how to take a dud/con policy or business offer and spin it into something more palatable, attractive...the BIG SELL.

No way is Romney the underdog...I have big expectations of him in the debates:

www.nytimes.com/.../...st-presidential-debate.html

Let's face it, the President is pre-occupied...running the country...sure he'll get training time in...but he has alot on his plate...the debates are a distraction.

For Romney they are an opportunit to stop being an idiot on the road and do the big salesman job. It's what these big biz, hedge funders, investment guys do.

That's how they get away woth making big bucks the rest of us couldn't even imagine.

A lifetime of selling themselves...convincing others they're worth it...no matter how much they fail...or stuffup.

N'

nasking

September 30. 2012 09:13 AM

nasking


That should be:

For Romney they are an opportunity to stop being an idiot on the road and do the big salesman pitch.

It's what these big biz, hedge funders, investment guys do.

That's how they get away with making big bucks the rest of us couldn't even imagine.

N'

nasking

September 30. 2012 09:15 AM

nasking



Alan Jones speaks for the Liberal Party and its oh so humble 'leader'.

His message from the back room just puts into public what Abbott and company bellow in Parliament, signal with their faces and body language in the wider world, insinuate into every statement about 'bad government'.

Neurotic, ugly, small-minded and vicious. That's Jones, that's Abbott's Coalition


Michael,
spot on.

N'

nasking

September 30. 2012 09:21 AM

TalkTurkey

Good Morning Comrade Swordsfolk,

I am so angry that people like Jones are given oxygen in this country. Let us be resolute in defying their kind.

Here's a little silver Twitter-Bullet I have fashioned for the hearts of the 3 heroes mentioned in it:

Jones+Pell+Abbortt!~Creep&Lout&Bum!~
A*Aims the Gun~P*Purifies him~J*Just beats the Drum!

May my Verse help remove you-all for GOOD.


[Silver Bullets can be used over and over btw.
I hope that many people retweet that verse,
I despise those 3 and their cohorts SO much!]

I have vowed of these people,
With my pen I will poison you,
With my words I shall wound you


They have brought division and hatred to our People,
They are TRAITORS to good governance of Australia,
They are the Enemy Within.








TalkTurkey

September 30. 2012 09:25 AM

nasking



I wrote this last night:

I was going to order from Woolworths again this weekend for a Monday delivery...we love their croissants and raisin & oat cookies...but not now after reading this:

During the five-hour event, three spoof songs were sung by Young Liberals member Simon Berger, Woolworths' government realtions manager.

www.heraldsun.com.au/.../story-fndo317g-1226484128451


Now I read this:

Woolworths' pokies 'target low-earners'

SUPERMARKET giant Woolworths is earning hundreds of millions of dollars a year from some of the country's poorest regions because of the concentration of its poker machines in low-income areas.


www.theage.com.au/.../...rners-20120929-26sem.html

Woolworths has lost the plot...so much for caring about local families.

Damn, I was looking forward to those choc chip...and raisin & oatmeal cookies...and croissants.

I guess it's back to Coles deliveries...wish they'd make better fresh bakery stuff etc

Coles delivery people are always nice.

We use them...and an organic food delivery company. Choose food etc online.

Saves always going into shops and picking up flus and colds.

N'

nasking

September 30. 2012 09:31 AM

nasking


Dear 2GB, we need to talk about Alan

Andrew Stafford, Brisbane Times

And I did feel disgust. I know Mr Jones is paid well, in part, for his controversial views: we may not like them, but he's difficult to ignore (much as, mostly, I do my best). But that couldn't stop the wave of bile that collected in my stomach when I read of his comments, and listened to the audio. I was genuinely sickened. I'm sure most decent people would feel the same way.

You are doubtless aware of the increasing debate about the standard of public debate in this country, and the lack of civility in public discourse. And I am aware that, as a talkback radio station, you place a premium on broadcasters with robust views who attract a large and loyal base of listeners; not just Mr Jones, but Ray Hadley, Steve Price and Chris Smith. Yours is not an industry for shrinking violets.
My question to you, though, is simple. Where do you draw the line?

Well, I'm not sure where you draw it. But I suspect you're about to find out where others draw it, because I anticipate that many of your advertisers won't be too keen on continuing to extend their patronage to a broadcaster vicious enough to publicly heap shame on a grieving person for effectively killing her father.


Much more here:


www.brisbanetimes.com.au/.../...0120930-26t2b.html

Indeed.

N'

nasking

September 30. 2012 10:08 AM

nasking


Talking Pictures really biased against govt this week.

Depend on the ABC to go over-the-top to try and help the Coalition in the Newspoll.

Top dog Mark Scott being a fella who worked for the Liberal Greiner govt.

Felt like the Howard era today...no balance whatsoever on Talking Pictures. Mike Bowers can be very disappointing as a host. Seems to luv these Murdoch empire political cartoonists.

N'

nasking

September 30. 2012 10:14 AM

Linda

Alan Jones is absolutely despicable!
For what it’s worth, I’ll be writing to Woolworths indicating that my “Everyday” account will not be used for the entire month of October. I know that they follow use because when we were on holiday recently, we got a “come back” message. I think someone with the position of Community and Government Relations Manager should be a little more circumspect whilst acknowledging that his “contribution” to the evening’s entertainment took place in his personal life. I would suggest his salary allows him to enjoy quite a nice personal life.

Linda

September 30. 2012 10:18 AM

TalkTurkey

This bloody stuff on Lopsiders about 47%:53% was old news last week.

Still the list of comparisons is wonderful for Labor, as indeed it should be.

Annabel the Slyly-sidling Crabbe is still running true to form as an apologist and trivialiser for Abbortt; Megalogenis largely being an apologist for himself over time while exuding believe-me-expertise, and Dear Laura Tingle is just being sensible.

Nobody wants to own Jones though. Turdball has distanced himself - How far is it possible to distance himself though, while in the party which does embrace shock-jocks? He should either challenge for leadership, or rule himself out from contesting next election.  

TalkTurkey

September 30. 2012 10:37 AM

nasking



Alan Jones is absolutely despicable!
For what it’s worth, I’ll be writing to Woolworths indicating that my “Everyday” account will not be used for the entire month of October. I know that they follow use because when we were on holiday recently, we got a “come back” message.

I think someone with the position of Community and Government Relations Manager should be a little more circumspect whilst acknowledging that his “contribution” to the evening’s entertainment took place in his personal life. I would suggest his salary allows him to enjoy quite a nice personal life.


Linda,
agree.

N'

nasking

September 30. 2012 10:41 AM

nasking


Mobius Echo @ Cafe Whispers pointed out this petition link...to call for the sacking of Alan Jones...over 2,300 signed already:

www.change.org/.../2gb-and-associated-advertisers-on-alan-jones-radio-program-immediately-terminate-the-contract-and-cease-association-with-alan-jones

Jones is a walking timebomb for talkback radio and the Liberal party.

Makes ya wonder about Howard and Abbott's judgement.

N'

nasking

September 30. 2012 10:45 AM

Lyn

Good Morning Ad and Everybody


As you will imagine the twittersphere is jammed this morning because of Alan Jones’ comments, if he wanted publicity he has got it:-

If you have time listen to the Sound Cloud of Gusface talking to Williams on radio, Williams loses the plot:-

Peter van Onselen ‏
Alan Jones' spin team telling journos the Sunday Tele we're out to get him...can't wait to hear his heart felt apology at the 11:30 presser

  Agnes Mack  
#insiders Alan Jones to make statement around 11.30 on CH 9

Anne Summers ‏@SummersAnne
liberal humour “chmharvey: Here's the list of auction items from the Jones dinner held by Syd Uni Liberal Club. http://yfrog.com/o0ss7kkj

An imaginary dog ‏
TurnbullMalcolm the tea party nuts / shock jocks have been emboldened under Abbott's leadership. Chaff bags, kicking to death, bestiality..

GenGusface on Mike Williams' show, 2GB - discussing Alan Jones comments on PM's father
Listen to Mike Williams of 2GB refuse to acknowledge Jones' disgraceful comments on the PM's recently deceased father - 30th Sept 2012
soundcloud.com/.../gengusface-on-mike-williams

  samantha maiden  
Interesting to note if wasn't a recording of Alan Jones speech we would still be in bullshit realm of "it never happened" & "out of context"

Gillard's father died of shame: Alan Jones, SMH
Jones went on to claim the media had somehow brainwashed the federal Liberal Party to go easy on the Prime Minister because "she's a woman".
www.theage.com.au/.../...jones-20120929-26soa.html

Put your hand up if you’re an offensive bastard, Malcolm Farr
There is a wider political consequence to this latest controversy.
One is the comparison between Opposition Leader Tony Abbott’s silence this morning and the swift rebuke of Mr Jones by front bench colleague Malcolm Turnbull, who said the broadcaster had to apologise to the Prime Minister.

Carbon pricing has been introduced over his objections; an early election has not been called despite his loud demands; Clover Moore is still Lord Mayor of Sydney, despite his public rally and on-air campaign against her.

And the great communicator became the great embarrassment to anti-carbon pricing rally organisers in August last year when he stood in front of Parliament House and accused policy of obeying political orders and blocking protest trucks entering Canberra. It was a fabrication.
www.thepunch.com.au/.../

Dear 2GB, we need to talk about Alan, Andrew Stafford, Brisbane times
You would also be well aware, of course, of the current debate surrounding trolling, since Mr Hadley has recently called on the government for "some form of regulation" of Twitter, after he found himself the subject of what he said were "criminally defamatory allegations" on the micro-blogging site. There has to be protection, he says, for "average people".

Including, I would suggest, average people like the PM. Because Julia Gillard is not just a woman; not just the PM; she is a human being. Had Mr Jones made such comments on Twitter, they would - if reported - likely have seen him suspended or banned from the service
www.brisbanetimes.com.au/.../...0120930-26t2b.html

Alan Jones says Julia Gillard's dad 'died of shame' , JONATHAN MARSHAL, Telegraph

www.dailytelegraph.com.au/.../story-e6freuy9-1226484128451
6m  Peter van Onselen ‏
Alan Jones probably created sympathy for PM when trying to hurt her. Poor political judgement from a 5 times failed Preselection candidate.

  TAWNBPM ‏
A petition from http://Change.org to remove Jones from 2GB ... let's do what we can to help guys http://fb.me/IDj6WW7E

Brigadier Slog
ALAN JONES MUST GO!!! RT @BrendenWood: #auspol - Tomorrow's Sunday Telegraph pic.twitter.com/gJckLyRs

Neil Mitchell ‏
What Alan Jones said about Julia Gullard's late father is poisonous and disgraceful and hurtful. Australia must be above this

TheFinnigans
Alan Jones video is no longer available on The Australian site - video.theaustralian.com.au/.../Alan-Jones-claims-PMs-dad-died-of-shame … but I have re-created it here: http://twitpic.com/azdrhh

  Ken ‏
Boycott Woolworths until their Community & Government Relations Manager Simon Berger is dismissed http://linkd.in/PBayz7

Space Kidette ‏
Key Question: Who from the LNP booked Alan Jones and endorsed his speech? #boycott2GB #AlanJonesMUSTGO #LNPTalkingPoints

Anthony B ‏
Remember folks, its not just 2GB. The Liberal Party booked Alan Jones as a speaker, and you can hear the audience laughing

Mark ‏
Is this THE most disgraceful article ever published by Daily Telegraph?...Absolutely disgusting comments by Alan Jones!! #

Chris Mullins ‏
boycott2GB  This appears to be a list of 2gb advertisers www.2gb.com/index.php

Jenna Price ‏
Folks, call Challenger on +61 133 566. Tell them why they shouldn't sponsor Alan Jones. +61 133 566 #shame2gb

  Kiera Gorden ‏
Dear SydneyUniLibs You appear to have removed a tweet for some reason! Not to worry, I have a copy for you here… pic.twitter.com/TtvShKHq

Bushfire Bill
Posted Saturday, September 29, 2012 at 6:59 pm | Permalink
Last Tuesday (no matter what happens this Tuesday) that myth was dispelled once and for all. Two years of political commentary and logic went out the window, into the garbage can of history.
The Libs have their backs to the abyss. A one seat loss for them due to misadventure, and a following win for the government in a by-election could finish off their hopes.
This is regarded as a totally fantastic, fairyland scenario by the media. I have never seen it discussed, anywhere in the MSM. But there ARE marginal Coalition seats, as well as marginal Labor ones.
blogs.crikey.com.au/.../#comment-1422791

Bushfire Bill
Posted Sunday, September 30, 2012 at 7:58 am | Permalink
Abbott supplied a pair of signed(!) budgie smugglers for the event, so he’s connected to it directly.
Downer – what can you say? – supplied fish net stockings, also signed.

In what must be one of the most ironic twists, the Government Relations executive from Woolworths sang songs about chaff bags during the night. So much for relations between Woolworths and this particular government. He should be sacked. His job is now untenable

This is Abbott’s “Free Speech”. The “Free Speech” consisting of lies, thuggery, misogyny, hatred and psychpopathic antagonism that he defended “to the death” only a few weeks ago, to a captive audience of smirkers and lurk merchants at the IPA.
blogs.crikey.com.au/.../#comment-1423262

Bushfire Bill
Posted Saturday, September 29, 2012 at 6:21 pm | Permalink
Ashby only got as far as he did because he had his incredibly expensive legal bills provided pro bono, meaning he could appeal anything he liked, no matter how fanciful, all the way to the High Court, as long as it caused a delay and ate into the election timing.
blogs.crikey.com.au/.../#comment-1422770

TheQldPublicServant
Why make drug addicts get treatment when u can jail them? Newman axes Drug Courts #dumbas #qldpol | Gold Coast Bully www.goldcoast.com.au/.../438901_crime-and-court-news.

David Marler
#auspol #qldpol #Newmania 22/9/12 Bundaberg "SES Cadets In Protest" - http://ow.ly/e5QcA

insiders:-

Werner & Ursula ‏
#insiders Sorry, an apology from Alan Jones is not good enough. It wouldn't be sincere, and is forced upon him! #auspol #alanjones

Miss Bailey Woof ‏
#insiders Sydney University Liberal Club auctioned off a chaff bag signed by Alan Jones.

Agnes Mack  
#insiders Laura : Abbott said electricity prices will go down after he removes #cp ..... he's tangling himself... octopus

dragon ‏
“PaulGeeReally: Alan Jones to make a comment on channel nine at 11:30am... Cash for comments?! #insiders”

SmileSmileSmileSmile

Lyn

September 30. 2012 11:18 AM

NormanK

Thanks Lyn.
Do you get paid double time for Sundays? Smile

NormanK

September 30. 2012 11:25 AM

Lyn

Hi NormanK

You have paid me with your thankyou NormanK.

Cheers to you SmileSmileSmileKissKiss

Lyn

September 30. 2012 11:40 AM

Ad astra

Good morning Folks
It was too late to comment last night after a delightful evening with the family.  Today we have a double birthday celebration with a son and granddaughter, and tomorrow with another granddaughter.

Thank you Lyn, Gravel and Nasking for your good wishes.  I’m glad to read that Stacey is recovering Nasking.  Give her our best wishes.  You are in fine form despite looking through a ‘thick fog’.

Lyn, your Twitterverse is bulging with the Alan Jones saga, which is already massive.  Sunrise gave him a big spray, as did Insiders; the papers will be full of it.  The fact that it was at Young Liberals gathering where a hessian bag and a pair Abbott’s budgie smugglers were auctioned, Malcolm Turnbull’s condemnatory tweet, Abbott’s silence so far, the initial denial by the organizer of the gathering that Jones made the remark at all, and the viral reaction in social media adds up to a major PR disaster for the Coalition, the Liberals, and particularly Tony Abbott, who has associated himself so closely with Jones.  Jones does not matter – it is the damage he has inflicted on his beloved Coalition and his adored LOTO that does.

If the media thought Lindsay Tanner’s media appearances were a big deal, let’s see how they deal with the Jones outburst.  They can hardly ignore it, as every outlet will be on to it.

Jones’ 11.30 presser will get wide coverage.  I wonder what this nasty, misogynist individual will be able to bring himself to say?

I’ll be away until late afternoon when I’ll post Kay Rollison’s Ronald Reagan, you were wrong.

Ad astra

September 30. 2012 11:47 AM

Todd

Fair dinkum Annabelle Crabbe is a joke.
Is it her job description to try make light of every Abbott fuck up and lack of policy?
250k of tax payers money to giggle like a love sick teenager, I would find more in depth analysis from Dolly magazine.

Todd

September 30. 2012 11:57 AM

Ad astra

Hi Lyn
Thank you again for working on a Sunday to bring us the latest on the political scene.

I couldn’t get onto the Jones presser.  Perhaps you or someone else could post what he said.  I’ll take the iPad with me to the birthday party.

Ad astra

September 30. 2012 12:03 PM

jaycee

As soon as A.Jones came over with the mea culpa at the presses I turned the tv. off before I vomited! Really, what a bal-faced bugger he really is!....less than pathetic, from pathos to bathos!

jaycee

September 30. 2012 12:20 PM

nasking


Cheers Ad...I'll pass on yer best wishes to Stacey.

Great work with Tweets Lyn.

Allan Jones has no dignity. Instead of just apologising he uses this horrid situation to be what he normally is...SLAVERING ATTACK DOG.

Makes you wonder about his moral age...came across like a teen that does a bad thing and then tries to spin their way out...and points the finger of accusation back at the person they've abused.

You can only shake yer head at the pathetic justifications.

SLY NEWS contributing to the attack dog stuff. Truly pathetic. Repeating Jones' garbage.

Makes ya wonder if this was all part of a campaign...that's gone wrong...badly.

N'

nasking

September 30. 2012 12:50 PM

M&#246;bius Ecko

ABC News reported the non-apology right wing attack on unions, Labor as a gracious and sincere apology.

There can be no doubt which side the ABC stands on.

Möbius Ecko

September 30. 2012 01:23 PM

MWS

I didn't know it was possible to die of shame.  After all, Alan Jones must have at least one living relative left?  Otherwise, Jones' actions would be killing them pretty quickly nowadays?

MWS

September 30. 2012 03:19 PM

Lyn

HI Ad

Here is the video of Alan jones apologising on ABC 24. You will come to your own conclusion.

I know what that will be, the same as me.

Note:  the last tweet is a link by Anne Summers to Patricia's blog "Polliepomes"

Jones sorry for saying Gillard's dad 'died of shame'
Jones said he thought it was a private function and was unaware there were journalists in the room
www.abc.net.au/.../4288118


Alan Jones has no shame, but what about Tony Abbott?September 30, 2012 - 12:01PM
In fact, as this columnist noted at the time, Tony Abbott was nothing less than magnificent in Parliament a fortnight ago, with the dignity and grace with which he honoured the Prime Minister's loss, noting of John Gillard that, “It is a remarkable parent who produces a prime minister of this country.”

So now let him stand up and say out loud what needs to be said: “The remarks of Alan Jones at the Liberal Party function were a disgrace, as was the reaction of some of the audience. Robust debate within the Australian political discourse is fine, but viciously personal insults of this nature have no part of it.” www.smh.com.au/.../...y-abbott-20120930-26t5d.html

www.smh.com.au/.../...y-abbott-20120930-26t5d.html

Anne Summers ‏@SummersAnne
Finally says her name. But says Julia! Then uses his apology to attack her on carbon tax and pink bats. Beyond belief #AlanJonesapology

Mia Freedman ‏@MiaFreedman
Alan Jones you are a repugnant, misogynistic troll. Thanks for confirming it.

Jill Tomlinson‏
How not to apologise: Transcript of Alan Jones' press conference via @JennaPrice via @maxious

JacktheInsider‏
Always fascinating to watch a sociopath in action. #alanjonesapology

Richard Hinds‏   Chief Sports Columnist for the Sydney Morning Herald
You have to admire the man's audacity. Turns a grubby reference to man's death into a lecture on ALP policy disasters. #alanjonesapolog

Luke Buckmaster‏  Crikey.com.au Website Editor and writer
I've seen lots of weird and shocking comedy, but this #alanjonesapology presser is on another level.

NeilMcMahon‏ Journo. SMH, Age, SanFran Chronicle, Washington Times
What a sad and sorry and pathetic and deluded excuse for a man. #alanjonesapology

Anne Summers‏
Thefinnigans: Let me say it again. It all started with this photo: polliepomes.files.wordpress.com/.../...picture.jpg” Important to not forget this.

SmileSmileSmileSmileSmile

Lyn

September 30. 2012 03:49 PM

NormanK

Let's have a lingering look at what Alan Jones said (and didn't say) during his press conference this morning.

I think any daughter, you would actually come to the same conclusion because it may well be that those sentiments sought to dilute the grief that a daughter feels. I'm now very mindful of that. As I said, the comments shouldn't have been repeated. I don't regret that, I apologise for that.

"Sought to dilute the grief that a daughter feels". Dilute the grief by injecting a degree of guilt and self-recrimination? Is that what Jones meant? Still, he apologised for appearing to make Gillard feel partially responsible for her father's death - he just doesn't regret it.

But that speech would have been better made if it did not include the remarks that have been attribute to me which I repeated from a comment that had been made to me earlier in the day when I was attending the day when I was attending the birthday party of my God son.

Slip sliding away. "Attributed to me". Indeed they are attributed to Alan Jones because they came out of his mouth without any indication on his part that he was just recounting an amusing comment (albeit a dark parody). While he is at it he manages to mention his God son half a dozen times throughout the press conference. Anyone with a God son can't be all bad.

So I took a theme which had been current during the course of the evening and repeated the story. Now I shouldn't have repeated the story.

This is Tony Abbott at his best. "I just got caught up in the heat of the moment and told an audience what I thought they wanted to hear. Who knew someone in the room might be offended?"

The AWU is another issue which she won't address in the Parliament. Then you have got pink batts where four people died. One of the mothers writes to me who is absolutely distraught.

And Alan Jones, with all of the research resources at his disposal, of course points out that three of the four employers involved in those deaths have been found culpable in courts of law. Does he not! He would also point out to the grieving mother that, at the time of the deaths, OH&S regulations were under the jurisdiction of the state in which the business operated. He would, wouldn't he?

I never made personal judgments about Julia Gillard.

It's never been personal? I'm sure I would take this rather personally.

Alan Jones: We’re being warned that Sydney is being invaded by a new breed of super rats that are immune to poison, a bit like Julia Gillard & Co. Immune to poison, too smart to get caught in the traps ...

— 2GB, Alan Jones Breakfast Show, 31st May, 2012”
www.abc.net.au/mediawatch/transcripts/s3551607.htm}

For what it is worth, as a country boy I am willing to accept his initial explanation about his chaff bag comment. It is conceivable that his father used such an expression to describe disposing of something that was no longer of use or was faulty or past its use-by date. However, having used the expression and witnessed the reaction by those people who "spent too much time living beside the bitumen" (i.e. misunderstood the expression, conferring on to it a meaning which was never intended) he continues to use it knowing full well that its meaning is different for many of those who hear it.

First use of the expression: 6th July, 2011.
Repeated use of the same expression:
Gillard - 17th May 2012
Rudd - 6th June 2012
Swan - 6th June 2012
Chris Hartcher - 1st May 2012
Clover Moore - 17th July 2012
Barack Obama - 18th July 2012
www.abc.net.au/mediawatch/transcripts/s3551607.htm


I said my God, well the women are ruining the joint ……

I~wasn't making a generic comment.


"Well the women are ruining the joint". This is not a generic comment? How else is the use of the word 'women' meant to be interpreted? And let's not forget the context - Julia Gillard had just announced a fund to support the elevation of more women into leadership roles including the political sphere.

The thing is I think that even, if I might call her Julia, that is Julia as the daughter, the daughter did say that many of the problems that she faced weighed heavily upon her father and I don't know exactly what she meant by that. But I'm sure they have been through difficult times as a result of the controversies that she's been in. But I don't think anyone visits upon the parents the problems of the child and certainly I have never, ever done that.

This is the most reprehensible part of Jones' self-justification today. But before we go off half-cocked, let's just seek some clarification.

Reporter: When you said earlier that Julia Gillard had made comments that the hardships that she faced were in respect to her parents. She said that in the eulogy. Aren't you implying she has had some (inaudible)?
Jones: Every child has an impact on their child's life, both success and failure. Every parent lives through all of that. That's irrelevant. I was making that as an observation she made in the speech. Every parent lives the life of their child. In every one of its details, whether it's the success which the issue of great jubilation are whether it's the disappointments. They carve a little piece in the psyche of the parent and we all know that. We have seen that with our parent, whether we failed University exams or succeed, whether we make a team or we don't.


What did Julia Gillard actually say in her speech to the Parliament?

"He felt more deeply than me, in many ways, some of the personal attacks, that we face in the business of politics, but I was always able to reassure him that he had raised a daughter with sufficient strength not to let that get her down."
www.heraldsun.com.au/.../story-e6frf7jo-1226477372157}

So the slippery eel that is Alan Jones is seeking to imply that even Julia Gillard acknowledges that her own shortcomings had an adverse effect on her father i.e. "I was partly right in saying (sorry - repeating) that John Gillard died of shame." What a disgusting excuse for an individual.

Despite what some media houses may be reporting, at no point during that press conference did Alan Jones say he was sorry. He never once offered an unequivocal apology.
www.tveeder.com/byrange

NormanK

September 30. 2012 03:57 PM

Michael

Two horrible little men. Which one's worse?


From: www.skynews.com.au/.../article.aspx?id=800662

Mr Abbott added his voice to the condemnation on Sunday afternoon.

"Alan's remarks regarding the PM were completely out of line," he said in a brief statement.

"It's good that he's recognised this and apologised for them."

...............

Could Abbott have said any less? Recognised less? Understood less?

And he sees himself as a national leader in waiting????

One little man with an acid mouth. The second with a mealymouth... and a delayed action morality.

Michael

September 30. 2012 04:07 PM

jane

Ad astra another enjoyable post, which I am still digesting. I want to make sure I get every last gram from it.

Nas', great news on the home front. Please pass on my best wishes to Stacey for a swift and full recovery.

It's also great to see that you're in top form despite all the angst you must have been feeling. Bears are very difficult to bring low, I'm pleased to say.

Lyn, thanks for all the work this weekend. You are a champion. I have emailed the Maggot and some of his sponsors and signed the change.org petition.

It's very telling that there hasn't been a peep out of Liealot. Someone should tell him that silence is NOT golden in this case.

Turnbull has shown him up for the empty ill-mannered, gutless vessel he really is. No doubt, he's hoping it will all blow over and it will be business as usual for him.

What he is obviously too stupid to realise is the huge weapon he has handed the government wrt his judgement and fitness for the highest office in this country.

With luck, it may also finally lead to the utter ruin and fall from grace of the Maggot. May he end his days beggin in the streets. I, for one, would happily kick his begging bowl into a drain.

jane

September 30. 2012 04:26 PM

Michael

Is the tveeder captioning service on the take?

At the link to Alan Jones's press conference provided by NormanK above, there's this portion:

"Julia Gillard had given money to the Cook islands for gender equality and to have women in public office... Anna Bligh left billions of dollars in debt."

OK, tveeder is a transcription service that relies on hearing what's said, and Jones mumbled past his sliding lips-licking fanging tongue through the whole pathetic self-justification and vile reiteration of his attacks on the PM, but...

He definitely said "95 billion dollars" when referring to Anna Bligh and the purported debt left by her period of government in Queensland. No "95" in the transcript.

He also referred to what I heard as '371 million dollars' of aid to the Cook Islands, which sounded so wrong I checked it - the figure was 3.7 million [www.ausaid.gov.au/.../home.aspx] - so yes, I may have misheard the number, but I definitely heard a number that included "3" and "7". Also not in the transcription.

So, Alan Bigmouth let off the hook? tveeder not good with numbers? Something else happening? Like... both numbers were lies?

I'll tell you what IS happening, which Abbott confirmed with his limpwristed 'defence' of Jones' avoidance of an apology, the lines are being laid out to 'prove' Alan was right, justified, and should never have been so cruelly attacked as he was, and clearly JULIAR was behind it all along.

The psychological, linguistic, sociological, plain 'is this even logical?' analyses that can be applied to Jone's words, should be applied to his intentions both today and last Saturday night, and will be applied because who can't be fascinated by a snake peering out from under a rock, will be just as fascinating to watch.

Jesuitical Tony's started the passage towards forgiveness for Jones. Who'll join him?

Michael

September 30. 2012 04:33 PM

NormanK

Michael

According to my recollection you are correct on both counts.
The $95 billion included "that's 'b' billions, 95 billion dollars".
As to the decimal point in the Cook Islands' announcement, I recall $371 million - we can check this later I'm sure.

NormanK

September 30. 2012 05:02 PM

Michael

Paul Kelly and Michelle Grattan seem to be sharing an incredible shrinking brain that shrinks a little more each time it is passed back and forth between them. Perhaps the cold light of day destroys a few more cells in the shrivelled organ each occasion it's outside their respective hollow craniums?

Here: www.theaustralian.com.au/.../story-e6frg74x-1226483756101

Kelly revisits so many of his old tropes here he probably only had to push 'auto-compile' on his keyboard pre-sets.

viz this: "...the purpose of modern Labor is to govern and exploit the power of the Treasury and executive authority to further its interests. Tanner is explicit on this point: for Labor today "nothing else matters" but winning elections - no cause, no ideology. Power is its own reward."

Well, apart from the fact the PM and her government have and continue to regularly enunciate contemporary Labor's cause and ideology, which means somebody (???) ain't listening, what exactly is this section all about?

"the purpose of modern Labor is to govern and exploit the power of the Treasury and executive authority to further its interests" except margarine smear transparent Coalition re-ranting, that boils down to "class warfare" and "Stalinist state"?

After all, substitute "Coalition" for "Labor" and the sentence is not only as 'true', it defines why democracies have elections which seek the support of voters.

You're in government to govern, to advance policies that the public have endorsed with their votes to see applied to their, the voters', advantage. Usually with the, to give we voters our due, belief that the government we have endorsed, reflecting our own views, will actually do things for the betterment and continuing advancement of the country.

But... somehow, that 'definition of democratic governance' sentence from Kelly seems to impute that Labor's "interests" are seedy, or self-interested, or focused on nothing but keeping noses in troughs and hands in lolly jars. And that, God only knows why in his (and Grattan's) swapped minds, such "interests" pursued by a Coalition government would be none of those things. Because they are noble? Disinterested in power except to do great things? Because they are of better pedigree?

We do have adversarial party politics in Australia. We bloody well should, because what drives Conservatism in this country is so focused on preserving power and wealth in those who have it right now, and nobody outside the kraaled for comfort tribe gets to share, that if we didn't have a Labor party prepared to step forward with "Hang on, that's not right. Fact is, 'Boss', it sucks!", we'd all be flexibly employed into oblivion.

A pontifical Press is constipatal to our democracy.

Michael

September 30. 2012 05:05 PM

Michael

NormanK, luv ya!

I was quite certain I heard those numbers and extra bits you quote above from Jones. If that ain't lying on his part, and then 'who knows what?' on tveeder's part, then I don't know what!

Michael

September 30. 2012 05:13 PM

Ad astra

Folks
We welcome another new original contributor to The Political Sword, Dr Kay Rollison, the author of this piece.  She has a PhD in History and has always been interested in politics – historically, in the present and of course future political battles.

Her piece, which I have just now posted, follows the theme of the last piece: Ronald Reagan, you were wrong.  Enjoy.

www.thepoliticalsword.com/.../...u-were-wrong.aspx

Ad astra

September 30. 2012 05:20 PM

Patriciawa

You're right, NormanK, what a slippery eel, Jones is.  At the end he was not apologising for his comments, he was justifying them! Gillard herself had admitted what a burden her career had been on her father.  What a glib piece of self rationalisation that was!

Lyn, I've had a few pingbacks from that link, but what a pity it was only to the picture and not to the pome and the whole post at polliepomes.wordpress.com/.../ where the picture was featured.  Even I could not have known how prophetic some lines in the pome were to be.  As well that post was very clear about the role that Alan Jones was playing as Tony Abbott's media ally in trying to bring the government down.

A Fair Go for Julia Gillard?

Asked should Julia Gillard get our traditional fair go,
Last year most Aussies would’ve answered “Yes!”
But last September (2010!) we didn’t know
What lay ahead. Did any of us guess?

Do you remember a year (now two!) ago?

Then we marvelled at our politicians
Working together in Downunderland
Where a Rainbow Coalition
Like something out of Wonderland
Had miraculously appeared.
Its members of such quality
Spirits rose, all the people cheered.
A ‘kinder, gentler polity’
Than this nation’s usual habit
Had even been suggested,
Would you believe, by Tony Abbott.
Then suddenly he protested
Such politics consensual
Were not appropriate in Oz.
Now he found it was essential
To drop that earlier view because

Circumstances had changed! And so….

Angry that his generosity
To some had clearly been abused
He was full of animosity.
The thought that he had been been refused
Gave rise to one long beef and bitch.
Those who’d foiled his life’s ambition
He dreamed of burning with that ‘witch.’
Daily, in a war of near attrition,
He’s made ferocious media forays
To attack her, ruin her reputation,
Against all parliamentary mores
With News Ltd’s approbation.
Yet she’s stood her ground, has his mettle,
Kept her cool, further enraging him,
When she taunted, ‘Oh, poor petal!’
As he sulked like a child denied his whim.

Seems he’ll never learn that wishing doesn’t make it so.

But Julia Gillard is already wise,
She knows how to make her own fair go,
Garnering those all important “Ayes!”
While Abbott stamps his foot with, “NO! NO! NO! NO! NO!!!”


Patriciawa

September 30. 2012 08:51 PM

Ad astra

Hi Lyn
Thanks for the link to the Jones ‘apology’.  Does anyone really believe his words and actions today indicated that he feels mortified by what he said a week ago?  His regret is that a news reporter recorded what he said and it got out.  His conviction that Julia Gillard is a liar remains.  His detestation of her continues.  As reprehensible as Jones’ comments, was the audience reaction of approval, the rating of his speech by the organizer as brilliant, and the limp reaction by Abbott.  The Young Liberals and those older ones who have not condemned Jones’ behaviour as grotesquely rude, shameful, libellous and totally unacceptable in the field of public political discourse, join him in the cesspit in which he habitually wallows.

The media will try to make this go away, but it will longer long in the memories of the electorate as a deep stain on the Coalition it will not be able to erase.

Ad astra

September 30. 2012 09:24 PM

Michael

From AA's post on the Jones 'apology':

"His regret is that a news reporter recorded what he said and it got out."

And Tony Abbott accepted Cory Bernardi's resignation because he was 'ill-disciplined', not because of what he said would follow upon legalisation of anything other than heterosexual monogamous marriages.

Same mindset, same avoidance of confronting the real issue - the core of the infraction, same complete inability to recognise behaviour meant to cause hurt.

Same certainty of moral superiority.

Same preparedness to offer a free pass, absolution even, to someone who appears to repent, who 'confesses' by resignation or 'apology'.

In short, hypocrisy.

And bone-deep to the soul moral failure.

Michael

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